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no_normanrockwell

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jul 8, 2014
Messages
8
I have been a member here for more than 10 years, but I'm usually a lurker. I created a new account for anonymity. Thanks for letting me vent.

This is actually about my FIL who won't leave me alone right now. He can tell I am busy writing something and is shout-talking at me from another room. Now he's pacing in front of my reading room... Actually, he just invited himself in and is sitting down across from me in my reading room while I'm typing these words. Unbelievable. Yep, still talking at me despite zero eye contact with me and single word responses from me. Okay, let me begin.

About a year ago I agreed that my 80 year old father-in-law would move into our house. I knew there would be some adjustment for all of us, but once we got through that, I just knew it would be great- a Norman Rockwell scene come to life. Our home was already peaceful and harmonious; a truly happy place. Then he moved in.

DO NOT ALLOW YOUR IN-LAW(S) TO LIVE WITH YOU. PLEASE. *I know there are always exceptions and I really hope your in-law is one. I had no idea what an absolutely awful person my FIL can be. We had always lived states away from my in-laws, and I now know he was mostly on his best behavior.

Here are a few of the challenges:

He doesn't care about boundaries. I've had to ban him from coming into our bedroom uninvited. We have a roomy home, but he's in everyone's business and personal space all the time. He reads personal mail if It's open but still in the envelope, even grocery receipts- Nothing is private if it's left in a public area of our home, e.g. kitchen counters, coffee tables. I've caught him screaming at my daughter and ordering her around like a crazed drill sergeant when he didn't know I was on the phone with her. We really had it out that time and he was almost asked to leave. He has since stopped that behavior but I will never trust him again. He's SNEAKY and skulks around the house popping out from around a corner. We've gotten into arguments with him shouting at me, "You just want to be the boss!" I calmly reminded him that I AM the boss of this house along with my husband. He's constantly making crude jokes about women, whether they're "big as cows" or "nice and slender." He's unsophisticated, lewd, sexist, racist, and a bigot. Wow, that actually felt good to get out. My husband is nothing like his father. The two couldn't be more different. Truly. This brings in a whole list of other complications which I won't go into.

I'll start with the most egregious thing he has done to date:

My father fell off a ladder which resulted in a severe head injury. Thankfully my dad bound his head very tightly; but instead of driving to the hospital, he drove to our house. Just looking at the amount of congealed blood on the bandage I knew it was an emergency situation. I almost had him convinced to go to the hospital until my 80yo FIL let himself into my bedroom and insisted on seeing the wound. My father kept saying no, I started to yell, my husband was asking him to stop, but he wouldn't leave and kept touching and poking at my dad's head. So there's my father sitting on my masterbath floor kicking his feet, holding his head, and screaming "stop, stop you're pulling it!" Both my husband and I were desperately trying to convince my FIL to stop, just short of physically taking him out of our room.

And then it was pulled off.

There was more blood than I have ever seen in my life. My FIL turns to me and says, "He needs to go to the hospital right now." As it happens, my father had severed an artery in his head when he fell but managed to stop the bleeding when he bound his head until my FIL ripped it off. We had to call an ambulance which took him to the hospital where he received 11 staples. My father now refuses to forgive my husband's father and calls him- well, all kinds of colorful, no-good adjectives.

Two weeks after that incident, my husband had a significant accident. It was a pretty bad year for us. After DH was removed from ICU my FIL and I drove separately to the hospital to see him. After we arrived in the room my FIL pulls out his deceased wife's handicap permit. It's always kept in the glove box so why would he take it out and bring it into the hospital?? He then tells me that he forgot to hang it in the car and doesn't want a ticket. He doesn't know exactly where he parked but asks if I would I mind going to where he thinks the car is to hang the permit for him. This hospital is HUGE and I need to walk a good distance and then take a shuttle to get back and forth from the parking garage to the hospital, but I happily go to help him avoid the ticket. It doesn't dawn on me that he has purposely sent me on a wild goose chase until I'm walking the rows and rows of vehicles clicking his remote trying to find his car.

I'm seething. I return and hand him the permit. He then has the nerve to tell me to go again! I apologize but refuse and say that I'm staying with my husband. Later when I asked him whether he got a parking ticket he chuckles while telling me that he didn't park in a handicap parking after all and had no problem finding his car.

There's so much more to this story- so many more examples of his dad being truly awful in the hospital and during husband's recovery. He had a full recovery, btw.


When my husband was first released from the hospital and completely out of it (lots of meds and a brain injury with memory loss) we fought about where my husband should recover. My FIL's wanted his room only, but I said our bedroom to sleep and the rest of the house during waking hours for stimulation and where our children and dogs could be around him. Sounds reasonable, right? I went to get more supplies and when I returned he was in my room standing over my drugged, sleeping, and NAKED husband (a decorative pillow covering his bits) rubbing goo-be-gone where his IV had been taped down. I was shocked and stood there literally mouth agape. He quickly left.

One Saturday morning while I was flipping eggs for breakfast he walked into the kitchen and announced to everyone and no one in particular, "You know, all the black people want to kill their babies." I quickly dismissed him saying, "That is the most ridiculous statement I have EVER heard."

The first conversation my FIL ever had with my dad had an awkward lull so my FIL blurts out, "I smoked marijuana when I was first in the service." Why would he say that? BECAUSE MY FATHER IS ORIGINALLY FROM MEXICO. Therefore must be hitting the bong like Chong. I wish you could have seen the look of confusion on my sweet dad's face. My father replied, ".... I think... we've all done things in our life that we regret." I'm actually laughing while I write this. When they're together it's like a movie mashup of Grumpy Old Men, Fools Rush In, and Deliverance. God help me. God help us all.

Thanks for listening and any support you give. It's really appreciated and needed.
 

Dee*Jay

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Mar 26, 2006
Messages
15,133
Oh... dear... god...

I don't even know where to begin.

Is there ANY chance you can get rid of your FIL? Seriously, can you say to your DH This Is Not Working and see if there's some other arrangement that can be made? Your FIL is 80 -- what about a retirement community? I know those things cost $, but is it workable? Can you somehow convince your FIL *he* would be happier elsewhere? Could you get your DH to support the idea of a move-out? Are there other siblings (to your DH) in the picture?

Hats off to you for having your heart in the right place and letting your FIL move in, but biggest hugs outgoing at this point. I can't really think of any other option aside from getting your FIL out of there that will preserve your homelife and sanity and there's only so much you can drink before you end up in Betty Ford yourself.
 

amc80

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jun 18, 2010
Messages
5,765
I don't care how old someone is or of what relation they are to you/your DH- if they are causing problems, they need to go. It's not fair to your family (and by that, I mean you, your DH, and your kids) to have this person there who is disrupting your lives. You gave it a try and it didn't work out. Time to move on to plan b.
 

JGator

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Nov 27, 2010
Messages
1,422
No Norman Rockwell, you are hilarious! I think you could write a novel about your FIL, and it would sell. I know it must be horrible, but I love your sense of humor. Please come out of lurkdom and post more! And, get your DH to kick the FIL out ASAP. That man is creepy!
 

junebug17

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jun 17, 2009
Messages
14,142
Why is your fil living with you? Does he have dementia, an illness, or is he disabled in any way? It is time to make other living arrangements for your FIL. You cannot continue living like this, it isn't fair to you or your family.
 

mayerling

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Mar 4, 2010
Messages
2,357
Sorry, I don't have any suggestions, but maybe you could post this to Hangout instead? More PSers read it and you might get more helpful advice.
 

lliang_chi

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Mar 13, 2008
Messages
3,740
Wow. Your FIL is unbelievable. It sounds like it's time for a Come to Jesus discussion with your DH about FIL. I'm making some assumptions, but to me, it sounds like FIL moved in with you guys after his wife's passing. He seems like a completely healthy capable adult, so I suggest a retirement community where he can continue to be independent and out of your roof. If financing is an issue you could look into less expensive retirement communitites that are rentals so your FIL can hopefully afford it
 

no_normanrockwell

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jul 8, 2014
Messages
8
Thank you all so much for coming to my pity party! Wait till you see what your parting gift is. It's just nice to unload sometimes, ya know. Your replies made me laugh out loud and feel heard- that's all I really needed.

lliang_chi, You are correct! He and MIL left a very nice retirement community in another state to be closer to us. They had their own apartment while we planned to build a small cottage on our property for them. She passed away when they broke ground. We were so devastated that I decided to stop construction and cover it with sod until we finished mourning. I'll never forget how happy she was when I would bring over tiles, paint colors, and wood samples to look at together. It's a very special memory for me.

Dee*Jay, Oh... dear... god... You said it, sister. Husband is an only child. I've discussed FIL leaving our home but my husband feels so guilty. He said he can't throw his father out like he's garbage, especially now that his mother is gone. Money is not an issue for my FIL to live in a retirement community or anywhere else. :dance: I can always hold out hope that he'll get sick of me and the way we run our home. (I occasionally rescue and rehabilitate strays whenever they find me, I chase my kids running and playing inside the house with them, I'm blessed to not have to work but still have a cleaning lady, and am in general a casual person who likes to drink wine. A lot of wine. My husband loves me- flaws, fleas, and all. Btw, Your pup looks a lot like an old girl I've just rescued!

amc80, I'm hoping and praying that he'll visit his widowed sister and decide to stay with her... But I actually like her, so :wink2:

JGator, You don't know the half of it. Glad you can laugh with me at this wreck of a living arrangement. Today he said that he didn't think he could live here anymore because of dust and pollen. He just keeps dangling that carrot, doesn't he. I think I will start posting more, thanks! I just received a new piece of jewelry so that can be my next post.

Mayerling, you girls gave me great support and suggestions.

Junebug17, I agree. It isn't fair to anyone in this house. All kidding aside, I keep coming back to that. It's not even fair to FIL... I'm sure this isn't how he wanted to spend his last years. So why does he stay? I think it's because he's afraid to be alone. Maybe for him, being in our madhouse is better than wasting away into oblivion.
 

Dee*Jay

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Mar 26, 2006
Messages
15,133
Honey, put down the keyboard and pick up the phone! Call the excavator back out and get on with digging the hole for the foundation for your FIL's new cottage!

Yes, I'm being flip. And yes, I respect the mourning for your MIL (my condolences on her passing). But you and your family need to live in the here and now if you're going to get back to a harmonious life.

Saw whatever you need too to get this process rolling. Say you've realized the cottage could be a tribute to you MIL and incorporate all the choices she made up to her passing. Say anything. But say it now!
 

junebug17

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jun 17, 2009
Messages
14,142
I sympathize with the situation BNN, the loss of his wife sounds like it was tough on everyone and I guess your fil is having a hard time dealing with the changes in his life, but he also sounds very difficult and so hard to live with that I just can't see this situation going on indefinitely! Nobody sounds happy…Something has to give. This is a long term arrangement and I just think things have to get to a more managable level for everyone. Caring for elderly parents presents challenges but it shouldn't be this hard right now!

I'm with Dee jay, I think it's time to revisit the cottage idea - or maybe a small apartment in the area? Or an addition onto your house. Or a serious talk with him where you set boundaries and let him know how his behavior is affecting everybody. (not sure this will work though )

Was he always this abrasive and difficult? I can't shake the feeling there's more going on such as dementia, but that's purely a guess.
 

partgypsy

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Nov 7, 2004
Messages
6,628
But seriously sounds like your FIL has a personality disorder or something affecting his cognition (preservation, lack of inhibition in his statements). Depression can manifest differently in the elderly. My Dad is 82 but he doesn't act that way. I'm not a medical professional.

If money is no object, why not continue with the cottage plan? He won't be alone, but he won't be living in your house (no key for him - he has to call on cell phone to be let in)
 

Cluless

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
May 14, 2011
Messages
1,061
It's not even fair to FIL... I'm sure this isn't how he wanted to spend his last years. So why does he stay? I think it's because he's afraid to be alone. Maybe for him, being in our madhouse is better than wasting away into oblivion.

Norma, you're a good woman I want to give you a great big hug, feel free to come here and vent whenever you feel the need. Please post more stories of fil and your dad I'm sure they are very entertaining.

I agree with some posters his behavior may be an indication of some type of dementia, my fil had similar behaviour turned out he had Lewy body dementia until he was diagnosed we all thought he was just being an a$$ lol.
 

Tourmaline

Ideal_Rock
Trade
Joined
Nov 17, 2013
Messages
2,560
Holy crap! You need him out of your house. Hugs.
 

no_normanrockwell

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jul 8, 2014
Messages
8
Building the cottage would be a great plan, but now that his wife's gone and he's already moved into our home, he's not willing financially help with the cottage. That's already been explored as an option. I'm sure if we completely funded the project he'd be happy to move in, but we're not willing to lose more money on that project. My husband, father, and I own some property 25 minutes outside the city, so I had considered selling our house and building a new house for us and a cottage for him. The truth is, we're very comfortable in our current house and location. Our daughter's go to school a stone's throw from here and my husband has no highway commute from our front door to his office. We're just not willing to uproot our entire family in order for him to have a little casita in our backyard.

But here's some good news! or maybe not. My dad will be visiting us in August. :twirl:

I've been thinking the suggestion of dementia playing a role in his behavior. He's always been a bit of an odd bird now that I think about it. I feel that I can let go of the anger and resentment I'm feeling toward him if that's the case. If not, I'll go full metal jacket on him. just kidding, i'll probably just drink more.
 

Clairitek

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jul 21, 2008
Messages
4,881
I don't really have any advice but I wanted to offer full access to my wine collection and an ear to bend. Jesus. I'm pretty much speechless at his behavior. I'm so sorry you have to deal with this.
 

junebug17

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jun 17, 2009
Messages
14,142
Ah ok, I understand the situation - I'm sorry you're dealing with this, and I'm hoping that in time he'll get used to his new surroundings, adjust to his new life, and settle the heck down! In the meantime, keep yourself well stocked! :Up_to_something:
1899449huiscpgoci.gif
 

canuk-gal

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Apr 19, 2004
Messages
25,731
HI:

Any chance your FIL would like a glass or two? JK, of course. :lol:

Is it possible to enroll your FIL in day programs for Seniors? Play cards? Visit other seniors in retirement communities--those who are not able to get out but need a good chat? What networks can you investigate relating to appropriate age activities for him--perhaps you would find other seniors willing to pick him up and take him along. Community center might be a start--or programs at local medical facilities.

Does your FIL have a GP who might make referrals as needed? In addition, perhaps your GP could be called upon to make Geriatric assessment to assess behavior as needed. (Perhaps, too, the GP is the gatekeeper to Geriatric programs.)

My thinking is if your FIL is otherwise engaged he might not insert himself 24/7. And he might enjoy it!!!

BTW, I give you and your family a lot of credit for caregiving.

cheers--Sharon
 

junebug17

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jun 17, 2009
Messages
14,142
canuk-gal|1405286866|3712654 said:
HI:

Any chance your FIL would like a glass or two? JK, of course. :lol:

Is it possible to enroll your FIL in day programs for Seniors? Play cards? Visit other seniors in retirement communities--those who are not able to get out but need a good chat? What networks can you investigate relating to appropriate age activities for him--perhaps you would find other seniors willing to pick him up and take him along. Community center might be a start--or programs at local medical facilities.

Does your FIL have a GP who might make referrals as needed? In addition, perhaps your GP could be called upon to make Geriatric assessment to assess behavior as needed. (Perhaps, too, the GP is the gatekeeper to Geriatric programs.)

My thinking is if your FIL is otherwise engaged he might not insert himself 24/7. And he might enjoy it!!!

BTW, I give you and your family a lot of credit for caregiving.

cheers--Sharon

Sharon, you made some really good points - maybe he's bored and needs something to do - also a chance for him to possibly make a few friends. My mother belonged to a town-run seniors group and they had meetings, get-togethers, and trips.
 

gem_anemone

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Jun 21, 2011
Messages
682
Our rule in our house is that if they don't come from my uterus they are not welcome to live in our home. Plain and simple. I hope you can find a way to get rid of your FIL. Many sympathies!!
 

no_normanrockwell

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jul 8, 2014
Messages
8
Wonderful suggestions, ladies! You've all been a Godsend.

Husband and I had a long talk. Several, actually. I explained in a loving way that his father's behavior is NOT acceptable. Period. If I have to confront FIL, ladies, THAT will make for a good post. I'm half, Mexican, half German- I can summon the burning fire of a thousand suns.

I told husband that he has to step up and make appointments with a doctor for FIL's behavior. We also agreed that his father has to decide where he really wants to be, because I really don't believe it's here. PLEASE let it not be here. I believe that if FIL could make this decision for himself, he would regain his autonomy and find some peace. Or maybe just a mood stabilizer slipped in his dinner would be good. Either way, should be some interesting discussions with him. Stay tuned.

:wavey:
 

hippi_pixi

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Nov 25, 2010
Messages
639
gem_anemone|1405432577|3713604 said:
Our rule in our house is that if they don't come from my uterus they are not welcome to live in our home. Plain and simple. I hope you can find a way to get rid of your FIL. Many sympathies!!

so where does our husband live?


:razz:

nonormanrockwell your situation is my worst nightmare. I'm from a culture where old people live in retirement homes and my husband is from a culture where old people live with their younger family. and the women in his family live a really really really long time. all i can do is cross my fingers. I'm with Gem anemone, I could only live with partners and offspring.

while i have nothing helpful to add it seems like your post has given you a release and the confidence to stand up for yourself. good on you
 

gem_anemone

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Jun 21, 2011
Messages
682
hippi_pixi|1405946164|3717512 said:
gem_anemone|1405432577|3713604 said:
Our rule in our house is that if they don't come from my uterus they are not welcome to live in our home. Plain and simple. I hope you can find a way to get rid of your FIL. Many sympathies!!

so where does our husband live?


:razz:

nonormanrockwell your situation is my worst nightmare. I'm from a culture where old people live in retirement homes and my husband is from a culture where old people live with their younger family. and the women in his family live a really really really long time. all i can do is cross my fingers. I'm with Gem anemone, I could only live with partners and offspring.

while i have nothing helpful to add it seems like your post has given you a release and the confidence to stand up for yourself. good on you
I guess if you're the one who put the children in my uterus you can stay too! :cheeky:
 
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