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sweetliloldme

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After some consideration, I relized that all of you were right. I decided that a big wedding wasn''t really that important to me, and just being his wife was sufficient enough. We were getting a couple thousand more dollars on our income tax return that we originally expected to so I suggested that we use it to get married. I figured that we could fly somewhere and have a beautiful, low key, inexpensive wedding on a beach somewhere. Well, he said that to do that it would be more than a couple of thousand dollars. Instead, he booked a trip to Disney World. So I figured that he did that because it was one of my favorite places, and that he would propose or something. We got back yesterday, NOTHING happened. After everything was said and done we spend more than the couple thousand anyway. Should I be upset? Now I feel that I am making comprimises, and he is still giving excuses.
 

Guilty Pleasure

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Either he is not ready to marry you or he is financially stupid.

The reason I say that is that if you want to get married but don''t have quite enough money, a good finaincial decision would be to save the money you do have and be well on your way to accomplishing your goal of marriage. The financially stupd thing would be to spend the entire sum of money and take yourself back down to zero, further away from your goal.


So either he doesn''t see the wedding as a short-term goal and didn''t need to save the money, or he doesn''t know how to be smart with money. Either option is not a good thing. I''m sorry he let you down, but at least you had a great trip to Disney!
 

sweetliloldme

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Your right there is a bright side, we did have a great time. But the some of the time I couldn''t help thinking that we should be getting married, or the money should be sitting in the bank (like you said to save, because I suggested that also.)
 

LaraOnline

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Date: 4/22/2009 10:15:26 AM
Author:sweetliloldme
so I suggested that we use it to get married. I figured that we could fly somewhere and have a beautiful, low key, inexpensive wedding on a beach somewhere. Well, he said that to do that it would be more than a couple of thousand dollars. Instead, he booked a trip to Disney World.
I'm wondering how clear you were in your negotiation ...? Did you interact with him and provide the information he needs to be clear on what your priorities were? I agree that it was pretty silly to waste the money on a trip when you were hoping to put the money towards your wedding!
But, if you made a suggestion, it fell on deaf ears, he says 'Nah honey, let's go to Disneyland' and you say 'OK'...well...perhaps you need to consider some communication training, like a course on negotiation....?
Do you think he is going to finally 'reward' you for your 'good behaviour' if you do everything he wants all the time, and enable his silly choices?

To make a generalisation, in pre-marriage land I found such behaviour allowed me only to be taken advantage of...

I have experienced this 'enabling behaviour / buckpassing backfire' in post-marriage land as well...
About a year ago, I let my husband buy a really crappy business, right when all our hard work on our first business was beginning to pay off. I thought his idea was incredibly stupid and wasteful, all the alarm bells were ringing, but I couldn't get him to discuss it rationally - every time I raised an objection he got incredibly *rssy....
Guess who's regretting his rash actions now!!

And guess who's payng for it?! Both of us.
I shouldn't have let him bully me into agreeing.
At the end of the day I guess I thought it would give me brownie points because I would have been the wicked witch of the west not to agree...

At least now he (and I!!!) have learned our lesson... the hard way.
 

lucyandroger

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Date: 4/22/2009 10:15:26 AM
Author:sweetliloldme
After some consideration, I relized that all of you were right. I decided that a big wedding wasn''t really that important to me, and just being his wife was sufficient enough. We were getting a couple thousand more dollars on our income tax return that we originally expected to so I suggested that we use it to get married. I figured that we could fly somewhere and have a beautiful, low key, inexpensive wedding on a beach somewhere. Well, he said that to do that it would be more than a couple of thousand dollars. Instead, he booked a trip to Disney World. So I figured that he did that because it was one of my favorite places, and that he would propose or something. We got back yesterday, NOTHING happened. After everything was said and done we spend more than the couple thousand anyway. Should I be upset? Now I feel that I am making comprimises, and he is still giving excuses.
Sweetliloldme,

I''m sorry that you''re feeling so down but I really think you need to take control back over your own life.

The highlighted part of your post really struck me. Why did you just let him declare how much the beach wedding would have cost? Why was he able to just book your Disney trip? Did you agree to it? Why is he making all the decisions?????

I''m sorry but your SO seems to be extremely irresponsible with money and doesn''t seem to mind that he''s setting your wedding goals back several steps. I think he''s quite happy with things the way they are and figured he could placate you with a Disney trip. Now, you have to stand up for yourself and tell him that you''re an equal partner and that you expect to be married within XX months.

You already have a child and house together so I find it kind of strange that you''re still tip toeing around the marriage topic. What would be the purpose of a "surprise" proposal at this point? I think he''s just using that as an excuse. If I were you, I''d just head to city hall and make it official. Then worry about a reception when you can afford it.
 

fieryred33143

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If it really is just about being his wife, would you be open to just going to the court house...no ring, no flying off to the beach...just signing the marriage license? The reason why I ask is because if you are open to that then I would suggest it to him. Going to the court house does not cost a couple of thousand. It''s a couple of hundred depending on your state. He wouldn''t be able to use money as an excuse. And if he comes up with another excuse...well, then there''s your answer.


My hunch is that he isn''t ready to get married. Yes you own a home together and yes you have a daughter together, but you''ve only known each other for 2 years. Maybe to him it isn''t enough time. And I know people will argue that it was enough time for him to have a baby but things do happen and I''m assuming your daughter is a product of these things that happen rather than a meaningful ''let''s try to conceive'' conversation. I know it sucks to be playing the role of the wife without being a wife but it is still a role you chose to be in when you moved in together and had a child. Now it looks like the option is to either wait until he''s ready to get married or take another approach...

 

Guilty Pleasure

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Date: 4/22/2009 11:04:27 AM
Author: lucyandroger

Sweetliloldme,

I''m sorry that you''re feeling so down but I really think you need to take control back over your own life.

The highlighted part of your post really struck me. Why did you just let him declare how much the beach wedding would have cost? Why was he able to just book your Disney trip? Did you agree to it? Why is he making all the decisions?????

I''m sorry but your SO seems to be extremely irresponsible with money and doesn''t seem to mind that he''s setting your wedding goals back several steps. I think he''s quite happy with things the way they are and figured he could placate you with a Disney trip. Now, you have to stand up for yourself and tell him that you''re an equal partner and that you expect to be married within XX months.

You already have a child and house together so I find it kind of strange that you''re still tip toeing around the marriage topic. What would be the purpose of a ''surprise'' proposal at this point? I think he''s just using that as an excuse. If I were you, I''d just head to city hall and make it official. Then worry about a reception when you can afford it.
I could not agree more.
 

sweetliloldme

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Joined
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Messages
83
Oh trust me there was no room for interpretation. After learning about the "extra" money I said oh great, so we can get married now. Why don''t we just go somewhere and get married on a beach. That''s when he said it would be too expensive. Then I looked it up, and gave him a figure. He said okay. And then he was talking about going to Disney. I got upset and said that clearly getting married didn''t mean anything to him, since he would rather go to Disney.Then he said well I was trying to do something nice, I know that you love it there and I thought that we could both use a vacation. I told him that I would still rather go to get married, or at least save the money to get married, yet he booked the Disney trip anyway.
 

Guilty Pleasure

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
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unacceptable for him to do that and not a good move for you to allow it to happen. Next time, let him know that you will not be going on the trip and then stick to your guns.

You also need a serious conversation about marriage. In no uncertain terms, he will either marry you or you will break up with him. A custody agreement can be drafted. You have a child for life, but you are not bound to being a live in girlfriend for life. just remember that.
 

LaraOnline

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Well, your last post made me feel a bit strange, liloldme! I mean, we can all see that you are being played like a violin.
so, what are you going to do? Bide your time? If you want to wait a decade, it can sometimes work out...

ETA: ok, I feel slack for being so blunt. I'm not TG or PP yet!


Guys often start out jerks and end up pretty reasonable guys...when they get their first grey hairs....

ETA: Oh my gosh I'm editing again! Still going back to the 'learning how to negotiate' idea... when he came back with his smooth talk about Disney, you have to come back with something intelligent too. Something that states it completely clearly, so it's not about him (for a change). Something like: 'But I'd MUCH RATHER get married than go to Disney World, so I don';t want to go!'

Was this just his tax return? Or did you have to fork out cash as well?
*sigh* now I feel depressed.
 

mrscushion

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Joined
Nov 15, 2008
Messages
3,309
Yes, I agree with Lara. Pretty sure he''s playing you and is not going to marry you. So you need to figure out what you want to do.
 

sweetliloldme

Rough_Rock
Joined
Apr 1, 2009
Messages
83
Right now, it''s not even about our different options to get married. It''s about the fact that we had an opprotunity, and he didn''t take it. For whatever reason he didn''t take it. Instead, he chose to do something else with the money. I didn''t "let" him. I said what I felt about going and he booked it any way. I wasn''t about to make him marry me instead. I know I could have cancelled the trip and so on, but like I said it wasn''t about that either. It''s about the fact that all of the excuses about money that he makes were voided, and he ignored the opprotunity. Maybe it''s because he has the bar comming up again, but again that''s not my fault that he didn''t pass the first time. Now again, here I am being supportive and practically being a single mother for months to support him, and he needs a vacation before he prepares. He just completly forgets about my sacrifices for the whole situation and my needs. It''s not about that either so I should stop ranting. I''m hurt, and I don''t feel like any of this is my fault. Yes, we had a child together and so on and so forth, but I didn''t do it alone. I grew up and made the choices that I had to make.
 

LaraOnline

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Messages
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Oh gee I feel pretty bad for you.
Try not to get emotionally swept up right now.

Hearing that he has big exams coming up does help see the picture a little better.
I would try my level best to bide my time, and see if something comes up in the first year after he passes his exam.

I know it''s incredibly difficult when every day you are wondering and worrying ... but then at least I would feel that I had done my level best for myself and my child...

single girls wonder and worry too... you do have one foot on the floor...
 

lucyandroger

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Date: 4/22/2009 11:46:42 AM
Author: sweetliloldme
Right now, it's not even about our different options to get married. It's about the fact that we had an opprotunity, and he didn't take it. For whatever reason he didn't take it. Instead, he chose to do something else with the money. I didn't 'let' him. I said what I felt about going and he booked it any way. I wasn't about to make him marry me instead. I know I could have cancelled the trip and so on, but like I said it wasn't about that either. It's about the fact that all of the excuses about money that he makes were voided, and he ignored the opprotunity. Maybe it's because he has the bar comming up again, but again that's not my fault that he didn't pass the first time. Now again, here I am being supportive and practically being a single mother for months to support him, and he needs a vacation before he prepares. He just completly forgets about my sacrifices for the whole situation and my needs. It's not about that either so I should stop ranting. I'm hurt, and I don't feel like any of this is my fault. Yes, we had a child together and so on and so forth, but I didn't do it alone. I grew up and made the choices that I had to make.
Sweetliloldme, I think that's your problem right there. You DID "let" him when you got on the plane and went on vacation with him. You made it okay for him to completely disregard your priorities and your opinions on how to spend your money.

He clearly is not taking the intiative to get married. So if that's something that's important to you, then you're going to have to make him marry you instead of frivously spending cash on vacations.

You have to decide if you're going to let him continue to control you or not.

ETA - You've already tried the sitting back, hoping he's going to propose strategy and it's clearly not working. If he wanted to, he would have. You said yourself that he had the opportunity and didn't take it. So you can continue to do the same thing and hope that some day he wants to marry you while you get resentful and bitter in the meantime. Or you can do something about it yourself. Why don't you flat out ask him if he's ever going to marry you?
 

gwendolyn

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Messages
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Date: 4/22/2009 12:17:49 PM
Author: lucyandroger
Date: 4/22/2009 11:46:42 AM

Author: sweetliloldme

Right now, it''s not even about our different options to get married. It''s about the fact that we had an opprotunity, and he didn''t take it. For whatever reason he didn''t take it. Instead, he chose to do something else with the money. I didn''t ''let'' him. I said what I felt about going and he booked it any way. I wasn''t about to make him marry me instead. I know I could have cancelled the trip and so on, but like I said it wasn''t about that either. It''s about the fact that all of the excuses about money that he makes were voided, and he ignored the opprotunity. Maybe it''s because he has the bar comming up again, but again that''s not my fault that he didn''t pass the first time. Now again, here I am being supportive and practically being a single mother for months to support him, and he needs a vacation before he prepares. He just completly forgets about my sacrifices for the whole situation and my needs. It''s not about that either so I should stop ranting. I''m hurt, and I don''t feel like any of this is my fault. Yes, we had a child together and so on and so forth, but I didn''t do it alone. I grew up and made the choices that I had to make.
Sweetliloldme, I think that''s your problem right there. You DID ''let'' him when you got on the plane and went on vacation with him. You made it okay for him to completely disregard your priorities and your opinions on how to spend your money.


He clearly is not taking the intiative to get married. So if that''s something that''s important to you, then you''re going to have to make him marry you instead of frivously spending cash on vacations.


You have to decide if you''re going to let him continue to control you or not.


ETA - You''ve already tried the sitting back, hoping he''s going to propose strategy and it''s clearly not working. If he wanted to, he would have. You said yourself that he had the opportunity and didn''t take it. So you can continue to do the same thing and hope that some day he wants to marry you while you get resentful and bitter in the meantime. Or you can do something about it yourself. Why don''t you flat out ask him if he''s ever going to marry you?
lucyandroger, I agree with just about everything you''ve said in this thread, but I''m not sure trying to MAKE him marry her is a viable solution. Who wants to marry someone who did it with a gun to his/her head?
 

lucyandroger

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Date: 4/22/2009 12:30:21 PM
Author: gwendolyn


Date: 4/22/2009 12:17:49 PM
Author: lucyandroger


Date: 4/22/2009 11:46:42 AM

Author: sweetliloldme

Right now, it's not even about our different options to get married. It's about the fact that we had an opprotunity, and he didn't take it. For whatever reason he didn't take it. Instead, he chose to do something else with the money. I didn't 'let' him. I said what I felt about going and he booked it any way. I wasn't about to make him marry me instead. I know I could have cancelled the trip and so on, but like I said it wasn't about that either. It's about the fact that all of the excuses about money that he makes were voided, and he ignored the opprotunity. Maybe it's because he has the bar comming up again, but again that's not my fault that he didn't pass the first time. Now again, here I am being supportive and practically being a single mother for months to support him, and he needs a vacation before he prepares. He just completly forgets about my sacrifices for the whole situation and my needs. It's not about that either so I should stop ranting. I'm hurt, and I don't feel like any of this is my fault. Yes, we had a child together and so on and so forth, but I didn't do it alone. I grew up and made the choices that I had to make.
Sweetliloldme, I think that's your problem right there. You DID 'let' him when you got on the plane and went on vacation with him. You made it okay for him to completely disregard your priorities and your opinions on how to spend your money.


He clearly is not taking the intiative to get married. So if that's something that's important to you, then you're going to have to make him marry you instead of frivously spending cash on vacations.


You have to decide if you're going to let him continue to control you or not.


ETA - You've already tried the sitting back, hoping he's going to propose strategy and it's clearly not working. If he wanted to, he would have. You said yourself that he had the opportunity and didn't take it. So you can continue to do the same thing and hope that some day he wants to marry you while you get resentful and bitter in the meantime. Or you can do something about it yourself. Why don't you flat out ask him if he's ever going to marry you?
lucyandroger, I agree with just about everything you've said in this thread, but I'm not sure trying to MAKE him marry her is a viable solution. Who wants to marry someone who did it with a gun to his/her head?
Totally agree!


I was just trying to use sweetliloldme's language. What I really meant was make him recognize marriage as a priority (as opposed to a vacation) since it's a priority of hers. Of course, you can't make anyone marry you and like you said, who would want to.
 

fieryred33143

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Messages
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Date: 4/22/2009 12:30:21 PM
Author: gwendolyn

lucyandroger, I agree with just about everything you''ve said in this thread, but I''m not sure trying to MAKE him marry her is a viable solution. Who wants to marry someone who did it with a gun to his/her head?
This exactly.

I understand the argument that they have a child together. But just because they are in this situation, that does not mean that he needs to be automatically ready to marry her. If he truly is not ready to marry her, then it isn''t fair to him to be forced to. He is doing his part for the child as her father by being there for her financially and/or emotionally and/or physically. His obligations to the relationship should remain the same as if they did not have a child in the picture. In other words, if they didn''t have their daughterby their 2 year mark and he wasn''t ready to marry her...no one would be telling him to do it anyway. Mommy and Daddy is not the same as Husband and Wife. Yes, it would be the honorable thing to do but wouldn''t you want someone to marry you out of love rather than out of obligation?
 

gwendolyn

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Messages
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Date: 4/22/2009 12:35:21 PM
Author: lucyandroger
Date: 4/22/2009 12:30:21 PM

Author: gwendolyn
lucyandroger, I agree with just about everything you''ve said in this thread, but I''m not sure trying to MAKE him marry her is a viable solution. Who wants to marry someone who did it with a gun to his/her head?
Totally agree!



I was just trying to use sweetliloldme''s language. What I really meant was make him recognize marriage as a priority (as opposed to a vacation) since it''s a priority of hers. Of course, you can''t make anyone marry you and like you said, who would want to.
Hahah, oh! Well, that''s excellent then--totally on the same page now.
 

sweetliloldme

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Joined
Apr 1, 2009
Messages
83
Lucy,

I have flat out asked him. In an earlier post we talked about it, but to make a long story short his answer was yes, but we didn''t have the money. Which brings me to this. We had the money, and he blew it.
 

Sizzle

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Joined
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Messages
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Date: 4/22/2009 10:15:26 AM
Author:sweetliloldme
After some consideration, I relized that all of you were right. I decided that a big wedding wasn''t really that important to me, and just being his wife was sufficient enough. We were getting a couple thousand more dollars on our income tax return that we originally expected to so I suggested that we use it to get married. I figured that we could fly somewhere and have a beautiful, low key, inexpensive wedding on a beach somewhere. Well, he said that to do that it would be more than a couple of thousand dollars. Instead, he booked a trip to Disney World. So I figured that he did that because it was one of my favorite places, and that he would propose or something. We got back yesterday, NOTHING happened. After everything was said and done we spend more than the couple thousand anyway. Should I be upset? Now I feel that I am making comprimises, and he is still giving excuses.
Are you prepared to handle life shoud he decide he is not interested in getting married?
 

Winks_Elf

Brilliant_Rock
Trade
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Nov 28, 2008
Messages
1,674
I don't know if you are working full time or not, but since he chose to take a vacation instead of making you a married woman, I would CHOOSE to go down to the damn court house with the child's birth certificate, and get an order for custody and child support. He obviously is in no rush to get married, and passing the bar is not going to make that any more of a priority. Taking care of your child is. Taking care of yourself is. If he is not on the same page as you, you need to protect yourself and your child by making sure at the very least there is an order for child support in place (if you haven't done so already). He is not going to take you seriously until you start acting serious.

Don't mess around with a bull, you'll get the horns.
 

fieryred33143

Ideal_Rock
Joined
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Messages
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Wink...I''m not really sure what you are suggesting her to do in your post.

Are you suggesting she gets the order for child support then come home and throw it in his face in a "if you don''t marry me this is what''s waiting for you" kind of way?

Or suggesting she puts the plans in motion to get herself out of the relationship?
 

sweetliloldme

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Joined
Apr 1, 2009
Messages
83
Sizzle,

Yes, I am prepared and already know what I would do should that be the outcome. The thing is I have asked him if that''s what he wants and if not he needs to speak up and say something. He get''s upset and says that he wants to, he doesn''t know why I would think different, blah, blah blah.
 

princesss

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Joined
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Messages
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Date: 4/22/2009 12:47:23 PM
Author: sweetliloldme
Lucy,

I have flat out asked him. In an earlier post we talked about it, but to make a long story short his answer was yes, but we didn''t have the money. Which brings me to this. We had the money, and he blew it.
And there is your answer. It''s not about the money. It''s about him not wanting to get married, but saying he does to keep you around.
 

Sunset_in_Cali

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Joined
Apr 15, 2009
Messages
75
Sweet, I''m so sorry you are going through this. It is obvious to me that marriage is not a priority to your SO at all. In fact, it seems he actively sabotaged the opportunity to get married, by spending the money on something unnecessary. And now, you''re back at square one, financially. So he gets to use the no money excuse all over again.

You need to find out from him in no uncertain terms whether he wants to marry you or not. Tell him you need to know the truth, even if it''s hard to hear. If he insists that he does want to marry, then no more excuses. Set a wedding date and start saving/working towards that. If he responds negatively or is wishy-washy, then you have your answer, and you need to make some big decisions for yourself.

I''m sorry that it''s come to this. Please take care of yourself. I hope things work out for you, whatever happens.
 

lucyandroger

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Joined
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Messages
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Date: 4/22/2009 12:47:23 PM
Author: sweetliloldme
Lucy,

I have flat out asked him. In an earlier post we talked about it, but to make a long story short his answer was yes, but we didn''t have the money. Which brings me to this. We had the money, and he blew it.
I''m afraid you have your real answer then. Are you prepared to continue to be the live-in girlfriend? Don''t let him make descisions on his own that are going to affect the rest of your life.

I think you need to sit down with him and don''t let him make anymore excuses. Say that you realize he''s putting off marriage and you need to know why so you can think about what you''re going to do. I''m sure you are an awesome woman with lots to offer and you deserve to be with a guy that respects your opinions, priorities, etc.
 

Guilty Pleasure

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Joined
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Messages
1,114
I agree with Fiery that having the child does not mean that they should be married. However, I do believe that because they have a child, they do not have the luxury of "wishy-washy, see what happens, maybe we get married, maybe we don''t... someday" behavior. Having a child does mean you have to grow up, and this type of behavior is not the behavior of a grown-up. He owes it his child and he owes it to his girlfriend to make a decision.

And I also personally believe that after the age of 25, two years of living together is plenty of time for an adult to make a decision and/or be honest about their lack of a decision, with or without a child. Whether or not he is ready, he owes her HONESTY about hsi reason. I don''t know how old the poster is, but I assume that they are old enough since he is taking the bar which means he''s had at least 7 years of schooling.
 

gwendolyn

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Messages
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Date: 4/22/2009 12:56:01 PM
Author: princesss
Date: 4/22/2009 12:47:23 PM

Author: sweetliloldme

Lucy,


I have flat out asked him. In an earlier post we talked about it, but to make a long story short his answer was yes, but we didn''t have the money. Which brings me to this. We had the money, and he blew it.

And there is your answer. It''s not about the money. It''s about him not wanting to get married, but saying he does to keep you around.
Have to agree.
 

sweetliloldme

Rough_Rock
Joined
Apr 1, 2009
Messages
83
okay so now what? have ANOTHER conversation with him, tell him that I feel like he''s making excuses..ect,. (i feel like ive said everything i can) then get the "let it go, your going to ruin the suprise." Then I say no, because you''ve had the chance to surprise me and you don''t take it. I already know that the conversation is going to go no where. I''m still going to get the same answers that I keep getting. Any thoughts as to how I can get new ones? Like I said i''ve said everything i can think of, and i need some new ideas.
 

princesss

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Joined
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Messages
8,035
I don''t think you''re going to get anything else out of him. So you just have to decide what''s right for you and your child. Will you live with him and just be a girlfriend? Will you move out? The only thing you can be certain of is that given the chance, he still wasn''t jumping at the chance to get married. He didn''t put one penny towards a wedding. That''s your answer. That is probably the clearest answer you get. More talking won''t do anything. It''s time for you to pick a course of action and follow it through.
 
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    Cushion Cut- Three Ways
    Cushion Cut- Three Ways

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Diamond Eye Candy

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