SuperIdeals - some better than others?

[OoohShiny]

Hi all

My apologies for asking what has probably been asked a lot before now but I had a search and could only really find SuperIdeal vs GIA ExExEx / AGS000 / lower cut type of threads!


I am attempting to heed the advice that Cut is King, and have already seen it with my own eyes the other week when I had a chance to look at some stones while in the city and an ExExVg sparkled more than the others but I am still a little hesitant regarding the SuperIdeal cuts, simply because they do command a premium, and it looks like one usually makes a trade off of one or two colour grades and/or one or two clarity grades for the SuperIdeal cut status (assuming similar prices and weights) although the SuperIdeal cut seems to be said to reflect so much light as to cancel out any drop in graded colour(?).

I mean, from what I've just read during my search (assuming I've not got the wrong end of the stick ) GIA tests seem to suggest they are impossible to identify apart from 'normal' well cut diamonds?? "GIA already said observers in their study could not tell the difference - AGS say the same thd I agree for what it is worth." (Garry H / Cut Nut - [URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/whats-the-difference-between-super-ideal-ideal.26216/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/whats-the-difference-between-super-ideal-ideal.26216/[/URL]) and I am sure I've also read on here that they are basically beyond ideal and, effectively, attempting to split up the top AGS and GIA grades into further layers.


I think I will be going ahead with a SuperIdeal, though, and have already got one or two in my targets with a recommended vendor but I thought I would just ask... Are some SuperIdeal stones more SuperIdeal than others?


In other words, would the following, and any others I've missed be able to be graded amongst themselves as some being definitely better in cut and some being not quite as good?

- WhiteFlash's A Cut Above line
- Good Old Gold's Hearts & Arrows / Ideal (Superior?) line (ignoring the Solasfera in this discussion)
- High Performance Diamond's Crafted by Infinity line
- Brian Gavin's Signature line
- James Allen's True Hearts line
- Victor Canera's Ideal Hearts line

I'm quite sure they will be all be great, if not equal, but you know how the saying goes - some things in life are more equal than others... lol


I appreciate all the help here, this place is amazingly helpful so any input is very much appreciated

 

[diamondgezer]

Hi

I think you may be in danger of raising your blood pressure over this!! Ha Ha!!1

If you start to split hairs as to whether THE STONES categorized as, for example, JA Truehearts are better (or worse) than Whiteflash ACA or BG Signature etc, I think the answer is a resounding NO in general!!!

However these guys are pretty astute businessmen and they are all trying to carve a niche and create differentiation for their business model and product.

The way they differentiate themselves will create appeal for some people. (This is just marketing) IMO there is no such thing as an 'uber-uber- superideal')

Rather you have a number (not necessarily limited to PS) of vendors who recognize the scientific definition of what are likely to be top of the line stones and actively seek out, verify and stock stones of such quality (very often for sound business reasons but also maybe, because of a passion for perfection)

At any point in time only a subset of these will have stones available to match a specific specification (eg 1.25ct, F, VS2, AGS0/GIA xxx, small table, high-ish crown angle) Oops sorry personal pref. coming through haha!!!

So time/place, aided, where possible, by a preference for a particular vendor will drive the purchasing decision, not the myth of a super-super ideal.

 

[luvdajules]

Hi OP, that short list of vendors u have seems a great place to start, there's plenty to see there. Many times, I've read, judge each stone and compare in person if you can. Obviously, this takes time and some money for shipping fees of returns. Maybe you can have a few shipped to a third party appraiser to view and consult with? That way, you may avoid some costs but add the appraiser fee (totally worth it)? I've only seen one Crafted by Infinity diamond and it blew me away! And I've seen many GIA triple X; its true what they say, that's too big of a category. It was also a K color, yikes! Still more gorgeous, lol. I'm planning to see others from the list you compiled, all in good time.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

I am totally confident in the top 4 as I have bought diamonds by two and have had a recut by one. Infinity is absolutely right up there with the best. With JA, I would evaluate each H&A stone individually. They also do not have as good an upgrade policy so you have to keep that in mind relative to price. Victor appears to have some nice stones and that could be a consideration if your setting is coming from him.

I have had a true H&A stone from GOG and one that fell into the GIAXXX/AGS0 area. I doubt anyone else could tell the difference. Both stones looked great and were fine diamonds. That is why those surveys showed what they did. But I could tell the difference because I had had a perfect stone before. So I am glad you are going for the best! No regrets that way!

 

[OoohShiny]

Many thanks for the kind advice, all, some good words of wisdom

I would love to get some delivered for inspection but I am in the UK and shipping is not cheap!

My budget is limited so it's looking like I can only go up to an F and maybe VVS2, but the comments regarding colour, even a K, offer comfort that the cut of any of the options listed would more than make up for it! I think I am just a little sceptical - you know, I need to have the physical object (whatever it is in question) in my hands before I will truly believe / appreciate the quality! Infinity seems to get such good comments (in this thread and others) it's almost too good to be true lol but if they are obviously stand-out better when among their peers 'in real life', that only adds to their attractiveness as an option

 

[arkieb1]

Purchasing a VVS2 if you are on a budget might be overkill. If you can get an eyeclean VS1 or even an eyeclean VS2 why pay more money for something that in reality you will never notice. As you have correctly identified the cut quality is the most important factor for determining fire and sparkle so.....

 

[Gypsy]

You do not need VVS clairty. Just go for VS2 and eyeclean.

 

[LLJsmom]

I too thought that the "superideal" would make the stone so sparkly that I wouldn't mind the color I saw, or would cause me NOT to see the color. I should say that I bought the Expert Selection stones from WF for a pair of studs, not their ACA line. I chose I VS2s for studs. However, when I wore them, I could see the warmth, and it just wasn't for me. My e-ring and upgrade are both F, so I was used to the kind of color coming off an F, and these looked different to me. So I ended up returning them.

Just so you know, I saw how sparkly and bright the stones were. They were beautiful indeed. They looked "white" in most types of lighting. But there were times when it definitely showed more warmth, at home, at night, in certain bathroom lighting. My e-ring did not show that kind of warmth. I do not prefer it. So I do also think it's a preference. I don't know if you'll notice, or if you'll care if you do. Just saying it's possible.

As for clarity, only you can decide how much clarity you want. Maybe you have mind-clean issues? I don't dispute that you won't be able to tell the difference without magnification, and sometimes not even then easily. And since you have a budget, you will need to prioritize what is most important to you. Maybe clarity will be toward the bottom. I'm just saying that each person can have their own list of priorities, which may not be in line with what most PSers want.

 

[OoohShiny]

Thank you all for the replies

I take the point re: VVS2 v VS2 - as mentioned, I think it is a case of 'mind clean' issues The two I'm looking at at the moment straddle a boundary so price per ct seems to jump a little, but the smaller diamond looks like it has tiny pinpoints under the edge of the table (and a feather that I can't see in the 'normal' pictures but can just detect on the ASET, I think) whereas the other diamond does not have either, so I am torn between sticking with the smaller, cheaper stone or stretching budget by another $1k for a potentially marginally cleaner stone that's difficult to detect without a loupe, that is about 0.06 carats extra and maybe +0.15mm spread...

I think diamondgeezer hit the nail on the head:

At any point in time only a subset of these will have stones available to match a specific specification ... So time/place, aided, where possible, by a preference for a particular vendor will drive the purchasing decision, not the myth of a super-super ideal.

I have a few months before I have to ask the big question so I'm not in a super-hurry but, equally, I don't want to miss out on the (relatively) cheap stone I've seen, so I may have to go for it and then do a swap if something comes to market before I ask the question! The vendor I've been working with does not have any other stones in a similar size/colour but lower clarity (such as VS2) at the moment so if I secure the stone I've seen now I could always up the colour/size but drop clarity later via their excellent upgrade program

Decisions!


Thank you very much for your comments re: the offsetting of colour against SuperIdeal cut, LLJsmom, that's really helped settle my mind whether an F would be colourless enough as, personally, I think I seem to notice colour more from G onwards so am reluctant to go lower in colour than an F, even with a SuperIdeal cut I think I may even prefer an E if I can afford it / can find a suitable stone, but I refer you to my thoughts above! (Fussy, me? )

This would be a lot easier with a bigger budget and a girlfriend who liked bigger stones as there seems to be a lot more choice as you get bigger, and I could even request a custom order for a SuperIdeal that hit all my idealised 4Cs if I was rich... lol

 

[SandyinAnaheim]

OooohShiny, six months ago I started doing the same hunting you're doing now. I started off wanting a GIA XXX D VVS2 or better. I encountered difficulties finding a perfectly cut GIA XXX. I bought a 1.5 ct I VVS1 GIA XXX and it was grey in most lighting situations. Then I set out to learn why this GIA rating did not equal a beautiful stone. You will see a lot of comments about "cut being king" on this site because it is true. After extensive research both online and numerous jaunts to local vendors, I luckily found High Performance Diamonds, who sells the Crafted by Infinity stones.

When I received my diamond rings from Wink, it made me feel as if I had never seen a well-cut diamond ever before. The difference is so obvious once seen, yet so hard to describe. I've seen more expensive stones, higher colored stones, higher HCA rated stones, branded stones, but the moment my fiancé and I laid eyes on my CBI - we instantly recognized its vast superiority to anything we had ever seen in person before. The blinding sparkle, fire, reflection, luster and abundant scintillation has no comparison.

The precision of the CBIs cut makes a world of difference. In every other diamond I have seen and actually own, the facets of the crown themselves are not clearly distinguishable; not so on the CBI. The facets near the girdle are pure precision and moving the stone almost imperceptibly makes the most dazzling light show! Its beauty is almost unearthly and I spend a LOT of time gazing into it to watch the kaleidoscope play of color and light. I will never buy another significant stone from anyone other than CBI because the quality of their product is incomparable and without equal as far as I have seen. As in most things, you get what you pay for, but in this case, my expectations were blown away and I got better than I hoped for.

I chose a 1.21 ct G VS1 AGS0 and am over the moon with it. I get comments on it every day, everywhere I go, so I KNOW I'm not the only one who thinks it's amazing. I know I have "mind clean" issues so I asked Wink to get me the cleanest highest colored stone within my size and price range and he did. My VS1 has a miniscule clear feather on the pavilion and that is the only thing keeping it from being an IF. There are some super clean VS1 and 2s, and some not so clean ones. I've been in other stores after buying it to compare it to higher colored stones just for fun, and my CBI is whiter and brighter than Es and Fs that I've compared it to, because of the cut.

There's a recent post on here from someone that was blown away by a K CBI they saw - brighter and whiter than everything else in the store if I remember correctly. You would do well to give them some serious consideration.

 

[TC1987]

Yes. If you are able to inspect several side by side, you may find you prefer one over the others. Even if both have ideal light reflecting performance, the differences in contrast patterns or minor faceting can change the personality of the stone in some subtle way. In a H&A stone, I like small table, taller crown w/ steep crown angle, fat arrows and strong contrast patterns.

Other people may prefer a different facet pattern, like a Solasfera or Star129 better. Or an August Vintage round.

 

[OoohShiny]

As I am in the UK I fear a side-by-side comparison is never going to happen! I have been looking at YouTube for videos of H&A / Solasfera / etc comparisons and I like the Solasfera but, if I understand it correctly, the smaller facets will mean more white light return rather than fire/colours? I think I prefer fire over white light, plus I like the 'chunkier', perhaps more 'architectural' H&A cut, I think?? The vintage cuts don't quite have enough sparkle for me, I reckon, but, again, these are the musings of a noob behind a screen lol


Sandy, thanks for posting about your real life experiences I'm not surprised people ask about your rings, they are stunning!

I found that thread discussing the K CBI stone:
[URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/saw-a-crafted-by-infinity-diamond-wow.200983/#post-3658293']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/saw-a-crafted-by-infinity-diamond-wow.200983/#post-3658293[/URL]
It does seem as though SuperIdeal cut can offset colour a bit, which is good to know Hopefully if I go for an F colour CBI I would never feel the need to upgrade!

 

[MarionC]

When I received my diamond rings from Wink, it made me feel as if I had never seen a well-cut diamond ever before. The difference is so obvious once seen, yet so hard to describe. I've seen more expensive stones, higher colored stones, higher HCA rated stones, branded stones, but the moment my fiancé and I laid eyes on my CBI - we instantly recognized its vast superiority to anything we had ever seen in person before. The blinding sparkle, fire, reflection, luster and abundant scintillation has no comparison.

I love that you say it can't be described. I agree...For me there is this shimmer which seems to make the diamond float.
My favorite comment came from a friend, who when we were out to dinner looked over at my ring, stopped eating, and said "what IS that?!"

So as not to get technical, I just told her it was a really clean diamond and the following week she brought her rings over so I could clean them.

 

[SandyinAnaheim]

Sandy, thanks for posting about your real life experiences I'm not surprised people ask about your rings, they are stunning!

I found that thread discussing the K CBI stone: [URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/saw-a-crafted-by-infinity-diamond-wow.200983/#post-3658293']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/saw-a-crafted-by-infinity-diamond-wow.200983/#post-3658293[/URL]
It does seem as though SuperIdeal cut can offset colour a bit, which is good to know Hopefully if I go for an F colour CBI I would never feel the need to upgrade!

You may never want to upgrade the color, but maybe the size someday HPD has an excellent upgrade policy, so you can't lose out.

I found the cut offset the color a good deal. Face up next to an average cut E, my CBI looks like a halogen bulb next to a candle. I'm sure it wouldn't hold up to an E cut by CBI though

I appreciate that you're across the pond, but most of the vendors here ship internationally and have generous return policies if you're not thrilled. And I certainly understand your reticence. I'm here in the US and I purchased my stone sight unseen, and had my rings designed with nothing more than emails and a few phone calls, just like you. Outside of a house or a car, this is the biggest purchase I've ever made and it was scary all the way till we opened the box. All of the fear and trepidation melted away under the sheer magnificence of the little piece of a blinding star captured in a ring for me, that I can't believe I possess.

I love that you say it can't be described. I agree...For me there is this shimmer which seems to make the diamond float. My favorite comment came from a friend, who when we were out to dinner looked over at my ring, stopped eating, and said "what IS that?!"

I agree. I'm rather articulate but cannot find the words to differentiate between other lovely diamonds and the exceptional pleasure my eyes experience when looking at mine. I find that I had never noticed star facets before really - but on my stone they are so brilliant and pronounced, and reflect everything around me, that I'm entranced for minutes at a time watching the light play in my ring. That stone changes personality every day depending on what I'm wearing. None of my other stones do that. There are so many nuances to it, which is why I say it is so hard to describe. I'm constantly awed by it.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

It would be an error to say that one of those top 4 has better cut than the others. All of their H&A lines are exceptional.

 

[MarionC]

It would be an error to say that one of those top 4 has better cut than the others. All of their H&A lines are exceptional.

This helps a perfectionist to not be "2nd guessing" her choice!

 

[pyramid]

I don't agree with the Cut is King, I do like super ideal and bought one but I would also buy VG cuts and have seen some with my eyes that look just as good. I was actually starting to wonder if these bad cuts are just in America and in the UK cut is not bad, there again we have smaller diamonds.

A clarity grade of vvs1 may be overkill but in my opinion so can a Super Ideal Cut be.

It is up to each buyer to decide what is important to THEM, because if this site disappears some day like others have, then Super Ideal Cut will only mean something to you. Other people don't know about it and don't care either. A diamond is a diamond they think.
Having said that I am intending to buy a three stone ring and will go for ideal cut again but if I see one before then in the uk I like I may just buy it. We don't hear of super ideal cut over here. There are some brands like Leo Schachtner (sp?) or hearts on fire but never here anyone speak of them.

Put the four C's in order of your preference, that used to be the way they taught people.

The standard used to be Cut, Color, Clarity and then the result gives you carat weight you can afford.

I believe this meant not a bad cut, but you can usually see that with your eyes. A dark diamond or one that doesn't sparkle much
when compared to others.

Everything is judged under the magnifying glass now and I think computers have something to do with that with their gigantic pictures.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

It would be an error to say that one of those top 4 has better cut than the others. All of their H&A lines are exceptional.

This helps a perfectionist to not be "2nd guessing" her choice!

I am the same...true H&A stones are a tiny percentage of all diamonds, and we are extremely fortunate to have multiple vendors who offer them! All 6 of the vendors named offer them. I just like the policies of some better than others...like 100% upgrade policy with no restrictions.

 

[pyramid]

Some people think they are lucky to avoid vendors of super ideal cuts as they have more money left after the purchase.
Can you tell on a strangers hand if they have a hearts and arrows stone or a well cut 'normal' stone?.

There was a vendor on here once who called 'hearts on fire' diamonds 'wallets on fire' diamonds.

To each his own as they say.

A well cut stone is more popular that is why there are more of them in the world, if hearts and arrows became more in demand there would be more of them cut to make more money.

 

[SandyinAnaheim]

Can you tell on a strangers hand if they have a hearts and arrows stone or a well cut 'normal' stone?

Absolutely! Once you see what perfection looks like, everything else looks dimmer by comparison! A perfect cut has hearts and arrows because it is perfectly cut, it is a byproduct of the perfect symmetry of the cutting of the facets in relation to each other. How perfect those hearts and arrows are is indicative of the quality of cut. Stones that aren't true H&A but are well cut are beautiful too, there's no denying that. But a perfectly cut stone is in a category by itself, in my opinion. My CBI stone is like a flashlight on my hand! I have other well cut stones set in beautiful rings and they are not anywhere near as glowing as my CBI. There's no question that once you've seen it you can tell the difference. It's like we say in the legal field, you can't unring the bell. Which means you cannot unhear what you heard and you cannot unsee what you saw. In this case, you can't unknow what you know and saw.

For many people, once you experience the quality of certain things, it's hard to settle for something lesser than, especially if one can afford it. I drive a Cadillac and have had 5 Cadillacs in a row. I rent cars when I travel and BOY am I happy when I get back to my Cadillac. It's the same for so many things in life. Do you want the dollar store detergent or the detergent that costs more and really cleans your clothes and leaves them soft and smelling fresh? Do you want a ribeye steak or a chuck roast? Do you want to stay in a decent hotel or a cheap one that might have bedbugs? I certainly know of people who don't care about those things and just want to save money - I have those in my family. It all comes down to what's important to the individual, saving the money or having the quality. Different things make different people happy. But it's lovely when you can find excellent quality for a good price that satisfies both desires.

A well cut stone is more popular that is why there are more of them in the world, if hearts and arrows became more in demand there would be more of them cut to make more money.

I don't agree with this at all. H&A and the quality it implies is in demand among discerning consumers. The problem is, it takes a LOT of time and energy to learn about diamonds and become self-educated on the subject, not everyone wants to invest their attention to learning this stuff. And there are a great many vendors with sub-standard products ready to prey on the unsuspecting.

H&A stones cost more because they take much longer to produce. Time is money, as in everything in life. It takes more time to map, cut and polish with absolute precision than it does to mass produce something, hence the superior quality and additional cost. Certain cutters have retention of carat weight as their primary goal, and others have perfection of cut as their goal, and one can DEFINITELY see the difference between the two.

 

[MarionC]

I don't think the following has been mentioned here:
The super-ideal cut stones have great light performance in every lighting situation. The cut falls in a category where brilliance, scintillation and fire are balanced.
Other diamonds may have lots of fire, but less scintillation, or will be very sparkly, but don't throw off color flashes etc., etc.
The super-ideals are always "on".

 

[SandyinAnaheim]

I don't think the following has been mentioned here: The super-ideal cut stones have great light performance in every lighting situation. The cut falls in a category where brilliance, scintillation and fire are balanced. Other diamonds may have lots of fire, but less scintillation, or will be very sparkly, but don't throw off color flashes etc., etc.
The super-ideals are always "on".

Exactly. Well put.

 

[pyramid]

Hearts and Arrows may be in demand in the USA but are unheard of in the UK. I bought one but only because I had seen them on this board and the previous one I frequented.

Diamonds in the UK are usually about half carat, 1 carat is large and most people would rather put money in property, car or fashion than diamonds. The promise rings in the USA are more the size of most engagement rings in the UK.

As I said, I love my Super Ideal Cut H&A but would buy a VG cut diamond too as I do not believe anyone but me would know the difference. VG cut diamonds are still beautiful and I have ones that are well cut but are not even certified which show off losts of Fire and Sparkle, not sure about Scintillation but there is some there.

In my opinion a Super Ideal Cut is top of the Cut C in the same way a D is top of Color, A Flawless top of Clarity and a 4 Carat is a big diamond. I feel the Cut C should be balanced by the buyer in the same way the others are. A happy medium is good in all things unless you can afford the best in all 4 Cs. I don't think ideal cut does camouflage colour below an H color either. It looks better on a L color say but it still does not look like a G color. All in my opinion ofcourse. Everyone should choose their own diamond by their own standards.

 

[OoohShiny]

And there are a great many vendors with sub-standard products ready to prey on the unsuspecting.

H&A stones cost more because they take much longer to produce. Time is money, as in everything in life. It takes more time to map, cut and polish with absolute precision than it does to mass produce something, hence the superior quality and additional cost. Certain cutters have retention of carat weight as their primary goal, and others have perfection of cut as their goal, and one can DEFINITELY see the difference between the two.

I think we mustn't forget that some dealers will get 'stuck' with stones that are of a quality they don't want, assuming they are buying bulk diamonds with no possibility of selecting only the best out of a tray, if my understanding is correct(?) and also that some people just want to be able to say "I have an X carat diamond", even if it looks like something a piece of broken glass found on the floor and mounted into a ring... so in a supply and demand, free market, I am not surprised that some vendors do charge high amounts for stones that are nowhere near as good as H&A / SuperIdeal quality and that the 'educated' buyer would not touch - it is because they can, because the market can bear it. Is it morally wrong? Very probably, but then is it any different to the MASSIVE markups that are in any product with a well known 'designer' label on it??

All IMHO, of course

 

[OoohShiny]

I don't agree with the Cut is King, I do like super ideal and bought one but I would also buy VG cuts and have seen some with my eyes that look just as good. I was actually starting to wonder if these bad cuts are just in America and in the UK cut is not bad, there again we have smaller diamonds.

A clarity grade of vvs1 may be overkill but in my opinion so can a Super Ideal Cut be.

It is up to each buyer to decide what is important to THEM, because if this site disappears some day like others have, then Super Ideal Cut will only mean something to you. Other people don't know about it and don't care either. A diamond is a diamond they think.
Having said that I am intending to buy a three stone ring and will go for ideal cut again but if I see one before then in the uk I like I may just buy it. We don't hear of super ideal cut over here. There are some brands like Leo Schachtner (sp?) or hearts on fire but never here anyone speak of them.

Put the four C's in order of your preference, that used to be the way they taught people.

The standard used to be Cut, Color, Clarity and then the result gives you carat weight you can afford.

I believe this meant not a bad cut, but you can usually see that with your eyes. A dark diamond or one that doesn't sparkle much
when compared to others.

Everything is judged under the magnifying glass now and I think computers have something to do with that with their gigantic pictures.

I do hear what you are saying about SuperIdeal being a term known here but not elsewhere A case in point is the blank and somewhat bemused look on the face of an assistant at one of the stores I visited recently when I mentioned AGS and how they may be better than GIA for Cut grading!

I have seen a couple of stones that were nice and sparkly under LED lighting but I'm intrigued to know just how much better a CBI or other SuperIdeal / H&A can be - part of my hesitance as a noob is because of the fact that 'degrees of Excellent/Ideal', as represented in the SuperIdeal cuts, would not be picked up in a GIA report and therefore be of limited value in the secondhand market (or the worst-case-scenario insurance-replacement-argument situation ) but then I guess an ERing is supposed to be for life so does it really matter, as long as the stone in question has all the good qualities and looks that the owner desires? And in the worst case scenario of wishing/needing to sell it or wishing to upgrade to a better quality or larger, more expensive stone, the good buyback values and upgrade policies offered by the vendors are a great insurance policy

Hearts and Arrows may be in demand in the USA but are unheard of in the UK. I bought one but only because I had seen them on this board and the previous one I frequented.

Diamonds in the UK are usually about half carat, 1 carat is large and most people would rather put money in property, car or fashion than diamonds. The promise rings in the USA are more the size of most engagement rings in the UK.

As I said, I love my Super Ideal Cut H&A but would buy a VG cut diamond too as I do not believe anyone but me would know the difference. VG cut diamonds are still beautiful and I have ones that are well cut but are not even certified which show off losts of Fire and Sparkle, not sure about Scintillation but there is some there.

In my opinion a Super Ideal Cut is top of the Cut C in the same way a D is top of Color, A Flawless top of Clarity and a 4 Carat is a big diamond. I feel the Cut C should be balanced by the buyer in the same way the others are. A happy medium is good in all things unless you can afford the best in all 4 Cs. I don't think ideal cut does camouflage colour below an H color either. It looks better on a L color say but it still does not look like a G color. All in my opinion ofcourse. Everyone should choose their own diamond by their own standards.

I agree with all your observations about the UK and that we as individuals all have individual preferences and tolerances of colour/clarity, so it is good that there is such a large range of stones available, going all the way up to SuperIdeal cuts, as it means we are not all scrabbling for the same stones and there is variety in the market - I wonder what would happen to the market and pricing if all stones were cut to SuperIdeal!

'Mind Clean' versus Real Life observations can definitely be different (as can, seemingly, VG/Ex/AGS000 cuts' ASETS vs Real Life), I can't deny that lol, I think I am just someone who wants to have the confidence that I can't buy better as, if I can, I'll always be wondering 'what if...'


So, for me, budget restrictions appear to be limiting me to an F colour and VVS clarity and a mid-size (for the UK) when balancing the gradings of each of those three Cs but attempting to get the best I can in each (bar size, where the other half is not a big jewellery fan, fortunately for my wallet), and if I can secure a 'SuperIdeal' cut with a great upgrade policy, I need not worry about changing my mind or losing money if I want to swap to a different stone with upgrades to the three other Cs


Thanks for everyone's replies on this thread, especially those owners who can compare with other stones they have, it has been very useful! Now we just need some 'real life' pics of these SuperIdeal stones mentioned in my opening post - you know, so we have some reference points... (and not just because we like eye candy lol)

 

[OoohShiny]

I don't think the following has been mentioned here:
The super-ideal cut stones have great light performance in every lighting situation. The cut falls in a category where brilliance, scintillation and fire are balanced.
Other diamonds may have lots of fire, but less scintillation, or will be very sparkly, but don't throw off color flashes etc., etc.
The super-ideals are always "on".

This is a great little summary of the benefits, thank you

 

[Daisyoz]

Hi OhhShiny,

I own a G VS1 ACA diamond. I made a thread about it last year. You can see photos of my diamond under different lighting conditions in my thread.

We went through the same considerations you have with purchasing a Superideal H and A diamond. Before that we were looking at Bluenile. I dont think here in Autralia they are very popular either. In fact the appraiser we took the ring to while knowing that AGS certificates are better than GIA (in his own words calling AGS the best certificate in the world) didnt even know our diamond is HnA and paid no attention to the A Cut Above brand on the certificate or even got curious about it. The appraisal only mentioned the diamond colour, clarity, weight and that it is of excellent cut. That's all. Are we bothered by that? Not one bit. We know what it is, we know how gorgeous it looks. My husband never once regrets paying the premium for it. He frequently takes secret pride in the fact it is so sparkly, so shimmering, so firey, more so than his sister in law's D VVS1 Bluenile Signature Ideal diamond. My colleagues even now would spontaneously exclaim how sparkly and beautiful the diamond is under different lightings in the office. It is just constantly beautiful and dynamic. I dont have anything else to compare it with. I own two other diamonds with unknown specs, though they are quite sparkly themselves, they can't compare to the ACA.

I dont know how my hubby justified biting the bullet to pay a few grants more for the ACA (besides that he wanted to give me what I want ). I know the reason I let him do it was because I wanted to see the best of the best and it is within his budget. I could have had an F VS1 AGS000 ( i dont care for higher clarity) even E VS1 triple X in the same size but I chose a G ACA (and for all it is worth I wouldnt have seen the difference). Yes the diamond is not appreciated fully here but we dont care. Everyday we enjoy its beauty and know we re seeing exceptional craftsmanship. To us it is a symbol of marriage, which is made out of beautiful material that is our love, but only great care, labour and hard work will make it release fully its inner glorious beauty.

 

[OoohShiny]

Thank you for your input, Daisy, I found your thread and your ring looks lovely!


I think what your post has helped highlight in my mind is that it doesn't really matter if others don't appreciate all the finer details of the better cut, it makes you happy and others get the benefits because they get to see how good it looks in all situations, even if they don't understand why!