HoF Engagement Ring Dilemma

[NorthFace51]

Here''s the scoop: I have already visited a B&M specifically for the reason that they were a licensed HoF retailer. About 2 years ago, I went to another HoF licensed dealer, not knowing about HoF and I was blown away at how those babies sparkle (even in the natural light). The reason I didn''t go back to the other dealer was the condescending tone he used because I was not a gemologist, ie. grabbing my hand and moving it into the right position to view the diamond. This B&M has winows galore and only case lighting so he showed me a HoF in the natural light and (I have heard this from others as well), they glimmer so much that they appear to be larger. I have been reading all of these posts concerning HoF on how they pump up the price for brand name only, can get other H&A for cheaper, etc. I am in a bit of a pickle because no I have heard from the Devil''s Advocate. Right now I am looking at $8,350 for Hearts on Fire Dream Diamond, 0.787, H, VS2 which includes the Single Solitaire Chevron Setting (a platinum band with intricate hearts carved on the outside). I was looking at similar H&A designs and it seems to be fairly similar in price. Go with the H&F or seek alternatives? Thank you.

 

[belle]

hof are not worth the premium in my opinion. you can find a top quality h&a for much (much) less. i have directly compared whiteflash's aca's to hof and i like the aca's better. the prices are extremely competitive as well.

 

[ep6585]

Date: 10/7/2005 2:14:51 PM
Author:NorthFace51
Here''s the scoop: I have already visited a B&M specifically for the reason that they were a licensed HoF retailer. About 2 years ago, I went to another HoF licensed dealer, not knowing about HoF and I was blown away at how those babies sparkle (even in the natural light). The reason I didn''t go back to the other dealer was the condescending tone he used because I was not a gemologist, ie. grabbing my hand and moving it into the right position to view the diamond. This B&M has winows galore and only case lighting so he showed me a HoF in the natural light and (I have heard this from others as well), they glimmer so much that they appear to be larger. I have been reading all of these posts concerning HoF on how they pump up the price for brand name only, can get other H&A for cheaper, etc. I am in a bit of a pickle because no I have heard from the Devil''s Advocate. Right now I am looking at $8,350 for Hearts on Fire Dream Diamond, 0.787, H, VS2 which includes the Single Solitaire Chevron Setting (a platinum band with intricate hearts carved on the outside). I was looking at similar H&A designs and it seems to be fairly similar in price. Go with the H&F or seek alternatives? Thank you.

The HOF Dream is similar to the Jubilee cut. Check out GOG''s Website to look at the Jubilee diamonds.

 

[Demelza]

$8350 for a .78 H, VS2 is insane. I did a quick search here for H&A stones in that range and they start at about $3500. Just for the sake of comparison, here is a branded H&A from Whiteflash. It's a full carat, F color, SI1 for around 6K. I would definitely encourage you to look around before buying. I think you can do much better!

 

[icekid]

holy crap, that price is nothing short of exorbitant! I just would not pay that kind of money for a not even pushing 1 ct stone. You can do MUCH better, and I am sure your gf will thank you for it later.

 

[NorthFace51]

Yeah, I had my doubts. I called it off because it seems like I am getting hosed on this diamond deal. Does anybody know of a reputable diamond dealer in the San Francisco Bay Area?

Also does anybody know of a good way to insure a diamond if you don''t own a house?

Thanks

 

[ep6585]

Date: 10/7/2005 3:26:13 PM
Author: NorthFace51
Yeah, I had my doubts. I called it off because it seems like I am getting hosed on this diamond deal. Does anybody know of a reputable diamond dealer in the San Francisco Bay Area?

Also does anybody know of a good way to insure a diamond if you don''t own a house?

Thanks

This LINK from last year talks about seeing a Jubilee in person at a store in the SF area. The jeweler is Geoffrey''s and is located in San Carlos, California in the SF Bay Area.

 

[aljdewey]

Date: 10/7/2005 3:26:13 PM
Author: NorthFace51

Also does anybody know of a good way to insure a diamond if you don''t own a house?

Yep.....one easy way is to get renter''s insurance, and do a jewelry rider to it.

 

[ame]

You can get Chubb or JM insurance without owning a house.

I suggest you call Good Old Gold. They sell Jubilees and I think you will be glad to deal with Jonathon. If you are looking for a square stone, this is the one for you. They are beautiful and Jonathon''s service is the best there is.

 

[Mara]

Date: 10/7/2005 4:40:30 PM
Author: ep6585

Date: 10/7/2005 3:26:13 PM
Author: NorthFace51
Yeah, I had my doubts. I called it off because it seems like I am getting hosed on this diamond deal. Does anybody know of a reputable diamond dealer in the San Francisco Bay Area?

Also does anybody know of a good way to insure a diamond if you don''t own a house?

Thanks

This LINK from last year talks about seeing a Jubilee in person at a store in the SF area. The jeweler is Geoffrey''s and is located in San Carlos, California in the SF Bay Area.

I would DEFINITELY check out Geoffreys...if you have the opportunity to see a Jubilee in person before buying, I would recommend it over buying online. They are different breeds than rounds..if you were not near a Jubilee dealer then online would be fine, but I''d definitely take this opportunity to go visit Geoffrey''s and see them in person to see what you think.

I loved the HOF Dreams but the 40% markup over other diamonds REALLY turned us off big time. I could have only gotten a .80ctw stone...whereas we ended up with a ~1.25c stone by going elsewhere for less $$$. Just an FYI re costs!!

 

[aljdewey]

Date: 10/7/2005 8:43:06 PM
Author: Mara

I would DEFINITELY check out Geoffreys...if you have the opportunity to see a Jubilee in person before buying, I would recommend it over buying online. They are different breeds than rounds..if you were not near a Jubilee dealer then online would be fine, but I'd definitely take this opportunity to go visit Geoffrey's and see them in person to see what you think.

I loved the HOF Dreams but the 40% markup over other diamonds REALLY turned us off big time. I could have only gotten a .80ctw stone...whereas we ended up with a ~1.25c stone by going elsewhere for less $$$. Just an FYI re costs!!

OOOOOOOOOOOooooo, Geoffrey's! I was gonna try to stop in there last year when Rich and I were out there for our honeymoon. I've not seen the Jube in person, and I heard great things about them.....I think from that same thread. Also, wasn't there a gal about 8 months ago who raved about them?

I'd love to see one in person...maybe if I can get to visit Mara this year, we can storm them next! LOL

 

[NorthFace51]

There is irony in the situation after I told the salesman about my decision to seek another type of diamond, he said that he didn't do a good enough job convincing me about just how truly great the HoF diamonds are and his job/reputation is built on HoF (I guess he was insinuating with the latter that I question why he has a job). He went into explain that other diamonds just don't sparkle like the HoF diamonds (which was funny because the color and clarity, as noted in my original post, were lower than other quality diamonds that I am now scouting). Then he pulls this line....In the end, the cost will be forgotten and then (he uses my gf's name) will probably never know about the sparkle you could have got her. He said that I will always regret no making the moment special with an HoF and will instead use a cheap substitute. I thought that was a low blow. Just made me glad that I chose to take my business elsewhere.

Funny thing about all of this is that I used to be one of their biggest fans, telling everybody about their diamonds and how great they are, had my doubts, checked this website, saw the very valuable information, and now I am firmly against HoF because they really don't sell that much better of a diamon at 2 to 3 times the cost. I am now a firm believer in pricescope.com. (and no I wasn't paid to say that)

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

Date: 10/7/2005 9:41:54 PM
Author: NorthFace51
I am now a firm believer in pricescope.com. (and no I wasn''t paid to say that)

Point of order. Pricescope is a consumer advocate website that brings vendors (who pay to be present for ads and listings) and consumers together.
You can believe in Pricscope, but you can not buy a diamond FROM Pricescope, only thru the PS portal.

(*•.¸(`*•.¸¸.•*´)¸.•*)
¨`•.¸ *belle*¸.• ´¨ WROTE:
"hof are not worth the premium in my opinion."
Belle I think this would be a better bit of grammar "in my opinion, hof are not worth the premium."

HoF have invested in a brand that is successful in adding a perception of value, just as Tiffany have. If a GF spins out on other people spinning out over the brand, then that is all fair in love and war.

I have consistently better looking diamonds than Tiffany, but I can not sell as many diamonds for as high a price / margin as Tiffany. I also can not tell anyone not to buy a Tiffany diamond. I can imply a to a potential client that we have the best diamonds available and present our goods and prices; but i can not say to a potential client that ours are better and they are cheaper.

 

[ame]

Date: 10/7/2005 9:41:54 PM
Author: NorthFace51
There is irony in the situation after I told the salesman about my decision to seek another type of diamond, he said that he didn''t do a good enough job convincing me about just how truly great the HoF diamonds are and his job/reputation is built on HoF (I guess he was insinuating with the latter that I question why he has a job). He went into explain that other diamonds just don''t sparkle like the HoF diamonds (which was funny because the color and clarity, as noted in my original post, were lower than other quality diamonds that I am now scouting). Then he pulls this line....In the end, the cost will be forgotten and then (he uses my gf''s name) will probably never know about the sparkle you could have got her. He said that I will always regret no making the moment special with an HoF and will instead use a cheap substitute. I thought that was a low blow. Just made me glad that I chose to take my business elsewhere.


Funny thing about all of this is that I used to be one of their biggest fans, telling everybody about their diamonds and how great they are, had my doubts, checked this website, saw the very valuable information, and now I am firmly against HoF because they really don''t sell that much better of a diamon at 2 to 3 times the cost. I am now a firm believer in pricescope.com. (and no I wasn''t paid to say that)

Make sure you and your soon-to-be go in their with your new sparkler and shove it into his fat head.

 

[belle]

Date: 10/7/2005 10:22:46 PM
Author: Garry H (Cut Nut)


'hof are not worth the premium in my opinion.'
Belle I think this would be a better bit of grammar 'in my opinion, hof are not worth the premium.'

okay...

Date: 10/7/2005 10:22:46 PM
Author: Garry H (Cut Nut)


HoF have invested in a brand that is successful in adding a perception of value, just as Tiffany have.

hof have invested in a brand that is successful in adding a perception of value, just as tiffany has.

i will change change mine if you will change yours

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

2 shey
(the French word

for ya got me)

 

[ame]

touché?

 

[aljdewey]

Date: 10/7/2005 9:41:54 PM
Author: NorthFace51

Then he pulls this line....In the end, the cost will be forgotten and then (he uses my gf''s name) will probably never know about the sparkle you could have got her. He said that I will always regret no making the moment special with an HoF and will instead use a cheap substitute.

This is just so disappointing. I can''t believe folks still try to equate how much a man spends to how "special" the engagement is, or how he will have regrets. That is just SUCH a shameful tactic....no matter who uses it.

It''s this type of crap that I really hate to see....it really hurts the industry, and those who *don''t* resort to that have to work ten times harder to gain credibility because of the few that do this.

Glad to see you walked the business elsewhere.

 

[aljdewey]

Date: 10/7/2005 10:22:46 PM
Author: Garry H (Cut Nut)







"hof are not worth the premium in my opinion.'
Belle I think this would be a better bit of grammar 'in my opinion, hof are not worth the premium.'

"Hearts on Fire" is the brand name....and it's only one brand name. Just like "Microsoft" is a single brand. As such, it should be "HOF is not worth the premium......"

If it were said as "HOF diamonds", then it would be "are".

 

[valeria101]

Good grammar or bad grammar... if that sort of brand value is all in the good vibes, than this is no place to listen to them.

Besides, isn''t that a bad thing to say about the poor brand? Between ''word of mouth'' and ''thin air''

there isn''t allot of difference.

Oh well, I kind of feel naughtly.

 

[phoenixgirl]

looking for some clarification . . . were you looking at the HOF round or dream stones? Everyone is saying this and that about the Jubilee, but I thought maybe you were looking at rounds. ???

Anyway, I''m glad you didn''t pay $8500 for that stone! My goodness gracious!

 

[NorthFace51]

No, it was a dream diamond. He even gave the me serial number that was inscribed in the stone.
Oh, Gary, that was a shot at irony and I am sorry that you didn''t understand the joke.

 

[IrishEyes]

Hey there! Ok, here''s the deal. I work at a place that carries HOF - both the dream and the rounds. I will say this much: they ARE amazing diamonds!! They are even running a campaign right now called the "wow" campaign because of the simple fact that almost 99% of people breathe an exclamatory "WOW!" when they view the perfect hearts and arrows of the HOF round stones. They do sparkle considerably more than MOST (not all) diamonds. The cutters have great technology to get it right all the time. Yada yada yada.

That being said, here''s my view: Yes, you CAN get a "comparable" diamond for much cheaper. HOF is branded, as many have said before, and you are paying for that, as well as the great cut. My feelings on the dream are not as kind as my feelings on the round brilliant. Reason being, the dream is supposed to be HOF''s rendition of the princess cut (with clipped corners though). The idea of the dream is the have the brilliance of a round with the shape of a princess. The only problem is, the spread of the dream is nowhere near that of a regular princess (most of the time, depending on the cut of the princess you are comparing it to). They are just not cut to be very big. So while they do sparkle quite nicely, you can take a well-cut princess, say 1 carat, and compare it to a dream of the same size, and 9 out of 10 times, the princess will look bigger. So why pay x amount of dollars more for the dream when you are getting a wonderful princess that looks bigger and is less expensive?? So I will try to talk you out of spending your cash on the dream!

Basically, people are afraid of branded diamonds usually, because "branded" implies "expensive", and usually, that is the reality. However, the round HOF IS a phenomenal diamond! Your jeweler dealt you a low-blow, a very unprofessional comment, and you should run like the wind away from HIM. Don''t discount the diamonds though! Just because he is an a**hole doesn''t mean his merchandise isn''t worth it! Basically, what it all comes down to is this: what is it worth to YOU and your GF??? What does SHE want? And please don''t get too hung up on the numbers and such. The job of a diamond is to reflect light and sparkle. Period. This means you need to use your eyes!!! If she wants size over sparke, well then, that''s what she wants. If she wants a modest yet knock-your-socks-off sparkly stone, find it and go for it - whether it be an HOF or not!!

I hope this all helps!! Good luck, i''m curious to see what your next move is!!!

 

[WinkHPD]

Nice commentary Irish eyes! Thank you for your insights.

I agree that the salesman made a poor job of presenting his case. I actually dissagree with him that other diamonds are not equally beautiful too. I have seen only a few of the HOF and they were indeed nice stones, but so are many of the other H&A diamonds that I have seen by other cutters. I have seen some that I consider to be superior to the HOF, especially through the various viewing scopes, but visually they are very hard to tell apart.

I have not yet seen the Dream so I can not specifically comment on it.

Wink

 

[perry]

Irish:

Glad you got the job you were looking for....

I have always presented the HOF, and 8*, diamonds as a great diamond, and should a person have the $ and the desire to own one... No issue from me. Just because others would not spend the money does not make it a bad choice for others.

Best of luck with your job; keep me posted.

Perry

 

[Sundial]

Thank you for your comments Irish Eyes. It is nice to hear from someone on this forum who actually works with HOF diamonds. My husband chose a three stone anniversary ring for me with HOF round diamonds and it will knock your socks off in any light. There is no question in my mind that I could have found a comparable ring for less money from an online vendor, but he wanted to deal with a local jeweler with whom we have a relationship. That added value to the purchase as far as he was concerned and I couldn't be more thrilled with the ring. One thing about it if I have a problem with the pave on my band or something else I can take it in to be taken care of by someone I know and not have to mail it off. Online purchases are great, but other options are not necessarily bad.

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

We think about 3/4''s of people making a big diamond purchase do a bit of internet research.
But we know that 90% buy in local stores.

This thread shows that this is normal. We tend to hear more around here from converted online shoppers. That is normal, because this is a slightly autistic geeky nerdy environment (present company included).

http://images.google.com/images?sourceid=navclient&ie=UTF-8&rls=GGLG,GGLG:2005-20,GGLG:en&q=geeks

But fellow geeks - remember, the normal people buy in local stores because they percieve additional value that might be hard for nerdishy folk to understand. But try hard, and understand that paying X0% is clearly ok for 90% of folks.

http://images.google.com/images?sourceid=navclient&ie=UTF-8&rls=GGLG,GGLG:2005-20,GGLG:en&q=normal+people

 

[valeria101]

Date: 10/10/2005 7:31:12 AM
Author: Garry H (Cut Nut)


But fellow geeks - remember, the normal people buy in local stores because they percieve additional value that might be hard for nerdishy folk to understand.

Hm... could it be that impresionistic diamond displays are only in their infancy on the net?

Seriously, it is easy to understand why someone would not even think about spending months sorting through mounds of random tid bits about that engagement ring. There should be more important things to take care of in the meantime.

But try hard, and understand that paying X0% is clearly ok for 90% of folks.

So is here, as much as I can tell.

 

[Mara]

Hey....three years of research and countless woman-hours on Pricescope and I am now "well-equipped" to save us 40% markup by buying unbranded H&A's vs some brands (Tiffany, HOF). Greg should be thanking me!

Oh yeah....but there is that pesky little side effect of total and complete DIAMOND ADDICTION that he may be a little miffed about...sheesh!!! Details details!!

Autistic, Garry? YIKES. and I just thought we were all high-strung!

 

[NorthFace51]

So here was my next move: I took a little drive down to Geoffrey''s in San Carlos, as my parent''s have had their rings fine-tuned their and my father has bought my mother jewelry from there as well. Also, I have seen some recommendations on this website to make a stop there. Top grade performance. I took in my set of specs and Andy was very impressed with what I was looking for in a diamond. I knew my stuff now, mainly because I have been looking for a while but with special help from this website needs to be mentioned. She even recommended that jewelry store lighting can make most diamonds "sparkle" but we took most of them out into the natural light, where you will see them most of the time. Most are very comparable. She showed me a variety of types but I wanted to stick with the round brilliant, as it is the best cut. Then she showed me the Jubilee...Honestly, this is VERY comparable to the HoF Dream. If you weren''t an expert, which most people are not, you wouldn''t be able to tell the difference. A very gorgeous cut. I will have the specs later but I am very impressed with the service.