Exasperated with 15 year old son!

[AGBF]

Slightly different topic, but not really. My daughter is a good driver. I mean, she is well coordinated and, when she is with her father or me, is capable of driving according to the rules of the road with good judgment. Or she used to be when she drove. When she was 16 or 17, after having a learner's permit for the requisite amount of time in our state, she got her driver's license.

She has emotional problems and has never worked. She has, therefore, never earned the money to buy her own car. She has only been allowed to borrow family cars. When she borrowed family cars, she used terrible judgment with them. When she was doing a high school internship at a nursing home, she drove there and back without making any side trips and we had no problems. But then she started to take friends from Community College on trips all over creation and to crash the car into pillars in garages. She underage boys without licenses drive it, and speed with it. One of them backed it into a rock. I found out one of them was driving it with her lying across the hood and once with her sticking her head out the skylight. Speeds exceeded 100 mph.

The result has been that she hasn't driven at all in about three years. I have said that she cannot drive any of our cars until she demonstrates that she has become responsible, and she surely hasn't done that. Until I read this thread I would have told you that there is nothing I have put have put my foot down about with my daughter, because she runs wild over everyone here. But she doesn't drive any of the cars and hasn't in years.

Deb/AGBF

 

[Begonia]

Thanks for the feedback, everyone. I take no offence, as I believe you are trying to be helpful. Bear with me, as I re-read posts and some of the wisdom sinks in. Sometimes that take a while with me...

Couple of points of clarification. Sam's grade (all A's) were from his last report card, so he hasn't fallen off the rails too far.
We don't have WiFi, but his computer has WiFi capability if it is plugged into the internet. We do not plug the internet in during the week M-W, and used to let them go on Thursday night (homework permitting). Thursday night is now off the table.

When I meant WW3, I didn't mean I was worried about upsetting him or a big blowout. I meant I was concerned that he would turn elsewhere, and what that might mean. Gabor Mate says hang on to your kids at all costs. Don't let their peers replace you as the primary influence in their life. That is what I meant. The law gets laid down around here in all sorts of way daily, believe you me.

Has the gaming gone further than I would like? You bet. It happened quickly and quietly. One day you look up and go "uh oh", I think my kid is at risk of being lost into the cyber world. Am I afraid to stop it? Nope. Nobody's gonna love ya like your Mama Sammy boy. I'll do what it takes. I have to do it the right way, with the right words and the right approach.

So the hubbie and I talked, and gaming is off Thursday nights now as well. We may allow some gaming on Saturday and Sunday evening, after we see some efforts being made in certain areas. The days will be left computer-free for the following priorities: homework, chores, friends and hobbies. I'm also going to help him find a job. He actually used to deliver the paper and earned enough money over 3 years to buy his own computer. That was a big accomplishment.

You don't know Sam, but I'll tell you about him.

He is tall and extremely slender. He is gentle with animals - I have seen wild birds land on his hand, and he can hand-feed all sorts of wild critters. Mean cats that no one can touch - Sam no problem. He sits down and the settle themselves on his lap. He is good with kids with special needs. His teachers have said he shows great patience with his Autism spectrum classmates. He talked early and then started to stutter as he was too young to pronounce the words. Just this little tiny man trying to say big words. The stuttering went away as his ability to actually say the words grew, and we worked on it with help from professionals. He is artistic and can draw and design. He likes to cook and is musical although he gave up the guitar, sadly. When he was young, he had a perfect boy soprano. He would sing to himself as he worked and played and people would look around to see where the voice was coming from. He is sensitive, oh so sensitive and is easily hurt. He was colicky as a baby and couldn't seem to filter the world out from the very moment we brought him home. He was an intense baby, but could lose himself in things for hours. I once bought him a make-up kit with nail polish (he wanted one) when he was 2. He played for hours with the thing. For hours. Each nail was different color and perfectly done. Now he gives me heck and says " why did you buy me one of those Mom?". Because I am Mom, and I want him to have all sorts of experiences without prejudice. He can run. He was smaller then everyone on the cross country team, but would always place extremely well - something about a weight to strength ratio? I don't run, so I'm not sure. My job was to show up with the chocolate milk and holler "run, Sam, run!". Now he is into computers. His abilities are amazing beyond the gaming. He started to teach himself coding when he was 11 (I think it is called that - I'm computer illiterate beyond the basics. Java Script stuff). He takes computing courses at school, as many as he can. He is funny. OMG. Humor is another of his gifts. If he would only join the dramal Slam Poetry, or stand-up club. He is interesting. Rich in personality.

That is Sam. My first born.

Now you know a little of the person you are helping me with.

It takes a village, so thanks for the feedback villagers.

Begonia

 

[iluvcarats]

Can I just say as someone who was an awful teenager and put my parents through hell? The only thing I wish, was that they had been harder on me. .... Yeah it might mean WW3 now, but really how much is that going to compare to the rest of his life? Do the hard thing, do it now.

Yep, this. My parents didn't have the stomach for tough parenting with me, and it definitely shows. They always said they just wanted me to be happy, and didn't want to "interfere with my happiness" by making me do work, or whatever. I got my shit together eventually but it took until my mid-twenties, whereas my brother, who was raised differently despite being just a few years younger, always had his shit together.

^^^^ this!
Kids don't need friends, they need parents who set rules and boundaries. Life isn't always fair, and life isn't always "fun", but if there isn't hard work and limitations involved, one doesn't appreciate life when it is good.

 

[ame]

Thanks for the feedback, everyone. I take no offence, as I believe you are trying to be helpful. Bear with me, as I re-read posts and some of the wisdom sinks in. Sometimes that take a while with me...

Couple of points of clarification. Sam's grade (all A's) were from his last report card, so he hasn't fallen off the rails too far.
We don't have WiFi, but his computer has WiFi capability if it is plugged into the internet. We do not plug the internet in during the week M-W, and used to let them go on Thursday night (homework permitting). Thursday night is now off the table.

When I meant WW3, I didn't mean I was worried about upsetting him or a big blowout. I meant I was concerned that he would turn elsewhere, and what that might mean. Gabor Mate says hang on to your kids at all costs. Don't let their peers replace you as the primary influence in their life. That is what I meant. The law gets laid down around here in all sorts of way daily, believe you me.

Has the gaming gone further than I would like? You bet. It happened quickly and quietly. One day you look up and go "uh oh", I think my kid is at risk of being lost into the cyber world. Am I afraid to stop it? Nope. Nobody's gonna love ya like your Mama Sammy boy. I'll do what it takes. I have to do it the right way, with the right words and the right approach.

So the hubbie and I talked, and gaming is off Thursday nights now as well. We may allow some gaming on Saturday and Sunday evening, after we see some efforts being made in certain areas. The days will be left computer-free for the following priorities: homework, chores, friends and hobbies. I'm also going to help him find a job. He actually used to deliver the paper and earned enough money over 3 years to buy his own computer. That was a big accomplishment.

You don't know Sam, but I'll tell you about him.

He is tall and extremely slender. He is gentle with animals - I have seen wild birds land on his hand, and he can hand-feed all sorts of wild critters. Mean cats that no one can touch - Sam no problem. He sits down and the settle themselves on his lap. He is good with kids with special needs. His teachers have said he shows great patience with his Autism spectrum classmates. He talked early and then started to stutter as he was too young to pronounce the words. Just this little tiny man trying to say big words. The stuttering went away as his ability to actually say the words grew, and we worked on it with help from professionals. He is artistic and can draw and design. He likes to cook and is musical although he gave up the guitar, sadly. When he was young, he had a perfect boy soprano. He would sing to himself as he worked and played and people would look around to see where the voice was coming from. He is sensitive, oh so sensitive and is easily hurt. He was colicky as a baby and couldn't seem to filter the world out from the very moment we brought him home. He was an intense baby, but could lose himself in things for hours. I once bought him a make-up kit with nail polish (he wanted one) when he was 2. He played for hours with the thing. For hours. Each nail was different color and perfectly done. Now he gives me heck and says " why did you buy me one of those Mom?". Because I am Mom, and I want him to have all sorts of experiences without prejudice. He can run. He was smaller then everyone on the cross country team, but would always place extremely well - something about a weight to strength ratio? I don't run, so I'm not sure. My job was to show up with the chocolate milk and holler "run, Sam, run!". Now he is into computers. His abilities are amazing beyond the gaming. He started to teach himself coding when he was 11 (I think it is called that - I'm computer illiterate beyond the basics. Java Script stuff). He takes computing courses at school, as many as he can. He is funny. OMG. Humor is another of his gifts. If he would only join the dramal Slam Poetry, or stand-up club. He is interesting. Rich in personality.

That is Sam. My first born.

Now you know a little of the person you are helping me with.

It takes a village, so thanks for the feedback villagers.

Begonia

Yea, you're just making it sound more and more like you are raising my husband. I find it fascinating how many of the traits you just mentioned seem to be so familiar. If my MIL wasn't on an epic vacation, I'd read this to her and I bet you a million she'd be like "oh my goodness that's DH!"

If he can keep up with the coding, that is worth exploring, but he has got to get the gaming addiction under control. I know a lot of young gamers hope that if they know how to code they can MAKE the games, but those jobs are few and far between.

Just limit the gaming and limit his avenues TO the gaming--friends that have parents allowing it, etc. That's our best advice. We're a village and we're here to help.

 

[momhappy]

How is your son socially? Does he have friends? Does he want friends or does he seem indifferent about it?
A few things stood out to me as I read your last post. You mention guitar, singing, etc. and it sounds a little bit like you have certain expectations of him that he's not meeting. Maybe he doesn't want to sing, or play guitar, or be in clubs, or get straight A's…. You mention that when he was younger he was intense and could play with things for hours - maybe that's what gaming is to him now. Is it possible that it's a passing interest - that his gaming is very intense now, but may fade a bit as time goes on? It's obviously something that he enjoys, so as long as you have boundaries, I see no reason why he should have to quit gaming entirely. How about using the gaming itself as the reward system? In other words, if your grades are good, you may game for specified periods of time.
He sounds like a good kid and I'd hate to see a complete breakdown in communication as a result rigid/unrealistic standards. I don't think it's necessarily fair to say that he has a "gaming addiction." It sounds like his personality is to immerse himself in things that he enjoys at that particular time. I have a child that operates the same way (not with gaming, but her intense interests in certain things changes periodically). I would say that her interests have definitely interfered with her school functioning from time to time because she has a tendency to want to focus on only her interests (as opposed to focusing on her academics). Over the years, we have had to learn ways to cope and as she gets older, those coping mechanisms have evolved.

 

[JulieN]

I would say that if school is his only work, he must maintain a 3.0 unweighted GPA. If he gets a job, he is allowed to go to a 2.0 with no C- allowed. If he does not follow this, privileges will be removed. Encourage him to find what it is he would like to do.

I just started a new job, and I have been there for a week. In the past 5 days, I've had 3 people ask me if we were hiring, and two people going door-to-door trying to sell something. It is tough out there.

Many of my peers will never make as much as their parents did. Just going shopping around my hometown, I've seen a couple of old classmates who I assume or know come from privileged backgrounds and are of above average intelligence working retail, or are Starbucks baristas. I know a recently married couple of two young teachers, and I assume their combined salary less than half of what her parents make.

 

[momhappy]

I guess it just goes to show that every parenting style is very different. I do not schedule my kids in lots of extracurricular activities and I would never expect/demand straight A's from them. Certainly not saying that any one way of parenting is better than other - just pointing out that what works for some families, may not work for another

 

[Begonia]

I guess it just goes to show that every parenting style is very different. I do not schedule my kids in lots of extracurricular activities and I would never expect/demand straight A's from them. Certainly not saying that any one way of parenting is better than other - just pointing out that what works for some families, may not work for another

I couldn't agree more.

Ame: interesting that my son's temperment and personality is so very much like your hubbies...it's all good. What is that famous saying around here...people vary

 

[ame]

I guess it just goes to show that every parenting style is very different. I do not schedule my kids in lots of extracurricular activities and I would never expect/demand straight A's from them. Certainly not saying that any one way of parenting is better than other - just pointing out that what works for some families, may not work for another

I couldn't agree more.

Ame: interesting that my son's temperment and personality is so very much like your hubbies...it's all good. What is that famous saying around here...people vary

It amazes me, seriously, how similar. Your description is just...wow. He read it and was like "my mom would be emotional reading this right now." I really hope this works out, and that you can hang in there. Hopefully you won't have to break out a pillow and smother him in his sleep

 

[Polished]

I used to take my son for a walk around the block when he was younger. It provided an escape from anything that was going on that was too intense. It gave an opportunity to talk and relax. I agree as a parent that you're there to guide them rather than be their friend but I've always found that if you have a rapport with them; if you can get that Good Cop Bad Cop balance happening, they are more likely to listen to you and you actually have more control.

I had a friend whose son was a complete computer games addict until he discovered the piano. He then pursued that with even more single-minded devotion in the hope of becoming a concert pianist. He is now on music scholarship in Europe. Some people just seem to be able to exclusively focus and all this quality needs is direction. All the best with your son Begonia.

 

[crown1]

Thanks for the feedback, everyone. I take no offence, as I believe you are trying to be helpful. Bear with me, as I re-read posts and some of the wisdom sinks in. Sometimes that take a while with me...

Couple of points of clarification. Sam's grade (all A's) were from his last report card, so he hasn't fallen off the rails too far.
We don't have WiFi, but his computer has WiFi capability if it is plugged into the internet. We do not plug the internet in during the week M-W, and used to let them go on Thursday night (homework permitting). Thursday night is now off the table.

When I meant WW3, I didn't mean I was worried about upsetting him or a big blowout. I meant I was concerned that he would turn elsewhere, and what that might mean. Gabor Mate says hang on to your kids at all costs. Don't let their peers replace you as the primary influence in their life. That is what I meant. The law gets laid down around here in all sorts of way daily, believe you me.

Has the gaming gone further than I would like? You bet. It happened quickly and quietly. One day you look up and go "uh oh", I think my kid is at risk of being lost into the cyber world. Am I afraid to stop it? Nope. Nobody's gonna love ya like your Mama Sammy boy. I'll do what it takes. I have to do it the right way, with the right words and the right approach.

So the hubbie and I talked, and gaming is off Thursday nights now as well. We may allow some gaming on Saturday and Sunday evening, after we see some efforts being made in certain areas. The days will be left computer-free for the following priorities: homework, chores, friends and hobbies. I'm also going to help him find a job. He actually used to deliver the paper and earned enough money over 3 years to buy his own computer. That was a big accomplishment.

You don't know Sam, but I'll tell you about him.

He is tall and extremely slender. He is gentle with animals - I have seen wild birds land on his hand, and he can hand-feed all sorts of wild critters. Mean cats that no one can touch - Sam no problem. He sits down and the settle themselves on his lap. He is good with kids with special needs. His teachers have said he shows great patience with his Autism spectrum classmates. He talked early and then started to stutter as he was too young to pronounce the words. Just this little tiny man trying to say big words. The stuttering went away as his ability to actually say the words grew, and we worked on it with help from professionals. He is artistic and can draw and design. He likes to cook and is musical although he gave up the guitar, sadly. When he was young, he had a perfect boy soprano. He would sing to himself as he worked and played and people would look around to see where the voice was coming from. He is sensitive, oh so sensitive and is easily hurt. He was colicky as a baby and couldn't seem to filter the world out from the very moment we brought him home. He was an intense baby, but could lose himself in things for hours. I once bought him a make-up kit with nail polish (he wanted one) when he was 2. He played for hours with the thing. For hours. Each nail was different color and perfectly done. Now he gives me heck and says " why did you buy me one of those Mom?". Because I am Mom, and I want him to have all sorts of experiences without prejudice. He can run. He was smaller then everyone on the cross country team, but would always place extremely well - something about a weight to strength ratio? I don't run, so I'm not sure. My job was to show up with the chocolate milk and holler "run, Sam, run!". Now he is into computers. His abilities are amazing beyond the gaming. He started to teach himself coding when he was 11 (I think it is called that - I'm computer illiterate beyond the basics. Java Script stuff). He takes computing courses at school, as many as he can. He is funny. OMG. Humor is another of his gifts. If he would only join the dramal Slam Poetry, or stand-up club. He is interesting. Rich in personality.

That is Sam. My first born.

Now you know a little of the person you are helping me with.

It takes a village, so thanks for the feedback villagers.

Begonia

I was very touched reading your description of your son, Sam. He sounds wonderful and your love and admiration come thru clearly. Kudos to you as a mother for going the distance to keep him on the right path. I hope he has a wonderful life!

 

[makemepretty]

You're a good parent. It's extremely common, as I have two that are addicted to gaming, computers and very nerdy role playing games. Time management is something he will have to learn, not something you can really teach him at 15, as he already knows this.

Sounds like he's a good kid, there are so many that aren't. Is he a perfect kid, no...but none are. Some lower grades won't kill him or you. High school is harder than when we were young. I don't have advice except to say that you're already doing a good job and to be thankful it's gaming he's addicted to, not drugs, sex, alcohol, hanging with the wrong crowd, etc. You only get to be a kid for such a short time in your life.

 

[momhappy]

I used to take my son for a walk around the block when he was younger. It provided an escape from anything that was going on that was too intense. It gave an opportunity to talk and relax. I agree as a parent that you're there to guide them rather than be their friend but I've always found that if you have a rapport with them; if you can get that Good Cop Bad Cop balance happening, they are more likely to listen to you and you actually have more control.

I had a friend whose son was a complete computer games addict until he discovered the piano. He then pursued that with even more single-minded devotion in the hope of becoming a concert pianist. He is now on music scholarship in Europe. Some people just seem to be able to exclusively focus and all this quality needs is direction. All the best with your son Begonia.

I asked this in my original post and maybe you missed it, but I was curious about the social aspect? How is your son socially? Does he have friends? Does he have a desire to have friends or does he seem indifferent?

 

[minmin001]

I was addicited to gaming in college myself. I have quit playing few times and finally stopped playing completely after I met my fiance. Most of my gaming friends quit like me (grow out of it)
I know I can still play and get addicited to it but I chose not to because I know it will ruin my relationship and life.

 

[Boatluvr]

Hello Begonia -

I don't post very much and most PSers don't know me, but, I was a single Mom who raised three sons from the time they were 2, 4 and 6.5. All three of them turned out just fine, despite being addicted to (at various times), video games (the original ones), skateboarding, comic books - just about everything except school. They are all very different personalities, but they are all in their 40's now - good husbands, great fathers and successful, each in their own right. My middle son, who I used to worry about regarding the game playing ended up (for a short time) as a video store manager when he was 18 and in college! He now works for the county school system in IT. All I did was try to point them in the right direction and give them love and understanding. "Sam" is a good kid - he'll be fine.

 

[blackprophet]

I hoppe my 2 cents are worth something.

I am going to approach this from a different angle. I am like your son. I see a lot of his patterns, I was in them when I was growing up.

You said he is now in a "special program", but he also got Straight A's last semester. Therefore his current level of effort is getting him straight A's. You said the mistakes he made were about your family, would that have lowered his mark? I suspect not. I would guess he is putting forth the effort that he thinks is needed to get A's, nothing more nothing less. I got very good at this in high school. The smartest or most savy kids learn how to game (no pun intended) the system quite quickly. You are scared that his grades might slip. Maybe he isn't. Or maybe he thinks a B or C isn't so bad. Seems he is exceptional intelligence wise (from your description of him). Find a way to engage that intelligence.

I understand the apprehension of most of the people here, but I will ask a questions that I think is relevant: If your son can get straight A's and game for 15 hrs on the weekend, is there really a problem? If you replaced gaming with running x-country would it still be a problem? Both are individual pusuits that stress the body. Gaming is seen as universally "bad", by parents who didn't grow up with them. Why is him spending hours reading on his ipod bad? How is it any different from reading a book? I admit I am of a different generation, so I have a different perspective (I'm 32).

I would say this though, it was 3rd year of university when the work outpaced my knowledge/effort, and by that point it took me another 3 years to catch up to where I needed to be. So I think the value of hard work needs to be driven home. You are breezing now, but the day will come when its not so breezy and you will need to know how to work hard. I coach football and we tell this to our kids who are bigger than all the other kids. Your bigger now, but one day you won't have that advantage, what then? To tell a kid "you need to focus on school" who only needs to work for 30 mins to get straight A's is not going to be effective. He's gonna do the 30 mins, and then what?

I agree that maybe more of his interests could be fostered. And his current interests, not just past ones. How about if he makes a game he can play it unlimited. Or something. I truly believe being more strict is not the answer. I'm not saying let him game uncontrollably, but I am saying engage his intellect/interests. Find out what he wants to do (outside of gaming), and foster that, whatever it may be. You might be surprised by what he would REALLY like to do.

 

[TitanCi]

Is the game called League of Legends by any chance?

If so, my kid brother is doing the same thing. Hes on it from 12 pm to SEVEN AM!!! Hes a freshman in college, barely passed HS, doesn't do ANYTHING at home to help out... All because of this stupid computer game.