Getting a House is Getting to me...

[Amethyste]

well...
I am petty upset - i was at work today bawling my eyes out
here we are 2 days prior to closing.... and we are denied our loan.
Why? Because we are unable to provide the lender with college transcripts from 2003 to 2008 for my husband.
He is German and was attending German universities ( 2 of them ), their grading system is not like in the USA, and
there are no transcripts. If you transfer from a University, the former one sends in your courses and if you passed of failed.
Don't you try to get them for yourself cause they wont give them to you...

I just cannot believe this...

Now we are going to try with a different lender, and try to extend the agreement to a couple of weeks out..

I just want to cry ( i did, but more... )

Advice? comments?

 

[Tacori E-ring]

Sorry! Hope it works out for you. I know how frustrating getting loans/home closings are.

 

[Haven]

I'm so sorry, Amey! That's awfully frustrating.

Hopefully another lender won't require the transcripts. I don't recall having to submit transcripts when we bought our house, and the entire mortgage was in my name alone. Here's hoping you'll be able to get another loan by your closing date!

 

[onedrop]

I am sorry to hear about the issues with the lender Amyethyste. Hopefully another lender will be more flexible. I am curious as to why the other lender needed transcripts from your husband in order to obtain a mortgage? I don't recall being asked for this information when I applied for a mortgage years ago.

 

[PinkTower]

Wow. I have bought many houses, townhouses,+ condos over the years. I have never been asked for anything other than financial documents. Hopefully some PS member who is a realtor will read this and comment.

 

[Mara]

Ditto the others that our lender never required transcripts of schooling.

 

[Tacori E-ring]

When I bought my first house, I was really young (22-23, can't quite remember) and the lender did want to see a transcript or proof of graduating. This was for a stated loan which no longer in exist but they wanted it proof for earning potential. Didn't know they still did that.

 

[Maisie]

Is your husband German? Maybe its more to do with his nationality. I hope that it gets sorted for you soon. I know you must feel incredibly stressed.

 

[Dancing Fire]

I'm so sorry, Amey! That's awfully frustrating.

Hopefully another lender won't require the transcripts. I don't recall having to submit transcripts when we bought our house, and the entire mortgage was in my name alone. Here's hoping you'll be able to get another loan by your closing date!

yeah,sounds strange what if i never attened any colleges?

 

[iota15]

Regardless of whether it is a strange practice, the fact remains that college transcripts were requested, and no institution is obliged to give you money, especially if you cannot fulfill their requirements - whatever they are.

I'm sorry to hear this, Ame. I hope you'll get the extension. Will the mortgagor take anything in lieu? Instead of a transcript, will they accept an official letter setting out his degree and completion of requirements from that college? How about references from his professors? You can have any letters in German translated by a certified interpreter to English.

 

[lyra]

Sounds crazy to me, but things are so much simpler in Canada. I really hope you can find another lender. Good luck!!

 

[Amethyste]

Is your husband German? Maybe its more to do with his nationality. I hope that it gets sorted for you soon. I know you must feel incredibly stressed.

yes, he is German. Maybe the audit lady didn't like his name, or got badly ill eating some saurkraut... I donno.
You have to show 2 years of working history. If you cannot, they usually want to see transcripts from school and a correlation between the job you do with what you went to school for. He works for the National Visa center and he goes over potential fraudulent documents that are submitted from immigrants which is in his schooling line ( translation etc ). With the immigration laws, when he came here, it took 6 months before he was given a greencard, so he obided the law by NOT working, they made a note of it and accepted that fact ( it's the law ) and have requested proof of last semester's University attendance. So we sent them completion course cards which has the seal of the University, the name of the teacher and a pass or fail grade. THat's how they do it. There is no transcripts. That is what I sent the lender, from 2003 to 2008. Can you believe the massive fax/email/scan that was? Still, it was not official enough for her.
For my husband to get anything MORE official than that, he'd have to fly all the way to the 2 university he frequented to request such paper in person. And that doesn't even guarantee he'd get anything other than that either.

Our closing WAS This Friday the 30th, but it will not happen. now I need to cancel my moving van, reverse the electric, the cable, the propane and some other pending cosmetic work that was to be done on the house in the mid-next week. The sellers agreed to extend the closing date, they have no problem with it and understand the tedious paperwork required. But I still feel terrible. It really hurts to be down the wire and be told no. Even when we were given a loan approval on the 23rd of July.

I am really thinking though, and my mortgage broker agrees, we most likely have been discriminated against. - There is no way my husband should provide 7+ years of transcripts. Even my father in law wrote a letter explaining how the system works over there and that what we submitted was all they have as well. Nope,that didn't matter.

I just hope that the next lender can be helpful and help us.

THANKS TO ALL THE DUMBA$$ES that got loans that were way too hefty for their little pockets coupled with agreeable and loose lenders - which in turns crashed the economy, foreclosures galore! Makes it nearly impossible for us - who are qualified to get a loan - to get a home that wecan actually afford! Makes me sick to my stomach

 

[Amethyste]

Regardless of whether it is a strange practice, the fact remains that college transcripts were requested, and no institution is obliged to give you money, especially if you cannot fulfill their requirements - whatever they are.

I'm sorry to hear this, Ame. I hope you'll get the extension. Will the mortgagor take anything in lieu? Instead of a transcript, will they accept an official letter setting out his degree and completion of requirements from that college? How about references from his professors? You can have any letters in German translated by a certified interpreter to English.

But come on... 7 years?! That's really unheard of. 2 is usually what they require. I DID give them the transcripts they asked, it's just not in the same format as in the USA and that's what she didn't like. There is no way I can give her transcripts that do not exist.
We have given them what we had and everything was translated as well. the professors write those classes completion courses, sign them and then the registar's office apply the official stamp on it. Doesn't get any more official than that. That's all is given to the students and even in between universities when a student needs to transfer.

 

[neatfreak]

It is getting really hard to close loans. Underwriters are doing what they should have been doing all along--but now have swung too far to the other side IMO.

I wouldn't go screaming about discrimination. The lender is about to make a large loan to you and is allowed to ask whatever they want from you to be satisfied that you can/will pay the mortgage back. It isn't discrimination just because they want more years of transcripts from you compared to others just as it isn't discrimination if they want different insurance documents from someone else.

We also were asked for our degrees/transcripts when we purchased our house because we were both finishing PhD programs and so had been in school for many years. It *is* a common practice if you go from earning very little, to earning much more, i.e., when you graduate school and begin working in the "real world". They want to be sure that what you are earning now isn't a fluke and that you continue to have the same earnings potential later.

If I were you, I would call the lender, ask to speak to the underwriter if you can, and ask her what documents you could provide her that would satisfy the requirement. Perhaps a letter from his boss stating the intent to keep him employed, a letter from a dean-type person at his school in Germany affirming his enrollment, other types of records that might label him as a student in those years, etc.

There likely will be a way around this but you might need to get creative. And if there isn't a way around this then something else is spooking them about approving your loan so you may want to investigate more to find out why. Transcripts shouldn't be a dealbreaker if you can get them some other type of documentation.

 

[Upgradable]

I've got nothing constructive to add. I just wanted to give Ames a big ole (((((HUG)))))!

Buying a house is the most stressful experience I've ever had! And I've birthed and am raising two teenagers!

I hope you get some resolution soon.

 

[NewEnglandLady]

Amethyste, I just wanted to offer some support and say that I'm really sorry you're going through this. Two days before closing? You must have been completely devastated when you found out! Are the sellers willing to extend the closing date for you without penalty?

I agree with NF--I would be on the phone with my underwriter asking if there is anything you can provide in lieu of transcripts? Maybe just a letter from the university stating that your husband was a student from xx date to xx date (the HR department should be able to fax something within a couple of hours). Or maybe there is a way around it altogether?

My DH is the only one on our loan, but he did have to provide transcripts--he quit his job for 6 months to go to grad school, then resumed his career--so that situation was more unique.

Good luck!!

ETA: I just saw that they need something more official than what you've already provided. UGH! And I'm glad the sellers were willing to push it back--I know this is all a major pain in the dupah for you, I just hope that in a couple of weeks it will all be over!!

 

[zoebartlett]

I had written out a whole response, but it was essentially the same as what NF and NEL had written. I don't think this is discrimination, and I'd be careful of using that word with the lenders. It's unfortunate that your lender isn't accepting the documentation you've provided, but it is within that company's right to ask you to for additional information if that's what it will take.

I do feel for you because I'm sure it hurts to have to hold off on closing and moving, and I hope things will work out in the end.

 

[Amethyste]

thanks to everyone who has taken the time to respond.

We DID provide all that she requested - we complied with every little requests and we understand the process. But it comes to the fact that she doesn't like the format the transcripts are given in Germany. She wants something like in the USA. It is 2 different countries with 2 different systems and grade points. She won't budge about it. We lost our loan on a technicality that the lender was not able to see that there is no other formats available and make a note in the file.
my husband did ask his university - and he would have to go and make a request in person. and they would give him exactly what we have here. what's the point? There is nothing more we can do transcript wise. She is not accepting that it is how they do it over there. We gave her the number of the registrar's - but she will not call. And a letter from them won't matter either. It's a lost battle - there will not be any resolution to this hiccup.

That's it. Byebye - baby goes to sleep.

 

[iheartscience]

Can you speak to someone higher up than the underwriter? If not, I'd talk to another lender ASAP-that's all you can do. Good luck!

 

[neatfreak]

I'm sorry that you are so down about this-but I wouldn't give up yet personally! Transcripts are not a dealbreaker like no bank statements would be. There should be something else that they are willing to accept that will prove the same point. If you talk them through the reasoning they should be willing to work with you on this if everything else is in place.

Are you sure that there aren't other things that are keeping them from giving you the loan? Perhaps other aspects they are a bit skittish on that you could provide more documentation to beef up so they can let the transcript thing go?

Can you talk to someone else at the lending company? Your underwriter isn't the only one who works there.

Be polite but firm, and let them know that they are not getting off the phone with you until you can work this out someway.

 

[movie zombie]

their money, their rules. simple.

and unfair as hell but doesn't change the facts.

however, can you call and get through to the head of underwriting? a face to face meeting with such a person? the underwriter's supervisor?

also, are you working through a broker? if so, make that person earn his/her $ and find another loan source.

i HATE closing on a house. its worse than trying to find a house in the first place. something always seems to go wrong.

take a deep breath and know that somehow this is going to work out.

mz

 

[Amandine]

I don't have any advice to offer...but, man, that really stinks! When we purchased our home this spring, the mortgage was the worst part of the whole thing. I ended up the only one on the mortgage due to my DH being a business owner, and the confirmation on the loan didn't come through till the day of closing. A real nail biter.

(((HUGS))) that this all turns out okay for you, and that you will end up in your beautiful home soon!

 

[iota15]

I'm sorry this is happening, Ames. I wouldn't say discrimination necessarily but certainly a blindness/indifference as to how different countries/cultures work.

If your broker tells you there is nothing else wrong with your application, let the underwriter's supervisor know and explain the German system to her. Maybe she'll be more cross-border-sensitive.

I recently purchased a property as well. It's definitely more work but I had two potential lenders going at the same time. It gave me a back up in case something went wrong with one. If this particular lender is done with you, maybe solicit two for the next round.

 

[Hera]

Take your credit reports and whatever else you have and go and shop other lenders. Try institutions that you already have a relationship with especially if they are a credit union. Try not to have anyone else pull your credit file themselves and risk lowering your credit score. I can't believe this happened to you just days before your closing!

 

[random_thought]

I am sorry this is happening but please keep in mind that NOT everyone who bought houses during the easy lending period were people who could not afford their houses. I'm sure many could and ended up being laid off or losing their jobs when the recession came (thus not being able to make their mortgage payment) and it could be hurtful to some to refer to them as dumb@$$es.

 

[Amethyste]

I am sorry this is happening but please keep in mind that NOT everyone who bought houses during the easy lending period were people who could not afford their houses. I'm sure many could and ended up being laid off or losing their jobs when the recession came (thus not being able to make their mortgage payment) and it could be hurtful to some to refer to them as dumb@$$es.

If you re-read what I wrote - my words were directed to the "champagne taste on a beer budget" type of buyers. Ones that went to the very top end of their lending range, lived in mansions with empty rooms cause they were not able to furnish them as the mortgage payment was already too hard to pay with 2 incomes ... almost felt like a free for all, and when the party ended, it was a rough awakening.

I am not insensitive to the ones who are hard working and were struck by the infortunate wrath of this economy. My words were not directed towards them. I know things are hard right now. they are hard due to the loose housing market in the prior years and all who have abused it.

 

[Amethyste]

I have replied previously that my inlaws wrote a letter explaining how the system works over there. She will not listen.

The audit department shut my loan off - there is no one I can speak to. I tried to call and this lender does not talk to the buyers, only to their broker. My broker relayed to me the transcript fiasco and there is nothing else i can get for her.

My mortgage broker has submitted our application to another lender - and we have signed another addendum to extend the closing date. We'll see...

 

[yssie]

Ame, I'm so sorry this is rough for you ::HUGS!!::


Asking for your transcripts rather than proof of graduation or something to buy a house seems very, very strange to me..

 

[NewEnglandLady]

We just closed last month, so I definitely understand the frustration of jumping through hoops in today's market. We worked with a broker, so she had multiple lenders at her fingertips and that was a blessing for us.

The good news for you, Amethyste, is that if you are the type of buyer that lenders are looking for (20% down, mortgage payment < 25% of net household income, solid credit scores and have been gainfully employed for several years), then finding another lender will be very easy for you. Our broker said that despite the market, buyers with solid financial footing were still had lenders lining up for them. I just hope you can apply, get approved and have all the paperwork put together in a couple of weeks!

 

[Nashville]

Oh, how disappointing... I'm sorry.

I agree with the suggestion to find another lender. How odd that they waited until the last minute to spring this on you, ugh.