FURIOUS!

[PGTips]

Okay, I''m trying to stay calm here...

As you may know, I mentioned a couple weeks ago that I STILL have not received the EGL certificate for the ascher cut diamond we purchased MONTHS ago! You guys advised me to contact Abazias, so I did. I not only emailed, but I phoned. And STILL, no response!!! I don''t know what to do now! I send emails and usually, though it takes days to hear back, I usually get a response. Now it has been TEN DAYS since the last email I sent, and they haven''t written back. I have tried calling and can never get through. I am calling during their open business hours. I have left two phone messages and no one has called me back.

What do I do? I am feeling absolutely sick. This diamond, while it was a good deal for what we got, is worth far less without its certificate. Abazias said that they are not able to get a duplicate made of the original EGL certificate. So that leaves me thinking they would need to re-certify the diamond by taking it out of the setting. I am sure this weakens the prongs, doesn''t it? That is the last thing I would want.

I''m at a loss as to what we should do. How do I get this company respond to me? What do I do now??

 

[Kaleigh]

What happens when you call them?? Do you just get voice mail or do you get to talk to someone. That stinks!!

 

[PGTips]

I only get voicemail. So I leave messages.

 

[Bagpuss]

Abazias said that they are not able to get a duplicate made of the original EGL certificate.

Why not? I thought it was simple to get a copy of a previously certificated diamond?

Something fishy there.......

 

[MissAva]

Something is rotten in the state of Denmark….

 

[door knob solitaire]

I dont know the whole story here...but I just learned my local jeweler (who by the way has nothing to do with the purchase of my stone) is able to obtain a copy my cert...or OF ANY STONE''S cert. It does cost $75 to $100...but it seems that paying that may be better than the distress you are going through. He is a GIA, CGA, AGS, OJA...not sure if any that is pertinent.

Again I am new to your plight and not aware what indentifing info on your stone you have. This may not apply to you...but it is possible this angle may be helpful to another poster.

Just an reminder...The Squeaky Wheel gets the grease. Sweetheart, You let 10 days go by unanswered... Squeak more with calls, emails, $5 certified letters with a signature required. You need to have a trail of proof your contact has gone unreturned. Take notes on call times...copy emails...then contact the BBB in THEIR city (They are a member you can see PS has an icon next to their name). Send a copies of all your papers to the BBB, DA and PRICESCOPE. And forward another packet of copies to Abazias...It is obvious you are not inviting them for Thanksgiving dinner...they are not your friend. This is business! Let them know you mean busness! You have got to start throwing paper around...your calls and emails aren''t working. (forget the principle and the right thing that they should have done...it is now your job to get what you paid for...work for it!)

You are a valuable consumer in the PS community. You did just what this advertising medium intended you to do. You bought in good faith from a Diamond vendor...represented here. I trust use of this language and instruction will allow me to continue to post here, but if not I feel this stand is worthy of my demise. There are others responsible to aid in your plight and I hope they repect your consumer power and aid you now.
Whew, Blood is pumping better walk away from the keys...I am taking abreak...hope I get to return

Door Knob

 

[PGTips]

Date: 10/23/2005 2:01:06 PM
Author: Bagpuss



Why not? I thought it was simple to get a copy of a previously certificated diamond?


Something fishy there.......

Bagpuss -

Abazias can''t get a copy of the certificate because they don''t know the number of the original. I guess if they knew the identifying number of the original certificate, they could indeed get a copy. So it is just down to finding the lost certificate! Apparently the diamond was sent directly from Antwerp and was only recently cut and certified. I should point out that they bought the diamond from a broker and the diamond was not owned in-house by Abazias. Here is part of the last communication I received from Abazias (almost one month ago on September 27, 2005):

"...I was not able to retrieve the EGL certificate number because the vendor
doesn''t even know it. I spoke with the owner of the broker who is
speaking directly to EGL to find out why a certificate would ever take
this long..."

They then go on to say they''ll send me the certificate as soon as possible. Well, in my mind, that is not acceptable. "As soon as possible" isn''t good enough. It should not take five months to get me a certificate for a diamond I have already paid for.

 

[ame]

I wonder if this stone was even certified by EGL.

 

[PGTips]

Date: 10/23/2005 2:55:25 PM
Author:

"...Just an reminder...The Squeaky Wheel gets the grease. Sweetheart, You let 10 days go by unanswered... Squeak more with calls, emails, $5 certified letters with a signature required. You need to have a trail of proof your contact has gone unreturned...."

Door Knob -

Thanks for the advice. I really thought I was "squeeking" loud enough! I let so much time pass because I have been so extremely busy planning my wedding, getting married, and on my honeymoon. I contacted Abazias about once a month (sometimes more frequently) and they always reassured me that they were "working on it." Well, now I''m at the five month point and suddenly I am realizing that this is taking way too long. Too much time has passed. I have now emailed and called and no one is contacting me. I figure my last resort is the community that helped me find this diamond in the first place.

I should also point out that I live in England. It is not always convenient for me to call the U.S. That is why in the past, I have preferred email as a way to get in touch. It has only been in the past few days that I have begun to "squeek" by calling them on the phone.

 

[PGTips]

Date: 10/23/2005 3:19:49 PM
Author: ame
I wonder if this stone was even certified by EGL.

ugh... don''t think it hasn''t crossed my mind. Along with all kinds of other horrible thoughts about this diamond''s history.

Thank God we had the diamond appraised by an extremely reputable Pricescope appraiser. That is the only thing keeping me sane regarding this diamond.

 

[Bagpuss]

Date: 10/23/2005 3:16:31 PM
Author: PGTips

Date: 10/23/2005 2:01:06 PM
Author: Bagpuss



Why not? I thought it was simple to get a copy of a previously certificated diamond?


Something fishy there.......

Bagpuss -

Abazias can''t get a copy of the certificate because they don''t know the number of the original. I guess if they knew the identifying number of the original certificate, they could indeed get a copy. So it is just down to finding the lost certificate! Apparently the diamond was sent directly from Antwerp and was only recently cut and certified. I should point out that they bought the diamond from a broker and the diamond was not owned in-house by Abazias. Here is part of the last communication I received from Abazias (almost one month ago on September 27, 2005):

''...I was not able to retrieve the EGL certificate number because the vendor
doesn''t even know it. I spoke with the owner of the broker who is
speaking directly to EGL to find out why a certificate would ever take
this long...''

They then go on to say they''ll send me the certificate as soon as possible. Well, in my mind, that is not acceptable. ''As soon as possible'' isn''t good enough. It should not take five months to get me a certificate for a diamond I have already paid for.

Didn''t they have any paperwork in-house for this diamond that would give the cert #. No photocopies or pics of the original cert? Nothing?

I find all this quite unbelievable. Are there any vendors out there that could tell us if what Abazias is saying is likely?

 

[MissAva]

If they have no paper work how would they know what to offer the stone as? How much to sell it for? Why would they choose EGL as the grading lab? Something just does not add up here.

 

[PGTips]

Date: 10/23/2005 3:43:20 PM
Author: Matatora
If they have no paper work how would they know what to offer the stone as? How much to sell it for? Why would they choose EGL as the grading lab? Something just does not add up here.

I know. That does seem odd. At the time, the stone had only partial information on Abazia''s website. I questioned it, and they said they were just tracking down the certificate. I mentioned that as seeming weird that they didn''t have the certificate to a few people, but they said it could happen, so I didn''t worry about it too much. So... I had Abazias call in the stone and take a look at it. It looked good, so I had them send it to a very reputable pricescope appraiser. He said it looked great, so we didn''t hesitate to buy the stone. I then had it set and have now been wearing it on my finger for a few months. I look back now and wonder if we''ve made a big mistake. We did a wire transfer of cash to Abazias. And, in speaking with my husband, we are realizing that all we have is the receipt of our bank transfer. We were never mailed a receipt from Abazias! All I have are a bunch of saved emails from Abazias. I have saved every email we have sent to or received from them.
But I have nothing else. No receipt, no certificate.

 

[Kaleigh]

They never sent you a reciept??? Wow, that''s strange. Geez. When they sent the stone nothing came with it at all???

 

[cheetahman]

I think they should give you half your money back until they can provide the certificate. That would serve as their motivation to complete the transaction.

Abazias is one of the very few vendors I was considering for an upcoming purchase. I''ll be watching this thread. Hopefully they are as well.

 

[mrssalvo]

Date: 10/23/2005 2:55:25 PM
Author: door knob solitaire




You are a valuable consumer in the PS community. You did just what this advertising medium intended you to do. You bought in good faith from a Diamond vendor...represented here. I trust use of this language and instruction will allow me to continue to post here, but if not I feel this stand is worthy of my demise. There are others responsible to aid in your plight and I hope they repect your consumer power and aid you now.

Whew, Blood is pumping better walk away from the keys...I am taking abreak...hope I get to return

Door Knob

Hey DKS,
i don't think you've spoken out of line. you are giving good consumer advice,no need to worry about getting in trouble

I do belive however that just because someone is an e-vendor on this site or advertises here does not mean Pricescope endorses or recommends them. it's our job to research which of the companies have good track records, provide good customer service, detailed info on the stones etc...there are a few vendors on the list i personally wouldn't buy from

PGTips, i agree with DKA that you should really become the squeaky wheel and get a good paper trail going. I love email, but when i realize someone doesn't respond quicky enough for me..i.e 24 hours then i pick up the phone and call. keep calling a couple of times a day until you speak with someone. let them know you have posted a thread here on their poor customer service etc...also, do you have your receipt? I think they ought to offer to pay for a new cert since they have lost the original. the stone can be removed and reset and your prongs should be fine..


ETA: just noticed they never sent a receipt? did they send your diamond in a package all by itself? how did you pay? can you track your purchase that way? this whole thing is very strange..

ETA again: just saw your paid by wire transfer. this is the one downside to wire, you can't dispute the charges like a credit card..

well, call and see if they will pay for a recert. if the appraiser looked at it and you were happy with it all you need is the cert.

 

[PGTips]

Mrs Salvo -

We had the diamond sent directly from the appraiser to Leon Mege, who made the setting for us. He then shipped it to us. We never saw the diamond outside of the setting.

 

[strmrdr]

that sux they havent got it for you yet.

What we need here is some expert advice.

Its sunday so they might not be around.

Lets put out an SOS and see what happens.

 

[mrssalvo]

oh gosh, i surely wouldn''t want to take it out of a leon setting..how detailed is it?

i would stay on them find it..i don''t know how common it is to "lose" or "not recieve" a cert. someone has to have the paperwork somewhere? keep calling, get the BB&B involved..

how frustrating

i''m so sorry...i agree, seeing how they handle your situation will speak volumes on who recommends them on this site..


ok, you''ve got a leon?? have we seen pics of this masterpiece??

 

[door knob solitaire]

Oh sweetie I am sorry. I realize that you have bigger fish to fry....wedding fish that is.

If it is true that the cert is lost, there should still be some sort return contact to you. And ofcourse compensation to you (knowing that isnot what you want...it may be what you have to settle for). And at least a display of every possible stone unturned to find this cert. An offer of a no cost to you recert...is a legitmate opition. I don''t know but each stone has its own fingerprint...it seems to me the measurements and delvery date should be adequate for EGL to find the cert. I have learned many brokers are now having their entire stock recert by GGL. To wash them of the EGL stigma....??? Wonder if that happened and that is where your cert got lost.

No on to business:

Don''t know if your country had a BBB-but we have this business/consumer advocate board called the Better Business Bureau. While it is not manatory that businesses join, membership is a sign that a business is willing to include the BBB in their business transactions. The BBB handles complaints and contacts businesses on your behalf. Your words in a letter will promt them (BBB) to action. They will contact the business with your letter and tell them they have X number of days to reply with an explantion...and X number of days to remedy the consumer complaint, if legitimate. If this action is not taken, a negative mark of explantion will be placed on their record and may have adverse reprocussions on the next consumer who is thinking about buying from them. Most americans are skeptical about business tranactions and contact the BBB prior to making a big ticket purchase. So this can be a useful tool.

In a nutshell, a member of the BBB will and should do cart wheels to avoid a negative report. Sometimes it takes a letter on the BBB letterhead to get them moving.

A letter can be mailed, faxed and maybe emailed...not sure about the latter. But I am sure you could email the BBB and inquire. If you need that contact information, let me know. I will gladly research it for you. An internet search of BBB in the city and state should suffice.

Best-

DKS

PS. I must tell you some BBB negative posts can be unmerited. I owned a furniture store..sold a sofa to a woman who within a month got transferred and her new interior colors didn''t match her month old sofa...asked me for a refund...I said I only sell brand new sofas...she wrote a letter and it remains on my record of non satisfactory consumer relations. I chose not to reply. She was NUTTS!! Oh well, you can''t win them all!

 

[PGTips]

Thanks, Door Knob! Actually, I am American as well. I have just lived in England for a couple of years. I am familiar with the BBB, but, I guess I have just trusted this company too much. I try to approach each situation at face value and assume that people are being honest. Then, it seems like a certain amount of time will go by and then I realize "uh oh..." looks like something might not be as it seems... you know what I mean? So... I''ve only just gotten that horrible pang in my stomach saying "uh oh..." and I''m starting to think things are not right. Especially after not having my email returned from over a week ago. That is freaking me out. Especially since my email went to "[email protected]." It went to a group. Not a specific person. So that tells me I am definately being avoided.

I will give it a couple more days. After that, I will contact the BBB.

(PS - Sorry to hear about that sofa situation!!! That is really taking things a bit far!)

 

[PGTips]

Date: 10/23/2005 4:14:27 PM
Author: strmrdr
that sux they havent got it for you yet.


What we need here is some expert advice.


Its sunday so they might not be around.


Lets put out an SOS and see what happens.

Thanks, Storm. I appreciate your input. You have helped me all along in this process. I know its Sunday, so Abazias is closed. Though I never see any representation from them on Pricescope anyway. But, I would appreciate the input of other PS vendors or experts, if they wouldn''t mind giving their opinion/advice.

 

[Regular Guy]

Date: 10/23/2005 1:55:45 PM
Author:PGTips
So that leaves me thinking they would need to re-certify the diamond by taking it out of the setting. I am sure this weakens the prongs, doesn''t it? That is the last thing I would want.

I''m at a loss as to what we should do. How do I get this company respond to me? What do I do now??

Hey PG, I began to research Denverappraiser''s advice on this similar problem, found it difficult, and then realized it was his advice to you on this exact problem that I was looking for.

I think you know this option, which you say you don''t want, is your alternative, and which professionals have said is your recourse. You know why it is the only expected solution. I think you simply need to decide a) if this is acceptable to you, and if so, insist on it, or b) move on. If (b) is not reasonable to you, and you don''t like (a), without a theory about what solution will work for you, you''re just causing yourself aggravation.

If weakening prongs problems is believed to be a problem (doubt it but don''t know),I''d say look for a solution that will not make it a problem, like a new head, or whatever.

I hope you get satisfaction.

 

[door knob solitaire]

PG-Great to hear you are a fellow American. No need to explain about the putting it off for another day...I do the very same thing. Some times it just feels right, or at least better.

This is where the rubber meets the road...baby...get busy!!

Mrssalvo-don''t know this for a fact, but I assume retailers on this board are held to some sort of ethics. A similar code to what the posters are held. You must admit they get alot for their advertising dollars -a built in online clientiele. I put the PS involvment parallel to that of say a radio station or newspaper...or even a shopping mall. It is afterall the medium in which we traveled to get to the merchandise. I would not hesitate to go directly to the management of any of those afore mentioned to ask for assistance.

They may not be able to asisst. But as the BBB keeps a record...maybe PS does also.

My posts seem argumentative...I hope that is not how you read it. It is so hard to make printed words reflect the tone of your emotion...as I am not trying to argue...just explain the thought.

DKS

That sofa story is a perfect example of just how stupid business owners can be. This could be the case here...with your retailer...there is no law againist running a business stupidly...just the law of sowing and reaping, I suppose. Harvest time is near ...his basket will be less full than it should be.

 

[lumpkin]

This is a bummer and I''m sorry you had that experience with Abazias. I''m also not sure there is much they can do about getting the cert because they are brokers, and the diamonds and the certs come from whoever actually has them. If there is no record of the certificate number and Abazias can''t get that info (perhaps it was lost, perhaps your actual stone was never certified, etc.) they really don''t have much control over that, I wouldn''t think. Not that I think that''s an excuse exactly. They should take steps to make sure it doesn''t happen again and try to work with you in some way. What would put you at ease? You may need to tell them, "Look, it''s going to take having this stone recertified to make me happy with this..." or whatever it is you want to do. I''m going to go in another direction here. Do you really need the cert? You had it appraised and it''s a beautiful diamond, worth what you paid for it if I understand correctly. However, if you are angry every time you look at that diamond and have negative feelings about the whole transaction, maybe you should talk to Abazias about sending it back in exchange for a stone that DOES have the certificate for the same amount of money (or comparable) to what you paid. Maybe they will agree to that. If so, have them pay for a new head, heck, have them set it for you if you are worried about the prongs. I woudn''t be unless the jeweler who resets it says it is not reusable. Most times you can use the same head with no problem.

Good luck and hope the situation is resolved in a way you are satisfied.

 

[Dancing Fire]

Date: 10/23/2005 3:19:49 PM
Author: ame
I wonder if this stone was even certified by EGL.

my guess is ;this stone never had a lab report.

 

[mrssalvo]

Date: 10/23/2005 5:19:41 PM
Author: door knob solitaire


Mrssalvo-don't know this for a fact, but I assume retailers on this board are held to some sort of ethics. A similar code to what the posters are held. You must admit they get alot for their advertising dollars -a built in online clientiele. I put the PS involvment parallel to that of say a radio station or newspaper...or even a shopping mall. It is afterall the medium in which we traveled to get to the merchandise. I would not hesitate to go directly to the management of any of those afore mentioned to ask for assistance.



DKS

i don't know for sure either, maybe Pricescope will jump in and clarify for us

p.s. i didn't think you were being argumentative at all, just expressing you thoughts

 

[Bagpuss]

If it came to it, would Leon Mege be willing to take the stone out of the mounting, send it to be certed and then replace it? All at Azabias's expense , of course. At least you could trust him not to mess up his own setting.

Not ideal, I know, but an option.

I just thought; you could have problems with our customs if you had to send your ring back and forth. And you don't even have a receipt to prove it's yours!

This gets worse and worse!

 

[pricescope]

PGTips, first of all thank you for sharing your experience and the problem. It is frustrating indeed.

As Jonathan wrote here, "All the vendors on this forum, including me do make honest mistakes from time to time and sometimes jobs get overlooked, etc..".

The vendors who made a mistake or didn''t deliver what was promised must resolve the situation and offer you an acceptable solution.

We emailed to Abazias about this discussion. Let''s see what solution they will suggest.

Date: 10/23/2005 5:36:14 PM
Author: mrssalvo

... I do belive however that just because someone is an e-vendor on this site or advertises here does not mean Pricescope endorses or recommends them. it''s our job to research which of the companies have good track records, provide good customer service, detailed info on the stones etc...

i don''t know either, maybe Pricescope will jump in and clarify for us

Clarifications.

Formal: Pricescope does not endorse any vendor (see our Terms of Use and Disclaimer as well as legal notice at the vendor''s list and diamond search results).

Informal: Mrssalvo is correct. We believe that providing an open platform for consumers to share their experience is the best way to keep consumers aware. We are not a police however if there is a proof of a wrongdoing, that advertiser will be removed from Pricesope.

 

[JCJD]

Any chance Leon has the diamond receipt and forgot to send it along with the completed ring? Maybe if you can get Leon informed about this situation he can give more advice and perhaps pull some strings with Abazias to get things moving faster?