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WGI experience?

esuk

Rough_Rock
Joined
Mar 16, 2018
Messages
4
Hey, bought a diamond ring the other day. Was told it would be ceritifed and come with all the details when I put the deposit down, but since I've got the diamond it's been certified by WGI, not GIA as I assumed it would be (yes, I know I shouldn't assume things). Has anyone had any experience with WGI ceritifcations or have any idea how accurate it is/whether there's a chance it could be overgraded? Is it worth getting the diamond sent off to GIA to check?
 

Dancing Fire

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Apr 3, 2004
Messages
32,399
Hey, bought a diamond ring the other day. Was told it would be ceritifed and come with all the details when I put the deposit down, but since I've got the diamond it's been certified by WGI, not GIA as I assumed it would be (yes, I know I shouldn't assume things). Has anyone had any experience with WGI ceritifcations or have any idea how accurate it is/whether there's a chance it could be overgraded? Is it worth getting the diamond sent off to GIA to check?
Nope, don't waste your money b/c if it was worth it the stone would have gone to GIA in the first place. You can send it to GIA but don't expect the stone to come back the same grade. Go ask for a refund now!

What are the specs on the stone? how much did you paid?
 

rockysalamander

Ideal_Rock
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May 20, 2016
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5,022
Which WGI? Can you post the grading report so we can see which organization this is in reference too. Many different uses of that acronym.
 

Wink

Ideal_Rock
Trade
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May 3, 2001
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7,509
There are two top tier laboratories in this country. AGSL and GIA. Both GIA and AGS were started by Robert Shipley. He founded the GIA in 1931 to educate jewelers, and then later founded the American Gem Society in 1934 to have an organization that practiced and preached high standards for jewelers.

In 1996, after years of AGS jewelers asking for cut grading on GIA reports, the American Gem Society founded the American Gem Society Laboratory. It took years for them to develop the three dimensional cut grading system that they use, and many cutters of the best cut diamonds use them for the quality of their cut grading system.

All of the other laboratories in this country are considered to be second, third and fourth tier laboratories. I can not comment on the Lab you mention, although I will say that I find it, at the least, misleading not to have disclosed the lab when you asked about a grading report.

Wink
 

OoohShiny

Ideal_Rock
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Joined
Apr 25, 2014
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7,984
There are two top tier laboratories in this country. AGSL and GIA. Both GIA and AGS were started by Robert Shipley. He founded the GIA in 1931 to educate jewelers, and then later founded the American Gem Society in 1934 to have an organization that practiced and preached high standards for jewelers.

In 1996, after years of AGS jewelers asking for cut grading on GIA reports, the American Gem Society founded the American Gem Society Laboratory. It took years for them to develop the three dimensional cut grading system that they use, and many cutters of the best cut diamonds use them for the quality of their cut grading system.

All of the other laboratories in this country are considered to be second, third and fourth tier laboratories. I can not comment on the Lab you mention, although I will say that I find it, at the least, misleading not to have disclosed the lab when you asked about a grading report.

Wink
Every day is a school day when Wink is in the room :))
 

esuk

Rough_Rock
Joined
Mar 16, 2018
Messages
4
What are the specs on the stone? how much did you paid?
Was a platinum ring with a princess cut 0.5 carat diamond (F, SI1 according to the report) and 0.15 carat of shoulder diamonds. Paid around £1300 for it
 

Irishgrrrl

Ideal_Rock
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Joined
Jun 3, 2008
Messages
4,684
@Wink thank you for that info! I always learn from your posts!

@esuk I believe the advice you're getting about returning the ring is very wise. I've never heard of this lab before, and I feel sure that the stone would've been sent to GIA or AGS for certification if it would have been worth it to do so. I would return the ring and start over from scratch. Let us know what your budget is, and I'm sure we can help you find a very nice princess-cut stone within that budget.
 

esuk

Rough_Rock
Joined
Mar 16, 2018
Messages
4
Let us know what your budget is, and I'm sure we can help you find a very nice princess-cut stone within that budget.
Ideally I'd like something similar for a similar price if possible. Able to spend a little more if needed but the budget is tight
 

Irishgrrrl

Ideal_Rock
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Jun 3, 2008
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4,684
OK, so you said you spent about 1,300 pounds, which I believe works out to around 1,800 US dollars. If you're looking specifically for a princess-cut, you can't go wrong with the A Cut Above (ACA) princess cuts from Whiteflash. They're ideal cut and AGS certified. I have a pair of 1.5ctw ACA princess studs and I love them! With your budget, you should be able to go a bit bigger than 0.5 carat if you'd like to.

Here's one that's around the same size as what you purchased originally (0.504), but it has an even higher color grade (D) and a higher clarity grade (VS2), and it's less than you paid for the other ring ($1,359.00 US).
https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/princess-cut-loose-diamond-3520039.htm

Or, you could go bigger! Here's one that's a D VS2 0.61 for $1,878.00. Of course, you'd still have to purchase a setting, but you'd be able to put it in a relatively simple solitaire for just a few hundred dollars (and then maybe upgrade the setting in the future):
https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/princess-cut-loose-diamond-3602753.htm
 

rockysalamander

Ideal_Rock
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5,022
Are you planning on paying VAT From the 1300 pound budget or on top of? What about the setting? Is that out of the 1300 or in addition?

Basically, what is your all in budget excluding taxes for the diamond and setting in USD?
 

alma15

Rough_Rock
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Apr 29, 2019
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1
Hey, bought a diamond ring the other day. Was told it would be ceritifed and come with all the details when I put the deposit down, but since I've got the diamond it's been certified by WGI, not GIA as I assumed it would be (yes, I know I shouldn't assume things). Has anyone had any experience with WGI ceritifcations or have any idea how accurate it is/whether there's a chance it could be overgraded? Is it worth getting the diamond sent off to GIA to check?
I got an experience with WGI laboratory in London and the service was brilliant. Very accurate and professional. I strongly recommend it as a laboratory for appraisal and second opinion.
 

sledge

Ideal_Rock
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Apr 23, 2018
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4,441
I got an experience with WGI laboratory in London and the service was brilliant. Very accurate and professional. I strongly recommend it as a laboratory for appraisal and second opinion.
Just joined today....with first post being here....recommending WGI. Hmmm. Smells fishy to me.

 

bmfang

Brilliant_Rock
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Jan 2, 2017
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1,852
@sledge , yes it seems a little fishy, but given most of the PS folks are US based, smaller labs from overseas may not get that much attention at all.

http://web.wgi-global.com/about-us/

Supposedly been around for 30 years with their gemologists being GIA trained and looking at eventually achieving FGA status (fellow of the Gemmological Association of Great Britain). If using GIA master sets and using GIA techniques for grading, they may be perfectly legit. But the way the website describes their operations, I don’t think they are in the same volume leagues as HRD or IGI for the European/Middle Eastern markets.
 

kmoro

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Sep 13, 2018
Messages
1,076
If I may chime in ... at first the concern was whether WGI was reputable ... but now, does it matter?

To the OP - now you know that you can get a better diamond for less ... even if WGI is reputable, the cut grade given is “N/A” ... you can get one that is AGS certified, where the actual light performance has been evaluated as ideal .. why would you not go that route?

:wavey:
 

sledge

Ideal_Rock
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Apr 23, 2018
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Haha, so I was searching old threads about WGI. Look at the initial post date of 3/16/2018. Over a year old. :lol:

When I looked at who revived it, it was @alma15.

When I made the post above I was under the assumption that was NOT a year old thread and it looked odd someone created an account today and posted how great WGI is for them.

Obviously, this wasn't the case. My apologies to @alma15.
 

Via Emilia

Rough_Rock
Trade
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Jul 30, 2020
Messages
6
Hey, bought a diamond ring the other day. Was told it would be ceritifed and come with all the details when I put the deposit down, but since I've got the diamond it's been certified by WGI, not GIA as I assumed it would be (yes, I know I shouldn't assume things). Has anyone had any experience with WGI ceritifcations or have any idea how accurate it is/whether there's a chance it could be overgraded? Is it worth getting the diamond sent off to GIA to check?
The WGI is highly reputable I use them for all of me gemstones and jewellery.
 

dk168

Ideal_Rock
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Jul 7, 2013
Messages
6,921
This is an old thread.

DK :))
 

Via Emilia

Rough_Rock
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Jul 30, 2020
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My apologies and I did not join today neither to I have any connection to the WGI other than I use them to certify my own jewellery and gemstones. I have always found them to be very reliable and accurate. We seem to be fixated on the GIA, IGI and Swiss lab... of course they are excellent but that does not mean there are not others who are just as good, and remember you had to start from a beginning and build up. And as for being "fishy" I can assure you there is nothing fishy about my comment at all other than the fact that I did not see it was an old thread.
 

oldminer

Ideal_Rock
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Sep 3, 2000
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6,448
In all fairness, there are very, very few smaller lab operations, "as good as" GIA or AGSL. A couple come to mind and I have occasionally supported their operations as completely professional and legitimate. Anytime I have done that, it starts a small controversy, so I won't mention the other labs at this time. However, in that rarefied environment, there are far less than 1% of gemology labs which could hope to be as good as GIA or AGSL. Many small labs do very good and professional work, but they operate at a lower level of sophistication and strict rules of compliance. They are independent and often use their own opinions to base their findings while the top tier labs use more science and high tech equipment along with expert and deep supervision of results. You can't generally do that in labs with just a couple people working, in most cases. it can be done, but it is truly uncommon.

When a lab is unknown to most of the participants on Pricescope it must be considered not equivalent to GIA or AGSL until there is a body of evidence to the contrary which becomes widely known and accepted.
 

Via Emilia

Rough_Rock
Trade
Joined
Jul 30, 2020
Messages
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In all fairness, there are very, very few smaller lab operations, "as good as" GIA or AGSL. A couple come to mind and I have occasionally supported their operations as completely professional and legitimate. Anytime I have done that, it starts a small controversy, so I won't mention the other labs at this time. However, in that rarefied environment, there are far less than 1% of gemology labs which could hope to be as good as GIA or AGSL. Many small labs do very good and professional work, but they operate at a lower level of sophistication and strict rules of compliance. They are independent and often use their own opinions to base their findings while the top tier labs use more science and high tech equipment along with expert and deep supervision of results. You can't generally do that in labs with just a couple people working, in most cases. it can be done, but it is truly uncommon.

When a lab is unknown to most of the participants on Pricescope it must be considered not equivalent to GIA or AGSL until there is a body of evidence to the contrary which becomes widely known and accepted.
Whilst I accept and appreciate what you are saying I wonder if the same was not said about the labs you mention in their earlier years. The GIA etc are the standard I agree but for me to see other labs come up that are offering an excellent service can only be good for the industry in the long run/
 

oldminer

Ideal_Rock
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Sorry, but I don't buy into the GIA ever being questionable. There was virtually no lab work before the GIA in the diamond business. There was nearly no uniformity to diamond grading before GIA. GIA brought science to the trade and eventually also to the public. The same founders of GIA were also AGS folks. The AGSL is a newer lab from from 1996, but established itself on firm grounds in lockstep with GIA philosophy and ethics. There are just a few labs worldwide who do conform very well to the norms, but the main business left for smaller operations is volume work which comes with requirements for liberal attitudes about grading standards. Little, low volume labs, may practice ethically and professionally, but they have no major impact on the diamond business. Those two types of business are the territory for secondary and tertiary level labs. You can think what you want, but the truth of the business is well understood by those of us who have been in it for a long time. That's why the best of us in the business put our faith and trust in those few labs that provide the highest consistency and regularity of results. It isn't perfect, but it is darn close.
 

dk168

Ideal_Rock
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Jul 7, 2013
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6,921
There are standards for any industry where "quality" matters, and IMHO, GIA sets the ones for diamond grading, based on the little knowledge I have on the matter.

DK :))
 
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