Cat Lovers can sign petition to save cats

[MarionC]

A cat refuge near my farm has been on national news recently. An investor bought the land next to it and is building an outdoor gun range.
If anyone feels like signing the petition, it would be great. I just signed it today and I truly hope they get enough signatures!

Where I live - out in the county-there is no zoning, so people can do what they like. Of course it's their land to do with as they like, but can you imagine a gun range going in next to your house?! Granted the lots are big but this is still a residential area where all residents - cats and people - are trying to lead peaceful lives.

The refuge owner has fenced in 5 wooded acres for homeless cats and many volunteers work here. It is quite impressive and the cats look happy. I hate to think what it will be like there if the gun range is built. The cat refuge owner said already the gun range owner's current modest amount of shooting on the adjacent property is making her cats nervous and afraid. She is terribly disturbed by the thought that a commercial gun range will be untolerable for them.

So if anyone here feels like helping out with a signature it would be most welcome, I am sure.

http://chn.ge/1ssGUkq

 

[missy]

How awful this is happening. I signed the petition Jimmianne and I hope the cats can continue to live in peace and safety!

 

[athenaworth]

Signed and shared

 

[Gypsy]

signed.

 

[CJ2008]

Signed, Jimmianne.

 

[MarionC]

You guys are great
I am so proud of PSers wanting to help.

Fingers crossed that the cat refuge prevails .

 

[lulu]

Done and shared!

 

[momhappy]

While I can appreciate the frustration of the owner of the cat refuge, I don't see anything wrong with two land owners using their land as they see fit (as long as it's not harming those around them). I don't believe that a gun range puts the cat refuge in any harm (outside of maybe being an annoyance). The gun range, like the cat refuge, provides a valuable service to the public and neither one should be deemed any more important than the other. To be honest, I wouldn't want to live next to a cat refuge any more than I would a gun range, so I presume that's why they are both out in the country. I like cats, but I don't want to sign a petition based on emotion alone. I know that the gun range/cat refuge debate is being looked into by officials, so I'll wait to see how it unfolds before taking any action.

 

[missy]

While I can appreciate the frustration of the owner of the cat refuge, I don't see anything wrong with two land owners using their land as they see fit (as long as it's not harming those around them). I don't believe that a gun range puts the cat refuge in any harm (outside of maybe being an annoyance). The gun range, like the cat refuge, provides a valuable service to the public and neither one should be deemed any more important than the other. To be honest, I wouldn't want to live next to a cat refuge any more than I would a gun range, so I presume that's why they are both out in the country. I like cats, but I won't be signing the petition simply based on my feelings for them because I feel that the issue deserves more than that.

momhappy, you are not a fan of cats. Your past posts have shown that to be fact. Cats are sensitive animals and loud noises can harm their well being and health. Not sure why you felt it necessary to post here when Jimmianne is clearly looking for people who love cats and want to help them. If you don't agree that is your right 100% but why the need to post that here?

 

[yssie]

Signed.

While I can appreciate the frustration of the owner of the cat refuge, I don't see anything wrong with two land owners using their land as they see fit (as long as it's not harming those around them). I don't believe that a gun range puts the cat refuge in any harm (outside of maybe being an annoyance). The gun range, like the cat refuge, provides a valuable service to the public and neither one should be deemed any more important than the other. To be honest, I wouldn't want to live next to a cat refuge any more than I would a gun range, so I presume that's why they are both out in the country. I like cats, but I don't want to sign a petition based on emotion alone.

The cat refuge is both a community service and a humanitarian venture (I certainly consider the welfare of the cats on the refuge and any that might wind up there in the future, and the peace of mind of those staffing it, to be "humane" causes).

I fail to see anything "humane" about a gun range; they are not, in my eyes, of remotely comparable value. Re. the bolded: the fact that you clearly aren't capable of considering this from the perspective of a responsible cat owner tells me exactly why you wound up dealing with otherwise healthy cats soiling your house, frankly.

ETA: Ditto missy.

 

[momhappy]

I am a fan of cats - I don't own any currently, but I used to. I have had issues in the past with a particular cat that I owned, but that certainly doesn't imply that I don't like them.
As far as why I posted here, I realize that she was asking for support and I never said that I wouldn't be supportive in some ways. What I said was that there are two sides to every issue. Both land owners are using their land to provide a service and unless research demonstrates that one of the land owners is violating policy of some sort, then I don't care to take any action at this point (like signing a petition). I guess my point was just that there is more research to be done on the issue. No harm done. If my thoughts aren't welcome here, that's fine too

 

[CJ2008]

Yes, in my mind, the welfare of cats or other animals, versus a place for people to go hang out and carry out an activity that will be loud and potentially negatively affect the cats (plus I don't see it as a "service" - or at least not on the same level as a place to care for live creatures)...

The cats win every time...

And yes, the people who live there too although admittedly I am much more touched by what could happen to the cats (so yes, there's definitely a lot of emotion there.)

The only compromise/solution I think would be acceptable (and I know nothing about guns so what I am about to say may sound silly) is to require silencers or something.

But I don't know if there would also be other issues (e.g., a stray bullet, etc.)

(Edited for clarity)

 

[momhappy]

There is no doubt that it is a sensitive subject. I agree that the welfare of cats is important and I applaud the woman for giving them a safe haven. However, as much as some folks might dislike a guns/a gun range, it still provides a valuable service. A shooting range is not simply a place where people go and shoot things. A shooting range provides a safe place where responsible gun owners can practice a skill. They are utilized by law enforcement, military, and the general public. I think that no matter where either one of these places (the cat refuge or the shooting range) operated, they would be at risk of having nearby neighbors complain. It's unfortunate that it's worked out this way and maybe officials will determine that the shooting range does in fact violate some ordinances - if that's the case, then yes, the issue deserves to be examined more thoroughly.

 

[missy]

I am a fan of cats - I don't own any currently, but I used to. I have had issues in the past with a particular cat that I owned, but that certainly doesn't imply that I don't like them.
As far as why I posted here, I realize that she was asking for support and I never said that I wouldn't be supportive in some ways. What I said was that there are two sides to every issue. Both land owners are using their land to provide a service and unless research demonstrates that one of the land owners is violating policy of some sort, then I don't care to take any action at this point (like signing a petition). I guess my point was just that there is more research to be done on the issue. No harm done. If my thoughts aren't welcome here, that's fine too

Hi momhappy, it's not that your thoughts are not welcome but perhaps this thread is not the best place because jimmianne did not ask for a debate. She asked for help for these animals. The kitties need help and lives are more important (IMO) than the freedom of people to shoot at that location.

For the record, I am not again guns or rifle ranges. Anything that teaches safe gun ownership is a positive but not there and not at the expense of the quality of the lives of these helpless animals. They have no where else to go. Let the gun range go elsewhere. The cats were there first and their lives matter. They are living beings and just because they are weaker and less intelligent than humans does not give us the right to trample all over them. What happened to the humanity in humans?

 

[Andelain]

momhappy, you are not a fan of cats. Your past posts have shown that to be fact. Cats are sensitive animals and loud noises can harm their well being and health. Not sure why you felt it necessary to post here when Jimmianne is clearly looking for people who love cats and want to help them. If you don't agree that is your right 100% but why the need to post that here?

I'm a cat lover, but I find myself agreeing with momhappy here. Not only the things she said about the service the range would provide, but the landowner's right to use his land in any legal way he chooses. Hopefully both sides can work together to come up with a solution good for both sides.

 

[momhappy]

I am a fan of cats - I don't own any currently, but I used to. I have had issues in the past with a particular cat that I owned, but that certainly doesn't imply that I don't like them.
As far as why I posted here, I realize that she was asking for support and I never said that I wouldn't be supportive in some ways. What I said was that there are two sides to every issue. Both land owners are using their land to provide a service and unless research demonstrates that one of the land owners is violating policy of some sort, then I don't care to take any action at this point (like signing a petition). I guess my point was just that there is more research to be done on the issue. No harm done. If my thoughts aren't welcome here, that's fine too

Hi momhappy, it's not that your thoughts are not welcome but perhaps this thread is not the best place because jimmianne did not ask for a debate. She asked for help for these animals. The kitties need help and lives are more important (IMO) than the freedom of people to shoot at that location.

For the record, I am not again guns or rifle ranges. Anything that teaches safe gun ownership is a positive but not there and not at the expense of the quality of the lives of these helpless animals. They have no where else to go. Let the gun range go elsewhere. The cats were there first and their lives matter. They are living beings and just because they are weaker and less intelligent than humans does not give us the right to trample all over them. What happened to the humanity in humans?

I understand what jimmianne was asking for and I don't think that I was necessarily offering up a debate. I was just posting to demonstrate that there are two sides to every story and that if folks want to support the petition (after doing their own research on both sides), then rock on. A debate would have ignited a discussion about who's right or wrong (the cat refuge or the shooting range) and as I posted before, I see value in each. Not everyone agrees that the cats need help in this particular scenario and unless I see/read any evidence to support that claim, I'm not signing a petition. The noise from the shooting range may be annoying, but whether or not it actually causes any harm, is another thing entirely. I didn't mean to offend anyone by posting here and I apologize (especially to OP who was simply trying to encourage support for a cause that she believes in) if my thoughts/opinions stirred up a debate.

 

[Andelain]

I understand what jimmianne was asking for and I don't think that I was necessarily offering up a debate. I was just posting to demonstrate that there are two sides to every story and that if folks want to support the petition (after doing their own research on both sides), then rock on. A debate would have ignited a discussion about who's right or wrong (the cat refuge or the shooting range) and as I posted before, I see value in each. Not everyone agrees that the cats need help in this particular scenario and unless I see/read any evidence to support that claim, I'm not signing a petition. The noise from the shooting range may be annoying, but whether or not it actually causes any harm, is another thing entirely. I didn't mean to offend anyone by posting here and I apologize (especially to OP who was simply trying to encourage support for a cause that she believes in) if my thoughts/opinions stirred up a debate.

I think a little debate is a good thing, people can see both sides of the fence. That way they can make a more informed decision about signing the petition or other actions on this matter.

 

[yssie]

Momhappy, I must apologise for my earlier response to you. I'm far too late to edit, but it was needlessly rude. My only excuse is that I've got unhealthy cats on the brain at the moment and I suppose I'm overly quick to bite anything on the topic.

Posting from my phone and hoping autocorrect doesn't mangle it...

 

[Andelain]

Momhappy, I must apologise for my earlier response to you. I'm far too late to edit, but it was needlessly rude. My only excuse is that I've got unhealthy cats on the brain at the moment and I suppose I'm overly quick to bite anything on the topic.

Posting from my phone and hoping autocorrect doesn't mangle it...

Yssie, just so you know, I'm still sending up lots of dust for your kitty. Really hoping they get to the bottom of her problem soom. And I can relate to the hurting reaction, I lost my beautiful Blackfoot a few weeks back.

 

[momhappy]

Momhappy, I must apologise for my earlier response to you. I'm far too late to edit, but it was needlessly rude. My only excuse is that I've got unhealthy cats on the brain at the moment and I suppose I'm overly quick to bite anything on the topic.

Posting from my phone and hoping autocorrect doesn't mangle it...

Thanks, Yssie - I've been following your other thread, so I know exactly where you were coming from. No harm done

 

[Dee*Jay]

ETA: I should have had the good grace to start my post by saying to the OP that I admire your empathy and your compassion for these animals, and I hope that an amicable resolution is reached by all of the people involved in this issue, cat and gun lovers alike.

***************

I normally shy away from threads that are likely to turn into heated debates but I'm dipping my toe in here WITH ALL RESPECT MEANT FOR BOTH SIDES OF THIS -- let me say that in advance.

I feel for the lady and for the cats. I do believe the cats are going to be negatively impacted by the gun range (the noise would likely be startling to all sorts of animals, and people). But I also believe the owners of the new property have the right to do anything with it that is legal.

This becomes a "where do we draw the line" question for me. What if the new owners wanted to put in a doggie day care with free roam for the dogs? I imagine that would be offputting for the cats, especially since the dogs would likely be attracted to the cats and spent a lot of time around the area of the fence separating the property. Would the potential constant barking of the dogs excited by the presence of the cats be as much/more/less of a problem as the guns being fired?

What if the new owners wanted to open a yodeling school?

What if they wanted to open a band camp? Trumpets and cymbols and drums -- oh my!

You get the point.

Should the potential purchaser of a property have to research--and maybe even consult?--the current owners with land adjoining (or within earshot of) his/her own? I'm going with NO on that one.

So I have sympathy for the cat and the cat lady, but unless there is a property that is equally (or more) suitable for the gun range that the person can buy for the same (or less) money (and even then the cat folk should--IMHO--pay for any transaction costs on both sides of the transactions) then this guy is free to do as he pleases with the land.

I am an animal lover. I am not a gun lover (but that is a matter for a different thread entirely). I apologize to those who I have offended here. And I think there is an opportunity here -- any cat ear plug inventors among us?!?

 

[missy]

Dee Jay, this is not directed specifically towards you but more as a general thought. Love you no matter what your thoughts are on this and I hope you don't feel upset about my feelings regarding this matter. And mainly I was posting in response to momhappy because Jimmianne was looking for supporters here and not asking for opinions yanno? Sort of like Show me the Bling where you don't criticize unless the OP asked specifically for those opinions and can get their money back. Either sign or don't sign.

What about opening up next to a school? Would that be OK? I don't think that would or should be legal but nor do I think it is OK to open a gun range just anywhere. There should be more consideration about opening a gun range to let's say opening an ice cream parlor as just an example. A gun range should have a different set of rules for just the reason it is not an endeavor without consequences. Those consequences being disrupting the peace and quiet. It's not a business that doesn't affect the neighbors if you kwim and should be subject to a different set of rules in whether it is OK or not to open in a specific location.

And to agree with Dee Jay I also hope an amicable solution for all involved is reached.

 

[VRBeauty]

I lost my beautiful Blackfoot a few weeks back.

I'm very sorry to hear that, Andelain.

 

[CJ2008]

I lost my beautiful Blackfoot a few weeks back.

Oh, no Andelain! Was that the same kitty you had a thread on recently?

So sorry...

 

[Dee*Jay]

Missy (and everyone else who shares this sentiment), you're right. The OP was asking for support and I didn't do a very good job of giving it. When the topic veered off-topic I could have just kept on clicking right to the next thread but for some reason I didn't, especially once I saw the validity of the debate and the subject was interesting to me. I need to find something more constructive to do with my time today!

Jimmianne, I'm sorry for further thread-jacking an already jacked thread.

And Andelain, I am so sorry to hear of the kitty passing. Big hugs to you.

 

[missy]

Andelain, I am so sorry about your dear kitty. (((Hugs))).

DeeJay, I am sorry too because my frustration is not directed at you in any way but to the person who felt the need to start a debate of sorts by showing *both* sides when that clearly wasn't in the spirit of what Jimmianne was asking for. PSers are a warm and generous bunch as a whole but sometimes it only takes one post to get the whole thing off track and it really is not in any way shape or form anything you should be sorry about. I should have just ignored that first post and hoped everyone else did the same. But as you know I write what I think almost verbatim and that gets me in trouble!

So back on track for the kitties sake (and I apologize Jimmianne for taking the thread more off track than it was already)...for everyone who has a heart and loves the animals please sign the petition. Pretty please.

 

[Andelain]

I lost my beautiful Blackfoot a few weeks back.

Oh, no Andelain! Was that the same kitty you had a thread on recently?

So sorry...

Yes, it's in here, [URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/dust-for-my-sick-kitty-please.198007/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/dust-for-my-sick-kitty-please.198007/[/URL] . I still haven't gone back and answered the kind posts in there bacause it makes me cry.

 

[momhappy]

Dee Jay, this is not directed specifically towards you but more as a general thought. Love you no matter what your thoughts are on this and I hope you don't feel upset about my feelings regarding this matter. And mainly I was posting in response to momhappy because Jimmianne was looking for supporters here and not asking for opinions yanno? Sort of like Show me the Bling where you don't criticize unless the OP asked specifically for those opinions and can get their money back. Either sign or don't sign.

What about opening up next to a school? Would that be OK? I don't think that would or should be legal but nor do I think it is OK to open a gun range just anywhere. There should be more consideration about opening a gun range to let's say opening an ice cream parlor as just an example. A gun range should have a different set of rules for just the reason it is not an endeavor without consequences. Those consequences being disrupting the peace and quiet. It's not a business that doesn't affect the neighbors if you kwim and should be subject to a different set of rules in whether it is OK or not to open in a specific location.

And to agree with Dee Jay I also hope an amicable solution for all involved is reached.

Shooting ranges are mandated by federal, state, or municipal laws, so there's plenty of consideration that goes into planning, construction, etc. Ranges must comply with things like noise limits, safety precautions, EPA regulations, etc., so it's not something that someone can just open up anywhere.

 

[MarionC]

Momhappy, I must apologise for my earlier response to you. I'm far too late to edit, but it was needlessly rude. My only excuse is that I've got unhealthy cats on the brain at the moment and I suppose I'm overly quick to bite anything on the topic.

Posting from my phone and hoping autocorrect doesn't mangle it...

Yssie, just so you know, I'm still sending up lots of dust for your kitty. Really hoping they get to the bottom of her problem soom. And I can relate to the hurting reaction, I lost my beautiful Blackfoot a few weeks back.

My ancient tiny black kitty, Mr.Picky, died two weeks ago. I share your sadness. When they become ill we hold them even closer and then when they are gone it hurts more. I would like to think that the pain is part of being an excellent steward for our dear cats.
I am sorry for your loss, Andelain.

 

[MarionC]

Is there anyone who would welcome a shooting range next to their home? It destroys the peace and lowers property values as well.
This is an area where people work hard to make their farms havens [for people and animals] and an outdoor range is an assault on the senses and well-being of living things.
The properties here are residential but the range is owned by people who don't live in the area. It's a business.
It may be legal, but that doesn't make it right.