Yay or Nay...thoughts on this 3 ct please.

LexiTheDoxi · Mar 3, 2019

https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-4059900.htm

Thanks in advance for reading and any thoughts you can provide.

Current e-ring is a 2ct F VVS 60/60 type of round diamond.
My ideal specs (long term goal): at least 3 ct, F, VS2, Ideal Cut
Current budget: 30K is the sweet spot, but can stretch a little too

Can I get a 3ct ideal cut round if I sacrifice on color and clarity? Willing to go down to G and even S12 if it's very eye clean or inclusions can be hidden under a prong.

I came across the expert selection diamond above. Whiteflash said is eye clean from 6 inches. I'm hoping that maybe it would be completely eye clean to me since I don't have such "expert" eyes. I'm concerned about the medium florescence which they also confirmed does not affect the stone negatively in any way. But I just don't know if I would like the bluish affects it would have in the sunlight. I have not seen a medium blue, but have seen a strong blue and did not care for that.

Do you think this is a good value? Any other ones that you can find?

Or should I stick with my ideal specs of F, VS2, Ideal cut and get a smaller diamond, maybe 2.5 carats with a dealer that has an awesome upgrade policy and work my way up to the 3 ct via subsequent trade in?

Thank you so much!

lovedogs · Mar 3, 2019

I often like WF's ES selection, but I'm not a huge fan of this one. If I were you I'd go with this one https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-4022268.htm

And then save for an upgrade to a 3ct ACA. I think the 2.5 will look plenty white IRL, and you can always ask them to pull both the 3ct you linked and this 2.5 and take pics next to each other so you can directly compare.

Gussie · Mar 3, 2019

Lots if people here love fluorescence. I, like you, am not one of them. I had a stone with med fluorescence and could not stand it in direct sunlight (which is a lot here in Texas). I dislike my stone turning blue even from reflection. That's why I prefer a J stone which has a bit of warmth so I don't get that blue effect as much. Not suggesting a J for you but just pointing out that well cut stones will turn a bit blue from reflection as well as fluorescence when in bright sunlight.

WF has such a great trade in that you can start where you want and work up. However, remember that settings always up the cost. So when planning I suggest simple settings until you are where you want to be.

MissGotRocks · Mar 3, 2019

I would definitely consider dropping down in size a bit to get something more affordable to you now. Just make sure that you do choose a vendor with a great trade in policy that doesn't require you to spend x amount of dollars or go up two or more color/clarity grades. Those can be restrictive when it comes to budgets so just make sure to read all the fine print!

OcnGypZ · Mar 3, 2019

I don't like the stone either. There's a glaring mis-cut... and I bet they did it to get the stone over the 3 ct mark to sell for more money. Hold your ground!

ccuheartnurse · Mar 3, 2019

I don't like the look of that stone either. Did your rep disclose what body tone that stone has? I've had medium fluoro stones before & I didn't notice the blue effect your mentioning.

HappyNewLife · Mar 3, 2019

I'd probably get a smaller ACA and work up to my ideal specs. Re: fluorescence - my ACA has "negligible" fluorescence per the certification, but take a look at it under a UV light. It's probably medium. That said, I LOVE it and I think I do get that bump in color. It's an "I" color and it is WHITE WHITE to me!

SimoneDi · Mar 3, 2019

I am not a huge fan of that stone as well. Here is a pretty 3ct and it seems to be completely eye-clean SI1, but it’s an H color, which I am not sure how you will feel about. It is a gorgeous stone otherwise:
https://www.jamesallen.com/mobile/l...rat-h-color-si1-clarity-ideal-cut-sku-6166795

You can ask JA about their advantage pricing which should bring the cost down.

ETA: here is a pretty G VS2 https://www.fourmine.com/diamonds/index/diamonddetail/id/248993791

TreeScientist · Mar 3, 2019

lovedogs said:
I often like WF's ES selection, but I'm not a huge fan of this one. If I were you I'd go with this one https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-4022268.htm

And then save for an upgrade to a 3ct ACA. I think the 2.5 will look plenty white IRL, and you can always ask them to pull both the 3ct you linked and this 2.5 and take pics next to each other so you can directly compare.

I 2nd (or 5th?) the recommendation to avoid that 3 carat. It's obvious that the diamond was cut to save weight and stay above 3 carats. As @lovedogs mentioned, a 2.5 carat-ish stone will still be a nice bump in size, and then you can save up for the 3 carat F/VS2 goal stone. I would personally perfer a well-cut smaller stone than a mediocre-cut larger stone.

Definitely stick with WF or HPD though if you know you're going to be eventually upgrading to that (currently out of budget) 3 carat F/VS2. Don't want to be stuck with a 2X-cost upgrade policy when looking for that 3 carat. Among online vendors, WF and HPD have the least restrictive upgrade policies ($1 more no size/clarity/color restrictions), but WF has the advantage of having a much larger inventory and higher turnover. Pretty easy to find what you're looking for within the WF inventory, even in the larger size ranges, if you stalk it for a few months.

I like the stone @lovedogs posted, but if you want to stick with G color or higher, this G/SI1 also looks like a great option and is just as eye-clean as the H/VS2

:
https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-4092518.htm

coda72 · Mar 3, 2019

If your budget can stretch for it, I would go for this WF one:

https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-4022278.htm

It’s over 2.75 carats, and over the 9 mm mark. I think the I color will still be plenty white, and if it isn’t, you have that great upgrade policy.

LexiTheDoxi · Mar 3, 2019

Thank you so much for your thoughts. That one you linked is beautiful.

I did ask them to do a comparison with this H color stone: https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-4039671.htm

I can see the color difference and probably prefer to stay with G color. I'll post the comparison pictures.

lovedogs said:
I often like WF's ES selection, but I'm not a huge fan of this one. If I were you I'd go with this one https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-4022268.htm

And then save for an upgrade to a 3ct ACA. I think the 2.5 will look plenty white IRL, and you can always ask them to pull both the 3ct you linked and this 2.5 and take pics next to each other so you can directly compare.

LexiTheDoxi · Mar 3, 2019

lovedogs said:
I often like WF's ES selection, but I'm not a huge fan of this one. If I were you I'd go with this one https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-4022268.htm

And then save for an upgrade to a 3ct ACA. I think the 2.5 will look plenty white IRL, and you can always ask them to pull both the 3ct you linked and this 2.5 and take pics next to each other so you can directly compare.

This is the H color ACA I had them compare against.

lovedogs · Mar 3, 2019

Yeah, I'm just not a fan of the ES. I see leakage, and feel like it wouldn't be as good of a performer as the 2.5 or others on the website. But I would definitely stick with WF because they have an amazing upgrade policy!

LexiTheDoxi · Mar 3, 2019

I get a lot of sunlight here where I am too. It didn't occur to me that the blue effects can be more obvious in the colorless stones. The two diamonds I saw in real life with strong fluorescence were D color.

Thank you for the reminder about considering the setting cost. If I do go that route, to work up to a 3 carat, I will definitely put it in a plain simple white gold solitaire.

ceg said:
Lots if people here love fluorescence. I, like you, am not one of them. I had a stone with med fluorescence and could not stand it in direct sunlight (which is a lot here in Texas). I dislike my stone turning blue even from reflection. That's why I prefer a J stone which has a bit of warmth so I don't get that blue effect as much. Not suggesting a J for you but just pointing out that well cut stones will turn a bit blue from reflection as well as fluorescence when in bright sunlight.

WF has such a great trade in that you can start where you want and work up. However, remember that settings always up the cost. So when planning I suggest simple settings until you are where you want to be.

LexiTheDoxi · Mar 3, 2019

MissGotRocks said:
I would definitely consider dropping down in size a bit to get something more affordable to you now. Just make sure that you do choose a vendor with a great trade in policy that doesn't require you to spend x amount of dollars or go up two or more color/clarity grades. Those can be restrictive when it comes to budgets so just make sure to read all the fine print!

Thank you for chiming it. I wish we would known about these vendors with the great trade in policy back then. My diamond was purchased from a local store and the trade in policy is that we would have to spend double the amount. Ever since I purchased online, I now prefer to go this route. It's so much more convenient.

LexiTheDoxi · Mar 3, 2019

Thank you! You're right, it's probably cut that way to stay over the magic 3 carat mark for the bump in price. Yes, I need to hold my ground.

OcnGypZ said:
I don't like the stone either. There's a glaring mis-cut... and I bet they did it to get the stone over the 3 ct mark to sell for more money. Hold your ground!

LexiTheDoxi · Mar 3, 2019

Thank you for your honest opinion about the stone. I will definitely be passing on it. I've been agonizing a bit all week and I'm so glad I finally posted.

The previous two diamonds I saw that had fluorescence were strong not medium.

ccuheartnurse said:
I don't like the look of that stone either. Did your rep disclose what body tone that stone has? I've had medium fluoro stones before & I didn't notice the blue effect your mentioning.

LexiTheDoxi · Mar 3, 2019

Whoa! Now I need to go get a UV light and see if any of my diamonds will do that. I LOVE your ring and it does look so white.

I always enjoy the pictures of fluorescing diamonds on this site.

HappyNewLife said:
I'd probably get a smaller ACA and work up to my ideal specs. Re: fluorescence - my ACA has "negligible" fluorescence per the certification, but take a look at it under a UV light. It's probably medium. That said, I LOVE it and I think I do get that bump in color. It's an "I" color and it is WHITE WHITE to me!

LexiTheDoxi · Mar 3, 2019

Wow! These are great finds, thank you. That SI is so clean. I've never heard of JA's advantage pricing. I have bought from James Allen before a few times.

I noticed these two vendors have the more restricted upgrade policy. However I would already have reached my 3 ct size goal.

SimoneDi said:
I am not a huge fan of that stone as well. Here is a pretty 3ct and it seems to be completely eye-clean SI1, but it’s an H color, which I am not sure how you will feel about. It is a gorgeous stone otherwise:
https://www.jamesallen.com/mobile/l...rat-h-color-si1-clarity-ideal-cut-sku-6166795

You can ask JA about their advantage pricing which should bring the cost down.

ETA: here is a pretty G VS2 https://www.fourmine.com/diamonds/index/diamonddetail/id/248993791

lovedogs · Mar 4, 2019

LexiTheDoxi said:
Wow! These are great finds, thank you. That SI is so clean. I've never heard of JA's advantage pricing. I have bought from James Allen before a few times.

I noticed these two vendors have the more restricted upgrade policy. However I would already have reached my 3 ct size goal.

Yeah, JA is much less easy with upgrades (more restricted policies), and doesn't always have the best pricing. But if you can find a great stone from there, then that's great. I would just personally stick with a vendor you can upgrade with, especially if you are upgrading now (you never know when you might want to again!)

TreeScientist · Mar 4, 2019

lovedogs said:
Yeah, JA is much less easy with upgrades (more restricted policies), and doesn't always have the best pricing. But if you can find a great stone from there, then that's great. I would just personally stick with a vendor you can upgrade with, especially if you are upgrading now (you never know when you might want to again!)

This. Unless you are absolutely, positively sure you'll be 100% satisfied with the stone you can afford with your current budget, and you're sure you'll never get that "itch" to upgrade again, I would stick with a vendor with the $1-more exchange policy. If you sink $35-40k into a stone from a vendor with a 2X exchange policy, and then a few years down the road you get that 3 carat F/VS2 itch, it will be a lot more difficult to upgrade.

Then again, I'm sure you could get a lot of stone for $70-80k...

...

LexiTheDoxi · Mar 4, 2019

TreeScientist said:
I 2nd (or 5th?) the recommendation to avoid that 3 carat. It's obvious that the diamond was cut to save weight and stay above 3 carats. As @lovedogs mentioned, a 2.5 carat-ish stone will still be a nice bump in size, and then you can save up for the 3 carat F/VS2 goal stone. I would personally perfer a well-cut smaller stone than a mediocre-cut larger stone.

Definitely stick with WF or HPD though if you know you're going to be eventually upgrading to that (currently out of budget) 3 carat F/VS2. Don't want to be stuck with a 2X-cost upgrade policy when looking for that 3 carat. Among online vendors, WF and HPD have the least restrictive upgrade policies ($1 more no size/clarity/color restrictions), but WF has the advantage of having a much larger inventory and higher turnover. Pretty easy to find what you're looking for within the WF inventory, even in the larger size ranges, if you stalk it for a few months.

I like the stone @lovedogs posted, but if you want to stick with G color or higher, this G/SI1 also looks like a great option and is just as eye-clean as the H/VS2 :
https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-4092518.htm

Thank you so much! I think everything you said makes so much sense. A 2.5 carat should already be noticeable larger. A reminder of my 1st priority of the C's which is cut. It's encouraging about what you've pointed out about Whiteflash and their inventory. I'm not in any rush so I do have time to look and wait. I really do like that G/SI1 you posted, it looks like it would be very eye-clean.

I have not seen a CBI in real life yet and would love to do so.

Dancing Fire · Mar 4, 2019

LexiTheDoxi said:
I have not seen a CBI in real life yet and would love to do so.

A must see!...of course I'm biased

..

LexiTheDoxi · Mar 4, 2019

TreeScientist said:
This. Unless you are absolutely, positively sure you'll be 100% satisfied with the stone you can afford with your current budget, and you're sure you'll never get that "itch" to upgrade again, I would stick with a vendor with the $1-more exchange policy. If you sink $35-40k into a stone from a vendor with a 2X exchange policy, and then a few years down the road you get that 3 carat F/VS2 itch, it will be a lot more difficult to upgrade.

Then again, I'm sure you could get a lot of stone for $70-80k... ...

When we got engaged I never heard of "upgrades" and thought a 2ct was plenty big. Man, DSS is real and PS is a dangerous place. So that's why I really do want to stick with a vendor that has such a generous upgrade policy, because maybe I'll have loftier goals once DSS sets in with the 3ct.

But, ahh, that last sentence! Now you have me thinking. My diamond was purchased around 2011, when prices were high. So I figured if I tried to see if any of the online vendors would consider it as a trade in, and assuming they would, it would probably be at a big loss to me and not be worth it. BUT, if I utilize the same vendor and do the upgrade through him, that means I would have to put in 37k (price I paid) which is not too much more from my budget and that means I can get a 74k diamond. Now what can I get for that? It has to be something that will guarantee I would not want to go bigger, which is probably around 3.5ct.

LexiTheDoxi · Mar 4, 2019

coda72 said:
If your budget can stretch for it, I would go for this WF one:

https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-4022278.htm

It’s over 2.75 carats, and over the 9 mm mark. I think the I color will still be plenty white, and if it isn’t, you have that great upgrade policy.

Thank you! I feel like I really should do my due diligence in this and somehow see in real life ACA's in I color before I *think* it's not white enough for me.

LexiTheDoxi · Mar 4, 2019

Dancing Fire said:
A must see!...of course I'm biased ..

And I have yet to see an Octavia and that's on my to do list too!

TreeScientist · Mar 4, 2019

LexiTheDoxi said:
When we got engaged I never heard of "upgrades" and thought a 2ct was plenty big. Man, DSS is real and PS is a dangerous place. So that's why I really do want to stick with a vendor that has such a generous upgrade policy, because maybe I'll have loftier goals once DSS sets in with the 3ct.

But, ahh, that last sentence! Now you have me thinking. My diamond was purchased around 2011, when prices were high. So I figured if I tried to see if any of the online vendors would consider it as a trade in, and assuming they would, it would probably be at a big loss to me and not be worth it. BUT, if I utilize the same vendor and do the upgrade through him, that means I would have to put in 37k (price I paid) which is not too much more from my budget and that means I can get a 74k diamond. Now what can I get for that? It has to be something that will guarantee I would not want to go bigger, which is probably around 3.5ct.

hm, it's an interesting proposition. Which store did you purchase your original diamond from? Do you trust them? At the price that you paid for the original, it would be nice if you could put that equity into the new stone. It certainly can't hurt to check with that store and see what they could do for you.

Obviously, most B&M stores are priced higher than online retailers, but if you could get a diamond for close to what they're listed for online then I definitely think it would be worth it to put the money upfront now to get a 3+ carat colorless/VS diamond.

Rather than just going into the store and seeing what they'll offer you, I would take listings for well-cut stones that you've found yourself online, along with the GIA numbers, and say "I found this diamond that I like online for $XX,XXX. What's the best price you can offer?" Most jewelers have access to the open-market stones that are listed on sites like FourMine, Adiamor, Yadav, etc., so it's a great way to get right to the point rather than having the jeweler feed you lines like "All GIA XXX diamonds perform the same."

Here's a nice stone that you could consider. 3.4 carat D/VS2 for $78k.

https://enchanteddiamonds.com/diamonds/view/R340-491061916?

Get's you close to that 3.5 carat mark that you said would be your "DSS-killer" size, and it is beautifully cut. I'm sure the B&M jeweler wouldn't be able to do $78k, but perhaps somewhere in the low 80s would be a possibility? If they know your attitude is "Work with me or I walk," I'm sure they'll be willing to lower their mark-up a bit. Better to have a slightly lower net profit than no profit at all.

Dancing Fire · Mar 4, 2019

LexiTheDoxi said:
And I have yet to see an Octavia and that's on my to do list too!

For your pleasure!

Yay or Nay...thoughts on this 3 ct please.

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