Why does my diamond appear milky in sunlight?

[lolabee]

My new ring is beautiful indoor but shows kind of a grey-ish blue color in sunlight. And I think it looks milky and cloudy too. I don't understand why, as GIA report shows only faint fluorescence. Do all diamonds look like this in sunlight?
I am thinking about returning this... but want to know what I should avoid in the next one.
This one is 1.80, J, SI2, 3xExcellent

 

[Christina...]

Someone better qualified to answer your question will be along, but have you had a chance to take the diamond to an appraiser to make sure that the report matches the diamond? How long have you had the stone? Your right faint florescence typically doesn't make a diamond appear milky, but I'm not sure if it will never make a diamond appear this way.


edit for grammar

 

[lolabee]

No i haven't had a chance to have this appraise yet. But my bf got it from Blue Nile, and came with GIA report. We figure we can probably trust it.

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

If it has faint blue fluoro I think what you are seeing is the blue sky via your diamond - try the same test on a mostly cloudy day and the stone will probably be white.

And looking at diamonds in direct sunlight is always going to give wierd looks anyway - most go very dark.

 

[Gypsy]

I agree with all of the above and want to add one thing... is it clean? Cause when my diamond is dirty holy heck does the sunlight really bring that out. A little hand lotion rubs off and my diamond goes milky in a heartbeat.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Also, what are the inclusions?

 

[Rhino]

Just because a diamond is accompanied by a GIA Report is no guarantee of anything really. There is more than one factor that can cause a diamond to go milky/oily in that lighting environment. It can be due to irregularity in the crystal growth and/or that and the combination of the fluoro that contributes to the appearance you see. I have a clip that shows the same phenomena due to that very reason because faint fluoro alone will not cause it.

Regards,
Rhino

 

[TitanCi]

Wow, that's "faint" fluoro? I like fluoro and all, but I would have thought maybe that's medium or strong?! If it were not milky/cloudy, would you care? I would think that's awesome if it were clear!

 

[Gypsy]

Wow, that's "faint" fluoro? I like fluoro and all, but I would have thought maybe that's medium or strong?! If it were not milky/cloudy, would you care? I would think that's awesome if it were clear!

No, that's not simple faint florescence, it doesn't do that to stones. We don't know what it is yet. We know the certificate she has shows faint florescence on the stone it refers to. We aren't sure the certificate matches the stone. It could also be the combination of faint florescence and some inclusion like clouds or something that's giving it that look. It could also be the reflection of the blue sky and some hand lotion (my diamond does exactly that with a blue sky above it and some hand lotion on it at times).

She needs a good appraiser and a sunny day to take it to them.

That said, strong blue florescence on clear stones does have a GORGEOUS glow and is something I covet and want to own some day.

 

[TitanCi]

Wow, that's "faint" fluoro? I like fluoro and all, but I would have thought maybe that's medium or strong?! If it were not milky/cloudy, would you care? I would think that's awesome if it were clear!

No, that's not simple faint florescence, it doesn't do that to stones. We don't know what it is yet. We know the certificate she has shows faint florescence on the stone it refers to. We aren't sure the certificate matches the stone. It could also be the combination of faint florescence and some inclusion like clouds or something that's giving it that look. It could also be the reflection of the blue sky and some hand lotion (my diamond does exactly that with a blue sky above it and some hand lotion on it at times).

She needs a good appraiser and a sunny day to take it to them.

That said, strong blue florescence on clear stones does have a GORGEOUS glow and is something I covet and want to own some day.

Wow, I'm curious to know what's going on with this stone. That'd be unfortunate if the stone was not matching...

There's a number of older Asian women that LOVE and prize "blue-white" diamonds (I'm not entirely sure what it's called, but colorless diamonds with strong fluoro) and think those are rarer than ones without it. I think it's cool.

 

[Gypsy]

Do a search for threads about Blue-White diamonds on here Titan. There are some great old posts about it, and it's fun reading. That term refers specifically to a D with Strong Blue.

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

I am certain that the effect is the blue sky.
Will you do this please - post enlarged photo's of the ring indoors and the second photo - because when you blow the images up it appears that all the small stones are also blue.
Now the chances that all are strong fluoro is just not on.
So please do this and the other experiment I asked earlier on a cloudy day.

Rhino I have never seen a bluish effect in a knatted or twinned stone that was not also blue fluoro. There is no scientific basis for that to occur that I am aware of.

The hand cream / dirt effect or cloudiness will however enhance the blue from the sky effect.

 

[lolabee]

Thank you everyone for your feedback!!
I took those pics of the ring right after I took it out from the UPS box, so probably no lotion and no smudges. We actually went to a local jewelry store earlier and compared our diamond to theirs side by side. Ours look so dull and gray/blue compare to theirs . They told me it's b/c of the fluor, but it's only "faint fluor"... so i don't get it.
Minimal inclusions showing on GIA report, and it is eye clean, even for a SI2. We thought we found something great. Guess this one is going back to Blue Nile... SIGH...

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

can you post the GIA report or the ct wt and the report # please?

(How many times have I warned folk here not to buy eye clean SI2 stones that have no grade making inclusions on the report? It is far better to have an inclusion that you can live with than clouds or bad graining / twinning).

The symbols on your grading report or the comments field will give it all away. And the sky would have been magnified by the dulling features. A returner from what we know so far.

 

[Christina...]

Can you post the GIA report? Under the comment section does it say 'clarity based on clouds not shown'? GIA doesn't show every inclusion in their clarity plot because it would muck it up and well, probably scare you death, so like Gary said it's important to read the information under the comment section. I'm betting that your stone has a bunch of deep clouds and it's affecting the brilliance of the diamond. The good news is that you have a return policy with blue nile. The bad news, you back to searching for your perfect diamond, but wait....there's more good new......we can help you find the perfect stone this time!!

I just purchased a diamond last week as well, and I also thought that there was an issue with mine so I know how heartbreaking it can be. But it's great that you noticed this so quickly and can do something about it. We see so many posters who have purchased stones without a return policy or with a very short return policy and later find out that there are issues with the stone, and they can't do anything about it. Good for you knowing better!

 

[lolabee]

I tried to post a picture of the GIA report, but it wouldn't let me for some reason. GIA# 5126825718. Yes, it does say under the comments: "Clarity grade is based on clouds that are not shown". The diagram shows 3 small spots of crystal, and needle. 1.80 Ct, J, SI2, EX, EX, EX.
So maybe it's the clouds and faint fluoro that caused the diamond to look hazy/dull?
Our budget is 12k, we could go up in color grade maybe to a G. Shall we completely avoid SI clarity? Are Twinning Wisps bad and noticeable? I want the stone to be at least 1.5ct tho therefore we rather stay in SI, but we def don't want milky color stone again.

 

[Christina...]

You can stay in the SI range and it will still be possible to find a nice clean stone. This thread sort of made twinning wisps sound scary but they are actually often times a great inclusion to have because they are almost always invisible to the naked eye. Clouds aren't always horrible either, it depends on how deep they are and where they are located in the stone. Don't worry about not realizing that there were clouds in the stone. It's confusing when labs do this, a person would assume that all grade making inclusions would be listed on the clarity map. I'll take a look around for you and see what we can find.

 

[Christina...]

http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/J-SI1-Excellent-Cut-Round-Diamond-1446378.asp
http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/J-VS2-Excellent-Cut-Round-Diamond-1435675.asp

http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-2763505.htm
http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-57142.htm

 

[Rhino]

I am certain that the effect is the blue sky.
Will you do this please - post enlarged photo's of the ring indoors and the second photo - because when you blow the images up it appears that all the small stones are also blue.
Now the chances that all are strong fluoro is just not on.
So please do this and the other experiment I asked earlier on a cloudy day.

Rhino I have never seen a bluish effect in a knatted or twinned stone that was not also blue fluoro. There is no scientific basis for that to occur that I am aware of.

The hand cream / dirt effect or cloudiness will however enhance the blue from the sky effect.

Hey mate,

I have seen it when you combine extraneous graining with fluoro. I have a clip on this very subject showing the phenomena. Hearing what's on the GIA however points to what may be a saturated cloud that is causing it. I've seen SI1's with the same features too.

All the best,
Rhino

 

[lolabee]

I am certain that the effect is the blue sky.
Will you do this please - post enlarged photo's of the ring indoors and the second photo - because when you blow the images up it appears that all the small stones are also blue.
Now the chances that all are strong fluoro is just not on.
So please do this and the other experiment I asked earlier on a cloudy day.

Rhino I have never seen a bluish effect in a knatted or twinned stone that was not also blue fluoro. There is no scientific basis for that to occur that I am aware of.

The hand cream / dirt effect or cloudiness will however enhance the blue from the sky effect.

Hey mate,

I have seen it when you combine extraneous graining with fluoro. I have a clip on this very subject showing the phenomena. Hearing what's on the GIA however points to what may be a saturated cloud that is causing it. I've seen SI1's with the same features too.

All the best,
Rhino

Rhino, I thought you look familiar. You are the Good Old Gold guy! I've seen some of your videos before and they're all very educational. Where can I find this clip that you are talking about?

 

[lolabee]

http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/J-SI1-Excellent-Cut-Round-Diamond-1446378.asp
http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/J-VS2-Excellent-Cut-Round-Diamond-1435675.asp

http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-2763505.htm
http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-57142.htm

Thanks, Christina!! I think we want to go above J this time, perhaps a H, and will probably buy from Blue Nile since they already have our money for my current ring. I will post a few options here later, maybe you can give me feedback? I appreciate all your help.

 

[thbmok]

I think Rhino is talking about this one: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XCRorteDK-Q

GIA report for the stone: https://myapps.gia.edu/ReportCheckPortal/getReportData.do?&reportno=5126825718&weight=1.8#

IMO in this case the issues you are seeing is most likely due to the clouds. The inclusion plot is super clean for a SI2, which would suggest that the clouds are pretty pervasive throughout the stone.

You really need someone to look at the stone to see whether any inclusions are problematic. Not all inclusions are the same, even if they are of the same types within the same clarity grades.

 

[Christina...]

http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/J-SI1-Excellent-Cut-Round-Diamond-1446378.asp
http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/J-VS2-Excellent-Cut-Round-Diamond-1435675.asp

http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-2763505.htm
http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-57142.htm

Thanks, Christina!! I think we want to go above J this time, perhaps a H, and will probably buy from Blue Nile since they already have our money for my current ring. I will post a few options here later, maybe you can give me feedback? I appreciate all your help.

That makes sense! I didn't even think of that when I was looking, I can take another look too.

 

[Md123456789]

Hi! I just bought a beautiful 2.03 carat j si2 with medium fluorescence and it's beautiful in natural light. The difference is I got to see this diamond in person before making a decision. If you can return, maybe you can pick something you can see first?

 

[lolabee]

I really like this one: http://www.bluenile.com/round-diamond-1-carat-ideal-cut-f-color-si2-clarity_LD02142373
what do you guys think? It has no comments on GIA reports, for a SI2 it looks pretty clean (I was told it's eye clean as well) but only concern is the clouds/crystal is right in the middle of the table. Will it affect the brilliance of the stone?
This one is also interesting http://www.bluenile.com/round-diamond-1-carat-ideal-cut-f-color-si2-clarity_LD02489771, but the comment: "Pinpoints are not shown" concerns me. Which one would u pick?
This one is smaller and lower color but VS1. Will it be shinier? http://www.bluenile.com/diamond-search#diamonds_pid=LD02493130

Appreciate all your help!!

 

[lolabee]

http://www.bluenile.com/diamond-search#diamonds_pid=LD02548221
Just found this one. looks promising to me, but much smaller

 

[Christina...]

Of the four new stones that you listed I like the first one the best as far how it's likely to perform. The pavilion angle on the others is to deep and the depth of the last stone is too deep which is going to make the diamond appear smaller in the face up position.

Ideally you want a diamond with a table between 55-58, a pavilion angle of 40.5-41, depth 60-62.3, and a crown 34-35.5. This is a bit restrictive and there are certainly beautiful diamond out there that have angles just outside of these, but it's a good guideline when you are buying a stone unseen.

Have you used the HCA here yet? If you look under the tools tab above and scroll down to HCA you can input the diamond your are considering dimensions and the HCA will predict the likely light performance of the diamond. You should be looking for stones that score under 2 and rejecting stones that score over 2. Once you find a diamond that scores well on the HCA your next step would be an idealscope image, but I think you said that Blue Nile doesn't do these. However, if your purchasing a GIA excellent cut AND it scores well on the HCA and has good inclusions and inclusion placement than it's probably worth taking a look at in person, so don't sweat not being able get IS images. Its a great tool to have if it's available but maybe not completely necessary.

Edit: When you inquire about the diamond being eye clean, you should also ask if the inclusions are affecting the brilliance of the diamond as well. As you found out, a diamond can be considered eye clean but have inclusions that affect it's performance.

 

[Black Jade]

Please call the Blue Nile customer service and explain the problem with them, with the information you have gotten on this post.
They are very very good about listening and about making exchanges--if you get in during the return period. Since the return period is just a month, if I were you, I would call them right now and also ask for their suggestions. If you want an SI2 price but not the clouds, tell them that. I had an SI2 once from them that made me unhappy and we discussed it and they exchanged it for one I liked much better without any problem (in fact, the one they exchanged it for cost slightly more and they didn't charge anything further).

 

[dreamer_dachsie]

"Clarity grade is based on clouds not shown" is a red flag with Si2 stones for this reason. I would just return it and keep looking.

 

[lolabee]

Thank you Christina for introducing to HCA to me!!! I've been playing around with it. It will def be part of my decision making from now on!! Online buying is much more complicated that I thought, but the price is so irresistible compare to buying in stores.