Total newbie looking for a 2 carat oval for engagement

[samstar]

Hi All,

I've been lurking here for a few weeks and have learnt so much about how to (try and) pick a loose stone. However, I need your help in choosing a better stone.

I'm looking for an oval of 2 Carat with a budget of about $13K. I'm thinking I or J color, VS2+, ideal to excellent cut (for whatever that means in an oval??? - do I rely on the GIA or AGS report for this?
The stone will be set in an 18K yellow gold ring so I'm thinking J color might not be a bad choice? Ring will be like this:

http://www.bluenile.com/build-your-own-ring/blue-nile-studio-cushion-petite-crown-platinum-engagement_50573?elem=img&track=product

I've been reading up on the 4Cs and how cut together with length and width are more important in fancy cuts (like in ovals). I know it should be within proportions of 1.33 to 1.66 for an oval - is that correct? If one stone is, say 1.35, and another is 1.45, I presume that means one is wider but shorter than another? Does this matter?

I've also been reading about the HCA being a good place to start weeding out stones but this doesn't seem to apply to ovals. So am I limited in what research I can do for ovals to just 4Cs along with polish, symmetry, fluorescence, culet, girdle, table, and depth? Or is there some other tool(s) I can use?

Do the table and depth & matter in an oval at all - am I limiting myself by just searching for tables between 55 and 60% and depth between 59 and 63%? I presume a shallower depth (and thus more width/length is better)?

Do ASET and IS images even figure for ovals?

In terms of vendors, I've been looking at these particular stone and wondered what the experts here think about it with a 59% table and depth?
https://www.adiamor.com/Diamonds/Results/D34501349 (too 'stubby'? I don't see much of the 'bow-tie' effect I've read about? But does the table and depth being the same bring it down? )
https://www.eternitybyyoni.com/2.07-I-VS2-V.-Good-Cut-Oval-Diamond-GIA-1209874681/ds-2598432/ (no image)
https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/oval-cut/2.05-carat-j-color-vs1-clarity-sku-2408520 (bow - tie quite visible)

How does the thickness of the girdle affect the light - if it's thicker does it create more of the bow-tie effect?

Sorry for some many questions but the more I read up the more questions I seem to come up with !

Thanks in advance for your help

 

[samstar]

Ok - just learnt that ASET is better than IS for fancies so that answers that question. Any help with the other questions would be much appreciated.

 

[WillyDiamond]

The link you provide just goes to the BluNile website.

 

[tyty333]

Hi All,

I've been lurking here for a few weeks and have learnt so much about how to (try and) pick a loose stone. However, I need your help in choosing a better stone.

I'm looking for an oval of 2 Carat with a budget of about $13K. I'm thinking I or J color, VS2+, ideal to excellent cut (for whatever that means in an oval??? - do I rely on the GIA or AGS report for this?
You probably need to open your specs to eye-clean SI1s also to give you a better chance of finding a well cut oval. GIA/AGS do
not grade cuts for ovals so what you are looking at is what the vendor decided they are...which doesnt really account for much.
The stone will be set in an 18K yellow gold ring so I'm thinking J color might not be a bad choice? Ring will be like this:
If it is nicely cut is should be ok but will show color from the side...just depends on the stone.
http://www.bluenile.com/build-your-own-ring/blue-nile-studio-cushion-petite-crown-platinum-engagement_50573?elem=img&track=product

I've been reading up on the 4Cs and how cut together with length and width are more important in fancy cuts (like in ovals). I know it should be within proportions of 1.33 to 1.66 for an oval - is that correct? If one stone is, say 1.35, and another is 1.45, I presume that means one is wider but shorter than another? Does this matter?
I usually look for well cut ovals and then go from there...whatever the ratio is...most people perfer longer ovals to get a little
more finger coverage in that direction.

I've also been reading about the HCA being a good place to start weeding out stones but this doesn't seem to apply to ovals. So am I limited in what research I can do for ovals to just 4Cs along with polish, symmetry, fluorescence, culet, girdle, table, and depth? Or is there some other tool(s) I can use?No other tool...and most of the things you've listed wont help either. Best thing to use is eyes
and Pricescoper eyes that have some experience at picking out ovals. Videos are a big +.

Do the table and depth & matter in an oval at all - am I limiting myself by just searching for tables between 55 and 60% and depth between 59 and 63%? I presume a shallower depth (and thus more width/length is better)?
They do matter some...usually like the table to be smaller than the depth and watch out for girdles being too thick and wasting
face up size.

Do ASET and IS images even figure for ovals? Asets a little but oval asets are not pretty. Videos really help so you can see how
the facets react as the stone moves.

In terms of vendors, I've been looking at these particular stone and wondered what the experts here think about it with a 59% table and depth?
https://www.adiamor.com/Diamonds/Results/D34501349 (too 'stubby'? I don't see much of the 'bow-tie' effect I've read about? But does the table and depth being the same bring it down? )No, other things matter more.
https://www.eternitybyyoni.com/2.07-I-VS2-V.-Good-Cut-Oval-Diamond-GIA-1209874681/ds-2598432/ (no image)
https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/oval-cut/2.05-carat-j-color-vs1-clarity-sku-2408520 (bow - tie quite visible)

How does the thickness of the girdle affect the light - if it's thicker does it create more of the bow-tie effectit waste weight.?

Sorry for some many questions but the more I read up the more questions I seem to come up with !

Thanks in advance for your help

I'll see what I can find in a few nice stones...I did not check girdles
https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/oval-cut/2.01-carat-j-color-si1-clarity-sku-2361998
https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/oval-cut/2.10-carat-j-color-si1-clarity-sku-2457946
https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/oval-cut/2.10-carat-j-color-vs2-clarity-sku-2287200 make sure eye-clean
https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/oval-cut/2.06-carat-i-color-vs2-clarity-sku-2351491 a tad over budget

 

[samstar]

The link you provide just goes to the BluNile website.

Sorry for some reason it won't paste the actual diamond link. But here's the link to the stock search I did.

http://www.bluenile.com/diamond-search?stockno=LD08194710

 

[samstar]

Hi All,

I've been lurking here for a few weeks and have learnt so much about how to (try and) pick a loose stone. However, I need your help in choosing a better stone.

I'm looking for an oval of 2 Carat with a budget of about $13K. I'm thinking I or J color, VS2+, ideal to excellent cut (for whatever that means in an oval??? - do I rely on the GIA or AGS report for this?
You probably need to open your specs to eye-clean SI1s also to give you a better chance of finding a well cut oval. GIA/AGS do
not grade cuts for ovals so what you are looking at is what the vendor decided they are...which doesnt really account for much.
The stone will be set in an 18K yellow gold ring so I'm thinking J color might not be a bad choice? Ring will be like this:
If it is nicely cut is should be ok but will show color from the side...just depends on the stone.
http://www.bluenile.com/build-your-own-ring/blue-nile-studio-cushion-petite-crown-platinum-engagement_50573?elem=img&track=product

I've been reading up on the 4Cs and how cut together with length and width are more important in fancy cuts (like in ovals). I know it should be within proportions of 1.33 to 1.66 for an oval - is that correct? If one stone is, say 1.35, and another is 1.45, I presume that means one is wider but shorter than another? Does this matter?
I usually look for well cut ovals and then go from there...whatever the ratio is...most people perfer longer ovals to get a little
more finger coverage in that direction.

I've also been reading about the HCA being a good place to start weeding out stones but this doesn't seem to apply to ovals. So am I limited in what research I can do for ovals to just 4Cs along with polish, symmetry, fluorescence, culet, girdle, table, and depth? Or is there some other tool(s) I can use?No other tool...and most of the things you've listed wont help either. Best thing to use is eyes
and Pricescoper eyes that have some experience at picking out ovals. Videos are a big +.

Do the table and depth & matter in an oval at all - am I limiting myself by just searching for tables between 55 and 60% and depth between 59 and 63%? I presume a shallower depth (and thus more width/length is better)?
They do matter some...usually like the table to be smaller than the depth and watch out for girdles being too thick and wasting
face up size.

Do ASET and IS images even figure for ovals? Asets a little but oval asets are not pretty. Videos really help so you can see how
the facets react as the stone moves.

In terms of vendors, I've been looking at these particular stone and wondered what the experts here think about it with a 59% table and depth?
https://www.adiamor.com/Diamonds/Results/D34501349 (too 'stubby'? I don't see much of the 'bow-tie' effect I've read about? But does the table and depth being the same bring it down? )No, other things matter more.
https://www.eternitybyyoni.com/2.07-I-VS2-V.-Good-Cut-Oval-Diamond-GIA-1209874681/ds-2598432/ (no image)
https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/oval-cut/2.05-carat-j-color-vs1-clarity-sku-2408520 (bow - tie quite visible)

How does the thickness of the girdle affect the light - if it's thicker does it create more of the bow-tie effectit waste weight.?

Sorry for some many questions but the more I read up the more questions I seem to come up with !

Thanks in advance for your help

I'll see what I can find in a few nice stones...I did not check girdles
https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/oval-cut/2.01-carat-j-color-si1-clarity-sku-2361998
https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/oval-cut/2.10-carat-j-color-si1-clarity-sku-2457946
https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/oval-cut/2.10-carat-j-color-vs2-clarity-sku-2287200 make sure eye-clean
https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/oval-cut/2.06-carat-i-color-vs2-clarity-sku-2351491 a tad over budget

Thanks for your replies tyty333.

I know everyone keeps talking about the cut being most important on an oval but if I can't rely on the GIA/AGS report for the cut and there's no tool to help determine the cut, then how does a layman like me know which is a good (or better) cut?

I'm searching only for very good to excellent cuts but are you saying that doesn't mean anything???
If the vendor determines the listing cut 'quality', then how do I even narrow the choices down?

A longer oval (for more finger coverage) means a ratio higher rather than lower - i.e. more towards 1.66 than 1.33 ?

Are you saying that things like polish, symmetry, etc don't matter at all in an oval? Or just that they feature low down the list in terms of importance in determining a good oval?

I was trying to attach a video of a stone as a wmv file but PS says the extension is not allowed. How can I upload a video of a stone I have seen?

The James Allen ones that you have linked all seem to suffer terribly from the bow-tie effect - that's a big put-off for me. Here's another search from JA but every stone seems to suffer badly from the bow tie effect. Is this normal ?

https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/oval-cut/?CaratFrom=1.99&CaratTo=2.30&Color=J,I&Clarity=SI1,VS2,VS1,VVS2,VVS1,IF,FL&PriceFrom=200&PriceTo=13000&ViewsOptions=Images&showAdvanced=show&Polish=EX,ID,VG&Symmetry=EX,ID,VG&Lab=GIA,AGS&Flour=None,Negligible,Faint&DepthFrom=57&DepthTo=65.1&TableFrom=54&TableTo=61

 

[WillyDiamond]

Hey OP
You may want to read this recent post about JA before you proceed:

[URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/james-allen-is-taking-me-for-a-ride.228750/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/james-allen-is-taking-me-for-a-ride.228750/[/URL]

 

[samstar]

Hey OP
You may want to read this recent post about JA before you proceed:

[URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/james-allen-is-taking-me-for-a-ride.228750/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/james-allen-is-taking-me-for-a-ride.228750/[/URL]

Thanks I just read that. JA is not for me.

Here's another stone I've seen - what do the PSers on here think?

http://www.bluenile.com/diamond-details/LD07281732?click_id=673204438

 

[samstar]

sorry but the blue nile links don't seem to work.

But if you copy and paste, the URL does work

 

[tyty333]

I know everyone keeps talking about the cut being most important on an oval but if I can't rely on the GIA/AGS report for the cut and there's no tool to help determine the cut, then how does a layman like me know which is a good (or better) cut?I would look
at only Excellent cuts but what I'm trying to say is that even some of those will not be good. You can drop down into Very Good for
cut to look around but you'll probably find even less.

I'm searching only for very good to excellent cuts but are you saying that doesn't mean anything???
If the vendor determines the listing cut 'quality', then how do I even narrow the choices down?

A longer oval (for more finger coverage) means a ratio higher rather than lower - i.e. more towards 1.66 than 1.33right...higher
ratio = thinner, longer oval ?

Are you saying that things like polish, symmetry, etc don't matter at all in an oval? Or just that they feature low down the list in terms of importance in determining a good oval? Low on the list...because it is hard to find well cut ovals that reflect light well. If you were looking at rounds polish and symmetry would be more important because you can find many rounds that are well cut.

I was trying to attach a video of a stone as a wmv file but PS says the extension is not allowed. How can I upload a video of a stone I have seen?Sorry, I dont know...you might contact admin.

The James Allen ones that you have linked all seem to suffer terribly from the bow-tie effect - that's a big put-off for me. Here's another search from JA but every stone seems to suffer badly from the bow tie effect. Is this normal ?
Almost all ovals are going to have an area through the center of the stone (except 4 main ovals) that will light up much better
than the area that heads towards the points. You need to try to minimize the "mushy" area as the stone turns. I consider those
bow-ties to be normal because they are reflecting light. Bad bow-ties that you want to avoid have a dark area (that does not return light) like the following...
https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/oval-cut/2.01-carat-i-color-vs2-clarity-sku-278425
https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/oval-cut/2.07-carat-g-color-si2-clarity-sku-353256
https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/oval-cut/2.03-carat-f-color-si1-clarity-sku-2118488

Here are a few nice stones (not in your size or budget) but to give you an idea of what nice faceting looks like if you can find it...
The ones I posted above were the best I could find in your size/budget...
https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/oval-cut/2.01-carat-g-color-vs2-clarity-sku-1051931
https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/oval-cut/2.01-carat-f-color-vs2-clarity-sku-2204403
https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/oval-cut/2.03-carat-i-color-vs1-clarity-sku-249123
https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/oval-cut/1.08-carat-h-color-vvs1-clarity-sku-2290062
https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/oval-cut/2.01-carat-g-color-vs2-clarity-sku-2484279

Half way decent cut 4 main...no obvious large faceting going through the center (you have to decide if you like this look or not)
https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/oval-cut/2.01-carat-h-color-vs2-clarity-sku-1051450
A poorly cut 4 main
https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/oval-cut/2.02-carat-h-color-vs2-clarity-sku-2523544

The JA thing...what happened in the other thread is unfortunate.

 

[WillyDiamond]

TYTY
I think the OP has eliminated JA, from his post above.

 

[tyty333]

TYTY
I think the OP has eliminated JA, from his post above.

Yes, I know...I was giving him examples to look for (if you notice I said they were not in his budget/size requirement)

 

[Tiber55]

Hello,

Just recently went through the process of picking out an oval for an engagement ring.

I would highly suggest working with a vendor to select the stone.

I ended up with GOG, many people also like IDJ.

Picking an oval without a video and or seeing it is a very difficult thing to do.

Select target numbers for ratio, spread(weight) , color, clarity, and have them pull stones for you.

 

[samstar]

Thanks tyty333 that all makes sense.

How about this one on Blue Nile - is the cut bad? (again for some reason the blue nile links don't work but pasting and copying does work).
http://www.bluenile.com/diamond-details/LD07281732?click_id=673204438

 

[LLJsmom]

Look the point is that it is very hard to judge an oval without seeing it or having an ASET. Or without having an expert and experienced eye look at it. The poster that suggested good old gold used them because GOG will evaluate which are good performers. If you care about performance, it's a crap shoot with BN. Trying to save the little bit is going to cost you a headache. Be mentally ready to return the stone if you don't like it. But if you have t seen a lot of ovals irl, maybe you won't even know what you like as you won't have a good point of reference.

 

[samstar]

Hello,

Just recently went through the process of picking out an oval for an engagement ring.

I would highly suggest working with a vendor to select the stone.

I ended up with GOG, many people also like IDJ.

Picking an oval without a video and or seeing it is a very difficult thing to do.

Select target numbers for ratio, spread(weight) , color, clarity, and have them pull stones for you.

Thanks Tiber - who is IDJ?

 

[samstar]

Look the point is that it is very hard to judge an oval without seeing it or having an ASET. Or without having an expert and experienced eye look at it. The poster that suggested good old gold used them because GOG will evaluate which are good performers. If you care about performance, it's a crap shoot with BN. Trying to save the little bit is going to cost you a headache. Be mentally ready to return the stone if you don't like it. But if you have t seen a lot of ovals irl, maybe you won't even know what you like as you won't have a good point of reference.

Thanks - yes I gathered that. I haven't seen a single oval as no store near me has any 2C+ loose stones. Also, very few vendors actually have pictures and/or videos. I've asked Blue Nile and they don't have, or are reluctant to give, pictures/vids. I've received only one video from B2C and then there's the stones on JA online. However, sicne, as you rightly say, I have no point of reference, this is an all out crap shoot
No wonder most people just buy the first thing they see and like locally

 

[WillyDiamond]

TYTY
I think the OP has eliminated JA, from his post above.

Yes, I know...I was giving him examples to look for (if you notice I said they were not in his budget/size requirement)

Really?