Feelings on Old European and Old Mine Cuts

[jameson_nj]

Hello all!

I see why everyone has such high post-ratings - I''ve just started posting here and it just plain addictive. I''ve been around looking at the "showcase" posts of everyone''s rings - and I have to say - Pricescope members have impeccable taste! You''re also a very generous and helpful bunch - and I preface my question with a big THANK YOU!! My gal''s close friends have been bouncing ideas off of her for me; and I''m definitely zoning in on what she is looking for

First Question:

What are people''s opinions on Old European cuts? How well do they capture light? How much clarity would be necessary for an eye-clean 1 carat?

I was directed to Fay Cullen''s site - which has some stunning pieces - however, I noticed that the majority of the color of the antique pieces were in the J-P range; I was advised on one of my earlier posts that this is typical of antique pieces - and that some people actually prefer a bit of yellow. I''d personally like to try to avoid that

Here''s an Edwardian w/Old Euro center from Fay:

Full link:
http://www.faycullen.com/antique_engagement_rings/800/b618r7d.html

I know - pretty busy ring. The setting is so intricate - would someone who is budget-minded be better off buying something like this from a dealer like Fay - or having a close-to-equivalent one made? And can something this intricate be made??

Next up: Old Mine Cushion ---also from Fay:

I actually prefer this style -- to me, more tasteful. But alas - this is not for me
How well do cushions do with light reflection? Also - this is color K - how obviously yellow will that look to the naked eye?
Here''s the full link:
http://www.faycullen.com/antique_engagement_rings/800/c125r3d.html

So the grand question would be - for a budget-minded lad looking for a ring for an antique nut - go the real route with a dealer like Fay, or can I get a 1 carat center reproduction, all said and done, in the 5K zone??

THANKS SO MUCH TO YOU ALL!!!!!! BLESSINGS ALL AROUND!!!!!
Jameson

 

[valeria101]

Hi! Isn't PS great ?

He, he...

The first ring seems to be an original oldie, the second is new made in vintage style. In fact, this is quite obvious given that Fay is listing several of the second style. What are th chances to find five identical antique rings .... I haven't looked at the listings to see if this is explained or not, but they usually point out the difference antique/antique style somehow.

So at least the second one could be made with a diamond of your choice.

Perhaps it is more common to see old rings with lower color stones (not sure, perhaps, perhaps not - depending where you are shopping), but this is no excuse for wanting one with high color grade. Take a look at the list of loose diamonds at Fay - they run the whole range of color grades.

Whether the firstring could be reproduced... yeah, anything can, but this sounds like a challenge. I would not try, honestly, because of the cost. It would be allot moreconvenient and less expensive, IMO, to buy it as is. Changing the stone in that setting will be hard too - perhaps damaging to the ring, perhas not. However, I don't think Fay does that. And making a new setting like that would probably approach the cost of buying that one and replacing the diamond yourself !

The second setting is more reasonable - it could probably be done with your choice of center stone either by Fay or someone else.

So speaking of choice of stone... well, old cuts can be very brilliant or very dull depending onproportions - just like any other diamond cut. It is perhaps harder to locate a very brilliant one because there is no 'antique branding'

to guide the way.

There must have been another question....

Oh, yes ! K color... you might want to see one. They are not half bad and should look better in a closed setting like those than in an open ne (like the vast majority of modern rings are), because the tint is allot more obvious from the sides than face down. Also, bezels add contrast - which also help play down the color grade.

P color already needs allot more help than that if you don't care for some tint to begin with. I love them, but they are no more white than white wine is.

IMO, Get a quote from Fay Cullen for the second setting, and look for a diamond in the meantime. Ask if they will set your diamond or only one of their's. If they would not make a setting for you on order, ask who would. Actually, youcould also ask Quest (search for their name on Pricescope...) 'cause they turned a nice version of an Art Deco ring of Tiffany's recently and your project resembles that.

 

[KittenKat]

What are people''s opinions on Old European cuts? How well do they capture light? How much clarity would be necessary for an eye-clean 1 carat?

I have an OEC in my engagement ring. I love it. It''s sparkle dances in every light! Mine is SI, and it''s eye clean.

The cut is so important on these and the only way to know what you''re getting is to see it in person. (And hopefully be able to compare it to others...) It''s much more difficult to order these unseen based on numbers.

You really should look at the stones in person. I think they are special. Each one is unique. While I love modern cuts too - there''s something very romantic about these old stones.

Where are you located? People might have recommendations in your area of vendors who sell these stones.

Mine is from Single Stone (www.singlestone.com) in Los Angeles. I was recently there - and they had an amazing selection of antique stones. And I haven''t seen a ''dud'' in their inventory thus far. That could be a really good place to start. (They also have a great upgrade policy!)

 

[Kaleigh]

I love both the old european cuts and the old mine cuts. I found a lovely H VS1 stone from Fay Cullen for my SIL, when she lost hers out of her setting. It sparkles like crazy and is a lovely stone!!!!

 

[jameson_nj]

WOW! Thank you all so much for the almost instant feedback!!

I am in NJ and am about 20 minutes from the diamond district - is Fay Cullen NY based do you know? I just tried connecting to her site and unfortunately either the site, or my connection is experiencing issues.

Any NYC based antique dealers that you know (and trust would be SO VERY APPRECIATED!!!

Jameson

 

[valeria101]

Date: 7/13/2005 1:18:52 PM
Author: jameson_nj

I just tried connecting to her site and unfortunately either the site, or my connection is experiencing issues.

yeah... FayCullen''s website is down.

 

[widget]

Hi, Jameson!

I think Fay Cullen is located in Florida.

Like many others, I am a HUGE FAN of older cut diamonds, and there are some beautiful ones out there.

You mentioned that your GF is an antique nut...if she is, and is like me, she probably would much prefer an authentic vintage piece over a repro...you probably should check this out before going too much further in your quest.

If you decide that an authentic old piece is your preference, I strongly recommend you check out www.nelsonrarities.com (they are located in Portland, Maine) and have a great selection of vintage erings. They specialize in nicer older stones, which are often repolished and GIA certified before being offered for sale. Call and talk to Malcolm Logan. He''s a great guy, and wouldn''t steer you wrong. (The general concensus around here is that it''s better to call them with an inquiry than to email.)

I''ve attached a picture of a truly droolworthy OEC diamond ring purchased from them: the stone is GIA certified: G, VVS-1....Yum!

Good luck!
widget

 

[Kaleigh]

Wow widget that ring is awesome!!!! Is that your ring??? Fay Cullen is located in Miami Florida. I love looking at the nelson Rarities website, Yummy!!!!

 

[katbadness]

Date: 7/13/2005 1:18:52 PM
Author: jameson_nj
WOW! Thank you all so much for the almost instant feedback!!

I am in NJ and am about 20 minutes from the diamond district - is Fay Cullen NY based do you know? I just tried connecting to her site and unfortunately either the site, or my connection is experiencing issues.

Any NYC based antique dealers that you know (and trust would be SO VERY APPRECIATED!!!

Jameson

You may want to get in touch with Dave Atlas (avatar: Oldminer here on the forum - he''s located in Philly).
Dave is generally known to be one of our resident experts on old cut diamonds. He may be able to recommend a few reputable dealers in your area that you can work with.

Good luck with your search, and do post the treasure of your hunt!

 

[mrssalvo]

wow, the pic widget posted looks mighty familiar

it was actually the ring that inspired my current custom setting for my OEC stone

 

[widget]

Author: kaleigh
Wow widget that ring is awesome!!!! Is that your ring???

No....I "borrowed" the pics from another site!

I didn''t even mention that that ring is an original signed Tiffany!

widget

 

[Kaleigh]

Wait is that the one that mrssalvo replicated??? I thought it looked familiar?? ETA: Ok I'm so dumb, sorry mrssalvo!!!! I just love that ring!!!

 

[mrssalvo]

here's the link to the original vintage tiffany thread

 

[widget]

Date: 7/13/2005 2:06:33 PM
Author: mrssalvo
here''s the link to the original vintage tiffany thread

Hee Hee....turns out I didn''t need to "borrow" the pictures from elsewhere!

Ok, Jameson: Here''s a closeup picture of one of my OMC diamonds in an old pair of earrings. It has a slightly funky shape (which I love) and it isn''t certified.

But it''s white, bright, and sparkles like crazy!

 

[jameson_nj]

WOAH WIDGET!! THAT IS SOME SERIOUS BLING!!!!!

Very, very nice. VERY NICE ---dare I repeat myself???

VERY NICE!!!

Soooooo --- 20 questions continue ------ can anyone identify what you would call THIS style:

I LOVE IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

EXCEPT:
I''d love it EVEN MORE if the diamond was set lengthwise, as opposed to horizontal:
Catch my drift? I like the elongation effect that laying the stone lengthwise gives.
THX!

 

[mrssalvo]

Halo''s are very popular right now..check out this link for tons of pics
here''s another thread with a bunch of pricescoper''s rings with halo''s

 

[Orange]

There are two places at 10 W 47th:

www.antiqueengagementrings.com
www.estatediamondjewelry.com

The first one has both antique and repro, and the seond one has a gorgeous selection but is kind of expensive in my opinion.

There''s also Eric Originals at 4 w. 47th (booth 2&3), and Stardust Antiques on Gramercy Park (www.stardustantiques.com).

 

[jameson_nj]

You guys are the absolute best --- thanks so much for the great advice/links.

MrsSalvo ---- that thread link to the halos - I''M BLIND!!!!!!! S-T-U-N-N-I-N-G!!!

Can someone reccommend a dealer who specializes in halo''s? Or point me to where your halo was created in conjunction with a Pricescope dealer''s diamond perhaps???

I''m also going to go head into the fire to seek out real antique rings in the diamond district next week ---- anyone know much about LaRouche? He''s in the Ddisctrict and it looks like he''s got some GIA and EGL cert rocks....I''m really looking for cert -- and good color - but if the brilliance knocks me over, I can sacrifice a little color and clarity.....

Keeping it all in the 5K range so I can pay with my head, not above it

And no, I''m not impulsive --- so I''ll be doing quite a bit of looking and mulling before making a deal anywhere

 

[mrssalvo]

Whiteflash has done some amazing custom halo''s check out this thread

you might want to try dirtcheapdiamonds and take a look at their micropave collection.