The Help

[dragonfly411]

For Those who would like to discuss. I'll admit I haven't finished it, and feel rather guilty, but have had to study for finals so I'm using that as my excuse.

 

[AGBF]

I read The Help a few weeks before we chose it for the book club, which made it an ideal choice as far as I was concerned since I did not need to reread it! I did, however, have to buy another copy of it. I had lent my first copy to one of my nieces, who had taken it with her to Spain. (My other niece was also reading it, but she had her own copy of it here in the the United States!) (I wanted to have a copy at hand for book club discussions.)

I really loved the book, which is one reason I was enthusiastic about using it for the book club although I had already read it. I liked its themes. I have never attempted to put those themes into words before. I think that one theme is that women stick together and help each other. I think another theme is that there is goodness where one would sometimes least expect to find it, and that it just needs help to find its way out. I think another theme is that there is a dignity in the black community that it earned through its suffering and that it cannot lose. I am sure there are more. I just thought I would start us off.

Deb/AGBF

 

[merilenda]

I also loved the book and am looking forward to discussing it! I really liked the way the author switched back and forth to different narrators. It was kind of jolting occasionally to switch from perspective to perspective, but in a good way. It really kept the story moving. I thought that was very effective. These women kind of came to life for me. The book really painted a picture of what Mississippi was like in the 1960's.

I like the themes you've mentioned to start us off, Deb, especially the second one.

 

[TravelingGal]

I think people flaked on reading! If this doesn't kill the PS book club, I don't know what will. And Ms. Haven, you are SO in trouble!

I have to go on a biz trip, so will be busy over the next few days but will check in when I can. One of the things that struck me about the book was the differences in voice for Minny - what went on in her head vs. how she spoke. I thought it was interesting.

Maybe also because I am not black or southern, I didn't find any fault with the dialect as some reviewers had mentioned. Overall, it was an engrossing read.

Hopefully we can explore more of the themes in the book!

 

[HopeDream]

I realy enjoyed the audio book version of The Help - three different women narrated the 3 different perspectives.

I still feel a little unsure about the ultimate fate of Skeeter's mother. I was also uneasy about the eventual fate of Minny's employer. Did she continue to be ostracized by the community? Will, she eventually get to meet Skeeter?

I was worried the book would end sadly, and was relieved when it didn't.

The book reminded me just how much women's roles and societal expectations for them have changed so much since the 50's.

In July 2010 they'll be filming the movie version!

 

[movie zombie]

not a "member" of this "club" but i have read THE HELP.....while i was down with my broken ankle during the summer.

first, i found it riveting: i could not stop reading it. i am amazed that this is the first effort by this author. the "voice" of each of the characters is finely honed and i had a definite sense of who each of these women were/are.

secondly, while many americans realize some of the history of the civil rights movement, it is the everyday people living everyday lives that i find fascinating....and this book certainly gave me an insight: an insight both into white women of privilege and those that serve them. i say serve them because in the eyes of some of these white women, black women appear to exist to merely be of use to them. but i am struck by some of the women who formed personal relationships and were there for their hired help as a friend.

i am also struck by the slow and growing awareness the main character has regarding what is really going on around her. which is also echoed when one troubled black woman gets the support of the white family she works for. it is the personal awareness and growth of the characters against a back drop of the times that i found rang true.

the manner in which these women had to communicate had not changed much since the days of plantations. the fear of being on the street alone. i could go on by how much this book broke down everyday life in the south at the time.

MoXo

ps i think this is more than about women binding together. i think it is semi-autobiographical re her growing up in the south and her coming to adulthood understanding finally what the daily life of her family help entailed. i think she's trying to show that change comes about when people come together. her work reminds me in a way of Joyce Carol Oates. this was a thoroughly satisfying reading experience for me.

 

[miraclesrule]

I got sidetracked by the home construction, so I just purchased the iPad download from Amazon. I will be able to discuss it within two days.

 

[rainwood]

I too have had to flake out on The Help. Haven't even started it and probably won't until after the holidays now. There are just too many things going on and we're now off on a mini-vacay and that big old hardback is just too heavy to pack. Maybe I can head up the second wave of discussions - the post-Christmas Helpers so to speak. Sorry.

 

[AGBF]

first, i found it riveting: i could not stop reading it.

I, also, had this experience. I started to read this book right when we were supposed to be reading the Wilkie Collins book, The Moonstone, for our first book club discussion and I wanted to make sure that I had that book finished on time. I could not put down, The Help, however, so I read it day and night for two or three days , just devouring it, until I had finished reading it!

secondly, while many americans realize some of the history of the civil rights movement, it is the everyday people living everyday lives that i find fascinating....and this book certainly gave me an insight: an insight both into white women of privilege and those that serve them. i say serve them because in the eyes of some of these white women, black women appear to exist to merely be of use to them. but i am struck by some of the women who formed personal relationships and were there for their hired help as a friend.

i think this is more than about women binding together. i think it is semi-autobiographical re her growing up in the south and her coming to adulthood understanding finally what the daily life of her family help entailed.

I agree that it is about more than women binding together; obviously it is about race relations! However, it is definitely, also, about women binding together. Although race relations is by far the most important element in the book, there is a minor theme of women binding together always present in the book.

I see that women in the book also tear at each other, but they help each other, too. The alliance beween Miss Celia and Minny in which they save each other's lives is one example that comes to mind. The hidden bond that had grown up, unbeknownst to anyone between Lou Anne Templeton and her maid, Louvenia, is another.

Deb/AGBF

 

[AGBF]

I was also uneasy about the eventual fate of Minny's employer. Did she continue to be ostracized by the community? Will, she eventually get to meet Skeeter?

You're talking about Miss Celia! First of all, her husband, Mister Johnny, was a very strong, stand-up guy who loved her like crazy...and if she wasn't having miscarriages all the time and almost dying she had a good chance at a healthy life. Apparently she was quite beautiful and strong and capable. She had Minny...and Minny was a great person to have as a friend. (I'd certainly rather have her as a friend than an enemy!) If that community didn't change, I don't think Miss Celia would be missing out on anything by being "ostracized" from it. Who knows? Maybe she (Celia) and Lou Anne Templeton could end up friends! She was the only other woman in that social circle besides Miss Skeeter who was worth a darn!

Deb/AGBF

 

[movie zombie]

and it is indeed interesting how these women bonded....or not, as the case may be. the secret traveling word that interviews were being taken to be published....those that wanted their statements heard. and really for me that is a lot of what this books is about: being heard. having a voice. being accepted and helping one another out. this is the real civil rights movement.

MoZo

 

[miraclesrule]

I am seriously loving this book right now...

 

[katamari]

I just couldn't find the thread. Oops!

I did enjoy the book, but not nearly as much as I anticipated I would.

More than anything, I wish there had been a storyline from a segregationist for comparison.

I am hesitant to discuss more since the thread is being visited by readers still visiting the book, but am certainly willing to discuss more.

I also don't think this is the death of the PS bookclub. The holidays gets crazy for everyone. VIVA LA BOOKCLUB!

 

[AGBF]

More than anything, I wish there had been a storyline from a segregationist for comparison.

I don't know what you mean by that.

Deb

 

[Clio]

I read the book over the summer, and I enjoyed it quite a lot.

In many ways, this is my family's story (in fact, my mother's family name is used for one of the characters), and she gets the atmosphere of Jackson in the 1960s right. From a historian's perspective, I'd say it's very good.

There are some things that don't ring true (mostly, the Junior League parts), but I can understand why she needed to write it that way.

The other thing I didn't like is that the characters were not very subtly drawn. Poor dumb Celia was just too dumb; her husband Johnny was just too devoted. Little nuance to the characters, for the most part.

 

[miraclesrule]

I feel asleep reading it last night. I didn't want to stop, but my eyes and body couldn't make it. That's a good thing, because I am late for work now.

 

[movie zombie]

SPOILERS SPOILERS SPOILERS SPOILERS

my take on it:

i didn't think celia was dumb: she's described as poor white trash that married above her station. her lack of experience is evident in her continued pursuit of being in the junior league. her problem is that despite being white she is still distained by the upper class of that area. oh, and she's not from that area and married a guy that one of the upper class was supposed to snag as a husband. she just doesn't "get it" that nothing she says or does will get over these barriers.

re johnny: the book is abpit the women, not the men. i think the men are representative of "sterotypes" or representing postures/positions of existing conditions. he does for me at least represent the changing and new south. he is willing to defy class. he is willing to judge based on personal interactions and observations. who and what an individual is is more important to him than the color of that individual's skin.


MoZo

ps i had seen this book at costco for about a year and read the costco review of it. didn't pick it up until last spring. didn't start reading it until june...and it was done in a matter of days. it is a book that i even remarked about to my husband. repeatedly. i'll be interested in seeing what is next for this author....

 

[merilenda]

I generally agree with movie zombie's take on Celia & Johnny. I don't think Celia was dumb, she was just socially out of place there and very isolated.

Oh, and HopeDream, I second your thought on the eventual fate of Miss Skeeter's mother. I didn't think it was realistic.

 

[Clio]

Y'all are right, dumb is not exactly the right word. Unsophisticated, maybe. I still say, however, that with the exception of Skeeter and possibly Minny, there's little subtlety or growth in the characters.

Overall, I liked the book, though.

 

[katamari]

More than anything, I wish there had been a storyline from a segregationist for comparison.

I don't know what you mean by that.

Deb

Sorry. I edited out a key phrase when trying not to give away spoilers.

I meant I would have enjoyed reading from the perspective of one of the mothers, or Hilly, or even Elizabeth. Generally someone who did think the book was a huge deal and shouldn't have been written. We get it a bit from the gossip and the reaction to the book. But, I would have liked to read about why it was so terrible, how it was such a threat and why, etc.

 

[miraclesrule]

Now, 8'm just getting excited. I'm on Chapter 12.... I'd be finished by now if II did not have to work and sleep.

 

[NewEnglandLady]

Okay, so I bought this book last week thinking I would not have a chance to read it for at least a week because I was just so busy with work. But it pulled me in immediately and by the time the weekend was over, I'd read it cover to cover.

I really enjoyed the book. There are many things I loved--I loved that each character had her own distinct voice and point of view, which I think the author did so well. I also really loved some of the nuances of the characters--the best example for me is Minny, who was a very strong character. She wasn't afraid to speak her mind, but also suffered at at the hand of her own husband. I don't want to get into too much for fear of spoiling anything.

The book definitely wasn't without fault, either. Some of the characters were very flat, I felt parts were not believable and sometimes the story felt really forced, but overall I really did enjoy it quite a bit and wish I were still reading it! For me, it's the perfect book-club type of book.

 

[miraclesrule]

I just finished it!! I thought it was amazing. I could have continued reading another 30 chapters if it would have been that long. It makes me want to spend more time with the 85yr old women who work with our company.

 

[Irishgrrrl]

I read this some time ago, and LOVED it! It sucked me right in and I couldn't put the darned thing down! This woman is a PHENOMENAL author and I can't wait for her next book to come out!

Of course, I'm probably particularly looking forward to her next book so that I can read it on my spankin' new Kindle that DH gave me today as an early Christmas gift! SOOOO excited!!!

 

[Porridge]

I loved The Help! I finished reading it months ago, I'll have to dip in to it again to be of any use in a discussion. I had the exact same thought as you TGal - Minny's voice in her head was so different to the voice she spoke with. I thought it was a great way to show how she puts on a strong face for the world, no matter what is going on inside.

I also thought the same as Katamari - it would have been interesting (if infuriating) to read from say Hilly's perspective. But I still think it was effectively portrayed even without that.

I was horrified when - I think it's Minny? - talks about how the white people go about ruining the lives of black people who cross them. The cold, calculating tools they use to systematically destroy them. It was terrifying!

I was disappointed in Stuart, especially as his father seemed to be a good man. MZ - that's an interesting point that the male characters are primarily there to represent stereotypes. I agree with you.

Celia wasn't dumb. She was just blind to how things really were, and I think that came more from innocence and inexperience than anything else. This was a whole new world for her. She just saw things as they should be, and didn't think to see the ugly minefield that was really there. I think thats why Johnny loved her so much. I loved how she handled Hilly towards the end - sending that check "for two-slice Hilly".

I thought of Celia and Johnnys house as a kind of refuge from the rest of the town. Once Minny met Johnny, and Celia stopped trying to cover up and everything was out in the open, and Minny's fear of being "caught" by the man of the house was gone, the whole atmosphere changed. After that, of all the situations in the book the Foote household was the one that didn't have that oppressive air. The Footes were good people, and their house for me represented the way things should have been. To them (it seemed to me), Minny wasn't a servant, the way most of the rest of the black women were to their employers. She was an employee and a friend, and it wouldn't have mattered to the Footes if she was black, white or green.

I maybe would have liked to hear a little bit more about what the women who told their stories wanted to achieve. I know the aim was to open people's eyes to how things really were, and to change attitudes, but I would have liked to have heard more about their ideas of how they thought things should be. Is it naieve of me to think they all want the same as me, a world of equality, where skin colour matters about as much as eye colour? I imagine they all had different opinions about that! It was clear from the attidudes of some of them towards white people that some were segregationist in their own way, and so I imagine those would have balked at the notion of wanting to be "equal" to white people, the way for example some feminists would balk at being "equal" to men, if that makes any sense. I wonder what did Aibileen and Minny want, what did their visions of a changed Jackson look like? Did they differ? What did Skeeter's vision look like? We get a fairly good idea of course, based on comments and opinions throughout the book, but I would have liked it explored more. But I suppose that goes beyond the scope of the book, which was a narrative on how things were at the time, and enters the scope of the book club! What did you readers think the storytellers wanted from the book?

 

[movie zombie]

i think they simply wanted to have a "voice" and have that voice "heard". it was indicated that some of the participating women told stories of friendship and goodness in their working relationships with some families. it was a surprise to Skeeter at how much she had underestimated one of the members of the "Hilly" social club. she learned of the goodness of that person through the story of "the help".

actions often speak louder than words and while many of the white women were cutting to the bone verbally, they could cut to the soul through cutting off the ability to obtain work and by spreading lies. i also think it was a learning experience for Skeeter to have to be careful of where she was seen and who she was seen with. having to sneak into the black area, go through backdoors. she got to have a taste of what the help had to endure.

MoZo

 

[PhillYOung]

Helping the people who are in need is a great work and a very good deeds.