BM drama? Potential drama? Maybe no drama at all?

[pannini]

I am about to try to fix a mistake I made months ago.

I''ve been friends with 3 girls from college for over 10 years now. One girl (I''ll call her Sandy) asked me to be her BM about 3 years ago, which I did.

Now that I am engaged, I asked the 3 girls prematurely to be my bridesmaids. My best friend Kelli is my MOH. My little sister is also a BM. So that is 5 total.

My fiance is having 4 groomsmen.

The issue comes around here:

Sandy and I have been slowly drifting apart, but it hasn''t been a big deal. We just never spend time with each other with as much effort anymore. She''s busy, I''m in grad school, we are just busy. Except I see more of the other 2 college friends and they are just as busy as her. She stopped meeting me halfway in terms of maintaining the friendship. That''s fine, no love lost. But this started happening right after I''ve made the premature invitation to have Sandy be one of BMs. THEN... my fiance''s sister has been growing close with me. She is married and has 2 babies. I''ve been pondering over having her be a BM too. That means I need to really keep it 5 and under.

So... now I am ready to change my BM lineup by informing Sandy of not being a BM anymore, and have my fiance''s sister be a BM instead.
OR... I tell them I "throw my hands up" and I am going to start at ZERO bridesmaids for now, and will discuss BM status once I get closer to wedding planning. Does everyone chose BMs before a certain deadline? My wedding is in 1.5 years, so I have time to reassess right?


I know... this is horrible. I am feeling horrible. I''ve lost sleep over this, but I know that it just wouldn''t feel right to have her be a part of that bridal party on the big day. It just doesn''t feel right, but neither is unnecessary drama.

Thoughts?
Also, if I don''t have fiance''s sister be a BM (due to her being married with kids already), how can I have her be a great symbolic part of the wedding without selling her short by having her do a reading (least likely doing any readings anyway, that''s not our style)? Is having her kids be a part of the wedding not sufficient?

 

[kama_s]

Date: 6/2/2010 6:58:26 PM
Author:pannini
Thoughts?
Also, if I don''t have fiance''s sister be a BM (due to her being married with kids already), how can I have her be a great symbolic part of the wedding without selling her short by having her do a reading (least likely doing any readings anyway, that''s not our style)? Is having her kids be a part of the wedding not sufficient?

You don''t have to do anything you don''t want to do. If you feel content with just her kids participating, then that''s great as is. But if you did want her to stand up for you, you can designate her to be your matron-of-honour. Ofcourse, that would mean you end up with 6 BMs. I don''t have any advice re: the situation with Sandy.

 

[getting excited]

Even though you and your friend have "drifted" I would think it would be pretty hurtful to kick her out of the wedding. Would it really be that bad to have six? I know people like to have the same number of bridesmaids and groomsmen, but I believe people should have as many as they want.

 

[OUpearlgirl]

I''m sorry, but I think it''s a bad idea to kick a bridesmaid out of a wedding because you don''t spend as much time together as you used to. If she were causing needless drama, being rude, or anything I might have a different answer. I just don''t find it appropriate to ask someone to stand down.

Can FI add two more guys?

 

[sonnyjane]

Date: 6/2/2010 8:20:19 PM
Author: OUpeargirl
I''m sorry, but I think it''s a bad idea to kick a bridesmaid out of a wedding because you don''t spend as much time together as you used to. If she were causing needless drama, being rude, or anything I might have a different answer. I just don''t find it appropriate to ask someone to stand down.


Can FI add two more guys?

This. If she hasn''t done anything to expressly be asked to step down, I think it''s in bad taste to ask her to do so. It would be much easier for your FI to add groomsmen.

 

[nkarma]

You are going to ruin your friendship with Sandy completely if you kick her out after you already ask her. There is no do-overs here...you already asked and should have thought of that before. Will it really be that bad if Sandy is a BM? Is it worth your entire friendship?

Also, lots of brides have uneven GM and BM these days, so if you want to ask FI''s sis, then go for it.

 

[pannini]

I see your points... maybe I should clarify.

I agree that it''s wrong to kick someone out for drifting apart. Maybe I''m being too modest. We drifted apart, but I tried to make an effort and she keeps flaking. I then find out that she has been hanging out with many other friends on all those dates I asked if we had time to do something. I live an hour away, and I have gone to many functions out there including her birthday. For all events that I''ve planned for us to do as a small group, I''ve made it in her neighborhood so that she can have an easier time to make it, but she ends up not being able to attend for many reasons.

All my other bridesmaid/friends live 10 min within each other. They are jsut as busy if not BUSIER than her, and they come out to see me or at least make themselves available when I make plans with them in their local neighborhood.

It just seems like she does''nt put any effort anymore. This issue is more based on our friendship, not the BM status. But, with the issue of friendship on the line, it is a bit awkward to assume that the BM status is still intact, right?

So I guess, does that help?

So my alternative route that I mentioned in original post is: maybe I email all of my BMs and tell them all BM planning is off. That due to budget and family and other issues, I have to start over in terms of BM assignments. MY wedding is in 1.5 years. I have at least half a year to assess how things are going, and assess how many BMs I actually have....
So I guess that seems like the more neutral route, to avoid anyone''s feelings getting hurt.


Thanks!

 

[sonnyjane]

Since your wedding is not for another year and a half, then yes, perhaps you should notify everyone that planning is on hold...

HOWEVER...

If you already asked her and she WANTS to be a bridesmaid, regardless of how much effort she puts into your friendship socially outside of the wedding planning, the fact remains that you asked her, and would still be cutting her loose. She will not forget that fact in another year when you revisit the situation if she still wants to be in your wedding. Since she also seems to be close with your other friends, she will find out if they are asked to stay in the bridal party and she's been cut. The only way I see getting her out of the party is if you wait another year before revisiting the situation and you two are no longer close by then and she just says she no longer wants to be a BM. Just tread carefully!

 

[lucyandroger]

Here''s my suggestion...since your wedding is still 1.5 years away, why not just chill with all of the BM talk. How do you know you''re not going to change your mind in another 6 months? Maybe you and Sandy will be best friends again or maybe you and FSIL will have a falling out...who knows...

Since not much BM-related planning really needs to be done at this point, I would wait for the one year mark and then reassess.

 

[cara]

I still don't see anything in Sandy's behavior worth kicking her out of being a BM. Are you ready to stop being friends with Sandy? Has her behavior reached that level, or is it just that you are slowly drifting apart and she's got a flaky streak. Assuming she is not actively dissing you and sabotaging your friendship, to the point that you don't want to be friends anymore, its not worth the hassle of kicking her out, nor is it worth the hassle of formally placing all your BM's on notice that all BM planning is 'on hold' or some such nonsense. I would wait until Sandy is either actively causing problems with wedding planning or you have decided to have a super-small wedding party with 0-1 attendants on each side before doing anything. For you to tell all the BM's that you are kicking them out, only to reask them again in a few months is, well, a little more drama than necessary.

I understand that you are now having second thoughts and your wedding is still a long way off - but you still asked these people to have a role in the wedding and they accepted. If Sandy expresses thoughts like what a burden it is to buy a bridesmaid dress or something at a later date then maybe you can nicely say that it would be fine if she attended the wedding as a regular guest - but without some kind of opening from her on that front it might come off as somewhat rude/demoting for you to suggest it.

As for your fiance's sister - you can always have her do a reading or ask her to stand up on your FI's side as a 5th groomswoman. Or just invite her to go dress shopping with you and other tasks - ie. be friends and include her in wedding planning. It isn't bridesmaid or bust.

ETA: OK saw your last post and it does seem like Sandy is being a little passive-aggressive on the friendship front. I'd address that rather than addressing the BM issue. If she is really withdrawing from you as a friend in obvious ways, then maybe calling her out on her behavior is in order. I'd keep the BM talk silent for now. Once you figure out if you are still friends then you can address it.

 

[mary poppins]

Your wedding is still quite a while away so there''s a chance things will change along the way. It seems like the real issue with Sandy is the status of your friendship, which, if addressed, may resolve the bridesmaid issue. Or the two issues may be intertwined. Rather than creating drama with the rest of your wedding party (putting things on hold and other such nonsense), perhaps you could tactfully approach Sandy with your observations and feelings and ask her if something is going on. Eliminating someone from the wedding party is a drastic and potentially relationship ending measure. Perhaps as a result of the conversation referenced above, she will take the opportunity to shape up or bow out.

Also, if you want the same number of people in the wedding party for each side, your FI''s sister could stand on FI''s side as a groomswoman. Based on a variety of circumstances, my FI''s sister is going to do that.

 

[4ever]

I would appoligise to all three girls you''ve told they are going to be brides maids and say you were caught up in the engagment excitment but think you were a bit premature in asking them as you havn''t fully made a desision yet about how many people will be in your bridal party.

1 1/2 years is a long way away yet so I say make a final desision closer to the time because alot can change it 1.5 years.

 

[mrscushion]

Why can't you have 6 bridesmaids?

The numbers really don't have to be even, you know -- mine are far from even.

I wouldn't un-ask your friend, nor would I set the clock back to zero on all of them once you've invited them. I also would definitely include my FI's sister in the wedding. So I'd go for 6 (or a groomswoman, as pointed out by mary poppins).

 

[chemgirl]

I was in a similar situation a few years ago, but the bridesmaid, not the bride. A very close friend invited myself and two of our other friends out to lunch and asked us if we would be bridesmaids in her wedding. The wedding was almost two years away, so after a month of excitement and planning, everything died down. Fast forward 1.5 years and I call her up to ask about ordering dresses. She then informs me that she has a different bridal party now and I won''t need to buy a dress! I was so insulted! To be fair, I had since moved to a city 5 hours away and we weren''t spending nearly as much time together. However, I always made it clear that I would come back whenever anything wedding related was going on. She also did the same thing to the other two girls. We were all off at school and she was not. We just didn''t have as much time for her, but she took it as a snub and found a new wedding party!

Of the three girls, I was the only one who attended the wedding or any of the pre-wedding events. I think I''m the only one who still has contact with her. The new girls she picked were coworkers and friends of her fiance. They didn''t know her well and you could tell that they didn''t put in much effort. Her mother ended up throwing her a bridal shower because they did not. She also didn''t have a bachelorette party. She was really sad about this after the fact and now regrets her choice.

My point is, the girl will remember that she was asked to be a bridesmaid. She will be insulted if you replace her and you will probably lose that friendship. There could also be drama with your other friends if they are at all close. Please talk to her and find out why she is being so distant before you make any decisions.

 

[zipzapgirl]

Here''s my suggestion...since your wedding is still 1.5 years away, why not just chill with all of the BM talk. How do you know you''re not going to change your mind in another 6 months? Maybe you and Sandy will be best friends again or maybe you and FSIL will have a falling out...who knows...

Since not much BM-related planning really needs to be done at this point, I would wait for the one year mark and then reassess.

I agree. Work on the friendship and reassess where you are in 6 months. You can''t really kick her out without a good reason, so if you feel things have deteriorated further at that point, give her an out and hope that she takes it. Otherwise, take it as a lesson and accept that she''s in.

 

[RaiKai]

I know this is not much good now, but this is why you do not ask your bridal party so far in advance!

Honestly, I would not even stress about it. A lot can change in a few months. What if you are hanging out more with her?

I would not kick her out of the bridal party. People get busy. Sometimes they get busier with other parts of their life. There is nothing wrong with having uneven bridesmaids and groomsmen if you STILL want to ask someone else (but wait a few months!). Plenty of people have uneven wedding parties! But I DO think it is rather crass to "replace" a bridesmaid without a really, really strong reason.

I think this is more of a friendship issue - rather than a bridesmaid issue. If you have concerns about your friendship with her....the much better approach would be to talk to her and ask her if anything is going on, and that you miss spending time with her and so on. Not to kick her out of the wedding party.

Honestly, I don't think this is worth losing sleep over as you indicated you have in your first post - I don't think ANY wedding planning related things are worth losing sleep over (unless it has something to do with who you are marrying and then it is perfectly acceptable to dismiss BM's and everything else!!!).

 

[sweetpea&babycorn]

Date: 6/2/2010 8:32:09 PM
Author: pannini
I see your points... maybe I should clarify.

I agree that it''s wrong to kick someone out for drifting apart. Maybe I''m being too modest. We drifted apart, but I tried to make an effort and she keeps flaking. I then find out that she has been hanging out with many other friends on all those dates I asked if we had time to do something. I live an hour away, and I have gone to many functions out there including her birthday. For all events that I''ve planned for us to do as a small group, I''ve made it in her neighborhood so that she can have an easier time to make it, but she ends up not being able to attend for many reasons.

All my other bridesmaid/friends live 10 min within each other. They are jsut as busy if not BUSIER than her, and they come out to see me or at least make themselves available when I make plans with them in their local neighborhood.

It just seems like she does''nt put any effort anymore. This issue is more based on our friendship, not the BM status. But, with the issue of friendship on the line, it is a bit awkward to assume that the BM status is still intact, right?

So I guess, does that help?

So my alternative route that I mentioned in original post is: maybe I email all of my BMs and tell them all BM planning is off. That due to budget and family and other issues, I have to start over in terms of BM assignments. MY wedding is in 1.5 years. I have at least half a year to assess how things are going, and assess how many BMs I actually have....
So I guess that seems like the more neutral route, to avoid anyone''s feelings getting hurt.


Thanks!

what i''m interpreting is that you want to tell all your BMs that you''re starting from zero BMs and will reevaluate everything and let them know 6mo - 1yr before the wedding who will be in your wedding party. but you''re only doing this so circumvent telling sandy that she is no longer a BM and choosing your FI sister instead. i see this going two ways:

1) you end up choosing the same bridesmaids except for Sandy, and replace her with your FI sister.
if this happens and Sandy finds out, it''ll probably be worse than telling her in person that you would like her to step down from being a BM

2) you end up choosing different BMs. maybe a couple will be the same, but you''ve definitely mixed it up more as time goes along and you become closer to other girls. this would be better than scenario #1.

i don''t think you should dis-invite a BM just because you guys are not as close and she is flaky. one of my posts was about a flaky BM and some people said you shouldn''t have asked her to begin with if you knew she was flaky and you needed wedding help. i don''t regret asking her though, as i''ve accepted the fact that she will involve herself as much as she wants and will approach me about what needs to be done, not vice versa.

maybe you should sit down with her one-on-one, discuss how you feel about your friendship dissipating, and kind of try to patch it up? she sounds like she is a friend that is worth being friends with, esp since you are sad that you guys are drifting apart and she hasn''t reciprocated the effort. i have been guilty of this too and after a wake up call from my friends, i have been much better about keeping in touch.

 

[Bunny007]

If you truly value the friendship, I''d talk to her about your concerns and do your best to repair the friendship. If you don''t, then give her the axe but my guess is that it would cause irreparable damage.

Some people have suggested putting everything on hold and reevaluating at a later date. I think that just prolongs the inevitable. This will only buy you a few months and it doesn''t sound like you intend to cut anyone else from the wedding except this particular friend. If I were her, I''d be really insulted and hurt that you went through the motions of "starting over" when it was only a pretense to cut me from the bridal party. The direct approach is always best, IMO.

 

[pannini]

Hi hi everyone.

Great points from everyone, and some tough points too esp telling me to "chill out."

Ok, I didn''t realize I''d be explaining this much about me. I am a graduate student that is only really free or clear-headed when I am not sucked into the rigorous coursework during the school year. That being said, the only real planning time I have is this summer of 2010, and winter break of 2010-11. Then... I graduate in the summer of NEXT year 2011, with 4 months to get ready. Thank goodness, I have those 4 months to decompress and prepare for the wedding.

The additional issue is my fiance is being relocated to Ireland for 7 months between now and the wedding. That also puts some restrictions on the amount of planning to do.

So accounting for that, I technically have this summer and next summer to do the planning-- that is about 8 months of wedding planning. So that is why I didn''t "chill out" and had to start thinking about all this before.

I understand the repercussions of asking someone out of the BM party, which is why this is so hard for me. I am not a cold-hearted girl, I worry a lot about other''s feelings.

So my decision to start at zero is to really figure out what the ultimate purpose of this whole BM thing is, and allow me to not have it loom over my head, and then to figure out how to address this friendship (not BM) issue I have with Sandy. This is what my strategy is.

Does that sound more heartfelt now?

I NEVER said I was going to "kick out" everyone as a BM, did I ? I just told them that it really is the fact that I made the overzealous mistake of prematurely asking everyone and their mom to be a BM, when I should have thought carefully about numbers.

I chose to not do 6 BMs because for me it''s just too much, and it''s not my taste. In my PERSONAL taste, I think less is more.

Thank you...

 

[swingirl]

I think asking anyone to commit to being a BM 1.5 years in advance is a bad move. I doubt anyone can take that seriously because so much can happen in that time. I would let Sandy know in a very kind way that you realize you shouldn''t have asked her so far in advance and that the wedding party is up in the air as your FI''s family might have to be included. She might be relieved or offended.

But it''s your wedding and I''d pick family over friends unless it''s a bff.

In almost every wedding I know of the friends who stood up are long gone in 5-10-20 years. The family members remain.

 

[VRBeauty]

Date: 6/4/2010 1:02:50 PM
Author: swingirl
I think asking anyone to commit to being a BM 1.5 years in advance is a bad move. I doubt anyone can take that seriously because so much can happen in that time. I would let Sandy know in a very kind way that you realize you shouldn''t have asked her so far in advance and that the wedding party is up in the air as your FI''s family might have to be included. She might be relieved or offended.


But it''s your wedding and I''d pick family over friends unless it''s a bff.


In almost every wedding I know of the friends who stood up are long gone in 5-10-20 years. The family members remain.

Ditto, especially that she might be relieved... and the friends over family part.

I''ve been a "maid" in three weddings. The only relationship that''s still going strong is the one with my sister-in-law.

The blanket "reconsidering the scale/makeup/oops I was premature" approach seems reasonable, especially since it''s true. It could carry a lot of weight if you''ve done this in other parts of your life as well, and your friends are aware of this.

If you think the only thing you''ll be changing is this one thing, then it might be worthwhile to just deal with this friend individually. It would be harder, but justified. Start with "It seems that we''re moving in different directions" or something along those lines. The way you''ve described your recent interactions with her, it sounds as if the two of you might not even be in contact anymore 1 1/2 years from now, if it weren''t for your wedding. As swingirl mentioned, she might be relieved to be let out of her "obligation."

 

[cara]

Asking a bunch of people to be in your wedding party, and then kicking them all out because you were overhasty and premature in asking them so that you can think over what you exactly you want is just a whole bunch of drama where there is no need for drama.

Consider yourself somewhat hemmed in by your hasty bridesmaid invitations. Think over now what you want out of your wedding WITHOUT demoting or disinviting all the participants. If you can come up with good, solid reasons for changing the wedding party (like you are going to have an uber-small wedding and a big bridal party would be inappropriate, or you and your FI have decided to have a super-low-key wedding ceremony with 0-1 attendants each), THEN go about adjusting the list, telling people you were overhasty and now that you have thought about it more carefully, you don''t want them as part of your wedding party. But I would err on the side of sticking to your original invites, even if you wouldn''t ask exactly the same people now, if for no other reason that you need to have good reasons for possibly hurting people''s feelings. And feelings are potentially involved, no matter how diplomatically you state your case.

It should give you pause that you are having this much trouble convincing us strangers on the internet that demoting bridesmaids is really a heartfelt decision. It is not what is in your heart that is the biggest problem - it is the perception! Even if you phrase it perfectly, it is going to be hard for the bridesmaid''s involved to feel positive about being asked to be a bridesmaid, saying yes, and then being asked to be understanding while you go back to zero bridesmaids and reconsider whether or not you want said person to stand up in your wedding. ESPECIALLY if then you go on to re-ask some/most of the Bridal Party Round #1 back onto your new improved, well-thought out list of Bridal Party Round #2. Its just way too much drama.

 

[lucyandroger]

I'm sorry you took so much offense to my use of the term "chill out." All I was saying is that if you just don't mention being a BM to Sandy and your relationship is actually deteriorating as you say it is, then in six months she probably will assume that she isn't going to be a BM anymore and things will be a lot easier to handle. But bringing up the BM thing and then telling her you're "reevaluating" sounds like a bad idea to me. It just seems like you're prematurely creating drama where there doesn't need to be any. And 1.5 years is still too early to ask IMO.


ETA - I agree with Cara.

 

[pannini]

Date: 6/4/2010 4:41:17 PM
Author: lucyandroger
I''m sorry you took so much offense to my use of the term ''chill out.'' All I was saying is that if you just don''t mention being a BM to Sandy and your relationship is actually deteriorating as you say it is, then in six months she probably will assume that she isn''t going to be a BM anymore and things will be a lot easier to handle. But bringing up the BM thing and then telling her you''re ''reevaluating'' sounds like a bad idea to me. It just seems like you''re prematurely creating drama where there doesn''t need to be any. And 1.5 years is still too early to ask IMO.



ETA - I agree with Cara.

Dear LucyandRoger, maybe it wasn''t offense. I think I am easily defensive with my current dilemma over the whole BMs thing, because I guess reading all the responses that seem to assume that I am being rude or irresponsible was a bit hurtful. I am not trying to say what I am doing is heartfelt, and I am not trying to say that what I did with making hasty decisions for BMs titles was done without heart. Like everyone has said, for those who are stating that it''s best to see how things go after the 1 year mark, would be such a great idea.

I think that will allow me to tend to my friendship with Sandy, and figure out if it''s a friendship about to fade out, or if it''s something else that we just haven''t addressed. Who knows, if it gets tended, I''ll grow closer to her and BM status will never change!

I just don''t want my crew start calling themselves my BMs for the next 6-8 months, and then suddenly get hit with my polite and thoughtful confrontation to minimize the bridal party number. All that stuff, etc. is such a stressful thing for me. It is a more personal issue that I am dealing with in terms of making my self happy over making everyone happy before my needs are met.

CARA-- thank you for your logical response. I agree with you completely that doing this is more drama than necessary. But, like I said, I am losing sleep and dwelling on this whole thing so much, it is my NEED to start at zero, with a "blank" slate on BMs. That way, I can think clearly, focus on relationships, and focus on priorities. I know feelings will get hurt. I''ve spoken to each and every one of my BMs to talk about the decision to re-do the lineup. For the record NO ONE felt like they were being "kicked out" or "disinvited" or "demoted" - that is more like a punishment. They know my personality, they know how hard it is for me to think of myself before others. tHey support my decision. They get it. Surprise, Sandy didn''t even reply to the email/phone calls.


Thanks for the input Swingirl and VRbeauty!!!

hugs to all honest and insightful PSers, even the ones who give me tough love.

 

[pannini]

Btw, Lucy and Roger, sorry if I misunderstood "chill out." My eyes got crossed during the stream of responses and connected it with another response that made chill out sound more like something else!

Take care!

 

[Indylady]

Boo. I''m disappointed Sandy didn''t even respond to your calls/emails.

 

[brazen_irish_hussy]

For what it is worth, one of my BMs was my brother''s GF. They broke up shortly after, I never speak to her and she has now decided she is really a man. Do I wish I had picked my friend Sarah, who I was not that close to at the time, but am now? Of course. Did it ruin my wedding or make me sad every time I see the pictures? No. It meant a lot to her to be my BM and she never did anything wrong during it. I would say leave things alone and don''t worry about it. As for his sister, can she get a black dress and walk with the groomsman? My best friend is a guy so I had a man of honor at my wedding and I will never regret choosing him.

 

[sweetpea&babycorn]

Hi panini, I''m glad things a working out for you and your BMs! I think your first post was leaning towards your conerns about what to do with Sandy and whether to pick her or your FIs sister to keep it at 5.

Ditto to Cara...I think you have to ask yourself why you are considering starting at zero because it seems like you don''t have any friendship issues pending with anyone other than Sandy. Evaluate what does a BM mean to you... It''s your wedding and you have the freedom to choose whoever you want for whatever reason you want! My FI is asking his father to be a groomsman even though that''s not "kosher" but who cares! It''s our wedding and well do what we want! Even though you may have "jumped the gun" about asking your friends to be BMs 1.5yrs before your wedding, there was a reason why these girls were asked first and you were so excited you asked them uber early.

There''s no drama here i think you are just very concerned about not hurting feelings and trying to get your BMs to understand your situation which is normal. I hope things turn out the best way possible for you. I feel ya on the time thing, I''ll be in school too and have winter break to make my invites and spring break to reconnect with my venue, then will have roughly a month to put it all together before the big day. We can do it! The less you let yourself get stressed the easier the whole thing will be

 

[violet3]

I would absolutely NOT de-bridesmaid someone. it''s just unfair to ask someone to stand up for you and then take it back. Even if you think you were premature in asking, the responsibility for that action lies with you.

I think having the other friend''s children in the wedding is sufficient enough to have her involved. Having been in a number of weddings, and being a little older, i am never offended if i''m not asked to be a bridesmaid.