excellentdiamondcutters.com?

[elbardo]

A new page that I haven''t come across lately, prices seem to be alright and similar to others on PS.

Has anyone worked with them before? Comments?

 

[moremoremore]

Never worked with them...I do look at their stuff though...they seem to have some really nice cuts....I don''t believe that they are the cutters...and that any ps vendor could get those stones

 

[pricescope]

Google their fax number. You''ll get this too: http://www.bbucutting.com/

 

[DiamondExpert]

Thanks for the followthrough Leonid. I''m sorry to see who is behind this site, but I knew it must be one of the wholesaler''s.

I have purchased from them in the past, but will now never do business with them again...too bad, they have some nice stones, but I won''t buy from someone who is in direct competition for my clients.

 

[pricescope]

Gary, I''m sorry you feel this way (and I''m sure many other jeweler do too) but this is inevitable process and there are niches for different type of the sellers and shoppers.

The fact that a manufacturer or wholesaler sells direct (a) doesn''t guarantee they will succeed in customer satisfaction, marketing, etc, and (b) it is not a unique situation for diamond industry only. Many other industries are going via the same process (travel, insurance, etc). As long as a vendors ads value, they should be fine.

 

[jabryant76]

I''ve never dealt with them, however I saw that they were on e-bay as well. Not sure if their prices match on their site.

http://stores.ebay.com/EXCELLENT-DIAMOND-CUTTERS_W0QQsspagenameZL2QQtZkm

 

[perry]

My first thoughts is that there is insufficient information to run a basic HCA on the diamonds listed. I understand that the HCA is not a "final" answer - but it does allow you to sort out the dogs up front.

It is an open question on "if" they will be willing to support the information request that I would have.

i.e. Sarin or Mega report.

A later at a minimum a discussion with a real person - who at least has an IdealScope - or a similar red light reflector technology - and knows how to use it.

Why waste the time and money sending them to me if they do not have a good light reflecting image...

Perry

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

This is after all what De beers want.

Everyone to move upstream. selling to their customers customers as Rapaport says.

Funny how new Internet players never realise they wll get caught out by all you super sleuths.

 

[BrightSpot]

Just to clarify, are you upset that a wholesaler is selling directly to the public or do you think a consumer would be at risk buying from Excellent Diamond Cutters?

I am looking at a couple of their stones & wonder if it would be risky to purchase from them.

Thanks!

 

[DiamondExpert]

I am going to go ahead here and shoot my mouth off a bit - I realize some won''t agree with what I say, and some of it may be plain wrong, but it is, after all, only one person''s opinion.

More disappointed than upset - retailers have their established wholesalers from whom they purchase for inventory, and this usually is a long-standing relationship.

But in addition, it is necessary to also establish other sources for memo goods - those goods which may not be available from the folks you buy from for inventory and are required on a short-term basis.

EDC fall into the latter category for me, and since they are selling for less than I could afford to, I don''t feel comfortable going to them again. That''s my decision. If they were a main source of inventory, then I would probably be upset.

Having said that, I don''t think you are at risk in buying from them - the only question you have to ask yourself is - are they going to provide the kind and quality of service you require. If you are looking largely at paper and price, then such a situation may be right for you.

--------------------
I''m well aware that the business is changing and in several years many more wholesalers will be selling directly to the public... as Garry says...De Beers is looking to produce a business model where only the sightholders and their biggest customers will sell directly to the public. Some will do it well and those that don''t will be dropped by De Beers and replaced by others.

I also appreciate that wholesalers are in a bind to turn their goods over as quickly as possible in order to stay in business, thus some feel pressured to sell in as many venues as possible. That''s their decision.

One of the major problems for wholesalers is retailers buying on memo - it''s very costly for them and there is no guarantee of a sale. Memo goods will dwindle and eventually disappear, in my opinion, and enormous pressure on those retailers not associated with sightholders will force them to buy more and on more rigorous terms or go without diamonds.

I also believe that the days of the internet dealers with only virtual inventories will also be history because only those who own the stones will be selling them directly (retailer and/or wholesaler) and the virtual inventories will no longer be necessary.

In the future with most or all of the "middlemen" removed from the pipeline, control will be absolute and direct and the prices the end user pays will be dictated by just how much profit the suppliers (De Beers) think they should be making. These prices may or may not be higher than what can currently be found at the internet level...I don''t know, but my guess is moderately higher.

Other newer forces are emerging to attempt to compete with De Beers, but the outcome at this point is in the distant future. Furthermore, even if they succeed, there is no guarantee that they will change the way De Beers does business, that they themselves will operate differently from De Beers, or that the buying public will in any way benefit.

 

[RockDoc]

Gary

I think your previous is rather meaningful....

In this current day world everyone seems to being trying to sell or market just about everything.

I walk in the grocery store and see lawn furniture for sale.

I walk in the local drug store ( chains like CVS and Walgreen''s) and find clothing.

But the pendulum swings both ways. I doubt that diamond wholesalers want to encourage their wholesale customers to not buy from them, as when one of the guys "double dipping" is exposed and their wholesale sales begin to dwindle.

As for my experience, I don''t believe many of the wholesalers playing "retailers" will really be able to adjust to the different demans of the increasing knowledge of the product. They are from a different school entirely, and unless they have personel that are "retail" trained, where the saavy consumer can get the extra service and infomation from, perhaps there wandering into this area will be short lived.

I really don''t think the knowledgeable internet merchant has to worry too much. I just think they have to find better ways than the "wholesaler" types that are on both sides of the fence.

Guess we''ll find out what will happen in the time to come.

But you have a very interesting perception of the EDC situation...and the predictions of De Beers future plans.

Regards

Rockdoc

 

[strmrdr]

Gary I understand where your coming from and being in an industry where we have to survive against Dell I really understand.

interesting story:
I took the pink tourmalines I bought from you into my local jeweler I have do my setting.
He asked why I never gave him a chance at selling me the gemstones.
I showed him the stones and asked if he could get some like them.
He pulled out his stuller book then put it away and said likely not.
He then asked me how much I paid for them.
He then said ok get your gemstones from him and ill set them when he heard how much id paid for them.
That earned my business right there.
I have a deal with him he mounts my gemstones and supplies the settings at a reasonable markup if im using gold settings if im putting them in a sterling silver setting I supply the setting because again he doesnt have a decent supplier for them and he charges me for labor to set them.

Iv sent over 20 people to see him for purchases, repairs and remounts.

Anyway the point is your putting price pressure on gemstones to a point he cant match, its how the world works.
But the smart ones find a way to make do and often do very well.

The diamond industry is way too set in their ways and a lot are going to get ran over just like bookstores, furniture, and computer stores did.
It doesnt help that a lot of people have the impression that they are going to get riped off every time they buy jewelery.

Im just hoping DeBeers in one of the ones that goes down in the rush.

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

De beers nearly did get swallowed up Storm.

5 years back they were a takeover target - $5Billion of diamonds in the safe, big loans, huge but aging diamond mines in Africa and partnerships with govts where they are under pressure to manufacture locally bypassing the distribution system. And the Asian and Tech crashes!
They managed to privatise just in time - to stop being taken over by Rio Tinto or BHP because their shares under valued the assets.

Now they are a serious but shrinking player. My money says in 10 - 20 years time BHP could be bigger than them.

 

[fire&ice]

How is the diamond business any different than the Ethan Allen model? They now have their own retail stores to sell their brand.

Not a commentary - just an observation.

It is "tradition" that the chain of command is what it is in the diamond biz - a dinosaur as markets evolve?

In my trade - years back the "pickers" (those that scour all types of markets for goods to sell to dealers) were at the mercy of our pocketbooks. Now, with all the open venues for selling "their" goods to the retail market, we are at their mercy that they still choose to deal w/ dealers (consumers can be very fickle - i.e. not confident with the purchase, always thinking they aren''t getting the best deal, etc).

Did this shift cost me lost profits? Not really in the long term. The people who got squezed out were the ones not paying their "pickers" a fair price & then charging retail consumers a *premium* price. It''s not rocket science. In the end, those people''s profits went from very high to very nil - with stale merch. And, one has to know *how* to compete with the likes of ebay & the ever prolification of auction houses. Though the auction route has a certain "fun" factor - it will never trump the "cache/security" of buying from a dealer.

How would this be different than the diamond industry? You review the market, think about it, adjust & evolve. It doesn''t take three people to change the lightbulb - One to do the changing & two to talk about how great the old one was. This is the way I am viewing many B&M jewelers.

Not trying to inflame - just continue to shake my head at the animosity of the situation.