shape
carat
color
clarity

What color is Too yellow?

At what color grade does a diamond begin to be tacky yellow?

  • e

    Votes: 1 100.0%
  • f

    Votes: 1 100.0%
  • g

    Votes: 1 100.0%
  • h

    Votes: 1 100.0%
  • k

    Votes: 1 100.0%
  • l

    Votes: 1 100.0%

  • Total voters
    1
  • Poll closed .
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Obsessed

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Since we've done the size poll to death, lets see what people think about color? Please, state reasons regarding preference as well as cultural beliefs!!!

Edit: For ENGAGEMENT centerstone!!!!
 

Mara

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I personally would say 'tacky yellow' is around N stage. UNLESS you want a warmer stone. But if you thought you were getting a whiter stone and have an N...
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I had N colored earrings for 2 years and didn't even know it! They just looked a little warm.




I have seen some online pix of amazing J stones and they are not yellow at all!




Okay and who is the person who voted H? Speak up now.
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Have you even SEEN an H in person? My H Regent is SOOOOOOOOOOOO white, honestly....I don't see a tint of color.
 

pqcollectibles

Ideal_Rock
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I can't answer. I have a gorgeous J. A well cut diamond from the right rough,.... Who knows???
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Nicrez

Ideal_Rock
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Color snob here. I am normally not a round stone fan, so shaped stones IMO will always need to be either colorless (TO AN H!!!) or Cape yellow, of fancy colors. That's just me.




However...If it's a round stone, I could drop to a J if it's well cut, like PQC's J...but I have only seen pics, and never seen a J in person. So Mara...I stick with my H.
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Obsessed

Shiny_Rock
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Messages
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Wow, I am actually surprised that so many people are voting H color? When considering this with the result of the Clarity poll, I dare to make this statement:
If you chose a G color VS 1 stone or better(assuming an excellent or ideal cut ofcourse), you'll find that it is very respectable to even the snobbiest diamond fans!
 

Nicrez

Ideal_Rock
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Obssessed, people would argue your decision to buy Tiffany's. you may be a name snob. I am a color snob, so I wanted a D. We just didn't find a well cut D in our carat size. Clarity is not a thing to me. I've seen nice SI1s, but prefer to be VS2 or over, especially in shaped stones.




Also, many cultures (such as Asian cultures) want the best purity and clarity as a symbolic gesture of perfection (and or investment). My guy wanted quality over size, and many want size over color or clarity, as you'll see here on PS. It depends on the person and their prioities and their budgets!
 

Mara

Super_Ideal_Rock
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I am really surprised as well that people are choosing H.




It leads me to believe that most of these people are not considering the SAME THING. Normally when I start a poll or something, I clarify what I am asking. e.g. color in a fancy cut may be more visible than a round brilliant.




I also think that maybe these people have not viewed a H&A H round cut stone for themselves.




Anyhow, I maintain that if someone sees a well-cut H round stone they would be shocked to notice that it's NOT tacky yellow at all.
 

Obsessed

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Messages
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Nicrez,

I know. I am just being an idiot here. Just humor me with my experiment. Everyone has different priorities when it comes to brand, size, quality, etc. I figure, why not see what the overwhelming majority feels about all those categories. A true showoff(i bet there are a few...) will be compelled to match highest expectations in all categories. Isn't that just delicious? Yeah, I did buy a Tiffany and it impresses SOME people, but obviously i couldn't match some of the other impressive parameters such as big size. That is very humbling to me and makes me realize that you can only concentrate on what are important to you and your loved one. Same thing goes to those who sport large rocks and think that it is 'all that'. Look around and see what other people think in terms of every other parameter. And if anyone happens to have that 2.5 carat D, IF.... more power to them.
 

mike04456

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
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I agree with a comment made in one of the other size/color/clarity poll threads--I don't think this is serving any useful purpose.
nono.gif
 

valeria101

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
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Messages
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Hm... if anyone happens to have a 2.5 D-IF they'd have to wear a tag attached for everyone to see those grades. Otherwise how am I supposed to tell it from a F-SI ? Granted, I am not handling dozens of stones each day to keep my sight trained on such detailed identification exercises, but on someone's hand I would never swear I could tell those apart.
sad.gif


BTW, Obsessed : it may be a good idea to determine what kind of diamond you want by democratic election
eek.gif
but... how about getting some actual items lined up in front of you for inspection ?
 

Nicrez

Ideal_Rock
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Obsessed, imagine now that it's from Tiffany's!!!
eek.gif





Honestly, Mara, I have seen an H round stone (when I was looking for rounds, as a last ditch resort of a possibly failed radiant search) and I almost fell off my seat that is was MUCH whiter (loooking) than the F princess next to it. I almost convinced my guy to get me the H Cento diamond I saw...Again, this stone was not H&A IDEAL cut by any means, so it was quite white! WOW!




Shaped stones I would only go up to H, but rounds, I would say about J, because to me a white diamond should be as white as possible, and when a hint of color is obvious, I am not impressed (personally). I would rather just get a Cape stone...




I'm also really really good with color, so it bugs me.
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My jeweler thought I was scary as I called off the colors he showed me with no indicator stones to base it on...
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AGBF

Super_Ideal_Rock
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I can't answer because I truly don't know. I have never seen a stone that anyone told me was some of these colors (I,J,K).

I am sure I have SEEN stones of these colors, but I didn't KNOW what color I was looking at when I did!

I thought it was fair to say that G and above was acceptable to even the worst color snob, though. I have stones between D and G. I like colorless stones and GIA's "G" looks good to me.

Deb
 

AGBF

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
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----------------
On 3/3/2004 4:01:34 PM Obsessed wrote:

Wow, I am actually surprised that so many people are voting H color? When considering this with the result of the Clarity poll, I dare to make this statement:
If you chose a G color VS 1 stone or better(assuming an excellent or ideal cut ofcourse), you'll find that it is very respectable to even the snobbiest diamond fans!
----------------


Yes, I think you could dare to make that statement.
 

tlnini

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jan 31, 2004
Messages
8
----------------
On 3/3/2004 4:24:38 PM Nicrez wrote:


and I almost fell off my seat that is was MUCH whiter (loooking) than the F princess next to it. I almost convinced my guy to get me the H Cento diamond I saw...

Look, there's a reason why a dimaond would be graded a H vs. a D. It has color! From face up, it might look white, but it still doesn't change the fact that it's only "near" colorless.

I think it all depends on the person you are giving it to. If your significant other is going to look the the diamond from all sorts of different angles, then a H might bother her.

Others might not care as much, it's a judgement call. Choose what you are comfortable with, but simply because the yellowness is mask by viewing the diamond face-up doesn't change the fact that it's a H color diamond.
 

valeria101

Super_Ideal_Rock
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The last answer was mine... just too tempting not to comment a bit !

Too dark... I would usually jup to saying that there is o such thing, but after some thought, I guess "Fancy deep" is too dark - at that point color saturation starts getting in the way of brilliance, hence the name. I'd get gray diamonds off the list, since I am not sure wether being dark is not a merit for them.
 

tomatoe

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----------------
On 3/3/2004 4:11:17 PM Nicrez wrote:


Also, many cultures (such as Asian cultures) want the best purity and clarity as a symbolic gesture of perfection (and or investment). My guy wanted quality over size, and many want size over color or clarity, as you'll see here on PS. It depends on the person and their prioities and their budgets!
----------------


Nicrez, it would be nice if you didnt make generalised statements like that
nono.gif
. Asians have also been brainwashed by the marketing machine that is DeBeers into thinking that D/ IF diamonds are the only way to go and are just as uneducated about diamonds as the average American.
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drdeano

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Having not studied Asian sociology, I can't comment on that. However, saying that someone is brainwashed because they place a high value on D/ IF stones is also making a pretty generalized statement.

A 1.0 carat ID ID D IF on Pricescope is $18,800
A 1.0 carat ID ID G VS1 on Pricescope is ~$6,000 (high end)

Which stone would YOU choose? What do YOU value? Which stone is more RARE?

I found 2 stones on Pricescope that fit the characteristics of the first stone. There were 43 of the second. Would the first stone be purchased by someone who is "brainwashed by DeBeers?" OR is the second stone the best buy because 98% of the people polled on this site find the characteristics "non-tacky?" Just wondering
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If NASA was somehow able to bring back rocks from Mars, and they were selling 1000 of them. If I wanted a "Mars rock" on my finger and I obtained one, I would be happy I posess something incredibly rare on this planet. If then, people called me brainwashed because I value that amazingly rare rock and they have something on their finger that LOOKS like my rock, is made of the same material as my rock but didnt come from Mars.. I would think THEY were crazy! hehe

It's all perspective. To me, when people say that stones "face up white" why does it matter? If people value the stone for what it represents, then it wont. If people are trying to get the "most apparent bang for the buck" (which is what I did, not judging anyone!!!
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) then they probably wont care that the rarity of the stone is not "out there for all to see." If all diamonds suddenly sprouted a speaker and spoke what it's specs were for all to hear.. I am sure more people would "value" the rarer stones because they "value" what other people think they have on their finger.

Just my random thoughts! I work in the printing industry.. my jeweler hated me because every stone he found for me in my budget was "too dingy" for me. He told me I have a good eye, but that good eye hit me in the wallet.. because I ended up going with an F because that was the threshhold where I could not see color... Am I a "color snob?" Gee, I hope not! I just place a bit higher value on color than some do. I wouldn't call someone who gets a 1.3 carat J a "size snob" because they happen to want a bigger stone.

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I've ranted too much.. sorry for the novel.

Different strokes for different folks is what I always say!

DrD
 

valeria101

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
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Interesting start, Drdeano
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Your comments give a very puzzling account of what might define a diamond's "value" to you. Is this anywhere near the point ? Not sure what the "brainwashing" is about: almost everyone here would agree they like how diamonds look and have bought some voluntarily (I hope).
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drdeano

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Puzzling account?

I admit I AM a puzzling person.. I don't know if I had a point in my post. I'm just sitting at work drinking coffee and something someone said put some thoughts in my head which required me to post.

I'll read it again to see if it made sense.. it was pretty much just ramblings from a board troll.
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DrD
 

Nicrez

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Tomatoe, I respect your opinion, but I stick to mine. SOME Asian cultures believe in the purity of the stone, just as some Americans and others all over. But generally, I have been told by 3 of my Asian friends that purity is a big thing in their "culture", Two are Chinese, One Vietnamese. All three woudl want high color, high clarity. Also 5 jewelers asked me if my BF was Asian, because we were looking for colorless and high clarity. To me, that says there's a trend.




If we didn't generalize about anything, we would be so specific and conversations would never end. For the sake of time and illustrating a trend, I said it, and I still stick to it. Just yesterday a jeweler told me that she always sends all her high color'clarity stones to Japan because they really sell there much better than here. She's been a jeweler for 30+ years!




If I am wrong, then I truly apologize, but let's not get all sensitive. Everyone is already bickering over size (too big / too small), why fight over such a silly point? I accept totally that their are acceptions to all generalizations, that's why I didn't say ALL Asian people like...I tried to keep it general. It's like saying ALL PS people are over 30years old. Some are, many are not, NOTHING is ever totally one way. Can we be friends now?
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alexah

Brilliant_Rock
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A little story:
When I was shopping for a stone, I was only looking at princess cuts.
I went to Tiffany to do a color-compare on their stones - looked at D thru I in the Lucida cut and noticed no difference - except price
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.
Then I went to Saks and they showed me an I stone that looked yellow-ish but, honestly, the cut was below average.
Finally, I went to an internet vendor & he showed me various colors & cuts.
Head and shoulders above the rest was the sparkliest (1A) J- it had a personality that outshone the others. It called to me & I can't imagine being any happier with any other stone- not even a 3ct D IF.
As a bonus, the money we "saved" on the stone is going into a custom e-ring/wedding set. I got my first look at the wedding band yesterday & it's absolutely perfect
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!

I don't know what color I would consider too yellow. I haven't seen a well-cut K-P- they could be dazzling? I'll reserve judgement...
 

tomatoe

Brilliant_Rock
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Nicrez, I certainly do not dispute what your Asian friends have said about diamonds and the Asian culture but it would be interesting to note if your Asian friends are born & bred in America (several generations and maybe think of themselves as being more "American" than yourself) or are first generation migrants who have lived in Asia for most of their young & adult life. The irony is that I am 100% Chinese and living in an 80% Asian society but have never heard of diamonds being used to denote purity in my culture. My family buys diamonds because we like them sparkly things. I belive it is more of the fact that most (Asia) Asians have a tendency to accept what has been said by a 'higher authority', in this case the majority of the diamond industry, and do not think outta the box or understand that what has been said is not set in stone and can even be wrong.

I am repeating myself here but I had to say what I did because none of my friends (Singaporean or Aussie Asian) know as much as we do, on PS, about diamonds and how cut is really important, so much so that we can lower the colour and clarity and still get a magnificently performing diamond. They believe all the hogwash that Debeers has been feeding us over the years; "Diamonds are forever", "D/IF diamonds are a symbol of purity", blah blah blah. It is truly sad when two of my guy friends compared only the ct weight of their wife's/ fiance's diamond solitaire and the guy with the bigger stone seemed mighty pleased with that fact, even though he spent double what the other guy did for a 0.1ct difference
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As for the jeweler that said "she always sends all her high color/clarity stones to Japan because they really sell there much better than here", that is certainly true and I am not disputing it. But why is it so hard to believe that this is a direct result of the marketing power of Debeer's? I've grown up & lived with, and have very close Japanese family friends and I have seen the scary way Japanese follow a trend blindly and religiously. If you wanted to make your fortune, all you'd need to do is invent something totally inane, market it to the Japanese as the latest must-have thing, sell it for only US$1 to half of their population and BINGO
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!

Tongue-in-cheek here, we were not friends to begin with, only acquaintances, so that issue never came into my mind
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. I dont like to pretend that everyone has the same ideas and opinions as you have mentioned, but we all know that the differences are what makes the world that much more interesting. As for playing nice, you can come over to my house for afternoon tea and show me more of your wonderful topaz ring later
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!
 

Nicrez

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Tomatoe, all three are Asian born, but engaged here in the USA. Maybe not all pockets of Asian culture have the same beliefs I certainly WILL agree with that. I would never assume EVERYONE shares the same beliefs being from a similar culture. I myself come from two totallty different cultures, and my boyfriend is a totally different one as well. I am very aware that people CAN NOT be categorized by the other people around them who share a race, color, or creed...It's stupid.
nono.gif





I have been profiled, and I certainly get VERY heated when anyone says a remark about a culture or race that doesn't apply to everyone. I don't think ANY remark can be made to apply that universally. So if that comment was ignorant, I do apologize, but that's all I have seen. I have not seen everything yet, and honestly, I have never seen a diamond on ANY hand in Korea...so maybe DeBeers missed them, or I missed the sparklies...
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Indeed, we are acquaintances, and my comment was more a gesture of good will, although reading my post again, my exclusion of smiley faces, DID seem more defensive than I had first thought, so sorry.
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I'd gladly come over with the topaz ring, now that I am actually wearing it around...
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It was too stuffy in it's box, I had to let him out!
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So, following my own advice in another post to stop being controversial and argumentative, I will venture to say, any person touched by De Beers has some brainwashing to overcome, to realize that good stones have no color, no carat, no clarity, but only the sentimental value of the intent and the fact that it's a luxury item GIFTED to you as a symbol of love....
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tomatoe

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NicreZ, heeheee, group hug time!!!!!
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We've all been tainted by the thing that calls itself Debeers. And I heart myself 0.71cts worth, bought with hubby's money of course..... ROFL!
Up_to_something.gif
 

sumi

Brilliant_Rock
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Messages
565
----------------
On 3/4/2004 12:07:08 PM tomatoe wrote:

..... I belive it is more of the fact that most (Asia) Asians have a tendency to accept what has been said by a 'higher authority', in this case the majority of the diamond industry, and do not think outta the box or understand that what has been said is not set in stone and can even be wrong.

I have seen the scary way Japanese follow a trend blindly and religiously. If you wanted to make your fortune, all you'd need to do is invent something totally inane, market it to the Japanese as the latest must-have thing, sell it for only US$1 to half of their population and BINGO
9.gif
!

----------------



Well, those are some pretty harsh generalizations too Tomatoe. Maybe you should read your own post about generalizations?

I was born in Japan and lived there off an on throughout my life, and my mother is born and bred in Japan. Even though I'm mixed race, I consider myself more Japanese than anything. It's true, the Japanese are very brand consious. I think that has mostly to do with the fact that an overwhelming majority of the population is middle class. A lot of people have that kind of disposable income. Also, it's very important in that society to look nice. For example, women don't usually leave the house without makeup, many housewives own business suits that they wear out even just for lunches with friends. They just have different standards and social norms.

As for diamonds, the engagement ring tradition is a relatively new on in Japan. Many women don't even have one. The overall style in Japan is very subtle and understated, so bigger stones may appear gaudy in that country. So, it seems like instead of spending a lot of the budget on size, they go for things like color and clarity.

At any rate, I don't think a lot of people realize the HUGE difference between Asian cultures. Just because Tomatoe is in Singapore and has Japanese friends does not make her an expert on the Japanese culture. My dad has lived for extended periods of time in both Japan and Singapore and he can attest to the fact that they are VERY different places. The Japanese are so different from the Chinese who are so different from Koreans, etc, etc.




Back to the REAL topic of the thread....I think we can all agree that color is a personal choice and we all have different thresholds for what we find attractive.
 

tomatoe

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oooo.... heh, Sumi, but Nicrez and I have settled our differences and would you like to come join us for some tea and sparklies too? Seriously though, I'm sorry if I come across as being too harsh, but I never claimed to be an expert on Japanese culture. It is just my observations and perception, also from speaking to my friend working in Japan for the past few years and from my step father who was married to a Japanese, had 2 kids with that lady and lived in Japan for many years of his life.

I specifically spoke to my mum about diamonds and Japan a few weeks ago and she told me that our family friend, Yumi, said that most Japanese ladies (even in Tokyo) do not have diamond e-rings. Yumi's mother (oba-chan) also mentioned that traditionally a Japanese lady only recieves a diamond for the diamond wedding anniversary. Sumi, please, do confirm or dispute this, as I am very interested in finding out more.

As for all the Asian countries being different, of course I am aware of that. I think it is a rather condescending statement, but perhaps I'd already rubbed you the wrong way.
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Hest88

Ideal_Rock
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I hesitate to join into this since last year we had some pretty heated discussions over this issue.

I'm Chinese, though Chinese-American, and I've heard that quality thing a lot too. However, I'd bet if you asked most non-Asian Americans what constituted a perfect diamond they'd say, "D, IF." Most people, much less most Asians, know diddly about diamonds so it's really easy to think purity is the best indicator of diamond quality. As we've discussed many times on PS, it's also the easiest for a consumer to grasp. It's only when you get an educated consumer that the link between sparkliness and cut is drawn.

Most of the relatives I see frequently are immigrants, and they talk about the purity of 24k gold, and how anything less isn't real gold. But the impracticality of that escapes them because it's the mantra they're used to repeating and hearing. I don't think that Asians wanting D, IF is really because Asians inherently value quality over size or whatever, but it's because they've been told to believe D, IF means quality.
 

Obsessed

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Feb 6, 2004
Messages
104
Its interesting to see this poll digress into a discussion about the Asian culture. But these observations are true with exceptions, ofcourse. As far as a D,IF being perfect, why disagree? All things(cut, polish, symmetry, etc) being equal, wouldn't a D IF be more perfect than a D VVS1 or E IF? Yes, D IF is perfect all else being equal. I guess you CAN say that a D IF is really not that practical because it cost a lot more but very difficult or even impossible to distinguish it from a F VVS1 or whatever.... yes, thats true but where do you draw the line? at E,F,G,H? or VVS, VS, SI? You see the point? Here is a nice Korean(i'm one although Korean-American) analogy: A 1600 SAT score will get you into Harvard. A 1550 SAT score will also get you into Harvard BUT it is NOT a perfect score! Same thing with diamonds
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!
 

valeria101

Super_Ideal_Rock
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----------------
On 3/5/2004 1:39:04 PM Obsessed wrote:



As far as a D,IF being perfect, why disagree? All things(cut, polish, symmetry, etc) being equal, wouldn't a D IF be more perfect than a D VVS1 or E IF? ----------------




Why ?

In this case, someone decided where to stop splitting hairs and placed a price on the threshold. I was not the one doing so... As far as I understand, "perfection" is has more legitimate usage in philosophy than in marketing
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