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The specs of the 1.21 princess cut! just called...

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courtneyclv

Shiny_Rock
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Nov 2, 2006
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125
This is what the other saleslady found on the EGL report...

1.21 center stone
F color
SI1
No graining, No flourescence
cutlet- none

5.82
by
5.68
by
4.18

depth 73.6
table width 71%
crown 13%
pavillion 57%
girdle medium/faceted

symetry good/very good
polish good/very good

This is all the info she told me on the phone. I have no clue what it means. Let me know what you think!
 

lisaC

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Jun 1, 2003
Messages
532
Are you sure of the numbers only I have a 1.13 that is shallower and measures 5.89-5.88x4.03.
But the numbers themselves aren''t bad. Have you looked at gemappraisers.com ? Dave Atlas came up with a cut grade chart which gives us, the consumer, the benefit of all his experience. According to his chart you have a lovely stone grade 1A.
 

courtneyclv

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Nov 2, 2006
Messages
125
"The only thing I remember hearing (reading) here often is that the best performers in princess cuts seem to have crowns of at least 10% and have slightly greater depths than tables, with top depths no more than 74%. I think. Again, not the expert speaking!"

I found this on another post. My diamond does have that! Can''t wait to hear what others think..so far so good.
 

mtrb

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Mar 8, 2003
Messages
207
Which EGL lab is this? Is it EGL NY?

Have you thought about having it double checked by an independent appraiser? I only ask because some EGL labs can be better than others, and they have been known to be off on color and clarity.

In your other post, someone posted a 1.21 stone at whiteflash with a GIA cert for $7500 or so. I would trust that certification without question, but I think you may want to bring the EGL stone to an independent appraiser to double check before you buy.

Would you ever consider purchasing an E diamond and having it set at your store with the setting you liked?
 

courtneyclv

Shiny_Rock
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Yes, but I am not sure sure what the difference would be from E to F, price wise. And wouldn't it be difficult for the jeweler to find the exact ratios but a different color? The E stone would also have to be SI1. to be about the same. When she brought in loose stones a few days ago, she knew my price range..so all of the stones were lower in color that I looked at H-J.

How do I 'borrow' the ring before purchase and how much does an independent appraiser cost?

I am doing research on EGL certification right now...

BUT- do you think what I have..is good anyways..IF it is the truth?
 

courtneyclv

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Nov 2, 2006
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125
Ahhh! I am going nuts, wondering if this is a good stone from what the specs are. I did look at charts online and from what they said..it is good!

If not, I want to go ASAP on Monday to look into it.

this is me..
 

decodelighted

Super_Ideal_Rock
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11,534
Don''t go nuts yet!


I think the previous poster meant "E-stone" not "E" color stone .. as in, you could get a princess stone from an online vendor & put it in the setting you like from your local jeweler.

But unless

a) you save a ton of $$
b) the jeweler''s stone isn''t great

It seems like a lot of hassle - especially if you LOVE that ring as is.

As to the indepedent appraiser ... you can ask the jeweler if he''d agree (because the cert is not GIA or AGS - but the less reliable EGL) to send the ring to the independent appraiser of your choice. That way you never "borrow" it ... they send directly (or take directly) to the appraiser. You''d probably have to pay for insurence & postage & the appraiser fee. (Appraisers could be $100-$250 depending on your area). They don''t have to unmount the stone to see if most of the specs are correct. I''d guess that they''d find the stone was more like a GIA "G" or "H" ... and you''d just have to make sure you''re not paying way too much (F prices for a G/H stone).

OR maybe you could agree to buy the ring but have a return clause if the ring doesn''t appraise as the cert says.

They will try to tell you that their own in-house appraiser is good enough ... but that isn''t INDEPENDENT. (read: un-invested in the outcome).
 

courtneyclv

Shiny_Rock
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jayrenay9

Brilliant_Rock
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jayrenay9

Brilliant_Rock
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You can't compare GIA prices to EGL prices. While EGL USA grades closer to GIA than the other EGL labs, EGL stones are typically sold at a lower price. In my opinion, and not many share it, you can get a nice stone at a great value with EGL USA, BUT that only works if you know what you are buying and are paying the appropriate price. I would NOT pay GIA prices for an EGL stone!

Edited to add: Can you negotiate the price with them? Go in armed with internet prices for EGL equivalent stones and expect to pay slightly more than that as it is a B&M store with a higher overhead, but not as high as a GIA.
 

courtneyclv

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Nov 2, 2006
Messages
125
Don't know if it is USA or not. I am looking for EGL stones that look similar.

BUT, putting certs. aside and which one it is etc...

are the specs of the ring good? If they aren't good, then I wont bother with another appraisal

This wont help..but i thought it would be fun to add a photo, blurry or not! LOL

myringahh.jpg
 

decodelighted

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
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Messages
11,534
Hmmm... I''m not a princess expert but the specs seem pretty good ... it''s the price that seems high to me, for what you''re getting.

Is the setting so special you can''t get it elsewhere? Or could you purchase JUST the setting from them & get the stone elsewhere. I almost think you could get to a 1.5 ct GIA ideal cut princess with that budget ... and a GIA "H" color would probably look like the EGL "F" you love.

Over 9K is a VERY nice budget - you should get a fab ring!! I''d rather see the $$ on your HAND for life & not in the B&M jeweler''s pocket!
 

decodelighted

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jul 27, 2005
Messages
11,534
Look at this stone

1.603
A Cut Above Ideal Princess
GIA "I" Si1
Depth 73.3
Table 69.7
Crown 12.7%
6.35 x 6.31 x 4.63 WHOPPER!!
Polish IDEAL
SYM IDEAL
$8904 ... but because it''s "ACA" it''s avail for 5% back I think during Nov??

Just think of the WHOPPER you could get if you choose a plainer platinum or white gold setting for the time being!


BTW - this GIA "I" color with an ideal cut will not look ANYTHING like the jewelry store EGL "I" colors you''re seeing. Do searches on here to see what GIA "I" looks like -- GORGEOUS!
 

courtneyclv

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Nov 2, 2006
Messages
125
I did look at loose stones on Friday..they were ALL GIA certified. They were all around 1-1.15 and were around $6,000 from what I remember. They were to small for me, and that is why I stuck with this stone. I also looked at a GIA color of I, and held it to this stone, the F..a big comparison!

I can go somewhere else but with almost $4000 off..i figured I should go there. And I won't find a setting for that much!

The truth is that it is an ex's ring we are trading up. So..even if BF spends 10,000 with tax..he is spending about 6,000 for the setting and the center stone.

And to me..I am getting a very nice ring for $6,000. What do you think?

All of these posts are starting to get me kind of upset. I am the kind of person that always doubts things, even after I get them. I want to be sure..but not go crazy.

I held up this center stone to a 1.48 and they looked almost alike. So I don't know if I want to get a larger stone, that may have visible inclusions or a yellow faint tint, just to say it is GIA certified.

And I know I could get JUST a solitare setting with small side stones (my friend has a 1.5 princess that was around 9,000) but that is too boring for me.
 

jayrenay9

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Aug 3, 2006
Messages
704
Just for comparison, I pulled up all F SI1 EGL stones between 1.25 and 1.6cts listed in the Pricescope database. Print this out and take it with you. https://www.pricescope.com/panning.aspx

You have to buy your ring at this store because of the credit and you love the ring you found. Negotiate the price so that you are paying appropriate prices and enjoy your ring. Maybe you won''t go so over budget paying appropriately.
 

jayrenay9

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Aug 3, 2006
Messages
704
Date: 11/12/2006 8:55:41 PM
Author: courtneyclv
I did look at loose stones on Friday..they were ALL GIA certified. They were all around 1-1.15 and were around $6,000 from what I remember. They were to small for me, and that is why I stuck with this stone. I also looked at a GIA setting of I, and held it to this stone, the F..a big comparison!

I can go somewhere else but with almost $4000 off..i figured I should go there. And I won''t find a setting for that much!

The truth is that it is an ex''s ring we are trading up. So..even if BF spends 10,000 with tax..he is spending about 6,000 for the setting and the center stone.

And to me..I am getting a very nice ring for $6,000. What do you think?

All of these posts are starting to get me kind of upset. I am the kind of person that always doubts things, even after I get them. I want to be sure..but not go crazy.

I held up this center stone to a 1.48 and they looked almost alike. So I don''t know if I want to get a larger stone, that may have visible inclusions or a yellow faint tint, just to say it is GIA certified.

And I know I could get JUST a solitare setting with small side stones (my friend has a 1.5 princess that was around 9,000) but that is too boring for me.
$6,000 out of pocket -- the ring still cost $9500. Wouldn''t it be nicer if it was only $4500 or $5000 out of pocket?
 

courtneyclv

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Nov 2, 2006
Messages
125
I will call my lady on Tuesday and let her know what I found. I will see if she can negociate.
It is hard finding the almost same specs with a supposed F color, same carat etc.

I looked under pricescope and found similar diamonds under EGL, but they were of G,H color. I hope those would be close enough! Should I ask her to take off
$1,000 you think?

OH OH..I just thougt of something! I don't have the actual price of the stone! I just know the entire price of the ring. Maybe, the price of the stone is correct and they are charging WAY too much for the setting!

hmmm..oh no..the wheels are turning...
 

diamondseeker2006

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jan 11, 2006
Messages
55,497
Courtney, I think it is perfectly reasonable for you to negotiate on the price a bit. Nothing at all with saying you have been doing some price comparisions and see that you can get a similar stone and setting for $1000-2000 less. Then maybe she''ll take off some. They know they have you to a certain extent because of the credit, but that doesn''t mean they should take advantage of you either. If they say no, then you can bluff and say you''ll have to look a little longer and if necessary, you can just use the credit for wedding rings. Then that may get them back in the bargaining mode and cut something off the $10,000. I feel like there has to be a fair price for both of you.

It sounds like the stone is a good one, so that is good. Just get a fair price and you''ll be doing great!
 

jayrenay9

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Aug 3, 2006
Messages
704
I didn't realize my link wouldn't work! I only found 8 1.2ish F SI1's and none of them had similar #'s as yours. I did find a1.50 F SI1 that is listed for about $4500 a carat. So, using the price and assuming the specs were similar, the price should be about $5400 for the diamond. Add that too the price of the setting and start negotiating! Good luck!
 

courtneyclv

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Nov 2, 2006
Messages
125
Whew..I am feeling better. I thought I was doing everything wrong..at least the diamond IS good! :)

I will call tomorrow, get the price of the center stone, im assuming that will be on the EGL report and try to negociate.

I know!! I will tell the saleslady that we only have a certain amout of cash and I dont want to charge this extra $2500 I am over on budget, then tell her my story (with puppy dog eyes) that I am going to Chicago in a month and need my families acceptance with the ring! We want to get the ring now, but cannot charge or get an account with thier banker for the extra amount. Maybe she will take off some!
 

jayrenay9

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Aug 3, 2006
Messages
704
EGL doesn''t set the price, the store does. With EGL full certs, there is a mini appraisal with the value of the stone. The price is way over inflated and not the retail price.

After the puppy dog eyes, you need to show her the proof! Do your homework and come prepared. I''m sure they want to make the sale and have a lifelong costumer!
 

courtneyclv

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Nov 2, 2006
Messages
125
I called and spoke the the manager of the store today, not my sales lady (she's asst. manager and will be in tomorrow) He said that they may be able to bring down the price but it is highly unlikely. He said they they do the best they can to charge the right amount and that Brenda can help me find a center stone to match my budget. I can call her and she what she can do.

!!!! That wasn't what I was expecting. Tomorrow I will get the price for the center and add it up and see what the setting is.

What do you think for a setting that is hand engraved on the sides with some pave diamonds, small, tapered baguettes, platinum and .64 tcw? I can't see them charging over $3000 for it...if the total price of the ring is $9300 I believe.

I am usually good at finagalling so wish me luck.

-If they wont lower it, yes, I can get a smaller stone, GIA cert. lower color...but I looked at those and they didn't compare...ARRGGG

I do feel like I am in a used car lot!

Courtney

ps- I just went to baileybanksandbiddle.com and saw Scott Kay engraved settings with .50ctw for almost $3700. wow! maybe the price is right.
 

asschersmitten

Rough_Rock
Joined
Oct 9, 2006
Messages
14
Courtney, I have been reading you post but unable to read until today. Here is my story.... Was with a boy for 2 yrs, got engaged and paid 2800 for the ring... broke up 2 yrs after that... after a break and some growing up got back together. I was 19 at my first engagement to him and we are 23 and 26 now. We are getting engaged again but wanted a new ring to symbolize our new relationship. We could have done the same thing in, go back to the original jeweler and get something at least double for full credit of the original. We weren''t thrilled with that idea given the jeweler (Shenoa... you can read plenty nightmare stories on PS) So instead I listed my ring for $3000 on craigslist.com with many pictures. We got over 45 responses to the ad and were able to get the full 3000 for the ring so we were up 200 and got to go where we pleased. We went to a local jewelers so i am sure we didnt get the bottom dollar best deal as opposed to dealing with a PS vendor, but i got to pick out just what i wanted... see the diamonds in person etc. We too had a 0% credit card which is 0% until April of 2008. We were hoping to put 3000-4000 on the card and use the 3000 from the original diamond for the rest. Figuring, as I am sure you are as well, at 0 % why wait. it was either save 225 a month until april of 08 then get engaged or buy it now and pay the 0% at 225 until then. Same difference right? Well all was to plan until the jeweler brought in a 1.4 carat Asscher or square emerald cut that I was in loooooooooooove with. HUGE spread and not a "by the numbers" ideal diamond but beautiful, as most ppl will tell you it is very hard to buy an asscher cut "by the numbers" as they are each so different etc etc. He brought in a few more including a few ideal cut diamonds which were smaller (1.1-1.2) but as soon as you set the 1.4 down it was a big "duh". so the diamond was 6900 plus tax... pretty much right at budget. but then there was the matter of the setting..... I LOVE antique-esq settings... my first setting was a beautiful antique setting but I could not use it again b/c it could not accomodate a larger or square stone. I saw a few settings that were nice... had my heart set on a pave halo.... then came out the Baguette Halo design.... and .. well... wow... could not have looked more amazing with the asscher diamond... as both have long clean lines. The setting.... 2700 (OUCH) but the boy.... well he saw my eyes when it was together... it was a true wow experience. the diamond looked HUGE the setting was dynamic. Soooo... without much hesitation he said yes lets get the whole thing. We are currently living with my parents to pay off debt and save for a house. I am waiting top government security clearance to start a new job and he is awaiting a promotion both of which will happen in the spring so we are stuck until at least the summer or 07. We figure we will have plenty of time to pay off the card and save for a hosue since our expenses otherwise are only 1 car and cell phones and we make a decent buck now before new job and promotions. ANYWAY.... PLENTY of people gave crap about using credit since we just paid off every cent of credit debt we each had and only have student loan stuff left which barely counts. We put 6700 on the card and already paid off 2000. We may not save enough to decorate our new home when we eventualy move with everything we could possibly want.,..... but the boy said he would put off his dream entertainment center for my ring.... what a guy I know.... So here is what I am saying...... PEOPLE USE CREDIT and at 0% don''t feel bad.... i totally get why and how you are using it. I had the "for right now ring" before and I CAN"T WAIT to get the "for always" ring. It will be worth it. As long as you LOVE your stone and your ring... P.S. we also look at it as a 6700 expense since the 3000 was long gone yrs ago. Or,.... if you can be patient throw the old thing on craigslist and wait.... thought i TOTALLY get the impatience... my ring was ordered 34 days ago and its been torture!
 

jayrenay9

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Aug 3, 2006
Messages
704
Date: 11/13/2006 8:09:09 PM
Author: courtneyclv
I called and spoke the the manager of the store today, not my sales lady (she''s asst. manager and will be in tomorrow) He said that they may be able to bring down the price but it is highly unlikely. He said they they do the best they can to charge the right amount and that Brenda can help me find a center stone to match my budget. I can call her and she what she can do.

!!!! That wasn''t what I was expecting. Tomorrow I will get the price for the center and add it up and see what the setting is.

What do you think for a setting that is hand engraved on the sides with some pave diamonds, small, tapered baguettes, platinum and .64 tcw? I can''t see them charging over $3000 for it...if the total price of the ring is $9300 I believe.

I am usually good at finagalling so wish me luck.

-If they wont lower it, yes, I can get a smaller stone, GIA cert. lower color...but I looked at those and they didn''t compare...ARRGGG

I do feel like I am in a used car lot!

Courtney

ps- I just went to baileybanksandbiddle.com and saw Scott Kay engraved settings with .50ctw for almost $3700. wow! maybe the price is right.
Scott Kay is very expensive! I wouldn''t compare to him unless you are actually getting a Scott Kay or some other high end designer. Have you tried some of the other online vendors to get an idea of how much platinum settings are?

I hate when sales people know your budget! I swear they try to give you the least amount for the most money!! We''re getting quotes to remodel our kitchen and the first question every time is "what is your budget?" UGH! I just tell them to give me a quote for what I want then I''ll decide how much I want to spend.

Be prepared and go in armed! The manager left some room for negotiating, so jump right in!
 

decodelighted

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
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Messages
11,534
Date: 11/13/2006 10:48:24 PM
Author: jayrenay9
Date: 11/13/2006 8:09:09 PM
Author: courtneyclv
-If they wont lower it, yes, I can get a smaller stone, GIA cert. lower color...but I looked at those and they didn''t compare...ARRGGG.
Scott Kay is very expensive! I wouldn''t compare to him unless you are actually getting a Scott Kay or some other high end designer.
I agree with Jayrenay ... Scott Kay isn''t a fair comparison pricewise. But I just wanted to say

DON''T BE AFRAID TO WALK AWAY. Don''t get talked into any of the smaller stones you don''t want ... at ANY price. Set in your mind a price you''re willing to pay for the one you DO want & start negotiation BELOW that price & work up ... if they don''t meet where you think is fair - WALK AWAY. Say "Call me if you can meet my price". My father bought his last new car that way. Sure enough, two-three days later ... when end of week sales #s were being tallied - they called & met his price.

They know you have the credit & want to use it .. that''s the disadvantage here. But as long as they think you have other options & aren''t afraid to use them - maybe they''ll bend.

Good luck!
 

courtneyclv

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Nov 2, 2006
Messages
125
Wow! Asshersmitten..thanks for the story. What a guy you know..awwww....

That was a great story and I am SO happy you are together again! Yes, there may be more cooking and less restaurants, a few less nights out a week. But I also know my BF and I know that wouldn''t bother him. He gave me this wonderful heartfelt talk last month about how he wishes he could give me the world and wants me to be his wife (not officially proposed to yet) , and yada yada yada. ~wipe a tear~

I know this ring is what he is giving to represent that and it will mean so much to me that we will be engaged. So yes, credit is a bad thing, but if you can afford it, pay your bills, pay your mortgage, and have extra to LIVE LIFE (my quote) haha...why not go ahead and do it. The happiness I will feel when I look at my finger and know that my ring is a sign of the love and life we share..is worth an extra monthly payment to me.

Thank you for your encouraging story...

Courtney

ps- Is there an engagement/wedding planning forum on here? I am getting addicted!
 
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