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EGL USA how are they doing ?

tyty333

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I cant tell much about the color but I'm pretty sure the clarity is off compared to GIA/AGS.
 

Christina...

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Yeah, I agree it's so hard to judge color from pics, especially against a colored background, but I'm betting that it doesn't appear colorless IRL. Can you take a photo against a white background? And SI1 you said??? :rolleyes:

You mentioned in another thread that you see lots of EGL stones. What's your experience, how do you compare them to GIA or AGS? And can you comment about difference between EGL labs, EGLUSA compared to EGL Isreal for instance.
 

Rockdiamond

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HI Christina,
I hope it's ok if I chime in....
I also see a lot of EGL graded stones.
As far as which EGL is better- I'm hesitant to try and "order" the labs- simply because for me, I think it's really a black and white question for consumers.
No GIA, means you need to trust the dealer's experience and word. Period.

In my experience, EVERY time a dealer walks in with a stone graded by EGL there's a very good reason for it. Badly cut, misgraded, or many other reasons why they seller wants to hide whatever GIA might say.
If they claim the stone is graded to GIA standards, no one- and I mean NO educated dealer - is going to pay as if it were graded by GIA in any of the more costly grades.
If it's an M/I1, who cares.
But in higher colors particulary, there's always a reason someone skipped ( or threw away) a GIA report.

Great example Jan! There's no way that's an SI1
 

Christina...

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Rockdiamond|1340906120|3225244 said:
HI Christina,
I hope it's ok if I chime in....
I also see a lot of EGL graded stones.
As far as which EGL is better- I'm hesitant to try and "order" the labs- simply because for me, I think it's really a black and white question for consumers.
No GIA, means you need to trust the dealer's experience and word. Period.

In my experience, EVERY time a dealer walks in with a stone graded by EGL there's a very good reason for it. Badly cut, misgraded, or many other reasons why they seller wants to hide whatever GIA might say.
If they claim the stone is graded to GIA standards, no one- and I mean NO educated dealer - is going to pay as if it were graded by GIA in any of the more costly grades.
If it's an M/I1, who cares.
But in higher colors particulary, there's always a reason someone skipped ( or threw away) a GIA report.

Great example Jan! There's no way that's an SI1

Thanks RD. I appreciate you chiming in. I 100% agree with you. I've seen threads lately where consumers feel that they can apply some sort of formula to an EGL report and have a somewhat accurate idea of what GIA would have graded the stone. I think this is a very unwise strategy as EGL isn't just soft in it's grading, but is also inconsistent. I also think that you raise another great point, so much emphasis is put on the color and clarity differences between an EGL and GIA report, but very little on the cut grading differences. I've seen claims of Hearts and Arrow precision on EGL reports that would have laughed out of the room by AGS. I suppose my frustration comes from the fact that consumers considering purchasing an EGL stone are at the mercy of the dealer and that dealers honesty and integrity. I've thought for awhile now that there really needs to be some sort of industry standard when it comes to lab grading diamonds. I leave to all of you in the trade to determine how that can happen, but it seems to me that if labs such as GIA can have numerous labs around the world and maintain a standard of consistency that labs such as EGL should be able to as well. And I guess that's where my initial question about how the grading of each EGL lab relate to one another.
 

Dancing Fire

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DiamondBrokersofFlorida|1340900674|3225166 said:
Here is a 1.01ct. graded SI1 F by EGL USA.
IMO...that's an I2 stone if graded by GIA.
 

kenny

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DiamondBrokersofFlorida|1340900674|3225166 said:
Here is a 1.01ct. graded SI1 F by EGL USA.

What's the point of this thread?

Everyone knows you can't grade diamonds by pictures.

I'm a diamond photographer and I can make inclusions stand out or vanish with clever lighting
Also we all know EGL's grading is NOT consistent.
You can find examples that are very close to, or very different from, GIA grading.
 

oldminer

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It isn't that I don't believe it is possible, but in all fairness, it would be a good thing to scan the image of the EGL report for us all to see so that we don't just bash a lab without proper evidence being offered. Like everyone on Pricesope, we understand that there are labs which tend to grade softer than GIA. Funny how no lab grades tougher, but they'd go out of business very fast wouldn't they? It is a very good trick to be able to match GIA grading and, in fact, it can't be done since GIA is inconsisten in its own grading. The only way for a lab to make a business is to grade equally as tough or less severe than GIA. This is not an excuse for bad behavior, but the reality of actual business which you can accept, reject or, hopefully, just understand. This is the way it must be for the time being.

There is a move to standardize lab grading although it is not as prominently discussed as lab inconsistency. Of course, if there was no discussion there would be no reason to move toward improvements. Truthfully, consumers are the major force behind change in this secretive and traditional business. Diamond dealers don't really need documents for doing most of their inside trading business, but they need them for retailers who deal with a public that is ever more aware of diamond grading. As the public becomes increasingly aware of lab inconsistency, there is increasing pressure to adopt standards based on real science.

Although not a major topic of discussion, the GIA is not 100% consistent in grading. They have a policy to allow for appeal of a grade. How many dealers have ever asked for a lower color or clarity grade? How many have asked for a higher color or clarity grade? Do you think that most ask for a higher grade? Of course. Do they get the higher grade sometimes? Of course. Right now grading is well understood, but not a perfect situation where nothing is ever left in doubt.
 

oldminer

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Thanks. This will give the thread more of credibility it deserves...
 

Garry H (Cut Nut)

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A stone like that would list as a virtual on Pricescope for probably less than $5k and similar stones with GIA equivalent grades might come in maybe half as much again at $7k ish. It is possible to buy say an EGL USA graded stone that is graded as a GIA equivalent, and often these can be priced better than GIA graded stones. But one can burn ones fingers.

I agree with Kenny that stones like that can be made worse with back lighting than they would appear as set in a ring.

But I agree that the soft grading issue is not getting better.
I hope we are good enough at helping consumers who want to buy these "bargains" to use the services of appraisers and report back the rejections and then understand this is an effective market with the same number of bargains there are in other effective markets.
 
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