WHAT cause stone hazy??

[yeleaves]

Hi everyone,

Recently, I started selecting my engagement stone and I was told by a sales that online shopping would probably get you a hazy one as even GIA triple ex could still be hazy/milky. I am so confused. Let's assume the the cutting is ideal and none fluorescence, then what's factors cause a stone hazy? Is that because of inclusions ? Please give me some suggestions to avoid haziness.

 

[bmfang]

Sounds like that in store sales associate wants some commission to me.

If there are clouds in the stone that could cause the stone to be hazy based on what I know. Apart from that, fluorescence could also turn a stone milky/hazy and that is why the top online vendors provide magnified images/videos so that consumers can readily look at stones before they make their purchasing decision.

And if you are looking at online vendors, the ones who actually own the stones they list usually have pre-screened their inventory to avoid having stock which is hazy/milky.

 

[Tophat1]

Agree, and all the price scope recommended retailers have excellent return policies too so even less of a concern

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Stay with VS2 clarity or higher, and medium to no fluorescence if you want to not worry about haziness or seeing an inclusion. The sales person is envious of losing sales to online vendors. They should be, because you will save money buying online, and you have the option of going with a vendor with a better upgrade policy, too.

 

[Kbell]

They of course would prefer you buy from them VS online. After extensive research we finally bit the bullet and
purchased a loose diamond online. What arrived looks absolutely perfect to me & exactly what I expected...and not hazy. I'm bringing it to an appraiser today to establish insurance value and make sure everything matches (laser inscription etc). Buying online got me a 30 day return policy & a great upgrade policy (which I probably will never use but others would I'm sure). So it
pretty much eliminates the risk. It may seem daunting at 1st especially for a large important purchase but the prices are much better & there is NO sales pressure to sway you one way or the other. You determine what you want which is the fun part! Good luck!

 

[denverappraiser]

Hazy appearance comes from 5 general things.

1) Grime. Oil and other contaminants obviously affect transparency and that makes a hazy appearance. It’s like looking through a dirty window. The first step is always to clean it.

2) Inclusions. If the material isn’t transparent, obviously that’s going to cause a problem. ‘Materially affects the beauty of the stone’ is part of the definition of the I-1 clarity grade and this is an important topic is you’re in that neighborhood, a correctly graded stone above, say SI-1, will not have inclusions that give a hazy appearance. Stones below that are usually there for other reasons but it's a good question to keep on your radar.

3) Fluorescence. Diamonds are all about reflecting around light, but fluorescent stones generate light under certain conditions. At what point this becomes a problem is a hotly debated topic in the trade but for Strong and Very Strong fluorescence grades it’s a good question to ask.

4) Polish. If the facets aren’t polished then they’re not transparent. Think of the obscured glass on your shower. Polish grades below Good are a flag for this.

5) Vision. Eyes and brains work in funny ways. If you stare into a really bright light, it'll look hazy to you. That's not about the light, or even the lens, it's about your eyes.

 

[Karl_K]

Buy from a stocking dealer who inspects the stone and has a good return policy and a good reputation with consumers and you can even go down to si or very strong florescence without getting hazy stones.
Not every si or very strong florescence diamond is going to be free of haziness which is why a stocking dealer is important.
There are also some hazy vs2 min. florescence diamonds out there but they are fairly rare.
Hazy diamonds are more common than they used to be on the market so its not total BS what your told.
But then again I know of b&m's that would sell you a hazy diamond in a heart beat and you would not likely see it under the jewelry store lights.
Careful shopping and return policies will help avoid the issue no matter where you buy.

You don't really know your diamond until you see it for a week or so in your own environment.
That's why a generous return policy is so important.

 

[yeleaves]

Hazy appearance comes from 5 general things.

1) Grime. Oil and other contaminants obviously affect transparency and that makes a hazy appearance. It’s like looking through a dirty window. The first step is always to clean it.

2) Inclusions. If the material isn’t transparent, obviously that’s going to cause a problem. ‘Materially affects the beauty of the stone’ is part of the definition of the I-1 clarity grade and this is an important topic is you’re in that neighborhood, a correctly graded stone above, say SI-1, will not have inclusions that give a hazy appearance. Stones below that are usually there for other reasons but it's a good question to keep on your radar.

3) Fluorescence. Diamonds are all about reflecting around light, but fluorescent stones generate light under certain conditions. At what point this becomes a problem is a hotly debated topic in the trade but for Strong and Very Strong fluorescence grades it’s a good question to ask.

4) Polish. If the facets aren’t polished then they’re not transparent. Think of the obscured glass on your shower. Polish grades below Good are a flag for this.

5) Vision. Eyes and brains work in funny ways. If you stare into a really bright light, it'll look hazy to you. That's not about the light, or even the lens, it's about your eyes.

Thanks very much.
pretty much I could avoid haziness if I set my range to clarity SI1 above, GIA 3EX, and none fluorescence?

 

[rainwood]

Actually, I think the takeaway is that if you buy a recommended stone from a reputable online seller you're unlikely to get a milky or hazy stone regardless of the specifications of that stone. All of my bigger diamonds I've bought online are SI1 or SI2, all have medium or strong blue fluorescence except one, and all of them are gorgeous with no haziness or milkiness whatsoever. The posters are telling you what CAN cause milkiness, but none of the vendors we recommend are going to sell you a milky stone unless you specifically ask for one.

And what you were told at the jewelry store is what is now known as an "alternative" fact. In other words, that salesperson was making stuff up to scare you away from buying a better cut and less expensive stone online. There have been lots of stories about what crazy stuff people have been told by jewelry store personnel. So don't worry. Look at what stones from PS recommended vendors are within your budget, ask people here about which ones they'd recommend, and they will guide you to a great diamond.

 

[yeleaves]

always saw stones on James Allens like pic, one seems sparkle and the other looks milky (Both are same SI1 grade)

Is there just because of the photography they took, nothing wrong with the diamonds .

 

[yeleaves]

Actually, I think the takeaway is that if you buy a recommended stone from a reputable online seller you're unlikely to get a milky or hazy stone regardless of the specifications of that stone. All of my bigger diamonds I've bought online are SI1 or SI2, all have medium or strong blue fluorescence except one, and all of them are gorgeous with no haziness or milkiness whatsoever. The posters are telling you what CAN cause milkiness, but none of the vendors we recommend are going to sell you a milky stone unless you specifically ask for one.

And what you were told at the jewelry store is what is now known as an "alternative" fact. In other words, that salesperson was making stuff up to scare you away from buying a better cut and less expensive stone online. There have been lots of stories about what crazy stuff people have been told by jewelry store personnel. So don't worry. Look at what stones from PS recommended vendors are within your budget, ask people here about which ones they'd recommend, and they will guide you to a great diamond.

Thanks rainwood. People here are so kind and always tolerate with my ignorance.


Thanks everyone !

 

[bmfang]

denverappraiser mentioned two that I entirely forgot about but which are critical: oil/grime/dirt and polish.

For an AGS Ideal/GIA XXX stone, you are unlikely to have a stone that has issues with polish but the oil/dirt/grime issue is definitely something that can really stuff up how a stone looks. Especially if a stone is not picked up with tweezers but by fingers, sebum from the skin can definitely affect transparency and make something look worse than it actually is.

 

[bmfang]

...

And what you were told at the jewelry store is what is now known as an "alternative" fact. In other words, that salesperson was making stuff up to scare you away from buying a better cut and less expensive stone online. There have been lots of stories about what crazy stuff people have been told by jewelry store personnel. So don't worry. Look at what stones from PS recommended vendors are within your budget, ask people here about which ones they'd recommend, and they will guide you to a great diamond.

I will have to remember this delicious phrase for use at the next B&M shop I visit that tries to tell me this (or other things) as a deadset fact. Usually I refer to stuff like that as "bovine fecal matter" (or its more common usage) instead...

 

[denverappraiser]

I was just answering the original question of what makes a stone look milky because it hadn’t been directly answered yet. In terms of shopping, I agree with rainwood above that it has more to do with the merchant than GIA.

1) Ask. The ‘risk’ area is involving stones that don’t seem to be what you’re looking at anyway, but any dealer worth calling themselves a jeweler is prepared to answer this question. They don’t want a return any more than you do.

2) ALWAYS buy from a dealer who will take a return for any reason for some reasonable amount of time and with no ongoing obligation and no significant penalty (maybe return shipping). During that time, look at it yourself in a variety of lighting conditions, show it to your friends, show it to your own chosen appraiser (not one chosen by them), your astrologer, and anyone else whose opinion you value. Maybe even show it to that naysayer of a jeweler and see what they think. If it doesn’t measure up to the claims or you just don’t love it for whatever reason, back it goes. This holds whether you buy online or on the street by the way.

FWIW, my wife’s wedding ring is an I-1/H strong blue. AGS000. It’s lovely. Would it be ‘better’ if it had some slightly different specs? I suppose in some ways. I landed there because of price and, at the time, that was pretty important to me. If I had gone the more standard route of VS+, G+ NoF, I would have ended up with a much smaller stone. That was important to me.

FWIW#2. I think fluorescence is sort of cool. The fact that it produced a discount was just a bonus.

 

[Karl_K]

And what you were told at the jewelry store is what is now known as an "alternative" fact. In other words, that salesperson was making stuff up to scare you away from buying a better cut and less expensive stone online.

I would not call it an alternative fact just an exaggeration because there are ways to avoid it.
Years ago I may have felt it was a large exaggeration or even maybe an alt fact, but there are a lot more hazy stones on the market now.
Every expert I have talked to who sees a lot of stones agrees there are more of them today.
GIA ex or AGS0 is not a guarantee they wont be hazy nor in some cases is clarity or florescence grade.
By careful shopping they are avoidable no matter where you buy so it isn't something to be super scared of but it is something to be aware of and take into consideration when selecting a vendor and a diamond.

 

[pyramid]

Those two are certainly not the same cut grades so could probably be that, you would need to ask the vendor to compare stones for you.

always saw stones on James Allens like pic, one seems sparkle and the other looks milky (Both are same SI1 grade)

Is there just because of the photography they took, nothing wrong with the diamonds .