Do you think the newbies are influenced by seasoned PSers...

[Dancing Fire]

from picking the 4 Cs to the choice of vendors?

 

[dk168]

I believe so; however, they may end up with DSS or feeling inadequate/inferior if they have already purchased or been given a stone that is not 'PS quality'.

DK

 

[Karl_K]

Duh!!

 

[missy]

The smart ones are.

 

[Wink]

As a vendor, I know many are.

 

[elizat]

Yes- that's an easy answer.

I think that there are a lot of people that are steered towards purchasing certain diamonds that they necessarily would not have purchased on their own.

I think that can be good and bad.

The majority of people that are purchasing a diamond for the first time are not going to necessarily be the type of consumer that is a serial upgrader, or buys a lot of diamonds in their life.

I know that this has been brought up a lot, but I do think to some degree, a disservice is done when the message is that only super ideal cuts are worth considering, when someone may legitimately not see the difference with their eyes.

It probably sounds like a foreign concept to regulars here, as people that buy a lot of diamonds and can discern a difference, but I come across many people in real life that would not be able to tell a difference between a super ideal cut or a well-cut GIA 3x. I think that there are buyers that could tell the difference between those stones even if it was a first purchase, but I don't think that the push to super ideal cut for all buyers is necessarily the right path.

Easy real life example: my mom. She would not be able to tell the difference at all between a GIA 3X and a super ideal cut. She doesn't have that eye. However, if you gave her the choice between a stone that was .50 in a super ideal and .70 in a nice GIA 3X, she'd go for the one that was a bit bigger. I think a lot of people fall here.

 

[AprilBaby]

I think people realize and if they don’t care about ideal they won’t ask for help.

 

[Rockdiamond]

It's truly a mixed blessing.....
Can we agree that it's far more advantageous to consumers if they are educated?
But at the same time, if there's no vetting of the educational content, it can easily be hijacked.
As Wink mentioned, I know for a fact that the forum has an effect- because many folks have called and mentioned Pricescope.
I very much appreciate that.
Yet there are also many times when a discussion illustrates certain half truths that are being passed off as fact.
Platinum scratches more easily than gold.
That is a totally misleading statement that has been brought up to me many times. Yesterday in fact.

And the discussion of cut- again, extremely informative in an overall sense ....but looked at in a more granular fashion....especially for newbies....It can be very intimidating to have a group of "experts" giving advice. The issue is that when advice is given by consumer experts- even seasoned ones with the very best of intentions- their own personal preferences will necessarily color their advice. Look at 60/60.
OMG!!! You bought a 60/60!!! Can you go skating on that MASSIVE PANCAKE table ??? ( Hey DF)

That entire discussion ( which really took place about 15 years back) was colored by the personal preference of those people selling smaller table diamonds.
Now, 1ct diamonds are 6.3mm...as opposed to 6.5mm back before smaller tables got vaulted to the top of the heap.

Another analogy- imagine this was a food forum-
You bought iceberg lettuce!!!!! OMG your hair will fall out- I don't give those to my pigs!!

For my part- I steadfastly avoid giving my opinion about preferential diamond/jewelry issues when pressed. I'm more interested in their preference. IMO, that's what a professional should do- listen and respond, as opposed to indoctrinate. Consumers don't have any such limitations. Nor should they.
It comes with the Pricescope territory.

It's a fun topic DF- thanks for starting it.

 

[Diamond Girl 21]

Yes, I definitely do, and I think everyone trying to help is wonderful. One thing that does concern me however, is specific advice about color and clarity. I really think a person needs to see and judge that for themselves. There's nothing wrong with telling someone that if they go lower in color/clarity they can get a larger diamond, but I don't think we should push the issue in that regard.

 

[MrsBlue]

Of course! But most newbies are looking to make a fast purchase so it's hard to get into a nuanced conversation.

If they hang around a little longer they'll learn more and use their knowledge to reach a more independent decision.

 

[Dancing Fire]

OMG!!! You bought a 60/60!!! Can you go skating on that MASSIVE PANCAKE table ??? ( Hey DF)

It's a fun topic DF- thanks for starting it.

David, There's nothing wrong with buying a nice 60/60 stone. I personally prefer a 60/60 stone with a higher crown.

 

[Rockdiamond]

David, There's nothing wrong with buying a nice 60/60 stone

How times have changed.....yoooshoulda herd this guy 10 years ago!!!!!

 

[yssie]

What concerns me much more - always has - is the PS regulars who adopt other PSers’ opinions as their own and simply parrot them without making the effort to validate them against their own experiences. There is a LOT of that in RT.

Regardless of who might claim what truths, you cannot buy the best diamond for yourself without seeing lots and lots of stones in-person.
And you cannot give “good” advice to others looking to buy diamonds without seeing lots and lots of stones yourself.
All the spreadsheets and cheat sheets and reports and PS “rules of thumb” and zeitgeist in the world can’t compensate for lack of personal hands-on experience with stones.
Period.
Done.
End of story.

 

[lilmosun]

What concerns me much more - always has - is the PS regulars who adopt other PSers’ opinions as their own and simply parrot them without making the effort to validate them against their own experiences. There is a LOT of that in RT.

Regardless of who might claim what truths, you cannot buy the best diamond for yourself without seeing lots and lots of stones in-person.
And you cannot give “good” advice to others looking to buy diamonds without seeing lots and lots of stones yourself.
All the spreadsheets and cheat sheets and reports and PS “rules of thumb” and zeitgeist in the world can’t compensate for lack of personal hands-on experience with stones.
Period.
Done.
End of story.

Agreed from someone who's only experience is in the CS forum. What troubles me the most is when opinions are stated as or taken as factual. Second is trying to live up to the high expectations set by the many beauty shots (although I do love looking at them).

When I started, I quickly started questioning and disliking everything I owned. Compared everything I bought to the beautiful pictures I saw here (nothing of mine seemed to measure up). It took me time to realize that what was important was the I love it -and- that some of my stones are just as nice as the ones I see on PS.

For those reasons, I stay out of the diamond forums (Although admittedly, if I were to make a more expensive diamond purchase, I would want to educate myself).

 

[Dancing Fire]

What concerns me much more - always has - is the PS regulars who adopt other PSers’ opinions as their own and simply parrot them without making the effort to validate them against their own experiences. There is a LOT of that in RT.

That's true!. That's why I always say based on "my own personal preference".

 

[musicloveranthony]

Absolutely, yes

 

[Modified Brilliant]

David, There's nothing wrong with buying a nice 60/60 stone. I personally prefer a 60/60 stone with a higher crown.

60/60 was the standard when I first got into the biz in 1979. "Spready table" was the term used.

 

[MissGotRocks]

Of course they are influenced. We were all newbies at one point and have learned a lot from being here. When folks are looking at random diamonds I don’t hesitate to recommend a super ideal cut stone. I can be assured that they won’t be disappointed with the cut and performance. Their budget is what it is and if they feel it is too much, others will help narrow down other diamonds. When I first came here and started seeing all of the black arrows, I was certain I wouldn’t like such a thing. As I read and learned, I discovered they weren’t always present like that. That is how green I was! People should come here to learn and gather information but still try to make the best decision they can based on the criteria that is most important to them. I agree that they should see diamonds in person but if all that is available to them is Kay’s and Zales, they are not going to get the best idea of a well cut diamond - super ideal or not.
Misinformation is a problem with anything but as long as a forum is made up of the public at large, it is hard to avoid altogether. I would encourage anyone new to the world of diamonds to read and by all means ask lots of questions! Diamonds are expensive and I wouldn’t make a purchase lightly.

 

[Wink]

I have enjoyed reading this thread and am reminded of an event that happened back in the early 1980's.

I probably somewhat handicapped myself when I took the GIA pearl course in Residence from Jill Fisher after I finished my classwork for the GG course in November of 1975. I got exposed to some incredible pearls during the course, and spent a lot of time looking for some of the top grade pearls to sell in Boise a few years later when I opened my store.

I found that pearls were not a top seller in Boise, but I still occasionally bought some strands because I love them. One time I bought a small hank of baroque pearls, a little over 8mm in diameter with great luster and a cream rose' color. I had a single unclasped strand made for the store that measured about 45 inches or a little more. I showed it to many of my best clients over a three year period, none of whom would "touch" a strand of baroque pearls. Too deformed, to this or too that...

After three years I took them home and gave them to my lovely wife, who had commented more than once that she loved them. A few weeks later she wore them to a big fancy fundraising party at the home of one of my clients.

The following Monday, three different ladies came in to buy a strand like the one my wife wore. All three of them had been shown the pearls for $1,000 over the course of the three years I had them.

I promised to see what I could find. The cost to make the strand had gone up to $3,500, and I have no idea what it would cost today, but a LOT more. Of course, I explained why the cost of pearls had gone up dramatically, but to no avail.

I found that these ladies all knew a little about what a good pearl was supposed to be, and it was not until they saw the baroque pearls being worn that they realized that what they knew was totally not adequate to help them know what they liked. Had I been in the business a few years longer, I would have also learned that I needed to be prepared to teach as well as to present.

The jewelry business is a fascinating world. Some of the rules work almost all of the time, and some of the broken rules are things of absolute beauty in the eye of the right beholder.

Wink

 

[oncrutchesrightnow]

This is all so fascinating. A few thoughts…

I started posting here back in 2006, then not so much until recently, and I was wondering where all the 60/60 threads had gone.

When it comes to anything aesthetic, people have to wear it rather than let it wear them.

I never would have bought my latest ring if I had not heard about DG from this forum and I almost never would have bought from DG if they did not offer LGD.

 

[Arete03]

As a new PSer, I would say we certainly are influenced! I felt like I stumbled upon a gold mine when I found this site! I also have a colleague who is recently engaged and we now talk about diamonds regularly. I found this site while trying to learn more about ERs and what made some diamonds a-b-s-o-l-u-t-e-l-y stunning versus meh..it's a rock. When my now fiancé and I were looking at diamonds, we went several places and at the time I was somewhat educated, but not as educated as I am now (and I still have plenty of learning to do!!). I tried to describe the diamond I wanted, but didn't know what made that diamond so beautiful. I would say things like, "I have seen probably two diamonds ever that when I looked at them, I knew they were stunning, they shined across the room and had such sparkle when you saw them. I want a diamond like that." After going many places and seeing diamonds that just didn't look like those two diamonds I had etched in my memory over the years, I started doing my detective work and reading everything I could get my hands on about diamonds. I never realized it was such a science about the cut, dimensions, etc. I also never knew there were more than the few kinds of diamonds (like OEC, etc)!

Once I found PS, I spent tons of hours reading about how all you experienced PSers got to where you are, saw some of your journeys, what you started with and where you are now, things you wish you would have done differently, etc, it was just so fantastic for me. Honestly, I feel lucky to have found PS so I can avoid buying diamonds that don't make me ecstatic, because I don't foresee the opportunity to change and evolve my ER over time. Of course, who knows, I can't see the future, but I'm already years beyond when some of you experienced PSers were initially engaged, so I've already missed some of those years of learning. I wanted to make sure I could get the best I could starting now and PS has helped me tremendously. I also love how friendly and helpful the long time PSers are. I can only hope to gain a fraction of the knowledge you experienced PSers have!

Speaking of, my ER is in the photography stages with BGD now after having my initial ER diamond chipped, so I'm super ecstatic and can't wait to see if it lives up to my expectations! Having that said, thanks to all who contribute to PS and provided all the different things I've been able to read and glean insightful info from!

 

[azstonie]

I hope not. There's a lot of pressure from one seasoned PSer on and off-forum to buy from one particular vendor.

 

[Dancing Fire]

I hope not. There's a lot of pressure from one seasoned PSer on and off-forum to buy from one particular vendor.

You mean the secret PS forum from 10 yrs ago?