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Recreating this antique ring - thoughts?

champagnepear

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I stumbled across these pictures online. The actual ring is an antique that is no longer for sale, but I'd love to make something similar. The center stone is about .85 carats - how big, then, do you think the smaller stones might be?

Thanks for the help!

img_3857_grande.jpg

img_1860_grande.jpg
 

rockysalamander

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Not an expert here, but using a drawing program, I did a little visual math. The first side stone is 50% the width of the center. I can't get a clear angle on the second side stone to see if it is the same as the first or a bit smaller. If smaller, it does not seem to be much smaller.
 

VRBeauty

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The two stones next to the center stone look to be .35 - .4 each.

Bear in mind that the width associated with a particular carat weight can vary widely, and that's particularly true of older cuts. I was using my 3-stone OEC ring, which has a .85 center stone and .40 side stones, for reference. But - Rockysalamander is right - if you want to replicate those proportions, your concern is more the diameter measurements than it is the carat weights.
 

Mayk

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Niel

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VRBeauty|1464999398|4039941 said:
The two stones next to the center stone look to be .35 - .4 each.

Bear in mind that the width associated with a particular carat weight can vary widely, and that's particularly true of older cuts. I was using my 3-stone OEC ring, which has a .85 center stone and .40 side stones, for reference. But - Rockysalamander is right - if you want to replicate those proportions, your concern is more the diameter measurements than it is the carat weights.

I do r they are that large.

Here is my ring, center is .84cts, then .32, then .15.. based on that I'd say the side stones in this pic are closer to .20-.25 for the closest pair, probably 10-15 points on the outside

Eta: I'm glad that one is sold, you can get better diamonds than that, those look very included

smellynelson_1168412912015282703_290172467.png
 

Niel

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top - 6/4/3mm
middle - 6/4.5/3.5mm
bottom - 6/4.5/3.75mm

The top one is closest but the proportions are still too large. And 4mm is .25 CTS (for modern rounds)so I don't even think they're that big

_1200.png
 

VRBeauty

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Niel|1465006069|4039960 said:
I do r they are that large.

Here is my ring, center is .84cts, then .32, then .15.. based on that I'd say the side stones in this pic are closer to .20-.25 for the closest pair, probably 10-15 points on the outside

Eta: I'm glad that one is sold, you can get better diamonds than that, those look very included
I suspect you're right. By the way, I really like how your ring turned out. Lovely proportions!
 

champagnepear

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Thanks Niel! Very helpful.

I actually did some more Internet stalking and the original listing says the total weight of the four sidestones is about .5 carat - so probably two .1s and two .15s.
 

VRBeauty

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champagnepear|1465235961|4040803 said:
Thanks Niel! Very helpful.

I actually did some more Internet stalking and the original listing says the total weight of the four sidestones is about .5 carat - so probably two .1s and two .15s.
Honestly? I think that's very unlikely, unless they seriously over-estimated the size of the center stone. If you try to build a replicate using OECs with those carat weights, I think you'll be disappointed with the results.

Bear in mind that unless they took the ring apart and weighed the diamonds, these are all guesstimates, and the smaller stones are going to harder to measure than the center stone because you've got more obstructions to deal with. And also bear in mind that the seller is likely using look-up tables designed for modern round brilliants. OECs or OMCs, as compared to MRBs, will often face up smaller for the same weight because of higher tables and/or thicker girdles.
 

VRBeauty

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champagnepear|1465235961|4040803 said:
Thanks Niel! Very helpful.

I actually did some more Internet stalking and the original listing says the total weight of the four sidestones is about .5 carat - so probably two .1s and two .15s.
Honestly? I think that's very unlikely, unless they seriously over-estimated the size of the center stone. If you try to build a replicate using OECs with those carat weights, I think you'll be disappointed with the results.

Bear in mind that unless they took the ring apart and weighed the diamonds, these are all guesstimates, and the smaller stones are going to harder to measure than the center stone because you've got more obstructions to deal with. And also bear in mind that the seller is likely using look-up tables designed for modern round brilliants. OECs or OMCs, as compared to MRBs, will often face up smaller for the same weight because of higher tables and/or thicker girdles.

Please forgive the poor picture quality, but this picture shows my ring with a .85 ct OEC center stone (bezel-set) and above it, a ~.24 MRB stud earring in an 8-prong setting. I tried to keep the center stone and the earring on about the same plane. I think the proportions are very similar to your example ring. A .15ct side stone would be much smaller.

fullsizerender__1__15.jpg
 

Niel

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I actually don't think that info is unhelpful. Considering that they probably did use the mm size to estimate the ctw, you can work backwards to recreate. If they used modern mm to ctw conversation, find out what 15 and 10 point stones measure at in modern rounds, and then search of diamonds that meet those mm. Sure,if you're trying to make this in old cuts, you'll probably end up with a higher ctw, but shop by the mm and you should be good.
 

Niel

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VRBeauty|1465242398|4040841 said:
champagnepear|1465235961|4040803 said:
Thanks Niel! Very helpful.

I actually did some more Internet stalking and the original listing says the total weight of the four sidestones is about .5 carat - so probably two .1s and two .15s.
Honestly? I think that's very unlikely, unless they seriously over-estimated the size of the center stone. If you try to build a replicate using OECs with those carat weights, I think you'll be disappointed with the results.

Bear in mind that unless they took the ring apart and weighed the diamonds, these are all guesstimates, and the smaller stones are going to harder to measure than the center stone because you've got more obstructions to deal with. And also bear in mind that the seller is likely using look-up tables designed for modern round brilliants. OECs or OMCs, as compared to MRBs, will often face up smaller for the same weight because of higher tables and/or thicker girdles.

Please forgive the poor picture quality, but this picture shows my ring with a .85 ct OEC center stone (bezel-set) and above it, a ~.24 MRB stud earring in an 8-prong setting. I tried to keep the center stone and the earring on about the same plane. I think the proportions are very similar to your example ring. A .15ct side stone would be much smaller.

fullsizerender__1__15.jpg
When I compare your pic to the original I can see your 25 pointer seems noticeably larger to the first pair in the ops ring. I agree I like the proportions of a 25 pointer, but I don't think it would recreate the OP ring . Those side stones are really small
 

champagnepear

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Thank you both. I think I may need to approach it from a different angle. Since I would probably want the band around 2mm, then the smallest stones should probably be about 3mm. I know I want the center stone to be about 6mm and to be noticeably larger than the sidetones (for a more traditional "engagement ring" look). Playing around with a drawing program, I think I like a more subtle graduation between the side-stones, so I think I will aim for about 3.75mm for the middle stones.

Niel, when you were selecting stones for your ring, were you able to pick the smaller ones out yourself or did you leave that up to the jeweler (JA?) I did send a request in to JA but they said they aren't doing custom work right now.

I'm currently undecided on whether I want to go with antique cuts or modern cuts. I like both, and budget is an issue, which makes me think modern would be easier/less expensive.
 

rubybeth

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champagnepear|1465245920|4040863 said:
I'm currently undecided on whether I want to go with antique cuts or modern cuts. I like both, and budget is an issue, which makes me think modern would be easier/less expensive.
Maybe, maybe not. I would reach out to Grace at Jewels by Grace or Erica at Love Affair Diamonds and see if they have any stones that would be good matches for a ring like this. They could line them up for you and take some photos/video. It may or may not be less expensive than modern cut stones. You won't know unless you get some quotes. :naughty:
 

Niel

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So I've got a lot of stuff on here when I made my rings I think will help you, but before I go digging, what size is your finger?
 

champagnepear

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Niel|1465255417|4040912 said:
So I've got a lot of stuff on here when I made my rings I think will help you, but before I go digging, what size is your finger?
It's a size five.
 

Gypsy

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I can help you with that.

0e6961eabf401bf55f6bb7e46cd6c145.jpg

This is what I am considering as a band for myself with MRB.

Center: 65 points and 5.5mm
Side: 35 points and 4.5 mn
Outside: 20 points and 3.8mm


I plan to use IDJ as my vendor. And H color Stones in platinum. GIA stones for largest 3 and uncerted for 20 pointers. Shank will be 1.8mm.

So if you plan an 80 point center and 30 point sides and 20 point outside stones it should give you what you want.
 

Niel

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Gypsy|1465258009|4040926 said:
I can help you with that.

0e6961eabf401bf55f6bb7e46cd6c145.jpg

This is what I am considering as a band for myself with MRB.

Center: 65 points and 5.5mm
Side: 35 points and 4.5 mn
Outside: 20 points and 3.8mm


I plan to use IDJ as my vendor. And H color Stones in platinum. GIA stones for largest 3 and uncerted for 20 pointers. Shank will be 1.8mm.

So if you plan an 80 point center and 30 point sides and 20 point outside stones it should give you what you want.
I'm included to agree somewhat with gypsys numbers. I did 15 pointers on the outside becuase if they do get between your fingers, it won't be uncomfortable, next 25-30 points, then I like 60-70 ish center.
I picked out my center, found a pair that JA had matched, then told them to find me 15 pointers as those where very small. I'll find you the links to my process

There's a magic number that will cover all of the top bit of your finger, without getting between your fingers. I think you want to see what the mm is of the top of your finger when it's closed, then use those measurements to determine what we have to work with
 

Gypsy

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Good point Niel.

If you keep the 5.5mm center at 65 points and do 25 point sides and 15 point ousides you get the look as well.

My finger is 6.5 for the record.
 

champagnepear

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Niel|1465258462|4040932 said:
I'm included to agree somewhat with gypsys numbers. I did 15 pointers on the outside becuase if they do get between your fingers, it won't be uncomfortable, next 25-30 points, then I like 60-70 ish center.
I picked out my center, found a pair that JA had matched, then told them to find me 15 pointers as those where very small. I'll find you the links to my process

There's a magic number that will cover all of the top bit of your finger, without getting between your fingers. I think you want to see what the mm is of the top of your finger when it's closed, then use those measurements to determine what we have to work with
Okay, I measured the top of my finger, and it looks like it's right about 20mm. Could be slightly more or slightly less as I doubt my measurement was very accurate. Plus, if I'm thinking about this correctly, once the diamonds sit up off my finger they will have ever so slightly more space to spread out in.
 

Niel

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What would you think of 3mm, 4mm, 5.5- 6mm?

That would be 10 pointers, 25 pointers, and a 65-80 pointer, 65 would be a more subtle graduation, 80 would be closer to your original post
 

champagnepear

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Niel|1465314447|4041188 said:
What would you think of 3mm, 4mm, 5.5- 6mm?

That would be 10 pointers, 25 pointers, and a 65-80 pointer, 65 would be a more subtle graduation, 80 would be closer to your original post
That sounds about right. Depending on what size center stone I go with (in the 65-80 points range) I will probably pick between 20-25 pointers to maintain the same proportions.

I would love to be able to try some on in person but I feel like most jewelry stores only carry non-graduated bands. Perhaps they might have some three-stones that would get me close, though.
 

Niel

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Your budget for this endeavor
 

mrs-b

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Gypsy|1465258009|4040926 said:
I can help you with that.

0e6961eabf401bf55f6bb7e46cd6c145.jpg

This is what I am considering as a band for myself with MRB.

Center: 65 points and 5.5mm
Side: 35 points and 4.5 mn
Outside: 20 points and 3.8mm


I plan to use IDJ as my vendor. And H color Stones in platinum. GIA stones for largest 3 and uncerted for 20 pointers. Shank will be 1.8mm.

So if you plan an 80 point center and 30 point sides and 20 point outside stones it should give you what you want.

Sorry for the threadjack but...

:o :love: :o :love: :o

Holy Guacamole! Gypsy - can you share where you found this STUNNING ring pls?

And I agree with Niel on this - if the center stone is 6mm, I'm thinking 2 x 20/25pts and 2 x 10/15pts for your 4 side stones.
 

Gypsy

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mrs-blop|1465320893|4041230 said:
Gypsy|1465258009|4040926 said:
I can help you with that.

0e6961eabf401bf55f6bb7e46cd6c145.jpg

This is what I am considering as a band for myself with MRB.

Center: 65 points and 5.5mm
Side: 35 points and 4.5 mn
Outside: 20 points and 3.8mm


I plan to use IDJ as my vendor. And H color Stones in platinum. GIA stones for largest 3 and uncerted for 20 pointers. Shank will be 1.8mm.

So if you plan an 80 point center and 30 point sides and 20 point outside stones it should give you what you want.

Sorry for the threadjack but...

:o :love: :o :love: :o

Holy Guacamole! Gypsy - can you share where you found this STUNNING ring pls?

And I agree with Niel on this - if the center stone is 6mm, I'm thinking 2 x 20/25pts and 2 x 10/15pts for your 4 side stones.

On etsy. https://www.etsy.com/listing/162586569/5-stone-bezel-set-diamond-band but it's overpriced (by A LOT) for uncertified stones of that size.

If I have it made it will be by IDJ in platinum. H color all around. Largest three stones GIA 3X. And the smallest uncertified but I will want an idealscope and a SARIN. And I want a 5.5mm center.
 

Gypsy

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Gonna be tight depending on your color preferences.

700 for two 25 pointers in H.
500 for two 15 pointers in H.
--------
1300
800 for 14kt custom setting.
2100 just for the sidestones and the setting.
So that leaves 1900 for the center and that's AT 4000 budget.

70 point H eyeclean is going to be right at 2k or slightly over.
 

champagnepear

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Gypsy|1465323812|4041250 said:
Gonna be tight depending on your color preferences.

700 for two 25 pointers in H.
500 for two 15 pointers in H.
--------
1300
800 for 14kt custom setting.
2100 just for the sidestones and the setting.
So that leaves 1900 for the center and that's AT 4000 budget.

70 point H eyeclean is going to be right at 2k or slightly over.
Thank you so much for your help Gypsy, this is so illuminating and helps me feel much more confident in my decisions.

I think I will go down to 10 and 20 pointers - looking at the original inspiration ring, the sidestones are pretty small, so I think I will still like it and hopefully that will save me a little there.

I'm okay with I color stones. They seem like a good value to me. I do want to set this in yellow gold.
 
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