Brilliant Earth Canadian Diamonds? Experience?

[franklin11]

Hello everyone,

As I continue my quest, I came across the Brilliant earth site. I began poking around and noticed they had "conflict free" stones...does that increase the price at all per ct.?

I noticed that they make you call in or fill out an online form to get a scanned GIA report of any of the stones you are interested in. I did, and they told me that they do this because they want to cut down on "people ripping off the grading reports and using them for other stones to sell"

Also does anyone have any experience with them as an online vendor?

Any information or wisdom to be shared would be great.... here are a couple that I looked at if any one wants to comment. I am sorry that the links are so incredibly long (let me know if there is a shorter way of letting you all check out the links???)

I requested the GIA reports to be e-mailed to me on Monday if more information is needed to make comments to me about them..

(#1)

http://www.brilliantearth.com/loose-diamonds/view_detail/30710?sid=&first=&show_diamond_tab=true&path=%2Floose-diamonds%2Fadvsearch%2F%3Fshapes%3DRound%26cuts%3DSuper%2BIdeal%252CIdeal%26colors%3DE%252CF%26clarities%3DVVS2%252CVS1%26min_carat%3D0.77%26max_carat%3D1.11%26min_price%3D0%26max_price%3D7310%26row%3D0%26order_by%3Dprice%26order_method%3Dasc%26scrollTop%3D0%26scroll_top_right%3Dfalse%26view_link%3D%26search_path%3D%252Floose-diamonds%252Fadvsearch%252F%26sid%3D%26first%3D%26direct%3Dnone%26requestedDataSize%3D200%26nocache%3D0.7913335054074928

(#2)

http://www.brilliantearth.com/loose-diamonds/view_detail/29233?sid=&first=&show_diamond_tab=true&path=%2Floose-diamonds%2Fadvsearch%2F%3Fshapes%3DRound%26cuts%3DSuper%2BIdeal%252CIdeal%26colors%3DE%252CF%26clarities%3DVVS2%252CVS1%26min_carat%3D0.77%26max_carat%3D1.11%26min_price%3D0%26max_price%3D7310%26row%3D0%26order_by%3Dprice%26order_method%3Dasc%26scrollTop%3D0%26scroll_top_right%3Dfalse%26view_link%3D%26search_path%3D%252Floose-diamonds%252Fadvsearch%252F%26sid%3D%26first%3D%26direct%3Dnone%26requestedDataSize%3D200%26nocache%3D0.06109898028580485

(#3)

http://www.brilliantearth.com/loose-diamonds/view_detail/28303?sid=&first=&show_diamond_tab=true&path=%2Floose-diamonds%2Fadvsearch%2F%3Fshapes%3DRound%26cuts%3DSuper%2BIdeal%252CIdeal%26colors%3DE%252CF%26clarities%3DVVS2%252CVS1%26min_carat%3D0.77%26max_carat%3D1.11%26min_price%3D0%26max_price%3D7310%26row%3D0%26order_by%3Dprice%26order_method%3Dasc%26scrollTop%3D0%26scroll_top_right%3Dfalse%26view_link%3D%26search_path%3D%252Floose-diamonds%252Fadvsearch%252F%26sid%3D%26first%3D%26direct%3Dnone%26requestedDataSize%3D200%26nocache%3D0.9453594024382002


As always, Cheers...

Erik

 

[MichelleCarmen]

Never heard of them. Being conflict free should not increase the price.

A few things popped up when I did a search +brilliant earth +diamonds There is a search feature here on PS on the right hand side of the screen. Pop that info in and see what shows up.

 

[denverappraiser]

Documented country of origin seems to command a premium in most markets, including the Brilliant Earth folks. ‘Conflict Free’, on the other hand, has become the standard everywhere. You would be hard pressed to find a ‘conflict diamond’ if you wanted one, and you can be confident in the merchandise from ANY legitimate dealer in either the US or Canada. This has been a requirement by customs for the import of all stones into the US, Canada and 72 other countries since 2002.

Here's some reading on the topic. www.diamondfacts.org

The claim that they're concerned that crooks will use their report scans to sell counterfeit goods strikes me as highly unlikely. Scans of GIA reports are EASY to find and if a bad guy wants to rip people off this way, the BE making their own reports harder for customers to see will have no affect. My guess is that it's either that they don't want to take the time to post a scan of every stone on their site or they want to make it difficult for customers to shop the same stone between them and other vendors.

Neil Beaty
GG(GIA) ICGA(AGS) NAJA
Professional Appraisals in Denver

 

[Regular Guy]

What I know about them is hearsay, but I think BE (Brilliant Earth) is worth study. Also worth study is the basis upon which anyone would call their goods conflict free.

Search on Kimberly Process, and find a lot which provides that basis. Do see links, in this order.

From what I can tell, BE does primarily, today, offer only Canadian diamonds. Possibly they are virtual to them. Regardless, if I were you, I''d ask of them:

a) can they get African diamonds with documented sources, and
b) for any diamonds they promote, can they provide, more than GIA docs, the other kinds of pictures recognized Pricescope dealers offer, to include IS and ASET photos, and the promise of visual inspection for evidence of diamonds both being eye clean, and, for that matter, visibly good (well cut) by their company.
c) ask them if they have any fair trade diamonds, and also, ones that are graded for cut.

BE is named by the Madison Dialogues as one of the good guys, and they are smart enough to have their name come up in any kind of ethical search. Unfortunately, more progressive action in the acquisition of diamonds is slow, but I do think they are on the bleeding edge of this, and that they would like to stay there.

Let us know what you find...and ditto with the certs you come up with. It would be good to know how they classify super ideal, and such.

Regards,

 

[Callisto]

I know this is an older thread, but I''ve been looking into them as well and wanted to add a few points.

First I think it''s interesting to note that they also use recycled gold. Metal mining like all mining is not good for the environment so using recycled metals is much more eco-friendly.

Also I don''t know as much about this topic, but their site mentions that Canadian diamonds, in addition to being conflict free, are also mined in an area with much stricter environmental laws. So I would assume that like the recycled metal, this makes their diamonds more eco-friendly as well.

I know there has been a lot of regulation to ensure conflict-free diamonds in the US but I think it''s important to note the need for us all to make eco-friendly choices in addition to choices that support fair labor and conflict free countries.

 

[Lula]

I agree with you, Callisto. I think we need to choose what we buy with an awareness of how we are affecting the environment/other countries'' people by our purchases.

When I first started shopping for a diamond, I looked into Brilliant Earth. I was happy to see their stones were sourced from Canada and also that they used recycled gold. However, I''d been reading up on diamond cut, and I was not happy to see that although their site talks about cut, and gives customers choices in cut quality, they don''t provide any images like IS or ASET and, as others on this thread have noted, getting the reports for their diamonds is tricky and time consuming.

Plus, even though their stones are mined in Canada, there is no indication on their site as to where their diamonds are cut and if they are cut by one cutter in an artisan fashion, or by a number of cutters as part of an assembly line process in India. So how and where the stone is cut can be as much of a human rights issue as where it is mined, in my view.

It wasn''t until I found Wink at High Performance Diamonds, who sells Crafted by Infinity diamonds, that I felt I had found a vendor that truly sells ethically mined -- and ethically cut -- diamonds. Plus, all the reports on the stone, and the IS, ASET, etc., is available for viewing on Wink''s site without a hassle.

 

[mrscushion]

FI and I worked with BE for my engagement ring. We had a very good experience. FI created a custom ring with them over a couple of rounds of revisions and the end result was exactly what we had hoped for.

We loved that their diamonds come from Canadian mining areas with solid labor and environmental standards, and that their metals are recycled. In addition, there is a donation made for every purchase going to charities in the developing world, many of them in formerly (diamond-financed) civil war countries.

They are a pretty small operation out of San Francisco. This may be one reason why there may be comparatively more hoops to jump through to get certificates, etc.

Also, they are not nearly as much in tune with the cut standards that Pricescopers like to adhere to. For them, the buck stops at GIA "Ideal Cut" (whereas we know there is a lot more than that). You need to be in the driving seat in terms of ensuring you get the best cut possible. But, that''s what Pricescope is for.

That said, their staff and bench people are lovely and caring.

 

[Lula]

Date: 3/4/2010 3:31:31 PM
Author: mscushion
FI and I worked with BE for my engagement ring. We had a very good experience. FI created a custom ring with them over a couple of rounds of revisions and the end result was exactly what we had hoped for.


We loved that their diamonds come from Canadian mining areas with solid labor and environmental standards, and that their metals are recycled. In addition, there is a donation made for every purchase going to charities in the developing world, many of them in formerly (diamond-financed) civil war countries.


They are a pretty small operation out of San Francisco. This may be one reason why there may be comparatively more hoops to jump through to get certificates, etc.


Also, they are not nearly as much in tune with the cut standards that Pricescopers like to adhere to. For them, the buck stops at GIA ''Ideal Cut'' (whereas we know there is a lot more than that). You need to be in the driving seat in terms of ensuring you get the best cut possible. But, that''s what Pricescope is for.


That said, their staff and bench people are lovely and caring.

But the company makes no guarantee that their diamonds were not cut in a sweat shop in India, where a great majority of the world''s diamonds are cut. It''s not just the mining that can be a problem, but also how and where they were cut -- i.e., after they are pulled out of the ground as rough, where do they go next?

 

[dreamer_dachsie]

Date: 3/4/2010 2:49:12 PM
Author: Callisto
I know this is an older thread, but I''ve been looking into them as well and wanted to add a few points.

First I think it''s interesting to note that they also use recycled gold. Metal mining like all mining is not good for the environment so using recycled metals is much more eco-friendly.

Also I don''t know as much about this topic, but their site mentions that Canadian diamonds, in addition to being conflict free, are also mined in an area with much stricter environmental laws. So I would assume that like the recycled metal, this makes their diamonds more eco-friendly as well.

I know there has been a lot of regulation to ensure conflict-free diamonds in the US but I think it''s important to note the need for us all to make eco-friendly choices in addition to choices that support fair labor and conflict free countries.

I don''t know about this specific company, but generally using recyled goods is not a guarantee of lesser environmental footprint; the proicess of refining recycled metals could be more toxic, or require additional energy consumption that negates the benefits of recyling in some cases. Just food for thought. Also, many Canadian mined diamonds are cut overseas, and thus the fule required to fly them from Canada to India, say, may be greater than the fuel required to transport from Africa.

Just food for thought. I do not think the issues of environmental footprint are a simple as some companies that advertise their "eco" ways would like us to believe.

 

[dreamer_dachsie]

I think if you want to be truly eco then buy your diamond and ring on the secondary market. That will completely eliminate an additional eco footpriont from your purchase.

 

[kenny]

I''d rather help a poorer country than a richer one.

 

[dreamer_dachsie]

Date: 3/4/2010 5:04:24 PM
Author: kenny
I''d rather help a poorer country than a richer one.

Interesting point.

I feel like the issues surroundings diamonds and diamond mining are just so much more complicated than is often presented in the media or by companies trying to capitalize on the eco market.

 

[Lula]

Date: 3/4/2010 5:04:24 PM
Author: kenny
I''d rather help a poorer country than a richer one.

I would, too, Kenny, that''s why I don''t refuse to buy diamonds from Africa -- I just like to make sure they''re not from areas with "issues" in Africa. I also don''t want my diamond cut in a sweat shop -- that is not helping a poorer country.

 

[yssie]

Okay. Maybe I'm extra tetchy because I've had exactly this conversation IRL twice in the last week, but...


I'm sick of the excessive and overstated hype surrounding "Canadian diamonds"

This growing belief that CANADA = conflict free is both erroneous and injurious. DO NOT assume that all diamonds sold with the word CANADA plastered all over the coversheet, or frequently and reverently interspersed through conversation, are actually MINED AND CUT in Canada. Ask to see the paper trail, if you really care that much.


BUT if you really care that much, you will read up on the Kimberley process and take good note of the fact that Canada is NOT the only place from which you can get a conflict-free diamond, despite marketing that may have you thinking otherwise. Vendors touting their "Canadian diamonds" as the only conflict-free diamonds available are flat-out lying, but people are buying into the belief - and buying the diamonds despite the inflated price tags, and thereby propagating that belief - which, as I stated earlier, is both erroneous and injurious.


ETA: I don't for a second believe that they don't post the certs online because they're afraid of people copying them and misusing them. Much more likely that they just don't want to spend the time and effort doing that for every stone - much cheaper to do it on a customer-query basis. Which, btw, is totally fine, but why not just say that rather than spinning stories?


ETA: Disclaimer: I got reamed in the newlyweds subforum for saying "you" a few weeks ago, so I'll very carefully note that my use of the word "you" is not an implication or a statement of my pointing fingers at anyone or anything. It makes things easier to read than saying "I" throughout, and I'm not particularly inclined to go through and change everything after the fact.

 

[Regular Guy]

A few points...

Regarding the other recent thread on this...although I frequently find PurrfectPear's post interesting...she simply must be given the benefit of the doubt, because otherwise, we must understand she doesn't know what she is talking about. It is one thing to be hopeful that Kimberly is OK, or even numb to the fact that you can't just understand it all. To be literally uncaring as to whether the diamond and ring one purchased is made from the strategic efforts of an organization involved in rape & murder...I don't think she will mean this.

Regarding Dreamer above...I agree, and recall Pricescope's previous inhabitor owner Irina mentioning the lunacy of being concerned about thrown away gold.

Yssie on Canada...I think a lot of us are saying this...motivating me to continue to look, and I believe I must have overlooked these guys, including Precious Earth, who deal with Namibia diamonds. Be careful, though, I called them up today. Dunn is (a/the) host jeweler. When you search on individual diamonds, you think they are GIA or AGS...but then when you call, to get more data, I learned those diamonds are not the Namibia ones...so it's still a search.

I've got to say...nobody makes it easy. Even and including Paul. You can find his selection under the Infinity make, but then at the store level, unless it's Wink, frequently all you get is a phone number.

Almost encouraging on the above linked site is the inclusion of Walmart. Until you look closer. They don't seem to do engagement rings, and even their diamonds are from Australia.

But...

Despite Kenny's good point:

Date: 3/4/2010 5:04:24 PM
Author: kenny
I'd rather help a poorer country than a richer one.

...if they do not make it, soon, easier to buy from Africa...I think, as has been recommended, it is not so crazy to jump on the Canada bandwagon. As mentioned I think in the earlier LA thread on this from Kenny, the effort the USA engaged in to boycott African apartheid on principle, from the point of view of constructive engagement, came to be viewed as a failed view.

I do take Rappaport's leaving the Diamond Council as an important move. I regard it as important, and I regard that what he's been doing as good works. If the advice now coming from him...is that buying Canadian is a reasonable way to not invest in blood diamonds, I do think this is to be taken seriously.

 

[Callisto]

Date: 3/4/2010 6:02:20 PM
Author: Regular Guy
A few points...


Regarding the other recent thread on this...although I frequently find PurrfectPear''s post interesting...she simply must be given the benefit of the doubt, because otherwise, we must understand she doesn''t know what she is talking about. It is one thing to be hopeful that Kimberly is OK, or even numb to the fact that you can''t just understand it all. To be literally uncaring as to whether the diamond and ring one purchased is made from the strategic efforts of an organization involved in rape & murder...I don''t think she will mean this.


Regarding Dreamer above...I agree, and recall Pricescope''s previous inhabitor owner Irina mentioning the lunacy of being concerned about thrown away gold.


Yssie on Canada...I think a lot of us are saying this...motivating me to continue to look, and I believe I must have overlooked these guys, including Precious Earth, who deal with Namibia diamonds. Be careful, though, I called them up today. Dunn is (a/the) host jeweler. When you search on individual diamonds, you think they are GIA or AGS...but then when you call, to get more data, I learned those diamonds are not the Namibia ones...so it''s still a search.

I''m definitely going to look into Precious Earth, thanks for the tip.

Also re: recycled metals. I found this to be a good and informative site:

http://www.greenkarat.com/about/standards/standards.asp

New metals have to be refined as well so while it is still not the most environmentally friendly option, is is better than participating in the damaging effects of mining AND refining.

And I do know about the Kimberly process and while it is a step in the right direction, it''s very new and it''s not seamless. Even if the chances of getting a conflict diamond are .2%, that''s .2% higher than it should be.

I understand that almost everything we do in this era has an effect (usually negative) on the environment, but I think as a consumer it''s important to know what your options are to minimize this effect.

 

[Lula]

Interesting post, Ira. I guess my beef with all these companies -- Brilliant Earth, Precious Earth, GreenKarat -- is that they seem gimmicky, and they're not telling the whole story either. Their prices are outrageous for suspect quality. Brilliant Earth does not give any assurances as to where their diamonds were cut -- so they're not tracing the stone from mine to cutter to wholesaler to retailer. And Precious Earth is being sold through a chain store, as far as I can tell (J. Dunn). So, again, a lot of steps between the mine and the cutter and the wholesaler and the retail store and you. How much of the profit do you honestly think goes back to the workers mining and cutting the stones?

I agree with Dreamer, the only real way to be green about this is to buy recycled diamonds. And if you want to buy a new diamond and a setting, at least buy one from someone who is as close to the mining and cutting source as possible, so you can be assured that you are getting a diamond that is not a conflict diamond and that was not cut in a sweat shop.

The articles I've seen on this subject lead me to believe that diamonds cut at certain cutting facilities in India are more likely to be conflict diamonds because many of these facilities cut the lower quality rough that is sourced from "conflict" areas in Africa and smuggled into India. That would suggest that the chances of finding a conflict diamond would be higher in mall stores that carry lower quality goods. I don't know, just a hunch.

 

[TheDoctor]

Next to water, gold is probably the most recycled material on Earth. Has been for millennia.
A manufacturer stating that they use only recycled gold is nearly a no-brainer, as most refiners are quite eager to accept tons of recycle material for refining versus buying bullion from mine owners. Most of us probably sport a molecule or two which were pillaged by Cortez and company from the Incas. Melted and diluted hundreds, perhaps thousands of times.
We are encouraged to sweep our floors and send dust, sweeps, and scrap to refiners on a regularly scheduled basis.
Oh, and it takes far more ugly chemistry and boundless amounts of energy to extract new gold from the ground, if there is a chance someone might have misunderstood the environmental cost differences between refining and mining.

 

[TheDoctor]

Canadian diamonds used to be ciut in Canada, now very few are. Many go to India, some perhaps to "sweat shops" as has been described. Prices are now comparable to African or Russian mined with Israeli cutting. In India, where there was once nothing but destitution, there are now cutting operations. Diamonds mined in Africa and cut in Israel aren''t necessarily any better. Belgian cutters, to my knowledge, can''t produce better results than some of the fine goods we receive from Indian manufacturers cutting Canadian rough. These outsell any others we market because they exhibit the skills of true craftsmen/women, not starving children working 20 hours per day.

Don''t think for a moment, though, that all of the "sweat shops" involved in the production of stones, jewellery, textiles, etc. are located offshore.

When the race to the bottom in pricing dictates how companies operate, you can bet your posterior that companies will hire immigrant labour and work them to death in Chicago, NYC, Toronto, or Mumbai, and not in any particular order. It''s nearly always about expediting delivery to eager buyers. When companies describe themselves as more ethical than their competitors on sketchy grounds, , that''s when all of my alarm bells ring, as should yours.

 

[dreamer_dachsie]

Very informtative posts Doctor. Thanks.

 

[gk]

Hi, Greg here from Brilliant Earth. It’s great to see so many diamond shoppers taking the time to make careful decisions before going ahead with their diamond purchases. Looking over some of these postings, it seems like this has been a broad-ranging discussion about Brilliant Earth. A lot of good questions are raised here and we very much appreciate the commentary and feedback. I’ll try to address a few of the issues that have been touched upon, but as always feel free to contact us directly by phone, e-mail, or live chat. (See http://www.brilliantearth.com/contact/ for our contact information).

First, as far as diamond origin, it’s unfortunately still the case that many diamonds are associated with human rights abuses including child labor, worker exploitation, and environmental destruction. Human Rights Watch has done an excellent job documenting the serious and appalling human rights abuses that have taken place in the Chiadzwa diamond fields in the eastern part of Zimbabwe. (This June 2009 report brought worldwide attention to the issue: http://www.hrw.org/en/reports/2009/06/26/diamonds-rough-0.) Zimbabwean diamonds continue to work their way into the international diamond supply and to be certified as conflict free by the Kimberley Process.

It’s our mission to find diamonds of reliably high quality that are mined, cut, and polished in a way that is verifiably ethical and eco-friendly—that is, with high labor and environmental standards. We carefully track our diamonds through the entire chain of custody from the mine, through cutting and polishing, to make sure that everything is being handled in a socially and environmentally responsible way. All of our diamonds are cut in vetted cutting factories of the highest standards either in the country of origin or in major cutting centers including Antwerp and Israel. When we were looking for a source of ethical-origin diamonds, Canadian diamonds stood out to us. In Canada, the civil wars and serious human rights abuses that plague other parts of the world are not present. Furthermore, while no extractive mining process is perfect, Canadian diamond mines are subject to some of the strictest labor and environmental laws in the world. While many of our diamonds come from Canada, Brilliant Earth also offers ethical origin diamonds that are mined, cut, and polished in Namibia. It’s important to realize that right now, there is no system in place to certify diamonds as “fair trade.” As diamond suppliers in developing countries launch more operations that are verifiably ethical and eco-friendly, we are eager to include those sources in our supply. We also offer vintage and estate jewelry as well as lab created gemstones for customers that prefer those options.

For our precious metal, Brilliant Earth uses almost exclusively recycled gold and platinum. Although there is some environmental footprint associated with the recycling process, recycling is a far better option for the environment than new gold mining. At many gold mines around the world, cyanide and mercury leach into the environment. There’s also this alarming statistic: about 20 tons of mine waste are created to product a single gold ring. The No Dirty Gold Campaign (www.nodirtygold.org), which is a campaign by Earthworks International, endorses the recycling of gold as an alternative to gold mining. Brilliant Earth is also pleased that a fair trade labeling system has recently been established for gold. We believe that fair trade gold, supplied by artisanal miners in developing countries, offers an ethical, eco-friendly alternative to recycled gold. Presently, we offer a limited selection of jewelry made from fair trade gold, and we look forward to expanding our offerings.

Finally, there were questions regarding the information available online about our individual diamonds. We presently provide grading reports by e-mail or fax, but we appreciate the feedback on this aspect of our web site. We are constantly working to make our web site better and to provide our customers with the information they need to make an informed purchasing decision. We find that the overwhelming majority of our customers are extremely satisfied both with the quality our jewelry and the customer service we provide. (Really, our customers rave out their experiences! Check out some of their letters at http://www.brilliantearth.com/customer-testimonials/) For more information on our mission and philosophy or with any other questions, please feel free to contact us! - Greg, www.brilliantearth.com