Weak HCA score - do you automatically disregard diamond?

[leapinghorse]

I am in the final stages of finding a diamond and have been working with a rep from one of the online vendors. She has been sending me some certificates of diamonds she recommends along with others I have recommended.

Two of the diamonds she just sent scored poorly on the HCA (5.2). I replied to her stating I didn''t like this and ultimately saying that I wouldn''t be interested in them for that reason. Her response was:

"In regards to the HCA, I would not necessarily make that your deciding factor on cut. It is a nice tool to have to plug in numbers, however, GIA and AGS do not go solely by Holloway’s Cut Advisor. They go by the numbers, however they have also done visual testing of hundreds of thousands of stones for 14-15 years and spent over 15 million dollars doing research to determine the cut. Holloway initially claimed before the GIA Cut Grading system came that GIA would use his formula, however they did not, so he has put disclaimers on all sites regarding this.
I would confidently go by what the gemological laboratory grades the cut as."


Does anyone here still consider diamonds with poor HCA scores but excellent cut ratings from GIA?

Thanks

 

[belle]

are the prices similar?

 

[WorkingHardforSmallRewards]

is she offering you a massive discount over other lower scoring diamonds?

Also, check the measurements by AGS required Ideal stats, do they match up with those?

 

[leapinghorse]

I have found others with similar characteristics and a great HCA at a similar price.

I guess I really want to know how much weighting you put on the HCA.

From her response, she seems to think a poor HCA score shouldn''t sway you. However, this may be just a way to sell a stone.

 

[curiopotter]

Can you post the stats on each diamond? At least we can look at the numbers and decide if there''s some obvious reason why HCA is giving you poor numbers, and let you know why you should or shouldn''t stay away from them.

Post the stats.

 

[WorkingHardforSmallRewards]

of course its a way to sell a stone

Obviously some people will like certain looks better than others. but if you dont have a special look in mind...then the HCA is pretty good stuff. Its about light return and performance. Yes, AGS and GIA have both done extensive research. but they dont agree. It might be a GIA excellent but I gurantee you it doesnt meet the requirements for an AGS0 if it has an HCA of 5.2. So why exactly would AGS not give it their top grade if they have both mastered the understanding of diamond cut and performance? Maybe somethign to consider.

Anyway, its an important debate if price is different because then you can factor in how much visual difference there is and if its worth the % increase in price. But, since you are not talking about different pricing then its a very simple matter of picking a diamond that satisifies all three bodies of research. A good HCA score, AGS0 parameters, and GIA excellent parameters. If to the best of your avaialable knoweldge you have satisfied what all three bodies of research would call a top of the line cut, and its the same price (as a diamond that only one study would call "cream of the crop"), then why even have to think about it or ask her twice?

 

[Ellen]

Date: 8/30/2007 12:37:56 PM
Author: curiopotter
Can you post the stats on each diamond? At least we can look at the numbers and decide if there''s some obvious reason why HCA is giving you poor numbers, and let you know why you should or shouldn''t stay away from them.

Post the stats.

Ditto.

 

[Regular Guy]

Date: 8/30/2007 12:29:10 PM
Author: leapinghorse
I have found others with similar characteristics and a great HCA at a similar price.

I think this is the main point...there''s enough options out there, you don''t have to sacrifice one for the other, and neither do you have to pay a premium to get both.

Do you know what was meant by: "so he has put disclaimers on all sites regarding this?"

Also, going forward, save your vendor of choice''s time, and your own, and share your criteria with them in advance of further research. If they won''t use whatever criteria you represent, find someone who will.

 

[strmrdr]

hca 5.2? yep would run run run away.
hca 2.5 .. would look at the rest of the data then decide...

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

Date: 8/30/2007 11:59:47 AM
Author:leapinghorse

Holloway initially claimed before the GIA Cut Grading system came that GIA would use his formula, however they did not, so he has put disclaimers on all sites regarding this.

This sounds like a lady called Jan.

If anyone wants to they can compare my granted patent with GIA''s much later application which has not been granted.

The only major difference is the look up tables. GIA favours steeper deeper stones which can be exlained by the diamond dealers desk lighting type environment and a few other things.

You can read GIA''s point of view, and ur rebutal here http://journal.pricescope.com/Articles/50/1/Letter-to-the-Editor-of-the-Australian-Gemmologist.aspx

 

[Fly Girl]

Date: 8/30/2007 11:59:47 AM
Author:leapinghorse

Does anyone here still consider diamonds with poor HCA scores but excellent cut ratings from GIA?

Thanks

Nope. For my money, I would want both a good HCA score AND and an excellent GIA cut grade.

Seven years ago when I upgraded my diamond ring, I didn''t have a way to judge cut, other than by having the jeweler pick one for me. I was fortunate to get a very pretty diamond.

Now, we the customers are empowered with the HCA. When I am shopping for a diamond today, I definitely use the HCA as an elimination tool.

Stick to your guns!