Do you feel entitled to know if others are vaccinated?

[MamaBee]

I do ask a service company to send over only vaccinated people. When they get to my house I ask them if they are vaccinated. I also ask them to wear a mask. I’ve had a few say that they are vaccinated..but are still wearing a mask..Others will ask if I still want them to wear a mask even though they are vaccinated. I reply with a laugh and say..Yes please..because I’m old. That softens them up and they will put one on. I won’t ask anyone else outside of the house unless they are close to me in certain settings. If they aren’t vaccinated I do a quick moonwalk faster than Michael Jackson..I still wear a mask.

@missy The situation with the maintenance staff member would make me livid. He went into someone’s home...I think we are entitled to know the truth if people are coming into our homes…In other situations no..I do assume anyone else could have Covid so I protect myself and family by keeping a distance and wearing a mask.

 

[Cerulean]

I don’t actually feel like I have a right to individual privacy in this case. I tend to be a “collectivist”, and will rarely defend individual rights if it risks the rights of people as a group. And I think the group has every right to protect itself from individuals who decide to ignore recommendations to vaccinate.

So, I think everyone is entitled to know everyone’s vaccine status, and for access to certain public amenities to be limited for non-vaccinated individuals. I feel similarly about other threats to the community, such as registered sex offenders who can be identified in a public database. I am just drawing an analogy.

I often think I was born in the wrong country, as I really just don’t align with many American ideologies.

 

[Dancing Fire]

So, I think everyone is entitled to know everyone’s vaccine status, and for access to certain public amenities to be limited for non-vaccinated individuals.

Maybe the vaccinated should wear their vaccinated card around their neck when they are out in public.

 

[Cerulean]

Maybe the vaccinated should wear their vaccinated card around their neck when they are out in public.

If you are trying to compare this to Jews wearing badges during the Holocaust you are definitely barking up the wrong tree.

My family was German Jewish so I won’t be attending your pity party.

 

[Lookinagain]

Maybe the vaccinated should wear their vaccinated card around their neck when they are out in public.

Can you explain to me how a vaccine has anything to do with ethnicity? Perhaps I'm missing something. But also please explain to me how you differentiate other mandatory vaccines for school or work or travel from the Pfizer which is no longer in emergency approval status.

I have so much more to say, or questions to ask, but I'm biting my tongue for the purpose of at least some civility.

 

[Dancing Fire]

Can you explain to me how a vaccine has anything to do with ethnicity? Perhaps I'm missing something. But also please explain to me how you differentiate other mandatory vaccines for school or work or travel from the Pfizer which is no longer in emergency approval status.

These vaccines have been around forever.

 

[Matata]

These vaccines have been around forever.

But they started out the same way as the covid vaccines. They were experimental, some took a long time to get approved and they were modified as new info about virus mutation came to light. FYI -- history of the flu vaccine.
https://weather.com/health/news/2021-01-21-how-long-did-it-take-to-develop-the-flu-shot

 

[ItsMainelyYou]

These vaccines have been around forever.

And a dog was once a puppy, but it's still a dog.
Yes, people were given pus straight from the pustules of infected/dead for small pox. They cut their arm and spread it right into the wound with a little spoon. A big reason we won the Revolutionary War was because George Washington forced smallpox(Variola) inoculations.

mRNAs have been around for a decade in testing for a myriad of diseases and thirty years in concept, they're not 'new'.

Maybe the vaccinated should wear their vaccinated card around their neck when they are out in public.

Nah, we'll just implement vaccine passports for public spaces and entertainment like we already do for international travel, school registration and the military.

 

[Lookinagain]

These vaccines have been around forever.

Not really. Anyone who is in their 60s today was given the polio vaccine, probably in school, just a few years after it was first made. It wasn’t around “forever” before there was a nationwide mobilization to vaccinate against polio. And it was eradicated because of that. So no, at the time many vaccines were given they hadn’t been around forever.

 

[Dancing Fire]

I have so much more to say, or questions to ask, but I'm biting my tongue for the purpose of at least some civility.

All you guys ever talk about is the vaccine and now begging for a booster shot. Why don't you guys ever talk about those people whom recovered from Covid with "natural immunity" ? which is much more powerful than those jabs.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlook/2021/09/15/natural-immunity-vaccine-mandate/

 

[ItsMainelyYou]

All you guys ever talk about is the vaccine and now begging for a booster shot. Why don't you guys ever talk about those people whom recovered from Covid with "natural immunity" ? which is much more powerful than those jabs.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlook/2021/09/15/natural-immunity-vaccine-mandate/

Not exactly. It's somewhat true, if you take out any possibility of variants. The natural immunity only works for that one variant. We have several variants right now. Vaccines can be tailored to respond to a particular protein on the virus or can include several variant markers to make it more effective.
We can also talk about the thousands of 'long haul' Covid sufferers or the people with increased risk of death after infection.

Coronavirus (COVID-19) Overview

COVID-19 is a new type of coronavirus that causes mild to severe cases. Here’s a quick guide on how to spot symptoms, risk factors, prevent spread of the disease, and find out what to do if you think you have it.

www.webmd.com

snip: For the Nature study, researchers examined more than 87,000 COVID-19 patients and nearly 5 million control patients in a federal database. They found COVID-19 patients had a 59% higher risk of death up to 6 months after infection, compared to non-infected people.

1 in 3 People Get COVID-19 Rebound Symptoms, Even Without Paxlovid

Researchers looked at a group of untreated COVID-19 patients to discover that, like patients who took Paxlovid, they also experienced recurrent symptoms after their illness appeared to resolve.

www.healthline.com

Why gamble and maybe die or win the long haul playing Covid roulette when you can just simply get a vaccine and avoid that? Mutations will continue to persist in our population when immunity is gained through infection as opposed to vaccine.

 

[Lookinagain]

All you guys ever talk about is the vaccine and now begging for a booster shot.

Maybe that's because this thread is about vaccinations......Did you notice the title?

 

[Asscherhalo_lover]

I'm at a PD today at a school different than mine, they asked for my vaccine card when I was checking in. It's not actually a requirement yet (I'm a union delegate) but I have it and didn't want to argue with security. So yes, they ask.

 

[VRBeauty]

As a public school teacher, we have never been required to get the flu shot. So I guess no once cares in the public sector if we are protected. Also. I have to wonder. If you are entitled to ask, are you also entitled to request proof of a vaccination? To what extent are you entitled? Bc if that’s the case, cut to the chase next time and ask to see proof of vaccination to prevent lying.

I think when it comes to seasonal influenza, people assume that if you’re concerned about getting the flu, you would get a flu shot.

 

[autumngems]

In my profession yes, our programs work with children, special needs and retirees. I am aghast at those that are in proximity to those groups of personnel and who will not get vaccinated. I am glad DOD civilians are required to get them now.

 

[doberman]

For a long time, in order to get a job in my field I had to provide proof of immunization, be able to pass a TB test, get a flu shot, and pee clean. I HAD to do this, or I wouldn't be hired. So I really find it disgusting that this ONE vaccine has become so politicized that Republicans won't get it.

 

[doberman]

All you guys ever talk about is the vaccine and now begging for a booster shot. Why don't you guys ever talk about those people whom recovered from Covid with "natural immunity" ? which is much more powerful than those jabs.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlook/2021/09/15/natural-immunity-vaccine-mandate/

Ah, DF, you know I love you but there is no difference between natural and non-natural (vaccine-driven) immunity. Both are triggered via the same cascade.

It's hard for humans to admit that so much of our health comes down to pure, unadulterated luck. I look at a vaccine as a way of increasing my luck.

We walk between raindrops my friend.

 

[Jsand]

I don’t feel entitled to know, nor do I care either way if someone is vaccinated or not. It’s their decision.

This is a genuine question, and I’m absolutely not trying to be a smart-ass (please don’t take it as such)… but if the vaccinated can still catch and spread Covid, why do people care if others are unvaxxed? How does it make a difference?

From my understanding the vax eases your symptoms if you get infected but doesn’t do anything to stop transmission.

I am vaccinated fwiw.

 

[doberman]

It's all about numbers, or rather probability. The vaccine lessens your chance of contracting the disease. Your chances of contracting the disease go up exponentially if you come in contact with someone who has the disease. The more people who shun the vaccine, the greater your chance of coming into contact. Breakthrough cases do exist, but it is likely that the severity of the illness will be lessened.

I don’t feel entitled to know, nor do I care either way if someone is vaccinated or not. It’s their decision.

This is a genuine question, and I’m absolutely not trying to be a smart-ass (please don’t take it as such)… but if the vaccinated can still catch and spread Covid, why do people care if others are unvaxxed? How does it make a difference?

From my understanding the vax eases your symptoms if you get infected but doesn’t do anything to stop transmission.

I am vaccinated fwiw.

 

[Matata]

but if the vaccinated can still catch and spread Covid, why do people care if others are unvaxxed? How does it make a difference?

It's a matter of degree. We either don't get sick if vaccinated or don't become as ill as unvaccinated. All you have to do to answer your question is look at the news. The majority of people dying now are unvaccinated. Vaccines tend to lessen the chance of virus mutation. Less mutation means less virus variants. Less variants means we may finally get the pandemic under control. More variants means we stay on this merry-go-round longer and risk the chance of a variant that could be resistant to the vaccines.

 

[Jsand]

It's all about numbers, or rather probability. The vaccine lessens your chance of contracting the disease. Your chances of contracting the disease go up exponentially if you come in contact with someone who has the disease. The more people who shun the vaccine, the greater your chance of coming into contact. Breakthrough cases do exist, but it is likely that the severity of the illness will be lessened.

Thank you for that explanation, I appreciate it.

It can be hard to know where the truth lies since most news outlets are fiercely pushing their opposing agendas to the extreme - I try not to buy into the sensationalist headlines either way.

(I hope my question didn’t seem dense - I work from home in a new city and am still quite new to the US meaning I haven’t made many friends here yet due to the pandemic. Almost all of my non-working time is spent with my husband and our 3 children under 4. Therefore I don’t get much opportunity to discuss this in real life!).

 

[Jsand]

All you have to do to answer your question is look at the news. The majority of people dying now are unvaccinated.

I see news which contradicts this all the time (see my more recent post). Which is why I wanted to ask my question on this forum of intelligent, mostly tolerant individuals

 

[Matata]

I see news which contradicts this all the time (see my more recent post).

This can help you determine which sources of news are less biased.

 

[Lookinagain]

I see news which contradicts this all the time (see my more recent post). Which is why I wanted to ask my question on this forum of intelligent, mostly tolerant individuals

really? i see news that the vaccinated have tested positive, and some have felt fairly sick, but all the new I see indicates that the majority of people in the ICU or dying from Covid are unvaccinated. i've really never seen anything to the contrary.

 

[Jsand]

really? i see news that the vaccinated have tested positive, and some have felt fairly sick, but all the new I see indicates that the majority of people in the ICU or dying from Covid are unvaccinated. i've really never seen anything to the contrary.

Yes, I have seen a decent amount to the contrary. Not saying I believe it, but it’s certainly out there.

 

[Lookinagain]

Yes, I have seen a decent amount to the contrary. Not saying I believe it, but it’s certainly out there.

Well, anything can be out there on any of the news outlets or social media so I can't comment on where you are hearing that. But the CDC is pretty clear on the the question.

The incidence of SARS-CoV-2 infection, hospitalization, and death is higher in unvaccinated than vaccinated persons, and the incidence rate ratios are related to vaccine effectiveness.

Monitoring Incidence of COVID-19 Cases...

After the COVID-19 B.1.617.2 (Delta) variant reached predominance, fully vaccinated people had less risk of infection, hospitalization, and death.

www.cdc.gov

 

[Dancing Fire]

This can help you determine which sources of news are less biased.

The mainstream = far left.

 

[Dancing Fire]

Not exactly. It's somewhat true, if you take out any possibility of variants. The natural immunity only works for that one variant. We have several variants right now. Vaccines can be tailored to respond to a particular protein on the virus or can include several variant markers to make it more effective.

If that is true then why are there so many breakthrough cases?

Breakthrough COVID-19 cases expected to become increasingly common

Experts blame the rise of the delta variant and declining efficacy of coronavirus vaccines but say there is no need for alarm.

www.rollcall.com

Mass. reports 4,568 new breakthrough COVID cases in 4.59M vaccinated individuals

A breakthrough case is when an individual tests positive for COVID-19 after they've been fully vaccinated against the disease.

www.wcvb.com

 

[missy]

If that is true then why are there so many breakthrough cases?

"CDC data released on Sept. 10 counted an average of 10.1 breakthrough cases for every 100,000 fully vaccinated people, meaning that at that time, just 0.01 percent of vaccinated individuals had a breakthrough case. This data was collected between April 4 and July 19"

That isn't "so many breakthrough cases" IMO.
I rather like those odds being vaccinated.

COVID-19: The Unvaccinated Pose a Risk to the Vaccinated - FactCheck.org

Q: How do people who have not been vaccinated against COVID-19 pose a risk to people who have been vaccinated? A: An unvaccinated person who is infected with COVID-19 poses a much greater risk to others who are also unvaccinated. But vaccines are not 100% effective, so there is a chance that an...

www.factcheck.org

"The risk is higher for the unvaccinated. A CDC study published Sept. 10 — but based on data from April to mid-July — found that, due to the delta variant, the unvaccinated (including those who were only partially vaccinated) were nearly five times more likely to become infected, about 10 times more likely to require hospitalization and almost 11 times more likely to die from COVID-19 than fully vaccinated individuals."


"The vaccine is simultaneously like a great seat belt and a choice to drive sober,” they added. “The seat belt reduces your chance of severe injury in an accident. Driving sober reduces the risk of the accident in the first place. The vaccine does both, but it still matters if you’re surrounded by reckless drivers. No vaccine is 100 percent effective, and the more virus is around us — in this case, carried by the unvaccinated, who are five times more likely to be infected and thus to spread coronavirus — the more likely the vaccinated are to become infected.”

 

[Lookinagain]

If that is true then why are there so many breakthrough cases?

Mass. reports 4,568 new breakthrough COVID cases in 4.59M vaccinated individuals

A breakthrough case is when an individual tests positive for COVID-19 after they've been fully vaccinated against the disease.

www.wcvb.com

Even the source you cite indicates breakthrough cases are less than 1% for vaccinated people in Massachusetts. You seem to be disproving your own statement!

The 32,345 total breakthrough COVID-19 cases are among the 4.59 million residents considered fully vaccinated in Massachusetts, or about 0.71% of those individuals.