Israel Lab Created Diamond Simulate - Thoughts?

[I Love Sparkly Things]

While browsing on ebay I ran across this company''s posting...

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=4194&item=4972071749#ebayphotohosting

Here''s the background of the company:
ABOUT ISRAEL LAB CREATED DIAMOND SIMULATES All gemstones offered by us are Lab-Created, not natural. Before you confuse this with a cheap department store substitute for a diamond or a cheap CZ, please read further. If you''ve ever looked at a fake department store diamond and a natural diamond side by side, the difference is noticeable right away. Most fake diamonds look like cut glass and aren''t much harder. What we sell is top of the line Israel Lab-Created diamond simulants. Our Israel Lab-created diamond simulants have the same optical characteristics of natural diamonds, they disperse light just like a natural diamond, and they will cut glass, just like a natural diamond. The only difference is that ours are made in a laboratory, instead of the earth! We get these stones in from the cutters in Israel very few at a time. They are enhanced in a lab and only sold by us on Ebay and our website. They are not sold to Retail Jewelers who would mark them up 3 to 6 times.These gemstones are as close as you will get to a natural Diamond. Diamond is one of the hardest substances known to man, and rates a 10 on the mineral hardness scale. Our Israel lab-created diamond simulants rate over 9 on the same scale, while the cheap fake diamond substitutes you see advertised on most of the cable shopping networks rate around 8. Glass rates around 5-6. To offer you complete peace of mind, we offer a lifetime guarantee on all the Israel lab-created diamond simulants that we sell. Read below about our Lifetime warranty.
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Now, I''m not naive enough to think this is going to beat a real diamond, but has anyone seen one of these? I''m curious about simulated diamonds and what people know about them...
Thanks!

 

[Richard Sherwood]

They certainly are very vague in their description. They give you no real information to go on, and plenty of information which could be easily misconstrued.

My gut instinct is that the stone is some type of cubic zirconia. The price is in line for expensive (well cut) cubic zirconia. They''re claiming a hardness of over 9, while cubic zirconia is usually 8.5, so possibly they have enhanced it in some way (they mention lab enhancement).

They mention "don''t confuse this with a ''cheap'' cz" (notice they don''t say "confuse this with a cz"), and they also talk about how a "regular" cz looks compared to theirs. It sounds like they''re doing a "word dance" around the fact that their stone is cz as well.

I''ve seen no announcement in the gemology world of a new diamond simulant, and I tend to follow these things closely. I''d be surprised if this is a new simulant rather than a "dressed up" cubic zirconia.

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

There are a couple of shonky mobs selling 'new' 'simulants' in Australia - they are being taken to the ACCC for misleading and deceptive conduct.

It is pure BS

(Hi Rich

)

 

[denverappraiser]

This sounds like CZ to me. Not that there is anything wrong with that but they sure do go through a lot of trouble to avoid saying it. They’re correct that well cut CZ looks way better than poorly cut CZ. Who here is surprised at this?

I almost hate to pick on their advertising because it’s so carefully written but I see several phrases that may need some translation:

“Certificate of Authinticity”
Authentic what? Excuse me. Authintic what?

“VVS1 - D-E color”
According to whom and on what scale? GIA does not grade CZ and their scale does not apply.

“Before you confuse this with a cheap department store substitute for a diamond or a cheap CZ….”
Ok, it’s expensive CZ.

“… they will cut glass, just like a natural diamond”
Most modern simulants and many natural gemstones also do this. So what?

“The only difference is that ours are made in a laboratory, instead of the earth!”
Israel, where they are cut, is on earth but they don’t actually say where the lab is located.
“We get these stones in from the cutters in Israel very few at a time”
They don’t sell very well.

“They are enhanced in a lab and only sold by us…”
They have an exclusive distribution deal with this particular manufacturer.

“They are not sold to Retail Jewelers”
See comment above.

“…who would mark them up 3 to 6 times”
All markup goes to the seller.

“These gemstones are as close as you will get to a natural Diamond”
I’ve no idea what this means. I guess you can touch them. That’s pretty close.

“You only pay shipping and handling to replace your stone.”
Handling? On a warranty replacement?

“We hand set all our stones with professional craftsmanship”
They pay their employees.

“Our Israel lab-created diamond simulants rate over 9 on the same scale,”
See Rich’s comments in the previous post. Since the lab is apparently not on earth, perhaps there is alien technology involved that isn''t written about in the gemological publications.

Neil Beaty
GG(GIA) ISA NAJA
Independent Appraisals in Denver

 

[RockDoc]

Well I agree with both Neil and Richard on this.

They have used the term "SIMULANT" instead of synthetic, which is the proper term for material that really is a lab grown diamond.


More information on SYNTHETIC diamonds are on the lucent webiste and the Gemisis websites.

Synthetics don''t sell for anywhere near $80.00 in engagement ring sizes. They have much higher prices, which is why the authenticity of this is questioned here by myself and others.

Cynically, this site seems to smell like the back end ( may more diplomatically said using the term POSTERIOR) of the BULL.

Rockdoc

 

[perry]

I think that it would be quite possible to treat a CZ and raise its hardness from the more normal mid 8''s to the low 9''s.

While I do not follow gem publications, I have followed the development of some technologies used to harden other materials - at least for several thousands of an inch - that I believe could be applied to CZ (and even diamond) if someone was willing to do the R&D and find out the right combination for CZ.

The tradeoff is that the materals are usually more brittle, which in the case of CZ "Jemstones" might mean that the corners would chip more easily.

These techniques are all based on radiation or electron/sub atomic particle bombardment of the material. Note that radiation includes laser light - up to including neutron radiation bombardment.

Perry

 

[Richard Sherwood]

Hi Garry

.

 

[Richard Sherwood]

We should all form a Gemological Vigilance Committee, the GVC.

 

[Stest7895]

A Lab Created Diamond is made in a lab instead of in a piece of coal! There is almost no difference and if it is made correctly a jewler has to magnify the diamond 10times higher then a diamond you find in a piece of coal. I have several and I mix them with my real diamonds and you CANNOT tell the difference. I have taken them and have had my jewler take a look at them and he was blown away by their beauty. The other great thing about a lab created diamond is that it is flawless. A diamond that comes from coal is almost never flawless. It can''t be because nature is making it or the way it was mined it was hurt or when the jewler cut it, it fractured. With lab created diamonds you don''t have that problem. They come completely clear and flawless and look like they cost if not 10''s of thousands then 100''s of thousands depending on the size. These are not CZ''s. They are crap! And you can tell the difference between a CZ and a diamond with the naked eye. A CZ also crumbles under enough weight where as the diamond and the lab created diamond do not. The reason for the increase in prices in natural diamonds is because of this revolutionary breakthrough with lab created diamonds. Russia was the first to put them on the market and DeBeers wasn''t happy!!!! They tried to sue over it but couldn''t because they are real diamonds! And DeBeers isn''t allowed to be the only diamond distributor. So if you see the diamond prices slowly rising it is because now you can get real diamonds at the fraction of the cost and DeBeers is running scared.

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

Date: 5/29/2005 10:35:15 PM
Author: Stest7895
A Lab Created Diamond is made in a lab instead of in a piece of coal! There is almost no difference and if it is made correctly a jewler has to magnify the diamond 10times higher then a diamond you find in a piece of coal. I have several and I mix them with my real diamonds and you CANNOT tell the difference. I have taken them and have had my jewler take a look at them and he was blown away by their beauty. The other great thing about a lab created diamond is that it is flawless. A diamond that comes from coal is almost never flawless. It can''t be because nature is making it or the way it was mined it was hurt or when the jewler cut it, it fractured. With lab created diamonds you don''t have that problem. They come completely clear and flawless and look like they cost if not 10''s of thousands then 100''s of thousands depending on the size. These are not CZ''s. They are crap! And you can tell the difference between a CZ and a diamond with the naked eye. A CZ also crumbles under enough weight where as the diamond and the lab created diamond do not. The reason for the increase in prices in natural diamonds is because of this revolutionary breakthrough with lab created diamonds. Russia was the first to put them on the market and DeBeers wasn''t happy!!!! They tried to sue over it but couldn''t because they are real diamonds! And DeBeers isn''t allowed to be the only diamond distributor. So if you see the diamond prices slowly rising it is because now you can get real diamonds at the fraction of the cost and DeBeers is running scared.

Can I have some of what your having Steph? (unless it needs to injected - I pass out at the sight of needles)

 

[denverappraiser]

Stephanie,

Welcome to pricescope.

Are you a representative of the Israel Lab Created Diamond company? If so, I have a few questions for you. I’ll skip over your misunderstandings of how diamonds are formed, cut and distributed or what potential problems some jewelers may have separating various materials. I won’t even go into an explanation of when, how and by whom the synthetics have been developed nor will I address your errors on how and by whom lawsuits may be filed, how and where DeBeers does business, and how diamonds react to extreme pressure. All of these would make great subjects for other discussions and many have been discussed at length in other threads. The thrust of this particular thread is not the merits or demerits of synthetic diamonds. It’s about the products being sold in the above advertisement.

If they are, in fact, synthetic diamonds, why do you call them simulants? They would sell far better and for more money if you accurately described them. Naturally, if they aren’t synthetic diamonds, you would be violating federal interstate commerce laws as well as ebay’s rules to describe them as if they were but this is apparently not an issue. This would be a great opportunity to separate your own fine products from the fraudsters. Why would you devote so much energy and writing talent to obfuscate what seems to be your primary selling point?

Neil Beaty
GG(GIA) ISA NAJA
Independent Appraisals in Denver