Should I buy from a "wholesaler" in nyc diamond district

[annemarieb10]

I would like a certified Canadian NWT diamond and have one at Weldiam in the New York diamond district. He normally sells only to retailers and he is on 7th floor of a place at 47th and 5th Ave in New York. To get in I had to show ID and have my fingerprint scanned. Seems like a legit situation to me, but then again I am very new to this. Are there are any downsides buying this way as compared to buying from retail jeweler? If I get the stone appraised and there is any problem, do you think it would be any more difficult to return?

This guy quoted me $8500 for the stone. Would it be appropriate for me to negotiate? Using pricescope, I just found the same stone listed by Abazias for $8701. Does $200 seem like a reasonable markup from wholesale to e-tailer?

Here are the stone specs:

AGS cert:
round brilliant 6.90-6.91 x 4.19
cut grade overall excellent 1
light performance 0
proportion factors 0
finish 1 (polish ex, sym ideal)
color G
clarity VVS2
carat 1.192
laser inscribed with NWT numberl
table 55.2, depth 60.8, crown 34.6 deg, pavillion 41.0 degrees
picture with inclusions looks clear -- I don''t see anything, at least on the copy of the cert I was given.

I was also given a mini Sarin report with all zeroes.

Thank you so much for any advice.

 

[avlis]

if he is selling to you, he is not a wholesaler. i have a couple friends who bought from "wholesalers/diamond brokers/friends in the industry", and got a worse deal than they could have online.

if it is the exact same diamond, then you need to think about things like, return policies, trade up policies, sales tax, possible pricescope discount or bank wire discounts.

personally i would not buy from someone who claims to be a wholesaler trying to sell me a diamond, its just a shady little lie that would make me cast doubt about the rest of the things that come out of the persons mouth.

 

[dfm00]

If he's selling to you then he's not solely a wholesaler, by definition. If a vendor trying to sell me a diamond called himself a wholesaler it would be a turn-off for me, I would think he was being misleading at best, if not dishonest.

As far as returns, you'd have to ask about his policies. One of the nice things about the popular online vendors is that they usual have very accommodating return policies and often attractive trade-in/buy back policies.

For comparison, here’s a Canadian AGS000 H&A at Good Old Gold. Looks very nice. It’s a little smaller, but probably not noticeably so. You lose a grade of color, which may be an issue to you. And a clarity grade, but most would say that VS1 is more than sufficient and VVS overkill. It is significantly cheaper than the one you’re looking at now. And GOG is on Long Island, so you might be able to see it in person if you’re in NYC.

http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond.php?d=1734&shape=2097152&resultsColumns=404226174&singleResult=1


Dave

 

[annemarieb10]

Thanks for the responses.

I agree that if someone is truly a wholesaler, then by definition he deosn''t sell to individuals. To be fair, I believe he actually said that he *usually* sells to retailers. I figured the fact that he sells from an office and not on street-level was consistent with that... And if his diamond is virtually listed on an e-tailer site, then he must be at least doing some wholesale. Am I off-base?

In the meantime I will inquire about his return policy. And I will also call the e-tailer listing the stone to ask similar questions.

 

[Regular Guy]

Date: 7/11/2007 9:04:40 AM
Author: annemarieb10

And if his diamond is virtually listed on an e-tailer site, then he must be at least doing some wholesale. Am I off-base?

In the meantime I will inquire about his return policy. And I will also call the e-tailer listing the stone to ask similar questions.

Standard practices, actually.

But, you''re doing due diligence. Keep asking these questions. AGS0 is good.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

He''s just selling wholesale to vendors and retail to regular customers. You aren''t getting a wholesale price. I''d far rather pay a little more to have a lifetime trade-up and buy back poilcy like Good Old Gold has. Call Good Old Gold, tell them what you want, and they can call in stones for you to go see.

 

[annemarieb10]

One last question:

If I decide I feel comfortable buying from this guy, is he likely to negotiate the price? If he''s offering it to me for 8500 and Abazias had it listed for 8701, what price might be reasonablef or me to offer? Would offering 8000 be ridiculous?

 

[neatfreak]

Date: 7/11/2007 9:29:43 AM
Author: annemarieb10
One last question:


If I decide I feel comfortable buying from this guy, is he likely to negotiate the price? If he's offering it to me for 8500 and Abazias had it listed for 8701, what price might be reasonablef or me to offer? Would offering 8000 be ridiculous?

Yes, probably. Usually the online database prices are pretty solid. Not too much negotiating to be had. But you could always try to negotiate sales tax (which you wouldn't pay online), or something else. But if his price is already lower than the online price there is a very slim chance that you have anything to work with in terms of negotiating.

Also, just to clarify, the online listing of diamonds can be accessed by ANYONE in the trade. It doesn't mean that he owns the diamond and is selling it to say Abazias. It means it's probably owned by a third party WHOLESALER, and any retailer can have access to it.

But personally, I wouldn't buy from him. No upgrade, return, etc. Not cool with me.

 

[Modified Brilliant]

There is no such thing as "wholesale to the public" yet we see it all the time in every industry.

www.metrojewelryappraisers.com

 

[Nicrez]

Date: 7/11/2007 9:50:20 AM
Author: Modified Brilliant
There is no such thing as ''wholesale to the public'' yet we see it all the time in every industry.

www.metrojewelryappraisers.com

This statement is so true! Why would a random stranger want to pass savings onto you, when he could sell you something at retail and make more profit? In the industry they know prices without RAP sheets. You say the specs on a stone and because they deal every single day with it, they have no questions. Either the price is good or they buy from someone else. Here you have no idea what pricing should be, you don''t know the details of diamonds and how to determine a good one from a bad one really (and that''s OK, because PS can help you with that), but this "wholesaler" knows that, why would he NOT want to profit off your lack of experience? Truth is some of these guys even try it within the trade.

As a wholesaler, he can not technically charge sales tax. He would have to be licensed to charge sales tax with (at least here in NY). If he is he is a RETAILER, so he''s lying. If he really is a wholesaler only, then not charging you sales tax is illegal as it is only used in cases of resale. If you don''t resell it, then you are illegally circumventing US tax laws. I hate to admit it, but it''s shady any way you slice it...

 

[In the rough]

Date: 7/11/2007 9:19:57 AM
Author: diamondseeker2006
He's just selling wholesale to vendors and retail to regular customers. You aren't getting a wholesale price. I'd far rather pay a little more to have a lifetime trade-up and buy back poilcy like Good Old Gold has. Call Good Old Gold, tell them what you want, and they can call in stones for you to go see.

I def. agree with diamondseeker. The ability to have that lifetime trade-up makes a difference. I live in NY and a lot of the dealers in the diamond district say they have a trade-up policy and when people go back the dealer has moved or is no longer in the area. This is not always the case, but it does happen. WF also has a trade up policy and great service. They will work hard to find exactly what you are looking for...Sheera is great there.

 

[annemarieb10]

I just checked out Whiteflash. I am very impressed with their "conflict-free guarantee" -- I think I feel ok buying a non-Canadian stone from them. And their website''s interface is very good, plus I just called and talked to someone who was excellent. Then you add the pricescope discount and it seems like a no-brainer.

You guys are awesome -- thanks for the guidance.

 

[neatfreak]

Date: 7/11/2007 10:48:34 AM
Author: annemarieb10
I just checked out Whiteflash. I am very impressed with their ''conflict-free guarantee'' -- I think I feel ok buying a non-Canadian stone from them. And their website''s interface is very good, plus I just called and talked to someone who was excellent. Then you add the pricescope discount and it seems like a no-brainer.


You guys are awesome -- thanks for the guidance.

You can''t go wrong with them. They have shown that not only their stones, but their customer service as well, are all impeccable. Plus the fact that unless you''re in TX you can LEGALLY pay no sales tax is great!

 

[MWG]

Date: 7/11/2007 10:48:34 AM
Author: annemarieb10
I just checked out Whiteflash. I am very impressed with their ''conflict-free guarantee'' -- I think I feel ok buying a non-Canadian stone from them. And their website''s interface is very good, plus I just called and talked to someone who was excellent. Then you add the pricescope discount and it seems like a no-brainer.

You guys are awesome -- thanks for the guidance.

You cant go wrong with an ACA!!!!

MWG

 

[Harriet]

Date: 7/12/2007 10:13:44 AM
Author: MWG

You cant go wrong with an ACA!!!!

MWG

I second that.