Use birth control pills to prevent pregnancy? You're fired!

[iheartscience]

Re: Use birth control pills to prevent pregnancy? You're fir

Black Jade, you're right, this thread IS political in nature. I reported my concern and was ignored although as I understand Pricescope's policy it says that we are not to discuss politics. Oh well. These issues being brought up NOW is an attempt at derailment from the other important issues our nation needs to fix. I personally do not feel like there is a war on women and while that may be some people's experience, I have lived peacefully in this country for the past 34 years without my life being affected due to gender. I make more and have more opportunities in my place of work than the males who have more experience and tenure than me (in the exact same position), for ONE example. The bigger issue I am interested in out of ALL OF THIS is education. WHEN are we going to use a common sense approach to teaching students about their bodies and biology? If everyone would stop arguing and trying to band-aid things and get back to the basics of educating our society...helloooooo.

American public schools actually used to use a common sense approach to educating students about their bodies and biology until the far right wing decided to legislate that out of existence and replace it with abstinence only "education" and creationism "education."

You know I love you, and you know I think it's awesome you're doing so well at work, but the recent EXPLOSION of anti-women's healthcare bills should alarm all women, and men, too.

 

[monarch64]

Re: Use birth control pills to prevent pregnancy? You're fir

Black Jade, you're right, this thread IS political in nature. I reported my concern and was ignored although as I understand Pricescope's policy it says that we are not to discuss politics. Oh well. These issues being brought up NOW is an attempt at derailment from the other important issues our nation needs to fix. I personally do not feel like there is a war on women and while that may be some people's experience, I have lived peacefully in this country for the past 34 years without my life being affected due to gender. I make more and have more opportunities in my place of work than the males who have more experience and tenure than me (in the exact same position), for ONE example. The bigger issue I am interested in out of ALL OF THIS is education. WHEN are we going to use a common sense approach to teaching students about their bodies and biology? If everyone would stop arguing and trying to band-aid things and get back to the basics of educating our society...helloooooo.

American public schools actually used to use a common sense approach to educating students about their bodies and biology until the far right wing decided to legislate that out of existence and replace it with abstinence only "education" and creationism "education."

You know I love you, and you know I think it's awesome you're doing so well at work, but the recent EXPLOSION of anti-women's healthcare bills should alarm all women, and men, too.

I know, and I agree with you, Thing. But don't you ever wonder why NOW we are having this explosion of anti-women's healthcare bills? It is so hard not to get into politics with all of this. And it is definitely alarming to me when I read certain articles, BUT I try to keep in mind that those articles are written in such a way and by people who are very good at alarming the public for political reasons. Not saying you do not do that. It's just crazy, all of it.

 

[iheartscience]

Re: Use birth control pills to prevent pregnancy? You're fir

Black Jade, you're right, this thread IS political in nature. I reported my concern and was ignored although as I understand Pricescope's policy it says that we are not to discuss politics. Oh well. These issues being brought up NOW is an attempt at derailment from the other important issues our nation needs to fix. I personally do not feel like there is a war on women and while that may be some people's experience, I have lived peacefully in this country for the past 34 years without my life being affected due to gender. I make more and have more opportunities in my place of work than the males who have more experience and tenure than me (in the exact same position), for ONE example. The bigger issue I am interested in out of ALL OF THIS is education. WHEN are we going to use a common sense approach to teaching students about their bodies and biology? If everyone would stop arguing and trying to band-aid things and get back to the basics of educating our society...helloooooo.

American public schools actually used to use a common sense approach to educating students about their bodies and biology until the far right wing decided to legislate that out of existence and replace it with abstinence only "education" and creationism "education."

You know I love you, and you know I think it's awesome you're doing so well at work, but the recent EXPLOSION of anti-women's healthcare bills should alarm all women, and men, too.

I know, and I agree with you, Thing. But don't you ever wonder why NOW we are having this explosion of anti-women's healthcare bills? It is so hard not to get into politics with all of this. And it is definitely alarming to me when I read certain articles, BUT I try to keep in mind that those articles are written in such a way and by people who are very good at alarming the public for political reasons. Not saying you do not do that. It's just crazy, all of it.

The timing is probably due to a few things. Number 1, in 2010 Republicans made huge gains in state legislatures, and the American Legislative Exchange Council (ALEC) drafts extreme right wing bills and gives them to all of the state legislatures, who are now able to pass them. Number 2, the economy is improving so Republicans are throwing chum to their base. Number 3, the Tea Party has become a vocal minority in the Republican party, and their views are much more extreme (and religiously based) than the GOP establishment. Thus, it pushes all of the candidates to the right to avoid or win primary challenges.

The reason the articles are alarming the public is because the bills are INSANE and the public should be more than alarmed, they should be OUTRAGED. State-mandated vaginal penetration? For no medical reason? Which will probably NOT be covered by insurance? People should be screaming from their roof tops.

 

[Circe]

Re: Use birth control pills to prevent pregnancy? You're fir

The timing is probably due to a few things. Number 1, in 2010 Republicans made huge gains in state legislatures, and the American Legislative Exchange Council (ALEC) drafts extreme right wing bills and gives them to all of the state legislatures, who are now able to pass them. Number 2, the economy is improving so Republicans are throwing chum to their base. Number 3, the Tea Party has become a vocal minority in the Republican party, and their views are much more extreme (and religiously based) than the GOP establishment. Thus, it pushes all of the candidates to the right to avoid or win primary challenges.

The reason the articles are alarming the public is because the bills are INSANE and the public should be more than alarmed, they should be OUTRAGED. State-mandated vaginal penetration? For no medical reason? Which will probably NOT be covered by insurance? People should be screaming from their roof tops.

Word, to all of it. I think my "favorite" came out of Wisconsin the other day when Representative Terry England defended the position that women should carry stillborn pregnancies until their bodies expelled them "naturally" rather than be induced to deliver. Why? Because that's what livestock does, even though it's hard - not for the livestock, but for the farmer - because it's "the natural plan." Also, I'm assuming just to twist the knife. From the same site Kenny originally cited ....

http://jezebel.com/5892657/lawmaker-says-pregnant-ladies-are-a-lot-like-livestock?tag=roevworld

 

[chemgirl]

Re: Use birth control pills to prevent pregnancy? You're fir

I thought of this thread when I saw this little bit of horror in my morning paper: http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/canadian-women-say-they-were-sexually-molested-by-female-us-border-guards/article2370301/

This border crossing is the closest one to my house, but I usually fly out of New York so I haven't used it. Sure not going to now!

Short story is there are several (well like 3, but that's too many) Canadian women suing the US border patrol because they were allegedly strip searched and penetrated by border control agents during routine crossings. They were never given a reason for it and two of the women had Nexus cards (so they've been security approved by US government). They were cleared to enter the US after the search, but were too upset and went home.

Love having another thing added to the list of things to worry about while travelling.

 

[iheartscience]

Re: Use birth control pills to prevent pregnancy? You're fir

The timing is probably due to a few things. Number 1, in 2010 Republicans made huge gains in state legislatures, and the American Legislative Exchange Council (ALEC) drafts extreme right wing bills and gives them to all of the state legislatures, who are now able to pass them. Number 2, the economy is improving so Republicans are throwing chum to their base. Number 3, the Tea Party has become a vocal minority in the Republican party, and their views are much more extreme (and religiously based) than the GOP establishment. Thus, it pushes all of the candidates to the right to avoid or win primary challenges.

The reason the articles are alarming the public is because the bills are INSANE and the public should be more than alarmed, they should be OUTRAGED. State-mandated vaginal penetration? For no medical reason? Which will probably NOT be covered by insurance? People should be screaming from their roof tops.

Word, to all of it. I think my "favorite" came out of Wisconsin the other day when Representative Terry England defended the position that women should carry stillborn pregnancies until their bodies expelled them "naturally" rather than be induced to deliver. Why? Because that's what livestock does, even though it's hard - not for the livestock, but for the farmer - because it's "the natural plan." Also, I'm assuming just to twist the knife. From the same site Kenny originally cited ....

http://jezebel.com/5892657/lawmaker-says-pregnant-ladies-are-a-lot-like-livestock?tag=roevworld

Ah yes-that's a classic! My new "favorite": PA governor Tom Corbett just said that women should just close their eyes if they don't want to see the state-mandated ultrasound image, because at least it's an "exterior" ultrasound, not an "interior" one! Except many will probably be "interior" because most abortions occur very early on. Good to know someone with solid medical knowledge is legislating healthcare procedures.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/03/15/tom-corbett-ultrasound-bill-pennsylvania_n_1348801.html

 

[monarch64]

Re: Use birth control pills to prevent pregnancy? You're fir

Thing, I would scream from my rooftop but I don't think pregnant ladies are supposed to be up there. I can and will do everything I can locally (and when November rolls around) to make sure that my state does not mandate crazy stupid laws like the ones being proposed. I love your chutzpah!

 

[beebrisk]

Re: Use birth control pills to prevent pregnancy? You're fir

Ugh..as a woman, I am so sick and tired of being told that there is a war being waged against me! I disagree with that assertion completely.

While the AZ law is obviously not worth the paper it's written on and I don't believe for one minute that my employer should have the right to know anything about any medication I am taking, we should all realize that with the advent of Obamacare in the coming few years, we will no longer enjoy any medical privacy whatsoever. Every pill you take, every test, every hiccup will be recorded in a federal databank. The overblown government agency that has been created to administer this monstrosity of a bill will not only know everything about you personally, it will have the authority to direct your physician on how to treat you every time you walk into his/her office.

If you think your employer isn't going know your secrets too, you're just being incredibly naive..

 

[kenny]

Re: Use birth control pills to prevent pregnancy? You're fir

It's not about politics or religion.
It's more fundamental.
It's about arrogance, power, and hatred disguised as morality.

I know a lot about that.
They use the same trick to deprive us gays of our civil rights too.

Heads up everyone.

 

[beebrisk]

Re: Use birth control pills to prevent pregnancy? You're fir

It's not about politics or religion.
It's more fundamental.
It's about arrogance, power, and hatred disguised as morality.

I know a lot about that.
They use the same trick to deprive us gays of our civil rights too.

Heads up everyone.

I'm sorry you have been made to feel like a second class citizen, Kenny. It shouldn't be and I'll never understand why...

As a woman however, I don't feel like I have ever had to fight that same battle. And I have never felt like anyone is encroaching on my rights or imposing their morality on me. I'm free to do whatever I want and feel really grateful to live in this country..

The plight of many women in this world living under regimes like the Taliban is maddening and heartbreaking. I just wish more women who live in the comfort and relative security of the West would demonstrate just a bit more outrage over the fanatical and misogynistic despots that force our "sisters" across the globe to live in constant fear and danger.

 

[Matata]

Re: Use birth control pills to prevent pregnancy? You're fir

It's not about politics or religion.
It's more fundamental.
It's about arrogance, power, and hatred disguised as morality.

I know a lot about that.
They use the same trick to deprive us gays of our civil rights too.

Heads up everyone.

I'm sorry you have been made to feel like a second class citizen, Kenny. It shouldn't be and I'll never understand why...

As a woman however, I don't feel like I have ever had to fight that same battle. And I have never felt like anyone is encroaching on my rights or imposing their morality on me. I'm free to do whatever I want and feel really grateful to live in this country..

The plight of many women in this world living under regimes like the Taliban is maddening and heartbreaking. I just wish more women who live in the comfort and relative security of the West would demonstrate just a bit more outrage over the fanatical and misogynistic despots that force our "sisters" across the globe to live in constant fear and danger.

You've been lucky...so far, thanks to a lot of women who fought for women's suffrage. We've only been "allowed" to vote since 1920, less than 100 yrs. and it's been 76 yrs since birth control information was no longer classified as obscene. There are women still living who remember what it was like not being free to do whatever they wanted in this country. And I don't think we have to look beyond our borders to find fanatical and misogynistic despots -- talk radio, anyone...

 

[Circe]

Re: Use birth control pills to prevent pregnancy? You're fir

This isn't directed at you, Bee - more a free association prompted by the mention - but I kind of feel like the Right uses the foreign oppression of women the same way Nice Guys (TM) complain about how women don't appreciate them and go for bad boys. There's always the unspoken threat that maybe, then, they should just stop being so nice.

 

[movie zombie]

Re: Use birth control pills to prevent pregnancy? You're fir

personally, i don't think any employer has a right to delve into a woman's sexuality, her use of birth control or the reasons why.

when an individual or group decides to go into business, that individual and/or group needs to play by the same rules as other employers. otherwise, the patients and/or employees have been reduced to 2nd class citizens and/or receiving 2nd rate health care services.

this has nothing to do with separation of church and state.
this has nothing to do with someone paying for something don't approve of.
it has everything to do power and control as kenny stated.

for some of you too young to know: i came of age working when an employer REQUIRED that women wear dresses, hose, and heels to work. REQUIRED. eventually, there was an allowance for fridays on which a woman could wear a PANT SUIT and boots. but only on friday. women were not paid the same wage for the same work as men. women were not promoted because men were supporting families and the supposition was that women were working for the fun of it. it was difficult for a woman on her own to obtain a loan to buy a home. if divorced, she had to recreate credit in her own name and did not automatically have credit due to "credit was in his name so you don't have any credit". there was no Title IX to encourage women in sports. that world existed in the late 1960's and into the early 1970's when the womens' movement gained steam.

do not be fooled into thinking that your world cannot change and revert back to a day in which you are a 2nd class citizen. i never thought that in my life time i would see the advancement of opportunities for women, birth control available, roe v. wade guaranteeing that a woman and her dr would make health decisions together, etc. to this creepy and imo obsene perversion of so-called rights of employers. do you really want to have to ask your boss for permission to obtain medical treatment? do you want to pay the total cost of pregnancy? there are some that think that pregnancy is "natural" and therefore should not be covered under medical insurance. if you work for a jehovah witness, do you want that person denying you access to medical insurance that covers blood transfusions?!

sorry for the rant. but i've been there and i've done that re being in the trenches re womens' issues. its not going to affect me that much other than piss me off at this stage of life but for you that are just starting out, for you that are 34, and for those that are pushing 50, think very hard before you allow yourself to be cut off from those things that women have fought so hard to get.

ps and before i end this rant: i remember having a miscarriage and my boss calling me in to ask my intentions regarding getting pregnant again because he needed to know i was committed to the job........do you really want to return to that?!

 

[Gypsy]

Re: Use birth control pills to prevent pregnancy? You're fir

i remember having a miscarriage and my boss calling me in to ask my intentions regarding getting pregnant again because he needed to know i was committed to the job........do you really want to return to that?!

WOW.

 

[beebrisk]

Re: Use birth control pills to prevent pregnancy? You're fir

Movie Zombie:
Sounds to me like we are the same age. While there have been some great and necessary changes for women over the years, I was raised by a mother who while cheering on the advances she saw, never once let herself feel or act like a second class citizen. She was strong, she took care of her family and she was/is.....happy. It so happens my mother was instrumental in reversing our public school system's policy of "skirts only" for girls. Her argument was a smart one: "Why should my daughter freeze in the winter walking to school, while my son is nice and warm in long pants?". She got her way. They got it right. She refused to stay quiet. A small victory, but a victory indeed.

I guess I have taken on a lot of those qualities and I have never been, and will never feel like a "victim". The only people with "control and power" over me are those that I allow. And, that's rarely

After all, isn't that a theme of the women's movement? "Take control...Own your power" By asserting that women can so easily be brought back to the dark ages is asserting that we don't have the smarts, the strength or the "balls" to live any differently. I give women way more credit than that!

Not really sure why the rant since no one here, including me, is interested in having their employer privy to their personal business. To the contrary, I am so fervently for individual freedom that I don't want the government involved either. Sadly, the days of privacy between doctor and patient will soon be over. The federal interloper is upon us.

As for your example of the Jehova's Witnesses, it's not about "access". There's no law that any employer must grant you access to anything. In fact, they are under no obligation to do anything at all except pay your wages as agreed and provide a safe and non-threatening work environment. Employer provided health care has always been a "benefit", nothing more. If an employer wants to opt out of healthcare they can.

 

[MissStepcut]

Re: Use birth control pills to prevent pregnancy? You're fir

i remember having a miscarriage and my boss calling me in to ask my intentions regarding getting pregnant again because he needed to know i was committed to the job........do you really want to return to that?!

WOW.

Not that I don't share the sentiment, but... doesn't this employer position (pro birth control) make infinite more sense than the reverse?! Baffling.

 

[movie zombie]

Re: Use birth control pills to prevent pregnancy? You're fir

the point is that while he was pro-BC, it was none of his business. yet as an employer he could ask that question legally.

beebrisk, i completely understand that an employer does not have to provide health insurance and many are starting to pull back from offering it. it is for this reason that i support a single-payer system as i also believe it benefits employers.

i do not want an employer overriding the opinion of my doctor and that is what is being suggested. again, this isn't going to affect me that much. i'm well pass bearing children. younger women who want children will find it harder and harder to have the costs taken care of by health insurance. employers are being empowered to act as lord of the manor and employees as serfs.

but in many ways this is not my battle. it is the women who will be most affected that need to realize and then decide if they want health care that assists them with their health needs or if they are ok with an employer deciding it for them. health care costs not paid for by insurance will be additional costs to families that are struggling as it is. i am thankful to have had health care for my needs. i would like to see younger women have the same. but ultimately it is up to them to decide to fight for it.

time to say good night.

 

[ericad]

Re: Use birth control pills to prevent pregnancy? You're fir

The overblown government agency that has been created to administer this monstrosity of a bill will not only know everything about you personally, it will have the authority to direct your physician on how to treat you every time you walk into his/her office.

As it stands now, my care is being governed by a for-profit insurance company whose bottom line improves the more they refuse treatment and push drugs - the sicker I get, the richer they get. And can you point me to the part of the bill stating that the government has the authority to direct my physician regarding my treatment? TIA.

 

[Porridge]

Re: Use birth control pills to prevent pregnancy? You're fir

They're talking about this here on Irish radio!

They interviewed Ohio senator, Nina Turner, apparently she is proposing a bill for men regarding Viagra, including regulations like:

-A psychological assessment to prove the symptoms are purely physical, and not psychological
-A cardiac stress test before prescription and then every 90 days
-A sworn affidavit from current and past partners confirming erectile dysfunction that could not be overcome without medication

She is speaking about the war on women and a prevailing atmosphere of misogyny. There's more but I'm running out the door to work!

It was this morning's Newstalk Breakfast if anyone here wants the podcast.

 

[Maria D]

Re: Use birth control pills to prevent pregnancy? You're fir

I'm really enjoying reading the viewpoints of all you intelligent ladies and gentleman of Pricescope! I can't even keep up with this thread --so much I want to agree with or comment on, so little time.

I was thinking about this transvaginal ultrasound stuff and about the irony that it's a diagnostic tool that's typically NOT used for pregnant women who will be going to term UNLESS there's an indication of a problem with the pregnancy. But we're going to legislate it as mandatory for women who choose to terminate a pregnancy? Yeah, insurance companies will go for that. I know my gynecologist likes to get a yearly look-see at my uterine fibroids and the insurance company is telling her that every other year is enough.

So here's the plan in the unlikely event that this legislation passes. I know plenty of women and men (most?) who are downright delighted to see the "fruit of their loins" when it's a welcome pregnancy. Many would love to have two pictures of their little nugget but can't get an insurance paid ultrasound in the first trimester. We need these people to all fake that they're considering abortion just so they can get a free transvaginal ultrasound! Bring hubby (or partner) in, heck bring the whole family. Get the picture taken and then decline the abortion.

 

[Circe]

Re: Use birth control pills to prevent pregnancy? You're fir

I think one of the additional problems is that while they've written this into law, they have NOT deigned to provide any sort of funding. So, to add insult to injury, women who can't proceed with their pregnancies will have to pay several hundred (maybe a thousand? I honestly don't know how much a transvaginal ultrasound costs, but a friend without insurance just had an emergency appendectomy which will run her 15K+, SO) for the privilege. And I believe some places are pondering forcing women to make two visits - one for the ultrasound, one for the procedure.

To sum up: if you can't afford to have a baby (finance being one of the biggest reasons women are terminating pregnancies, according to recent studies), you'd still better have a couple of hundred/thousand lying around to cover an unnecessary medical procedure, a couple of days worth of lost wages, transportation, etc.

I hate to be blithe, but how long do we give it before women start resorting to back-alley solutions and suffering again?

 

[beebrisk]

Re: Use birth control pills to prevent pregnancy? You're fir

To sum up: if you can't afford to have a baby (finance being one of the biggest reasons women are terminating pregnancies, according to recent studies), you'd still better have a couple of hundred/thousand lying around to cover an unnecessary medical procedure, a couple of days worth of lost wages, transportation, etc.

I hate to be blithe, but how long do we give it before women start resorting to back-alley solutions and suffering again?

Here's a solution. Can't afford a baby? Don't get pregnant. Preventing pregnancy is not rocket science. It's pretty basic, actually. Of course accidents happen but usually not if you are being responsible. Somehow I have managed my whole life not to get pregnant. That was my choice and I knew what to do (and, frankly, what not to do!). As we are all interested in the "health" of women, we should remember that having no pregnancy is obviously "safer" for us than the act of terminating one.

Yes, I know, there's the argument about the "life of the mother, etc...", but lets face it, the vast majority of pregnancies that are terminated are not done so because the mother's life is in danger.

When does "Our Bodies Ourselves" become "Our Bodies Ourselves and Our Own Responsibility"? After 30+ years of women shouting to keep the government out of their uteruses, they seem more than willing right now to have the government pay for what goes in and comes out of those uteruses.

 

[Deia]

Re: Use birth control pills to prevent pregnancy? You're fir

This makes me so incredibly sad. The world I grew up in is changing, and not for the best. It's going backwards and that really pains me. I'm only 27, I have no clue what to expect....but keep capitalism going the way it is and it won't be pretty....IMO.

 

[beebrisk]

Re: Use birth control pills to prevent pregnancy? You're fir

And can you point me to the part of the bill stating that the government has the authority to direct my physician regarding my treatment? TIA.

The government will be administering your health care and paying for it, too. Greater government dependency, greater government control. For the most part, insurance companies are directing your treatment now. Soon it will be the new "company" that administers your health care: the federal government.

 

[MissStepcut]

Re: Use birth control pills to prevent pregnancy? You're fir

To sum up: if you can't afford to have a baby (finance being one of the biggest reasons women are terminating pregnancies, according to recent studies), you'd still better have a couple of hundred/thousand lying around to cover an unnecessary medical procedure, a couple of days worth of lost wages, transportation, etc.

I hate to be blithe, but how long do we give it before women start resorting to back-alley solutions and suffering again?

Here's a solution. Can't afford a baby? Don't get pregnant. Preventing pregnancy is not rocket science. It's pretty basic, actually. Of course accidents happen but usually not if you are being responsible. Somehow I have managed my whole life not to get pregnant. That was my choice and I knew what to do (and, frankly, what not to do!). As we are all interested in the "health" of women, we should remember that having no pregnancy is obviously "safer" for us than the act of terminating one.

Yes, I know, there's the argument about the "life of the mother, etc...", but lets face it, the vast majority of pregnancies that are terminated are not done so because the mother's life is in danger.

When does "Our Bodies Ourselves" become "Our Bodies Ourselves and Our Own Responsibility"? After 30+ years of women shouting to keep the government out of their uteruses, they seem more than willing right now to have the government pay for what goes in and comes out of those uteruses.

Well as far as having the gov't pay for things goes, Circe is only talking about the cost of a totally unnecessary ultrasound.

I can't take hormonal birth control daily (or through patch, injection, implant... anything that releases constant hormones) because of a cardiovascular issue. When I first started having sex, I had a couple of condom failures. Basically, they were the wrong size. I didn't know how to tell they were because I just didn't have enough experience. I took morning after pills (that I got for free from Planned Parenthood, thank goodness). But they could have failed, too. So then I would have had to either have a baby in college (since I was responsible not to start having sex in high school) or else get an abortion, with this pointless, intrusive and possibly expensive procedure on top of it.

Congratulations on avoiding unwanted pregnancies thus far, but I don't know why you have such contempt for anyone who isn't as lucky as you have been.

 

[beebrisk]

Re: Use birth control pills to prevent pregnancy? You're fir

Congratulations on avoiding unwanted pregnancies thus far, but I don't know why you have such contempt for anyone who isn't as lucky as you have been.

I feel contempt because of the number of abortions that take place when the pregnancy could have been prevented in the first place. Abortions are not all the result of "accidents". Many are the result of a woman being irresponsible and taking a chance. The fact that I never got pregnant has nothing to do with "luck" and everything to do with being pro-active and taking responsibility.

I understand some women cannot use the pill. I understand condoms fail. I understand things "happen". But if you are in a situation where you know something could potentially happen, and you go ahead anyway, that's called being irresponsible. In my book that's nothing more than throwing caution to the wind and hoping for "the best".

I'm tired of so many saying that they have such a deep interest in women's "health", yet will never advise against such irresponsible behavior.

 

[ericad]

Re: Use birth control pills to prevent pregnancy? You're fir

To sum up: if you can't afford to have a baby (finance being one of the biggest reasons women are terminating pregnancies, according to recent studies), you'd still better have a couple of hundred/thousand lying around to cover an unnecessary medical procedure, a couple of days worth of lost wages, transportation, etc.

I hate to be blithe, but how long do we give it before women start resorting to back-alley solutions and suffering again?

Here's a solution. Can't afford a baby? Don't get pregnant. Preventing pregnancy is not rocket science. It's pretty basic, actually. Of course accidents happen but usually not if you are being responsible. Somehow I have managed my whole life not to get pregnant. That was my choice and I knew what to do (and, frankly, what not to do!). As we are all interested in the "health" of women, we should remember that having no pregnancy is obviously "safer" for us than the act of terminating one.

Yes, I know, there's the argument about the "life of the mother, etc...", but lets face it, the vast majority of pregnancies that are terminated are not done so because the mother's life is in danger.

When does "Our Bodies Ourselves" become "Our Bodies Ourselves and Our Own Responsibility"? After 30+ years of women shouting to keep the government out of their uteruses, they seem more than willing right now to have the government pay for what goes in and comes out of those uteruses.

Wow breebrisk, this is a very black and white perspective to a complex issue. Women should stop getting pregnant and use birthcontrol that insurance should cease to cover (and employers should be allowed to shame women into not using.) Hmmm, wonder which groups of women will be most impacted by this? The ones who can afford to pay for BC out of pocket or to walk away from a job that pays the bills because they don't like the new rules? Not likely.

Let me share something personal with you. I come from an upper middle class family. I'm highly educated and grew up with plenty of knowledge about my body. More than most, I'd say. I utilized Planned Parenthood to obtain BC pills when I was in my teens (cuz I was a whore) and avoided pregnancy just fine because I had a place to go where no questions were asked and pills were $5/month. Then, in my early adult years I had to get off the pill due to some hormonal side effects that weren't working well for me (after trying several different types of pill and working with my doctor). Despite utilizing other methods of BC (non-pill), after getting married I became accidentally pregnant twice (cuz I'm still a whore, apparently). I guess that makes me pretty dumb, eh? After all, it's not rocket science.

 

[Circe]

Re: Use birth control pills to prevent pregnancy? You're fir

Do you remember the "We Are the 54%," or whatever percentage it was that was a response to the "We Are the 99%? (Which, btw, always made me wonder if somebody had failed math, to be unable to realize those two overlapped.) The thing that bugged me about it - aside from the concern they might be dislocating their shoulders, what with the back-patting - was how firmly convinced the participants were of their agency. They were successful because they worked hard!

Which, hey, was probably true, but there was a caveat.

They worked hard and got lucky that nothing in their lives had gone seriously wrong.

We all have agency, but we're all members of a society, and if that society places objective barriers or hurdles in front of certain classes ... well, even if we as individuals are lucky enough to dodge them, I feel like we should be fighting the good fight both on principle, and out of the realization that there-but-for-the-grace-of-god.

I'm a woman, and I've managed to get a good education. And great jobs. And the worst sexism I've faced has been a truly egregious amount of street harassment. Not because I'm smart, but because I'm, a) white, b) middle-class, c) able-bodied, and d) LUCKY.

I've managed not to get pregnant when I didn't want to, too: that was because of, a) massive paranoia, to the point of using the Pill, condoms, and occasionally spermicides all in conjunction (these days, I could lose my job for that sort of thing, apparently), and, b) LUCK.

Luck is great.

But we're reaching the point where, if you're a woman in this society, you don't just need the luck of the Irish: you need to win the bloody jackpot. How, pray tell, is that a system worth supporting? Or, even if you're not directly supporting it, why take the time to rub some salt in the wounds of the people who've been less fortunate?

 

[MissStepcut]

Re: Use birth control pills to prevent pregnancy? You're fir

I feel contempt because of the number of abortions that take place when the pregnancy could have been prevented in the first place. Abortions are not all the result of "accidents". Many are the result of a woman being irresponsible and taking a chance. The fact that I never got pregnant has nothing to do with "luck" and everything to do with being pro-active and taking responsibility.

I understand some women cannot use the pill. I understand condoms fail. I understand things "happen". But if you are in a situation where you know something could potentially happen, and you go ahead anyway, that's called being irresponsible. In my book that's nothing more than throwing caution to the wind and hoping for "the best".

I'm tired of so many saying that they have such a deep interest in women's "health", yet will never advise against such irresponsible behavior.

Something could ALWAYS happen. Your BC pills could be faulty. Your morning after pill could fail. Even tubal ligations fail. So I guess every woman who ever has sex knowing that that's where babies come from is irresponsible, eh? Including you?

 

[MissStepcut]

Re: Use birth control pills to prevent pregnancy? You're fir

Oh, and I'll add that I am currently experiencing an unplanned pregnancy. By a rocket scientist.