Please help, diamond upgrade dillemma

[devientdrow]

First time post and boy may it be lengthy.

I am already married and looking to upgrade my engagement ring. Both my wedding band and engagement aren''t great quality. The wedding band is a 1/2 ct plat "anniversary" band from Littmans. Diamonds are clear and sparkly and under the Littmans lighting they looked great but the next morning in the light of the airport and the sun I could visibly see tyhe yellow tint in them. However for sentimental reasons this is my wedding band and i''m sticking to it. My engagement ring, considering we were very poor at the time, isn''t that great eithier. The only paperwork concerning the diamond that I have is what Gordons printed out for it and it was listed as a .90 ct tw (center diamond and baugettes on each side)in a 6 prong plat engagement ring. Recently when looked at in comparison to other diamonds I was told there was NO WAY the ring even total weight reached .90 ct. We got it on clearance for $500. The center diamond is MAYBE .35 ct if i''m lucky and altho bright white it''s very cloudy. It appears dirty all the time. The only time it looks good is literally right after it''s cleaned. Financially we are in a *little* better of a spot and I want the diamond our relationship deserves.

So begins the educating. It''s been non stop, I find this all quite interesting but now that i''ve delved into it i''m confused. I''m going to keep my setting. It''s platinum and the baugettes aren''t bad and we actually had some work done to it to beef up the shank and that way I won''t feel like i''m ditching my original. Loose diamonds it is. The two prominent places I saw for this in my area was Smyth Jewelers and Jareds Galleria of Jewellry, then of course there is the internet. I''m going to write about each of my expieriences and hopefully you all can give me some feedback on what I should do. Thanks in advance.

Jareds:
We were planning to get my current jewelry appraised there, we went in over the weekend and the person who greated us was very friendly and really helped me understand the diamonds that I had on my finger already. He didn''t show me any of thiers but I made it clear I wasn''t purchasing yet so I didn''t take much offense to it. I went back to a different Jareds after work today and was a little annoyed. I noticed that the lighting in the store was very much the bright beaming lights that they have in mall stores. Their diamonds were very sparkly and pretty but very bright from all the light shining on them and I personally found it a little hard to see the clarity that way. In thier defense they do have a diamond viewing room with different lights I suppose you can ask to see it in. The sales woman was a little pushy. I told her I had applied for credit there and that I was waiting for the card to come in the mail, and she INSISTED on looking it up for me and telling me how much I was approved for even though I told her I wasn''t buying today. They had 3 displays of round diamonds. The Leo''s (which we didn''t even approach) the regualrs and the 5 "ideal" cuts that they had, which she told me were out of my price range there in a much nicer way then just saying it. I noticed the diamonds were not GIA cert but IGI. Is that a big deal? Also the cards only held the carat, clarity and color, nothing about the cut and the saleswoman offered no other information about it. The other thing I didn''t like was I noticed a lot were I1 in clarity. The best deal she could offer was a .90 ct, G in color, S1 in clarity for $3,700.00. And in comparison to my diamond it did look a million times better.

Smyth:
The lighting was the 1st thing i noticed, the cielings are very high and thus the lighting is not directly on the cases. I found this made the diamonds less bright but much clearer to see into. The sales people were very low pressure. From what I saw in the case (I went directly to the ideal cuts) there was a .74ct H S1 ideal for $3,600 and an ideal cut .70ct I S1 for $2,100 (keep in mind since my wedding band is a little warmer in color I don''t want to put a stark white white stone next to it so i''ve been looking in the G H I range) These seemed very good prices for an ideal cut diamond. They also looked huge for thier size! Very sparkly just not as gleaming white as Jareds but i''m thinking thats the lighting. I glanced in thier regular case and the guy said when I came to seriously look he would take out the ideal cuts and compare them to some of thier regular diamonds and I could see which was for me. Their regualr stock is also GIA cert and when I asked if I could see all the specs on them they said yes. However i''m not sure if this place offers financing of any kind or credit and doesn''t it look bad to my credit company if i''m running around applying for cards everywhere??

Then we come to the internet, which I am scared CRAPLESS of. I browsed a few sights and the amounts that I saw weren''t that much cheaper than what I saw in the stores. Then I saw this:
http://www.mondera.com/diamonds/product.asp?partno=424871&Sourceid=MDDMEmail

and that seemed like an excellent deal!

I''d like to get as close to a carat as I can. My budget is pretty low, probably NO MORE than $3,500. I want it to be clear and sparkly......G H I in color. I want it to definatly be a quality rock.

Any thoughts on where I should go with????

 

[belle]

hey devientdrow

welcome to ps!
that was quite a first post! thanks for sharing your experience. i can totally understand your fears of spending your $$ on a diamond over the internet but as many here will attest, when dealing with a reputable vendor the experience can be quite satisfying.
i have personally dealt with www.whiteflash.com and can recommend them highly. let me tell you, you can get a GREAT diamond for your budget.

best of luck!

 

[windowshopper]

hello and welcome................gee there is so much to say in response to your post that I scarcely know where to begin. First: are you expecting or planning to use your original center diamond as a trade in? It doesnt sound as though its worth it nor will you get much. I must tell you--please do not purchase from these mall stores. Any store where a majority of their stones are I1 is a BIG warning sign. AND you arent even getting information about the cut. I promise you that if you purchase from one of these reputable Pricescope vendors you will be treated well, you will not be cheated and you will end up happy.I knowthat others here will chime in but just so you know a good many of us have been in your shoes. I purchased two stones just as you did way back and on my third try stumbled upon pricescope in the nick of time. I spent 6 months learning and then went on to purchase an absolutely spectacular diamond that gets praise and comments like no tomorrow...............Whiteflash, James Allen, Good Old Gold etc are solid and reputable and you will not go wrong

 

[strmrdr]

Welcome to PS!
It looks like your well on your way to learning what you want dont rush and take your time.

Please dont take offense at the following I mean it in a trying to be helpful way
You mentioned credit cards, store cards usually have very high rates after the advertised low rates expire, also it is a rather bad idea to use credit to buy diamonds.
They are a luxury items that its almost impossible to get your money out of without taking a huge hit.
They should only be bought with spare funds after careful consideration.

edit: using a credit card is fine if you have the funds to pay it off.

 

[Lorelei]

http://www.whiteflash.com/diamonds/expert-diamonds.aspx?isStatic=true&PageID=19


Check out this link, there are some fantastic Expert Selection diamonds which you might like, gives you an idea of what you can get online. There is nothing to fear buying online IMO, I have done so twice and am more than happy that I did. Everyone has given you some great advice, all I can add is take your time, look online, continue to get educated and compare. This research will pay big dividends when you have that sparkling rock on your finger!

If the link doesn't work, go to the Wf site and search their Expert Selection diamonds, they have some lovely just under a carat Ideal Cut diamonds in budget!!!!

 

[devientdrow]

Thank you for the welcome and the info!

 

[devientdrow]

I was not thinking of trading it in, like you said I don''t think I would get much for it. The Jared''s lady kept pushing me to have it made into a pendant so it would be ''close to my heart'' but as nice as a sentiment as that is, why would I want to spend even more money on a poor diamond??!!?? Both of the stores I looked at aren''t in the mall, but i''ve come to the definate conclusion that at least Jareds should be. Smyth is an independently owned family store, not a chain and I think if I were to buy retail they would be the best. I liked how they didn''t blast thier stock with bright light and they were willing to show me all the certs and specs of each diamond including the cut %''s and all.

That being said, as long as I feel I can trust an internet vendor i''m not beyond using them. I''m going to check whiteflash right now, what about the link I posted. Anyone heard of or brought from Mondera?

 

[devientdrow]

Also strmrdr no offense taken!!!!! I''m hear to learn!!! That makes perfect sense in what you said. My credit is pretty good but my husbands pretty much JUST established it. I think i''m just being excited about replacing the stone and getting ahead of myself. Since we recently got married some of our wedding expenses went over budget and we had to dip into savings, it won''t take very long to build it back up again. Then again....it is the Christmas season isn''t it??!! *sigh* How does it always sneak up so fast!

 

[jaz464]

Pre-Pricescope, I had considered my local Jared''s. In retrospect, the diamonds were quite overpriced and the information on cut was minimal, often consisting of the shape of the stone. I mistakenly told the man there that I was considering buying online and he started in on how I probably wouldn''t even get a genunine diamond if I went that route. I told him it was possible to have the diamond sent to an appraiser BEFORE purchase for viewing and he basically called me a liar. Anyway, I bought from http://www.usacerteddiamonds.com/usagia/index100.html?md=10 and my diamond is to die for. I paid 2/3 of what is was appraised for. Currently, Whiteflash is doing the setting for my diamond and they have been amazing to work with (I''m kind of a demanding consumer, you might say). Please do not rule out the reputable online vendors that were mentioned by others. You will not be sorry. The quality from WF, Good Old Gold, etc, will blow you away, as will their customer service. Good luck, you can get an excellent diamond for your budget!

 

[Patty]

Hi there and welcome devientdrow! You've come to the right place.

Are you planning to get a new setting for your new stone or use your existing e-ring?

If your wedding band has stones with a tint to them, you might want to consider an ideal cut J or even K stone. You will probably be shocked at how white and sparkly they appear when they are cut well!

Here is a .95c diamond for under 3K from Whiteflash. It would probably look as big as, if not bigger than most "mall" store 1 carat diamonds! http://www.whiteflash.com/round_ideal_cut/Round-Ideal-Cut-cut-diamond-1958366.htm

Check out this thread to see how great a J or K stone can look...https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/j-color-stones-in-platinum.24731/

Enjoy shopping online. Whiteflash has a stellar reputation. I just bought some J colored earrings from them and they are stunning!

 

[cinnabar]

Date: 11/29/2005 9:04:05 AM
Author: devientdrow

That being said, as long as I feel I can trust an internet vendor i''m not beyond using them. I''m going to check whiteflash right now, what about the link I posted. Anyone heard of or brought from Mondera?

We bought from Mondera. We had some problems with the fact that their virtual inventory was not available on the first two stones we tried to buy, but overall it was easy and convenient. The staff aren''t knowledgeable about diamonds, so it pays to do your own research and know what you want (which is no different from buying from, say, Costco).

My main reason for choosing Mondera was that they had the exact setting I wanted, and I didn''t want the fuss of buying diamond from one place and setting from another.

They were very discreet, thinking this was a surprise engagement ring, so when they rang our home to confirm something, they wouldn''t talk to me (when in fact I chose diamond and setting and did everything apart from pay for it). Some people have had problems with Tiffany''s spoiling the surprise by sending mail to the home address despite being asked not to; you would never have that problem with Mondera, they seem to be especially sensitive to that issue. Obviously if it''s not a surprise then it doesn''t matter, but it''s nice to know they care.

They work better with phone calls than emails, which seems to be true for quite a lot of e-vendors.

If you just want to buy a nicer diamond than the mall stores sell, then Blue Nile and Mondera are great. Most PS members are perfectionists though, and want very specific parameters (eye-clean SI stones, for example) as well as ideal cuts, which you need a more specialised vendor for. I found the super-ideal specialist vendors to have poor inventory (virtual or real) on anything other than round stones, which is why we went with Mondera: there was just more to choose from.

 

[devientdrow]

This is where my indecision is coming in at. I totally get the idea that you can play with the scales here and still have something wonderful. I checked out the I,J and K thread that was mentioned that they were gorgeous!!!! Since i''m new to looking at close up magnifications of diamonds i''m having a hard time gauging them online. A lot of the sites i''ve seen say "same image" on the diamond as well and I guess you can''t even view it. I feel like if I purchased a diamond from one of those sites I would have to get something ''good on paper''. But if like I went back to Smyth and they happened to show me an J color diamond of excellent cut that I could physically hold next an H and see that it''s very white face up well then I could probably get the better deal right? How can you tell online? Just like there were I, J and K stones in that thread that were gorgeous there are lots out there that aren''t.......I did notice that most of the people who post in these threads do purchase online so i''m guessing there has to be SOME way to compare visually. !?!?

 

[devientdrow]

''sample" image rather then same....sorry!

 

[belle]

cut quality is going to have a huge impact on the appearance of color. i have seen pedestrian cut ''j'' color stones and i have seen well cut (superideal) ''j'' color stones. the difference is night and day. i would get a smaller diamond of lower(h/i/j) color over a higher color (d/e/f) or bigger size diamond any day. there is just no comparison when it comes to a well cut stone.

 

[MissAva]

If you would like a warmer color diamond then I would strongly sugest looking at WF Expert Selection stones. I bought a .738 K/VS1 ES stone from them and it is very lovely.

 

[pearcrazy]

Looking for max size and a great cut in your budget? Check out this EGL diamond from DirtCheapDiamonds 1.10 carats H (may be closer to I color in EGL) SI2 clarity. http://www.dirtcheapdiamonds.com/diamond_detail.cfm?did=8662447 It may be worth your while to call them and find out if this diamond is eye clean. EGL graded diamonds tend to get a bad rap around here because they're a little looser in their color standards, but if this diamond is pretty, white and sparklie then it could be a super bargain. It's under $3500 and I guarantee you it will beat anything you'd be able to get in Jared's for the same price. I've purchased three diamonds from DCD (they also operate under the name James Allen) and have been very pleased with what I got for what I paid. I couldn't have touched it in quality and price in any of my local jewelers.

 

[devientdrow]

I just wanted to say thank you to everyone who responded to my question, and you all offered quite a bit of help. After looking at a few diamond sites online and researching my local options more I have decided to go with Smyth. Needless to say I ruled out Jared really quick and i''ll do everything in my power to tell others to avoid a diamond purchase there. They try and market themselves and their store as an independetly owned and higher quality shop but in my opinion they are no different, diamond wise, than a Zales or Kay.

I saw some excellent deals online and using specs only, I totally see how I could get a diamond online $500 to $1,000 cheaper than if I purchased it retail. However I was also really excited when some people posted their I and J colored stones and they were just as brilliant and bright at the G and H ones. Should I be able to see these diamonds and compare them side by side I would feel MORE than secure in purchasing online. If I had unlimited funds I would purchase online, but I don''t. And i''m looking to get a good quality stone, as close to 1 ct as possible, on my budget. I think that I might actually get a better deal in person. Ie....I wouldn''t want to take chance online and i''d probably not order below an H (well cut of course) S1. However if I go to Smyth and they can show me a larger I or J colored diamond for the same price then i''d be more than happier to buy that one and i''d feel totally comfortable with it since i''d actually have a chance to inspect it myself in person.

Now before everyone sighs at another paranoid person who won''t take advantage of the internet diamond market Let me just rave about Smyth for a moment. In addition to all the good things I listed in my original description of my visit (No ''mall store'' lighting, very low pressure sales people, huge selection of GIA certified diamonds, GIA gemologist onsite, with the abilities to appraise or let you view your diamond under a scope) I have found even more that I like. There are a few Smyth''s but they ARE an independent family owned shop. None of the salespeople there are on comission. All of this made me feel like I could get the best deal just going into Smyth. My hubbys cousin purchased his now fiancee''s engagement ring there and it was gorgeous. Emerald cut 1ct diamond in a yellow gold setting with a trillion? cut sapphire on each side. I know he paid $7,000 for the whole ring. The setting was $2,000 which made me shudder and I thought thas possibly why thier loose diamonds are reasonable priced?? Cause then they screw you by marking up their settings?? The diamond he purchased for $5,000 was gorgeous. It didn''t look very large at first sight (being as it''s emerald I guess it sits deeper into the setting) but it was CRYSTAL clear, and full of brilliance and sparkle. I was really surprised when he told me the specs, it was an I S1. When I told him what that meant he was a little pouty thinking he got ripped off but I assured him the stone must of been very well cut because it''s absolutly gorgeous and really you weren''t going to find a 1ct in Smyth under $4,000 just because of the popular weight. I left out that I would of gladly taken the .96ct for $500 cheaper!!!! I know he might of gotten ripped off a little, I checked the loose specs of his ring against the White Flash diamond search and it came up much cheaper, but I know how his scenario probably played out. I''m sure he walked up to the first sales person he saw and said " I have $7,000 to spend, I know nothing about diamonds and I want it to be a 1 carat." So really.....you can''t blame them for taking advantage a little. I feel 100% secure that i''ll find a good deal. The one person I got to talk to there seemed really happy that I had some diamond knowledge already and seemed more than helpful. Soooo I have an appointment with the hubby at Smyth on saturday at 4:30 pm. I''m sooooo excited!!! I''m giggly!!! I literally feel like a kid on Christmas Eve!!!

So thanks again everyone, this one purchase i''m going to be doing in person but i''m already looking online for a stone for a setting my mom gave me a while ago that originally held a very flawed sapphire!!!

Heres a pic of my engagement ring as it is now, the one pic actually makes the middle diamond look ok. Irl it''s white and bright but very cloudy.....

 

[Patty]

Devientdrow, you are making an educated choice. No need to defend your decision! It sounds like you are very comfortable with the family owned jewelry store. That''s great!

I love your setting! I hope you are planning to keep it?

As for them "screwing you on the setting" I don''t think that they probably set out to screw your in-law. It could be that the markup on their settings is higher than their markup on loose stones.

Enjoy shopping and let us know what you end up with!

 

[devientdrow]

Thank you Patty !! Yes I am planning on keeping the setting. I''m sentimental and my hubby''s pride was somewhat hurt when I mentioned upgrading my ering until I told him that we could just change the stone out, and it would still be the same ring he proposed with. Besides sentimental reasons I like the design of the setting, it''s what makes my wedding band look cool with it as a "set" and it''s platinum and sturdy. The store that sold it to us, Gordons, sold it to us with the shank bent almost flat and told us that was how it was made to not put extra stress on the baugettes. I took my ring to a reputable jeweler who laughed his ass off at that and said no, they had just made the shank thin to save on $$ and it has most likely had another tray of jewelry on top of it cause the ring to slowly bend over time. I took it back and after a lot of arguing they bent it corrected it so it was nice and round and sized it down for me, adding some platinum to the shank. I hope i''m using that term correctly!

What you said about mark up makes complete sense to me. I originally thought the settings were so pricey because most that I saw were all high end brand names, but my cousin in law''s setting isn''t, but that''s what you get for being a boy who doesn''t want to do his research!

 

[devientdrow]

Also this is my wedding band, I knew NOTHING about diamonds when we purchased it from Littmans. I love how the pattern fits with my ering as it is now and how it will look after the upgrade. Price wise we were charged the generic price for this piece......in Littmans under the bright lights the rounds looked clear and sparkly and very very white. The next morning the first thing I noticed was how in the hotel lighting, sunlight, airport lighting....I noticed how yellow the rounds look. The guy from Smyth assured me it wasn''t too TOO bad. They did have a yellow tint to them but at least they are fairly clear. On the Littmans page they have generic specs for what the band COULD be color and clarity wise. I know it is a 1/2 carat total weight, in a platinum band. Possible color J-K. Possible clarity I1A-2. They describe the rounds as "brilliant" *sigh* I''ll know for sure after the appraisal.

Up close but hard to convey the color

And the pic Littmans has on thier site of it: