Fair Price for 2.0 F SI1 EGL Cushion

[katrina_33]

A retailer in the LA diamond district has quoted me a price of 15,500 on a 2 Carat F SI1 cushion cut stone with a depth of 68% that he says is gorgeous. We may go look at it this week, and then I''ll know if I even like it and want to pursue.

I did a PS price comparison search and found stones from 9,040 to $16450 for 1.9 - 2.1 F, SI1 cushions. The 15,500 he quoted me seemed very in line with what GIA cushions are selling for over the internet, but the EGL cushions on PS were in the 9 - 11,500 range, not selling up at 15.

What do people think would be a fair price for this stone from a (downtown) retailer? He''s not a direct importer of stones, but I would still think that the price we pay should be less than we''d pay in a normal retail environment just because he''s downtown, no? How much should it be over what they''re selling for online?

He mostly deals in custom handcrafted platinum settings that are to die for, but has let us know that he won''t sell just a setting, so we''re seeing if perhaps he can find us the right stone and work with him on the whole project.

Thanks! I''m so excited to finally be close to actually getting a diamond!!!!!

 

[sasa]

Date: 7/6/2005 7:56:54 PM
Author:katrina_33
A retailer in the LA diamond district has quoted me a price of 15,500 on a 2 Carat F SI1 cushion cut stone with a depth of 68% that he says is gorgeous. We may go look at it this week, and then I''ll know if I even like it and want to pursue.


I did a PS price comparison search and found stones from 9,040 to $16450 for 1.9 - 2.1 F, SI1 cushions. The 15,500 he quoted me seemed very in line with what GIA cushions are selling for over the internet, but the EGL cushions on PS were in the 9 - 11,500 range, not selling up at 15.


What do people think would be a fair price for this stone from a (downtown) retailer? He''s not a direct importer of stones, but I would still think that the price we pay should be less than we''d pay in a normal retail environment just because he''s downtown, no? How much should it be over what they''re selling for online?


He mostly deals in custom handcrafted platinum settings that are to die for, but has let us know that he won''t sell just a setting, so we''re seeing if perhaps he can find us the right stone and work with him on the whole project.


Thanks! I''m so excited to finally be close to actually getting a diamond!!!!!

Hi Katrina_33, from what I know EGL is not as strict as GIA. But that''s all I know.
BF and I are actually going to LA Diamond district this weekend, can I ask which jeweler your going to? We don''t have a idea which one is good.

 

[katrina_33]

Hi,

We''ve been there several times now (I''m actually getting burnt out on diamond shopping, who knew it was possible!)

I would visit Vic at European Jewelry Co (www.europeanjewelryco.com) for stones

Some people really like Oscar''s Design at 550 Hill St for stones and settings

SN Queens and Belle Epoque are both great for high end handcrafted platinum settings (i have the addresses at home, let me know if you want me to post them) but both say you have to get the stone through them for them to do the setting

If you do a search here for los angeles jewelry district you''ll get some good results

 

[katrina_33]

Bump...

Anyone?

Vendors?

I only found 2 examples on PS of very similar EGL certed stones and both were far less, but I don''t know if I should be asking this vendor for a similar price, or if that''s unfair as he''s a local retail storefront.

Help!

 

[moremoremore]

Yes, you are right- it's in line with the GIA- there is a 2.03 F Si1 69.7 depth / 63 table, EX/VG (what a great cut) stone on GOG's cushion list. It's a GIA. It's $15,422.00.

I don't think it's realistic to expect a several thousand discount for the EGL- can you show me the links? You sure they are the same cut?

 

[moremoremore]

Also, as I'm sure you know, there is a HUGE jump in price from 1.9 to 2.0 So you can't really compare...

There is a G Si2 EGL 2.01 decent cut on dirtcheap for 10,858. So I would be SHOCKED if there was a well cut 2.0 F Si1 out there for $11,500. There is a very porly cut 2.0 G Si1 on McGivern for $11,693.00
Nice cut 2.09 F Vs2 EGL (with vg/vg although a bit deep) on Union for $15,354.
So if you've got a great cut, it's still a bit high but not high for a retail store I think.

But we'd need more details re the cut.

But BTW, I don't like this guy's high pressure sale- Oh, I won't make you a setting without the stone. Who does he think he is. The man Leon Mege doesn't even make you buy the stone from him. Just something to think about!

 

[katrina_33]

http://www.abazias.com/database/NewDiamondInfo.asp?stock=13066498&flag=ps

http://www.uniondiamond.com/diamonds/diamonds.php?item_id=15012&search_type_id=2&action_type_id=2&network_id=0cf05810a0f83094f6e9972ef21cdd34#

There are the links, both 9 - 11''s, both 2 ct even. The 11K stone actually is very badly cut and I wouldn''t consider it. but the 9 K stone seems like it could be decent.

All I know about this cushion he has is the depth and the fact that he says it''s spectacular and I have clicked with him so far. I would just go by my eyes with this stone, don''t really care about the other #''s as long as I know it''s not overly deep and so not spreading its weight, and like how it looks in person.

I just saw these 2 stones online and got the impression that the price he''d quoted me might be way too high, but then again, maybe not!

 

[autumngems]

I myself find that high. I am no diamond expert by any means but I have been looking for a 2 carat with about the same grades, etc. and and finding lower prices. My last diamond I bought from a broker (the best way to go I think) DWC, and now that is the only way I go. Got a great price and a beautiful stone.

 

[diamondsbylauren]

Hi Katrina,
First of all, let''s talk about an EGL F/SI1.
When sending diamonds to gem labs, cutters and dealers must make decisions.
IF the diamond was truly a nice looking F/SI1 no cutter would send it to EGL. So, being a "diamond detective" is essential when dealing with such a large stone with EGL report. Is thge diamond eye clean- or is there some other factor that caused the seller to either skip GIA, or throw away the GIA report and resort to EGL.
It could be a nice diamond- but it definitely rasies quiestions due to the EGL.

The prices quoted here - such as mid $15''s for a GIA F/SI1 are completely in line with online sellers- which is generally quite a bit less than ANY retail walk in envoronment- exchange or no. After all, the store give you the advantage of simply walking in and looking- this costs a LOT of money.

In this light- if you are comfortable with the walk in seller- if the diamond is OK, maybe the price is OK. But you will do better with a better online seller.

Moremoremore- I can definately see the sellers point- if he does not want to sell mountings without the stone.
There''s a lot of risk involved setting someone''s stone. Who''s risk is that on a 2 carat cushion?
Companies like Leon Mege are set up speciifally to handle "ring only" sales.
It''s really two completley different business models-
1) a company selling diamond offers rings to their clients- at prices below what they need to charge if they did NOT sell the center diamond
2) a company is founded to sell only rings and re-mounts. In this case the seller has already planned on costs without including a diamond sale.

There''s been a lot of discussion about this, and there are differing points of veiw- my perspecitve is shaped by the fact we operate under the #1 business model.
I''m not saying the guy is right or wrong, or you should buy the diamond- simply explaining it from a vendors point of veiw.

PS - make SURE you get a MONEY BACK ( not simply exchange) guarantee.

 

[katrina_33]

Thanks all. DBL, I was under the impression that some vendors (particularly downtown LA) send their stones to EGL simply because the certification process is faster and less expensive, and therefore they can sell their stones for less, and it''s a very competitive neighborhood in terms of price. I was also under the impression that EGL Los Angeles is nearly as strict as the GIA, and probablly leans on the liberal side rather than the conservative side if a stone is borderline, but wouldn''t today grade a stone that clearly has GIA SI2 level inclusions an SI1.

anyhow, the fact that they won''t sell the setting separately in fact annoys me, because they''re 100% custom, handcrafted platinum settings that run $4 and 5,000, so it''s not like I''m expecting some stock setting virtually at cost or something. They could tell me they''d charge whatever they want to say for the mounting I ask for, there are no set prices like on a designer piece, so if they aren''t making $ from a stone sale and can''t sell me the mounting at the same price they otherwise might have, they can just quote me what he wants for the setting and make a little more $ that way.

I understand the liability when setting issue, but couldn''t they make the setting without actually using or setting the stone? Just based on the dimensions?

Most of the other high end handcrafted platinum people here in town I''ve talked to are fine with custom making mountings with the customer providing their own stone, by the way.

 

[moremoremore]

David- couldn't they just *make* the setting and not set the stone. Then there is no risk. I agree 100% that if a setter chips a stone that wasnt purchased from him...unless he's grossly negligent, then he has no responsibiilty for it.
edited* I just re-read your response. I'm brain dead right now

 

[diamondsbylauren]

I was under the impression that some vendors (particularly downtown LA) send their stones to EGL simply because the certification process is faster and less expensive, and therefore they can sell their stones for less, and it''s a very competitive neighborhood in terms of price. I was also under the impression that EGL Los Angeles is nearly as strict as the GIA, and probablly leans on the liberal side rather than the conservative side if a stone is borderline, but wouldn''t today grade a stone that clearly has GIA SI2 level inclusions an SI1.

Katrina- STOP RIGHT THERE!!!!
This is a line- a very very big one.
First of all EGL LA is being sued by EGL USA.
IN the industry, EGL USA is though to be by far the best of the EGL''s.
Yet, still- even if GIA takes 6 weeks to EGL''s one week- it is simply NOT worth it to send stones there- especially 2 carat E/SI1''s UNLESS- something is wrong with thyem
Yes, it''s a competitive market.
Still, are you going to rush and spend $15,000.
Of course not- if you''ve got 15K, take your time- just as anyone in the diamond business would -IF- they had a 2 carat E/SI1.
Or maybe a place is going out of business next week and can''t wait a few weeks for GIA to do their job.
Now that''s a place I''d RUN away from



Moremoremore- no, you can not make a ring without the center diamond and expect everything to fit together properly.
Sure, jewelers do that- but they also do all kinds of other nasty things.
Like bending prongs to fit stones.
If you want to manufacture a custom made ring - especially for a stone which does not have a regular shape, such as a cushion- having and setting the center is crucial.
And how can one prove "gross neglegance" on a diamond setter?

 

[valeria101]

Date: 7/11/2005 6:01:47 PM
Author: diamondsbylauren

Moremoremore- no, you can not make a ring without the center diamond and expect everything to fit together properly.

Sure so, for super critical, detail-oriented judges like me

And surely those 4-5 k of manufacturing prize better be for a carefully considered piece - unless there are large sidestones involved which would shift focus off labor quality again. Just IMO, as usual.

Why not Art of Platinum anyway ? Not their style ? What kind of ring is it ? Or ...well, there should be other very, very good jewelry makers working with second-party stones anyway.

Just a thought. Of course, if you are confortable with the premium for shopping on the ground, why not. The tradeoff means waiting for FedEX to show up with a surprise which may or may not turn up perfect at the first instalement. Not that a local jeweler would let you look over their shoulder and controll every manufacturing detail as it happens, but then there is no FedEx guy involved and this seems to have some value added by some accounts. Otherwise, there would be no jewelry stores left !