Thoughts on these Emerald Cuts

[EverDiamond]

Hello! Long-time lurker. What a wonderful community here. Over time I've learned so much from the posts, replies, stickies and Knowledge page. Thanks so much!

I'm narrowing down my search for an EC for her engagement ring. I'm reaching the point where I can't really proceed much without actually seeing them in person. Because of that, I'm curious if you could take a look and point out anything worth...pointing out!

It's been some time, but I actually used to sell engagement rings. I remember enjoying whiter stones, but I'm also a believer that one can typically see size before color (for example, a passer-by is more likely to notice a 0.25ct difference than a G-to-F difference). That said, all of the ones below are within my personal range, so I'm open to any thoughts. In particular, I'm also curious about your thoughts on table%/depth%, as well as length/width. I understand the latter is pretty personal. I've read that a 1.5 ratio is the "norm" but I think I tend to like things to be more square to rectangular, if I had a choice. I'm just not sure where things actually begin to square off. Perhaps a 1.35 ratio?

It's my first time doing this, apologies if I've left anything out. All the GIA certs look pretty similar. The recipient is a lovely, youthful gal who will truly enjoy any of these stones. I'm eyeing Victor Canera's Evelyn Setting. I think that's about it for now.

 

[JulieN]

Need pictures.

 

[chrono]

You are correct that it is impossible to proceed without pictures and at least the ASET of these ECs. I would not take the vendor at their word that the cut on these ECs are VG. I have seen many stones with these depth and table percentages that turned out to be duds, so shopping by the numbers is useless.

 

[EverDiamond]

Exactly what I was looking for, thanks guys.

So regarding sourcing a stone online, do sites like Blue Nile offer photos and/or ASET? If not, do you guys completely rule them out as a place to buy? And if so, are there other websites that are better for customers "like us" who want a great selection and competitive prices, but who don't want to buy sight-unseen?

Thanks again.

 

[chrono]

I'm not sure if BN provides pictures but I know they don't provide ASET. Good Old Gold, Brilliantly Engaged and James Allen will provide ASETs, pictures and a video. I'm not sure if B2C and other vendors do.

 

[EverDiamond]

Thanks for this.

I like that GoodOldGold includes the imaging right on the site. Unfortunately they don't have many EC's available, so I wrote them just in case. I'm not seeing imaging on JA's site and wrote them for guidance. I'd heard great things about WhiteFlash but found their site to be a bit cumbersome.

I'll go read up on ASET now, but is there any quick tips that I should keep in mind for step-cuts?

 

[chrono]

You pick the 3 most promising ECs and JA will pass them on to the imaging group to take their ASET. You only get 3 ASETs for free and they must be done at the same time.

Whiteflash does not stock ECs, so they will pull them from the virtual stock which other vendors also have access to. Please read WF's policy with regards to virtual stones.

 

[EverDiamond]

Very helpful, thanks again Chrono.

 

[chrono]

If you are considering JA, run your choices here at RT first so that you don't waste your 3 chances on duds. There are a few very experienced diamond "readers" here who can predict reasonably accurately based on JA's videos which ones will be nice and which ones won't.

 

[EverDiamond]

Good call, thanks. These are the first three to jump out at me:

2.01 H VS1
1.30 L/W
No florescence
http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/emerald-cut/2.01-carat-h-color-vs1-clarity-sku-376052

1.82 G VS1
1.30 L/W
No florescence
http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/emerald-cut/1.82-carat-g-color-vs1-clarity-sku-302757

1.86 G VS1
1.43 L/W
No floresence
Is that an inclusion near the center - the white speck slightly to the right? Perhaps dust? I figure inclusions aren't visible to the eye at VS1
http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/emerald-cut/1.86-carat-g-color-vs1-clarity-sku-366389

 

[EverDiamond]

Good call, thanks. These are the first three to jump out at me:

2.01 H VS1
1.30 L/W
No florescence
http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/emerald-cut/2.01-carat-h-color-vs1-clarity-sku-376052

1.82 G VS1
1.30 L/W
No florescence
http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/emerald-cut/1.82-carat-g-color-vs1-clarity-sku-302757

1.86 G VS1
1.43 L/W
No floresence
Is that an inclusion near the center - the white speck slightly to the right? Perhaps dust? I figure inclusions aren't visible to the eye at VS1
http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/emerald-cut/1.86-carat-g-color-vs1-clarity-sku-366389

I've been speaking with someone at JA via email. He says he ranks the first as his favorite. "I love the dynamic light performance," which I agreed with, but in my case it's purely based on 360-degree photo.

 

[JulieN]

The first one is my least favorite of the three. Middle of it looks dead.

 

[JulieN]

The problem is that JA's lighting and photgraphy is terrible for emeralds, AND the diamonds are oriented E/W when most people wear them N/S. Looks like you don't have 3 on hold yet and still need to pick more.

#2 and #3 seem possibly ok, here are the ones I would choose from, #2 is repeated http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/asscher-cut/?CaratFrom=1.70&CaratTo=15.00&Color=D,E,F,G,H&Clarity=IF,VVS1,VVS2,VS1,VS2&PriceFrom=200&PriceTo=17000&Sort=Carat%20desc%20,DefaultOrder&TabSelected=3&advancedParameter=pn&showAdvanced=show&ps=15&DiamondID=382748,302757,360247,289640,381427,364556

 

[EverDiamond]

Thanks for the feedback JulieN.

The only reason I didn't request the ASET from the second one is because it doesn't have a serial number on the facet. This feature isn't a deal-breaker, but I just figured leave it out since there were other options (at least it seemed there were to my amateur eye).

I'm curious what you're looking for in the photos. Regarding faceting and light play, the only real difference I'm seeing is the addition (or lack) of the black and blue "bars". I figure the pattern they create is indicative of something, but I'm just not sure whatt. For example:

• are black bars inherently bad?
• are thin versus thick bars worse?
• is it that the bars aren't bad at all, and we're simply looking for them to be symmetrical on all four lengths of the rectangle?
• perhaps it's a combination of things?

I've added some observations to the stones you chose. Any guidance on what to look for would be great!

 

[EverDiamond]

At this angle I feel like the yellow of the H really comes through. The rest look about equal to me.

 

[JulieN]

Yeah, the H of the first one is more than the others, I noticed it too.

You want black (obstruction) because JA's cameras over-obstruct the diamonds compared to normal viewing. No obstruction means leakage or weak light return. Once you get the ASET you will see that there is not as much obstruction as in the videos.

 

[EverDiamond]

So if I understand correctly, the black is the camera being reflected. So in theory, if there's no black, it's because the reflection is leaking somewhere other than back up to our eyes?

If so, #1 and #3 seem to reflect the most black. That said, #1 also reflects it on the "width" (up and down), not just parallel (left and right). Not sure if this is an important observation or completely unrelated to what we're looking for

 

[JulieN]

Did you read this thread and look at the ASETs and JA's videos? [URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/emerald-daimond-help-dimensions-and-aset-included.208561/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/emerald-daimond-help-dimensions-and-aset-included.208561/[/URL]

His first stone pick has practically a solid black bow-tie in the video. In the ASET, it is borderline red/blue.

 

[EverDiamond]

I didn't, thank you I read them now!

Just curious, when it comes to looking at photos versus ASET, are we looking for the same thing? IE, ASET just shows the same thing but in a more digestible format?

On another note:

This one appears asymmetrical with the black markings, but maybe that's camera angle? Or is this actually bad?
http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/emerald-cut/1.70-carat-e-color-vs1-clarity-sku-373939

This one shows lots of black:
http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/emerald-cut/1.81-carat-g-color-vs1-clarity-sku-281538

Of to reading those two posts.

 

[JulieN]

No, i do not like the distribution of obstruction in those two.

The ASET is more slightly more standardized than different vendors photography setups. Some photography setups correspond very well to what you would see under ASET, some don't.

 

[EverDiamond]

From your list would this be a good third option? (top-right from your list)

What I see is a large bowtie, and I'm unsure if this is a good thing, a bad thing, or a non thing.

http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/emerald-cut/1.76-carat-h-color-vs1-clarity-sku-360247

 

[JulieN]

Yeah, I would certainly give that one a chance. I think it looks much more dynamic than #1. You can cancel the ASET request on that if you want, but don't let me bully you.

 

[EverDiamond]

Seems like a good mix to go on.

2.01 H VS1 I selected and that has questionable photos
http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/emerald-cut/2.01-carat-h-color-vs1-clarity-sku-376052

1.86 G VS1 I selected that has the size and color I like, and that you gave your OK to
http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/emerald-cut/1.86-carat-g-color-vs1-clarity-sku-366389

1.76 H VS you selected as an option. It's little smaller and more yellow than I wanted, but perhaps it will make up for it in ASET
http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/emerald-cut/1.76-carat-h-color-vs1-clarity-sku-360247

Excited to see how things go.

The only issue is that this is a time-constrained search. I need the stone delivered by next Friday, so JA is going to try to get the ASET back by next Tuesday at the latest. This poses a few issues. If I go with JA, who I've enjoyed working with, it will have to be one of these three stones as I won't have time to request another ASET. But it also means that if I find a stone I like elsewhere, I won't really have the to compare them to JA's results.

Unless I'm looking in the incorrect spot, GOG looks to only have a total of 6 EC's on their website. I wrote them this morning and will call tomorrow morning if we're yet to connect. I appreciate that they have the ASETs pre-populated.

 

[JulieN]

The 2 ct H and the 1.86 G will show some green under ASET... green isn't bad but you want a good mix of red in there, too.

I like the 1.72 D, but the possibility of visible inclusion and the "good" symmetry.

The other H is a little yellow, plus the windmills come to a line.

Between the other Gs, I think I like the 1.70 the best, but possiblity of wide obstruction bands which you don't want, and it looks slightly hazy in the video.

So let's hope for the best!

 

[EverDiamond]

So the first H that I showed in this post, being the one you didn't like, is a lot more expensive than the H that you included as an option.
Any ideas on the price sway?

If I recall the first one was ~16k.
Interesting note is that it's table percent (67) is larger than it's depth percent (63). Thoughts?
http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/emerald-cut/2.01-carat-h-color-vs1-clarity-sku-376052

The one you sent is just $12.8k. Perhaps because it has a length/width ratio of 1.23? Seems like a pretty good price, I'd be interested in looking at it weren't it so square.
http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/emerald-cut/2.02-carat-h-color-vs1-clarity-sku-382748

 

[JulieN]

The 2.01 is more classic emerald. On the 2.02, you see the windmills close before they meet at the keel.

If it is a low/lucky H that could impact the price, plus the strong fluorescence brings price down a lot.

 

[EverDiamond]

Good eyes! Yeah I'd say I'm not interested based on the fluorescence and windmills like that.

Unfortunately JA just got back. My first pick, the 2.01 isn't at their NY office and thus they can't do an ASET without it being purchased. I don't think I'd be willing to spend the premium without at least sharing the imagery here. Especially if you think the center has the potential to be dead. Is it that you can see right through the facets that are towards the dead-center?
http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/emerald-cut/2.01-carat-h-color-vs1-clarity-sku-376052

Will have him pull #2 and #3 and then continue looking for a final one for ASET.
1 - http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/emerald-cut/1.76-carat-h-color-vs1-clarity-sku-360247 not available for ASET
2 - http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/emerald-cut/1.86-carat-g-color-vs1-clarity-sku-366389
3 - http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/emerald-cut/1.76-carat-h-color-vs1-clarity-sku-360247

Still looking for a third option. Wasn't too crazy about any other other ones in your selection, mainly due to being slightly smaller than I was hoping. Still up for persuasion though! In the meantime, here's a few F's that I'd value your one-over on, mainly as far as the photo goes.
http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/emerald-cut/1.80-carat-f-color-vs1-clarity-sku-293414 (good/good, 1.58, weird percentages)
http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/emerald-cut/1.82-carat-f-color-vvs2-clarity-sku-302719 (nice, table seems small?)
http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/emerald-cut/1.84-carat-f-color-vs1-clarity-sku-383407 (love it but the 1.28 ratio is darn'd square)

 

[Gypsy]

Best ones of your original post are #2 and # 4 . And they should ASET out well, can you link me to the video of them?

 

[EverDiamond]

Best ones of your original post are #2 and # 4 . And they should ASET out well, can you link me to the video of them?

Hi Gypsy, thanks for chiming in. I enjoyed some of your other posts.

Regarding those options, do you mean the photo I included of the Blue Nile options in the first post of this thread? If so, unfortunately I don't think the offer ASET, photos or videos.

I'm curious to hear why you think they would ASET well. The #2 and #3 were my favorites before I discovered this site, but it was just from the numbers on paper.

 

[JulieN]

Still looking for a third option. Wasn't too crazy about any other other ones in your selection, mainly due to being slightly smaller than I was hoping. Still up for persuasion though! In the meantime, here's a few F's that I'd value your one-over on, mainly as far as the photo goes.
http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/emerald-cut/1.80-carat-f-color-vs1-clarity-sku-293414 (good/good, 1.58, weird percentages)
http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/emerald-cut/1.82-carat-f-color-vvs2-clarity-sku-302719 (nice, table seems small?)
http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/emerald-cut/1.84-carat-f-color-vs1-clarity-sku-383407 (love it but the 1.28 ratio is darn'd square)

I don't really like the first one. The other two are ok but prob not great.

The third one, if you want a short l/w ratio I kind of like this: http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/emerald-cut/1.73-carat-f-color-vvs1-clarity-sku-121370 See how the reflections are bright, while 383407 looks kind of gray?