GIA colored stone ID....500 gemstones?!?

[RockHugger]

I am signing up for my last 2 GIA classes (the 2 colored stone classes), and I am told there are 500 gemstones I need to identify :- O.

Now the amount of stones isnt a huge deal to ID....the bad part is they only send 10 at a time so it will take flipping FOREVER to complete this class.

Are there any GGs out there that were able to get more then 10 stones at a time? If I do 10 a week, it will take me 50 weeks to complete this class. Thats insane!

I am playing phone tag with my instructor so no answer from him yet about it.

 

[Jim Rentfrow]

There are labs they do around the country which make it so you can almost get them done in a week or two. Plus I think I had two stone sets at a time when I was doing my stone sets.

 

[RockHugger]

The only labs they have now are carlsbrad and NYC. They closed the chicago one till further notice. I am in MI, so 2 weeks in NYC is impossable for me. I am going to ask him about getting 2 or 3 sets at a time. I dont want to be in the program for the rest of the year.

 

[Jim Rentfrow]

I think there is one in Vegas this year as well. I know they had ones in Minneapolis before, which is where I did mine, but I didnt have time to do my 20 stone at that lab. I will have to fly out to Carlsbad or NYC to finish it unfortunately. But it will be nice to have it done. I am still trying to decide if I want a FGA and BsC as well.

 

[Pandora II]

Date: 3/9/2010 1:58:26 PM
Author: Jim Rentfrow
I think there is one in Vegas this year as well. I know they had ones in Minneapolis before, which is where I did mine, but I didnt have time to do my 20 stone at that lab. I will have to fly out to Carlsbad or NYC to finish it unfortunately. But it will be nice to have it done. I am still trying to decide if I want a FGA and BsC as well.

Jim, I''m in the middle of the FGA at the moment if you''ve got any questions - I''m live in London so I''m doing it at Gem-A HQ. It seems very different to the GG from what I''ve heard and seen. The quickest you can do it is on-site full-time which is 5 months. I do the evening classes 2 nights a week and it takes 18 months, or you can do it via DL which is about 2 years plus 2 practical sessions.

The FGA is very hot on memorization: things like spectra, chemical compositions, crystal systems for all the different gem groups and knowing how to explain the science behind all the equipment (so strong grasp of optics, colour theory and physics .... oh how I wish I was a physicist in some classes). I have pictures of different absorbtion spectra stuck on my bedroom wall at the moment so I can learn the patterns off!

There''s no ''300 Stone ID'' section or anything, but there are Workbooks that have to be completed and signed off before you can take the exam which cover practical use of all the instruments and pages and pages of Stone Observation to do.

The exam papers are truly frightening even at Foundation level... closed book and all full written answers, diagram drawing and no multi-choice - the failure rate is high I''ve heard (pass grade is 70%). I have a load of past papers and they make me feel slightly queasy.

There was an interesting discussion on another professional forum about people''s experiences at the different schools. A number have people have said that the two complement each other. A quote I liked was

"If you love science, attend the Gem-A. If you want a broader overview of the entire industry attend GIA. If you want to be near the action and get a good view of the colored stone market and corundum, attend AIGS."


I was more interested in the theory than in ''the industry'' (hey that''s what PS is for

), so the FGA was a good choice for me.

 

[RockHugger]

Date: 3/10/2010 7:31:28 AM
Author: Pandora II

Date: 3/9/2010 1:58:26 PM
Author: Jim Rentfrow
I think there is one in Vegas this year as well. I know they had ones in Minneapolis before, which is where I did mine, but I didnt have time to do my 20 stone at that lab. I will have to fly out to Carlsbad or NYC to finish it unfortunately. But it will be nice to have it done. I am still trying to decide if I want a FGA and BsC as well.

Jim, I''m in the middle of the FGA at the moment if you''ve got any questions - I''m live in London so I''m doing it at Gem-A HQ. It seems very different to the GG from what I''ve heard and seen. The quickest you can do it is on-site full-time which is 5 months. I do the evening classes 2 nights a week and it takes 18 months, or you can do it via DL which is about 2 years plus 2 practical sessions.

The FGA is very hot on memorization: things like spectra, chemical compositions, crystal systems for all the different gem groups and knowing how to explain the science behind all the equipment (so strong grasp of optics, colour theory and physics .... oh how I wish I was a physicist in some classes). I have pictures of different absorbtion spectra stuck on my bedroom wall at the moment so I can learn the patterns off!

There''s no ''300 Stone ID'' section or anything, but there are Workbooks that have to be completed and signed off before you can take the exam which cover practical use of all the instruments and pages and pages of Stone Observation to do.

The exam papers are truly frightening even at Foundation level... closed book and all full written answers, diagram drawing and no multi-choice - the failure rate is high I''ve heard (pass grade is 70%). I have a load of past papers and they make me feel slightly queasy.

There was an interesting discussion on another professional forum about people''s experiences at the different schools. A number have people have said that the two complement each other. A quote I liked was

''If you love science, attend the Gem-A. If you want a broader overview of the entire industry attend GIA. If you want to be near the action and get a good view of the colored stone market and corundum, attend AIGS.''


I was more interested in the theory than in ''the industry'' (hey that''s what PS is for

), so the FGA was a good choice for me.

Oh man, that sounds terrifying. I guess I need to be thankful for my mutiple choice LOL!!

 

[Pandora II]

Date: 3/10/2010 7:59:01 AM
Author: RockHugger


Oh man, that sounds terrifying. I guess I need to be thankful for my mutiple choice LOL!!

Is the whole final exam multiple choice?

 

[Arkteia]

Date: 3/10/2010 7:31:28 AM
Author: Pandora II

Date: 3/9/2010 1:58:26 PM
Author: Jim Rentfrow
I think there is one in Vegas this year as well. I know they had ones in Minneapolis before, which is where I did mine, but I didnt have time to do my 20 stone at that lab. I will have to fly out to Carlsbad or NYC to finish it unfortunately. But it will be nice to have it done. I am still trying to decide if I want a FGA and BsC as well.

Jim, I''m in the middle of the FGA at the moment if you''ve got any questions - I''m live in London so I''m doing it at Gem-A HQ. It seems very different to the GG from what I''ve heard and seen. The quickest you can do it is on-site full-time which is 5 months. I do the evening classes 2 nights a week and it takes 18 months, or you can do it via DL which is about 2 years plus 2 practical sessions.

The FGA is very hot on memorization: things like spectra, chemical compositions, crystal systems for all the different gem groups and knowing how to explain the science behind all the equipment (so strong grasp of optics, colour theory and physics .... oh how I wish I was a physicist in some classes). I have pictures of different absorbtion spectra stuck on my bedroom wall at the moment so I can learn the patterns off!

There''s no ''300 Stone ID'' section or anything, but there are Workbooks that have to be completed and signed off before you can take the exam which cover practical use of all the instruments and pages and pages of Stone Observation to do.

The exam papers are truly frightening even at Foundation level... closed book and all full written answers, diagram drawing and no multi-choice - the failure rate is high I''ve heard (pass grade is 70%). I have a load of past papers and they make me feel slightly queasy.

There was an interesting discussion on another professional forum about people''s experiences at the different schools. A number have people have said that the two complement each other. A quote I liked was

''If you love science, attend the Gem-A. If you want a broader overview of the entire industry attend GIA. If you want to be near the action and get a good view of the colored stone market and corundum, attend AIGS.''


I was more interested in the theory than in ''the industry'' (hey that''s what PS is for

), so the FGA was a good choice for me.

And if you just need to see what the stone is worth? Just for your own practical needs? Not for a degree, not for the market, but just to make fewer mistakes when you are looking at the stone? For yourself?

I''d do very well in physics and I love science but I plan to take course at my own pace because honestly, unless I plan to make $$ by appraising stones, and I do not, it is not worth while to rush through the classes. So I need something that would give me strong practical basis.

 

[Jim Rentfrow]

I have heard that about a FGA compared to a GG, another post I saw stated, "A FGA basically is about how to take the science of gemology and dumb it down and talk to a fifth grader. Being able to explain things in very simple terms and identify the science behind the gemology. A GG is more about the industry." I think both would compliment each other, and the idea of studying in London and making professional networks is appealing to me.

 

[Pandora II]

Date: 3/10/2010 12:14:38 PM
Author: Jim Rentfrow
I have heard that about a FGA compared to a GG, another post I saw stated, ''A FGA basically is about how to take the science of gemology and dumb it down and talk to a fifth grader. Being able to explain things in very simple terms and identify the science behind the gemology. A GG is more about the industry.'' I think both would compliment each other, and the idea of studying in London and making professional networks is appealing to me.

LOL!

Sounds about right. Sadly explaining things in 5th Grade terms means that you have to understand them pretty darn well to do it that simply... a bit like French Grammar.

In a way it''s a bit like a drive-by poster on PS dropping in and saying what is Be Treatment - you could link them to 5 page articles or give them the ''PS Concise Guide to Be Enhancement'' in a fairly thick paragraph!

London is fun, and the HQ is right in the heart of the Jewellery Quarter. If you do come, be prepared for shock at what the place looks like (and watch your fingers in the grille on the lift door

) - it''s not glamorous!

 

[Jim Rentfrow]

Do you have any pictures of the place?

 

[Pandora II]

Date: 3/10/2010 11:28:38 AM
Author: crasru

And if you just need to see what the stone is worth? Just for your own practical needs? Not for a degree, not for the market, but just to make fewer mistakes when you are looking at the stone? For yourself?

I''d do very well in physics and I love science but I plan to take course at my own pace because honestly, unless I plan to make $$ by appraising stones, and I do not, it is not worth while to rush through the classes. So I need something that would give me strong practical basis.

It''s not that one course teaches one thing and the other something else, there is just a different emphasis.

The FGA is strong on the practical side - their way of doing it (or at least my tutor''s way) is to chuck you a stone and in return he''d like a labelled drawing showing all the features, a description of the crystal system with sketch, a description of the tests you would carry out and what you think the result might be for each. Oh, and while you''re at it could you explain how the different tests work and what optical/chemical or whatever properties they demonstrate.

We do a lot of synthetics and for those, the above applies, but you have to identify the type of synthetic and be able to describe the process with diagrams.

At the moment we can use books up to a point but for the exams you only get a sheet with the SG and RI of different stones and nothing else.

For all I know, not having done the GG, this is exactly the same way it''s done there. Rockhugger can you comment on how the Stone ID works?

Where the FGA isn''t particularly focused is on the commercial elements, so they don''t teach you marketing or sales stuff. If you were hiring for a retail store you''d probably want a GG rather than an FGA.

IMHO, to know what a stone is worth is far more about experience and being out there and looking at what things cost and what''s available and what is big at any one time. It''s not something you can really ''learn'' from a course.

To answer your initial questions, I have several years experience in the trade - as a designer and as a stone buyer. I have maintained my contacts and added new ones.

I''m not shy and I spend plenty of time with dealers looking at their stock - sometimes I even buy something

- it seems that gem obsessives are not that common and when I go in, they''ll often get out something special just because they know I''d be interested. On the whole, people like to share knowledge and teach so I get taken under people''s wings and learn what I can from them. Being a designer also helps - I can swap design help for info on things like what they are paying their wholesalers for certain things.

Although I''d like to go back into the industry - hopefully as a stone buyer - my personal interests are more academic. I''m fascinated by garnets, not just because they''re pretty, but they are also fascinating stones because of the isomorphous replacement in the species. There is still no satisfying accepted way of saying exactly where a spessartite stops being a spessartite and becomes a pyrope or an almandine... what proportion of spessartite should there be in a stone to give it that name? These conundrums are the things that really excite me as far as my hobby side is concerned.

(The FGA can be taken by distance learning at your own pace and they operate a stone ''lending library'' that supplies you with study stones if you don''t want to collect your own)

 

[Pandora II]

Date: 3/10/2010 2:21:04 PM
Author: Jim Rentfrow
Do you have any pictures of the place?

Fraid not, but google maps should have an outside view - it''s on the corner of Greville Street and Saffron Hill.

It''s based over 4 floors, with a small office and a large teaching room on each of the 2nd, 3rd and 4th floors. First floor has a shop and I think the admin offices. The lift is truly terrifying to open, but the steep stairs are too exhausting for lazy me since I''m always on the top floor.
It''s all fairly dilapidated - until you get to the equipment and then it''s great! Looks aren''t what count to me, but it''s a definite contrast to the GIA HQ - mind you central London prices are excruciating for rental/purchase.

(There''s a fab pub - The Bleeding Heart - with amazing food a mere 50 feet away)