Insurance for a WF ring

[jkb_222]

I''ve done a search on past insurance questions and haven''t been able to find the answer to my question. So any help would be appreciated!

I''ve purchased a Whiteflash hearts and arrows diamond, plus a setting, which will be here in a few weeks. I''m looking into getting insurance. I''m in a small town in MO and the only two Chubb agents locally will not sell a policy without getting auto/renters insurance, which I don''t need. I''ve contacted Jewelers Mutual. They said they cannot work with Whiteflash with regards to a replacement, and I would have to go through a local jeweler.

My question is, will a local jeweler be able to replace a Hearts and Arrows diamond? I was not impressed with any of the local B&M''s with regards to cut and quality while shopping for the ring, which is why I went with WF.

I guess I just want to make sure if the ring is lost, I''ll be able to get another Hearts and Arrows with the same specs as I have now.

Thanks...

 

[chantheman]

While I am no expert on insurance, I did face some of the same issues you face.

I purchased a separate valuable items policy from Travelers. I was able to choose reimbursement for appraised value.
While this cost more money, I am able to control replacement of my stone. I had to provide highly detailed appraisal information, but I feel it is well worth it. You may want to check with some of the other large national insurance companies regarding whether or not they offer policies like this.

I did not purchase my diamond from Whiteflash, but they did make my custom setting. My transaction with Travelers went through without complications and I am fully covered for the appraised value of my stone, setting, and wedding band.

Good luck!

 

[FireGoddess]

Honestly, I would probably ask Jeweler's Mutual which local jewelers around you they would deal with, and then discuss with those jewelers their ability to procure a H&A diamond on request for you. And seriously. Not just "sure, I could probably do that." I personally do not like policies where they will replace the stone/ring with one of equal value rather than pay you the full insured price and let you buy your own replacement.

Both Chubb and Geico wanted me to have renter's insurance before they would schedule a separate policy for my e-ring. I ended up having to get renter's insurance w/ Geico, and then schedule a policy for the ring. The renter's insurance was only $150 for an entire year though, so not that bad. The ring policy was more like $300 for the year, which covers everything (and pays me my insured price). Also note: renter's insurance does cover jewelry, but usually caps out at less than your ring will be worth. AND, it only covers theft from the apartment, not other things like damage.

In sum, talk to the actual people who would be given the task of replacing your H&A stone before committing to the policy. Just my $0.02...

Good luck.

 

[jkb_222]

Thanks for the reply''s. I don''t have renters insurance right now but I could explore that with local insurance agencies, perhaps then I can get a policy for the ring too.

 

[pqcollectibles]

Renter''s insurance may be a good alternative for you. More bang for the buck so to speak. If the Renter''s policy doesn''t have jewelry coverage, or the coverage amount isn''t enough (probably NOT), you can add a rider for the amount of coverage you desire. Something to investigate.

Another thought for you,.......... I live in Kansas City. Is it a comfortable commute for you to go either to KC or St. Louis?? You will be able to find H&A Vendors in both of those cities. Or maybe you are closer to a major metropolitan area in another state. Alternate sources for you for potential replacement service if you wind up with a straight out replacement policy.

 

[ame]

What town are you in? I am in St. Louis and they didn''t have any problem selling me just a jewelry policy.

If you want my Chubb agent''s name give me a PM and I can give it to you.

 

[denverappraiser]

jkb-222,

The agreement with the insurance company is to replace a lost item with another of ‘like kind and quality’ (usually). Where they get it is their problem, not yours. The appraisal that you turn in to the company at the time you bind the policy will be used as the definition for what is an acceptable replacement and a properly done appraisal will include this information. If the H&A pattern is an important value element in your stone, make sure it’s discussed in the appraisal along with photos of the pattern, the designers name and any other information that you or your appraiser consider critical. This is part of why it’s worth the money to hire a professional appraiser instead of relying on the abbreviated reports supplied by many of the sellers (including Whiteflash). Although the insurance company will accept almost anything, you should hold out for a service that protects your own interests as well as those of the company.
The appraisal becomes part of the contract with the company and it constitutes a statement from you about what is being insured. This is the reason that they have YOU find the appraiser instead of using one of their own. Pay attention to what it says.

Neil Beaty
GG(GIA) ISA NAJA
Independent Appraisals in Denver

 

[jkb_222]

Wow,

thanks everyone, I wasn''t expecting this kind of response.

I have found a Chubb agent in town that will do just the engagement ring. He''s quoting me 112 a year, but that is the price I''ve given him for what I''ve paid, not the appraised value (haven''t received the ring/appraisal yet from whiteflash.) I assume you want to insure the appraisal value, right? In that case I''m sure that premium will go up a little. It also sounds like I should get another appraisal here in town for Chubb, and not just rely on the appraisal from Whiteflash.

112 sounded reasonable, although JM was around 80, but I guess it might be worth going with Chubb so I can just receive a check from them and replace it myself.

 

[FireGoddess]

I believe Chubb will only insure the ring for the appraisal value, and that has to include the stone in the ring. Your premium is based on that appraisal value, which can be quite a bit more than you actually paid for the ring. And I think getting the check is much better should you ever have to make a claim for sure, and worth a few extra dollars.

 

[ame]

Good deal man. Definitely have it insured with the appraised value.

 

[Mara]

I actually wanted to chime in with a different perspective regarding insuring the ring for appraisal value. First off, Chubb will appraise for appraisal or receipt value, depending on what you want. Or else they did when I first got my policy.

Secondly, insure the ring for *what you can replace it for*, assuming you didn't get any sort of excellent deal you can't match again. The reason I say this is because appraisals are usually pretty inflated, and if you paid $10k for your ring, but it appraised for $15k, that adds a HUGE amount onto your yearly premiums and for what? If you can replace that ring for $10k if it was stolen, lost etc, then why insure it for $15k unless you just want to make some money *in the event* something happens to it.

But then again, the chances of something actually happening to it are quite slim from what I have heard. Insurance is really kind of a sinkhole in terms of funds...you would probably only want to pay for it as long as you could not afford to replace the ring on your own. Once you can replace the ring on your own, why have insurance? It does add up over the years.

So really in the end it's your decision but imagine your premiums jumping up another $100 because you want to use the appraisal value? Then think about the odds of you taking that payout. In the end I would always go for price you paid, again assuming you could replace the ring for that amount, and maybe factor in some of the price hikes that are happening...because Chubb accounts for inflation per year, but the diamond hikes may be happening faster than they account for inflation. So if possible, insure for an amount slightly over what you paid but less than the inflated appraisal.

One last thing, you can also ask your appraiser to give you a very realistic appraisal amount, in which case I have seen them give less of that inflated appraisal amount...so maybe if you paid $10k then they may appraise it for $12k rather than the over inflated typical $15k. All appraisers are different, so some may just give realistic as typical while others may want to use that inflated value -- depending on who you deal with.

My two cents!

 

[FireGoddess]

I called 3 different Chubb agents just 2 weeks ago to get this done. All 3 I contacted would only insure the ring for the appraisal value, not for what I paid for it. I would have much rather paid insurance on receipt value, but they would not do this.

I think that the chances of something happening to the ring may be slim, but what if you want your stone reset? It is not an easy undertaking to find someone who will take responsibility for any damage done to the stone during setting, unless you bought the stone directly from them. Or if the stone gets chipped or scratched? It's not a common occurrence, but it does happen. And that's what insurance is for of course.

Still, if you can find someone to insure the ring for close to what you paid for it, I'm all for it. But nobody I contacted from both Chubb or Geico would do this.

Edit: I haven't tried telling the appraiser to give a "realistic" appraisal amount...would probably try this in the future.

 

[denverappraiser]

"Appraisal Value" is not some number that is defined as nutso high, even though many people and even some appraisers seem to think so. The appraisal should be a description of the piece and how it is reasonably expected relate to a particular marketplace. In the case of insurance replacement appraisals, the marketplace in question is the one in which the insurance company can be reasonably expected to make the replacement. You want an insurance policy that will cover that amount. Appraising for more than that is wasting your premium dollars and appraising for less will leave you underinsured. If your appraiser is doing their job, one of their first questions will be ''What is the function of this appraisal?'' or words to that effect. We ask this because it''s important to the valuation question even though it''s irrelevant to the gemological issues. Different answers to the function question can result in important differences in the value determination. Make sure that your appraiser understands what question you''re asking and then make sure they answer the question that you''ve asked.

The value conclusion is not the only element of an insurance appraisal. It''s not even the most important.

I agree with Mara''s post above. The insurance value should be for the amount that the company can be reasonably expected to replace the piece. As it happens, this should also be the appraised value for insurance replacement type appraisals.

Neil Beaty
GG(GIA) ISA NAJA
Independent Appraisals in Denver

 

[Mara]

FG...insurance is definitely a preference for people. Some insurance companies may not cover having someone else tinker with the ring (aka a reset) while some others cover everything under the sun except nuclear war, intentional damage and/or a natural occurance (aka earthquake where earth eats your ring!). So it really pays to find out WHAT the insurance policy covers before signing away as not all companies and policies will be the same.

In terms of what Chubb will and won''t do...they are FAMOUS for being really inconsistent with what they tell customers. There have been alot of posts on here about what one Chubb agent told them vs another. Sometimes they try to have you get renters or homeowners insurance through them, then tell you you can''t insure the ring with them unless you do so. Others have gotten around that by just calling agent after agent to see what the others say. There do seem to be some that will and won''t and possibly is the same regarding appraisal value vs receipt. When I got my policy 2 years ago, I went directly through Chubb (which is no longer possible) and they gave me the option. So unfortunately who REALLY knows what they will or won''t do since it seems that almost always people can find an agent to help them out in the end.

 

[solange]

An insurance agent my husband has property insured with was willing to get my ring insured through Chubb. However it is a large stone and the insurance was $750 a year for that ring alone.
We have our homeowners policy with Liberty Mutual and they were willling to give me their insurance for about $350. However their policy covers replacement and not a cash payout as Chubb does.

The first person I spoke with at Liberty Mutual gave me complete misinformation. He said it would only be insured if it was stolen and I had filed a police report. And he said breakage was not covered.

Fortunately I decided to check further and asked to speak with a manager. She said that my ring was insured under all circumstances--like if I dropped it down the drain, I would not have to file a police report.

She also informed me that the company has to make me whole. With the amount of information I had filed, it was unlikely that they would be able to replace the stone with something close enough to what i had and if they could not, they would just give me a check. She also said that if the stone broke, they might try to repair it if it were just a small chip on the girdle. But if the stone had to be reduced in size significantly, they would pay me.

I would have wound up paying more than twice the amount for, what to all intents and purposes, is what Chubb gives. It is also Liberty Mutual''s policy to factor in the increased cost if prices have gone up.