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Questions about Cushion cut yellow diamond

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ElizabethR

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Jan 19, 2011
Messages
313
Hi, I'm looking to buy a canary yellow cushion cut diamond for the center stone of my new ring. There will be trapezoid side-stones f-h color.
My questions:
will faint yellow color stand out against these side stones?
what table and depth should I be looking for n the yellow center stone?
What should I avoid at all costs :naughty:

Thank you
 
For starters, I would avoid a faint yellow color - if you're going to go yellow, go bold. I'm fine with some faint diamond colors (pinks, blues, etc.), but not yellows.
 
Thanks momhappy, I can understand that. I definitely want the yellow to be the most prominent feature. I don't want a dark yellow stone but a nice deep/warm canary yellow. I'm just not sure where on the color scale that would be.
 
Go to http://www.leibish.com/world-of-colors and look at the various shades of yellow and what they are called. When you
cursor over the stones it will tell you what color category it belongs to.

I on the other hand like light yellow stones (faint). Nice buttery, creamy yellow has such a rich look while the
darker yellows are too in your face to me.

Colored stones tend to be more on the deeper side but I dont think there are specific numbers you can stick to. I think each
stone has to be looked at independently.

Edit - avoid windows at all cost. If you give us your budget and size specs we could help you look.

You can also check out www.diamondsbylauren.com..
 
Hi tyty, thanks for the info, but what are windows?
 
Hi tyty, thanks for the info, but what are windows?
Wow! That's an awesome tool. I think I'm leaning toward the fancy light to fancy intense. My budget is very tight for the center stone $2.500. $3.000.
 
I would advise you to post on the Colored stones board.

Regarding color and WHITE diamonds:

It is important to remember is that color is graded FACE DOWN. Where there is NO light return. Not face up where there is light return and refraction. You wear diamonds set. FACE UP.

Within one color grade, even the labs can't agree on the color grades of stones and something could be a "high" H or a "low" E. So... no. Not really. Within 2 color grades it is hard. Not impossible. But very hard. And it gets harder once set. If you are talking ideal rounds, or any stone with ideal light return and no sharp corners it gets harder still because the ideal light return masks body color.

Generally we say to be conservative stay above H.

If you are talking fancy shapes without ideal light return (because there is no 'ideal' for EC's Radiant, etc) it's a bit different.

This is how I think of it.

Ever gotten one of those HUGE paint fan decks? Where there are literally 100s of colors of whites? And when they are RIGHT next to each other you can TOTALLY tell that one is bluer/colder and one is a bit warmer and which one is one is TOTALLY warmer. One there's one that's slightly greener. One that's slightly pinker? But really. They are all white?

Then you pick one after agonizing over this white or that white and when it's on the walls and people are like: Oh. You painted again. And it's STILL white. Great.

And you're all... BUT it's BLUE white. Or it's a WARM white now. It used to be ____ white. It's TOTALLY different.

It's like that. You are talking about shades of white. D is colder... J is warmer. But it's all white.

YES. If you have an accurately graded F and an H THAT HAVE THE SAME PERFORMANCE you are going to be able to tell them apart when you compare them side by side. Just like you would be able to tell if you painted your walls a warm white, but painted the crown molding a cold/straight white. But both are STILL white, you only see the contrast because of the proximity. But it's very slight, you could set an F center with G sides and never tell the difference. And even H sides depending on the setting and the size of the sidestones... especially with round brilliants.


I want you notice all the qualifiers thought. I'm talking about stones with the SAME performance. An ideal H will out white an F that has compromised light performance from a poor cut.

NOTHING impacts the appearance of a diamond as much as cut. CUT is king.

You want the shinest whitest and brightest diamond out there: Cut is King. No other factor, not color or clarity or anything else impacts how white bright an shiny a stone is.
 
There is no "number" guideline for cushion. And for yellow diamonds... color is primary. You do want to avoid windows (where you can see right through faceting the diamond, like a window where there should be faceting), and you want to make sure the stone isn't showing a lot of obstruction. But shopping for yellow diamonds is very different than shopping for white ones. Just make sure that the light return and the

That said, if you want faint yellow, I would stick to D-E-F sidestones.

And I agree, that you would be better served with a more saturated color than 'faint' yellow although SOME are more yellow than others. This one is one of the more yellow ones, for example: http://www.leibish.com/yellow-diamond/087ct-fancy-light-yellow-cushion-si1-92425-16119 this one is too light, though in contrast even though it is a nicely cut one: http://www.leibish.com/yellow-diamond/081ct-fancy-light-yellow-cushion-si1-92433-16124


I don't like pee yellow diamonds myself.

These are some nice canary diamonds, just for your reference:
http://www.leibish.com/yellow-diamond/063ct-fancy-vivid-yellow-cushion-vvs2-129479-18956
http://www.leibish.com/yellow-diamond/092ct-fancy-yellow-cushion-vs2-116811-18081
http://www.leibish.com/yellow-diamond/125ct-fancy-intense-yellow-cushion-vs2-90707-15920\

See how even both the color and the light are?

Here are ones that have issues with their light return and cut:
http://www.leibish.com/yellow-diamond/120ct-fancy-intense-yellow-cushion-vvs1-116856-18087
http://www.leibish.com/yellow-diamond/071ct-fancy-yellow-cushion-if-97580-16692
http://www.leibish.com/yellow-diamond/104ct-fancy-vivid-yellow-cushion-vs1-120160-18367

See the dark spots?

Hopefully that will help you.

Diamonds by Lauren also has nice canary diamonds. Brilliantly Engaged also carries Canary diamonds, and they are full service and will source stones for you and then send you all the images/etc. you need.
http://www.leibish.com/yellow-diamond/064ct-light-yellow-cushion-vs2-43360-10495
 
Wow, that's an amazing amount of info. Thank you Gypsy for going to all that trouble to help me out. I really appreciate it.

If you don't mind, do I understand correctly, it's only Rounds that have Ideal cut? If yes, I'm a little confused. One of the sites I've been checking out stated that their cushions were select-ideal or ideal select. I took it to mean their cushions were cut to Ideal proportions. Am I getting it wrong?

Gypsy, I've looked at all those diamonds and I can't figure what the difference is that make one diamond hav great light return and the other not. What is it in the reports that shows this?
Thanks,
Elizabeth
 
It's not in the report. Even if it was a white diamond NOTHING ON A LAB REPORT will tell you what you need to know about faceting and light return of a fancy shaped diamond.

Use your eyes and compare the images of the diamonds I posted for you. It should be as obvious as the nose on your face what the similarities are between the 'good' stones I posted for you in terms of cut and the contrast between those and the 'bad' diamonds I posted for you. I didn't say any of them had "great" light return. Colored diamonds are not cut for light return. I posted ones WITH significant issues and ones without. That's all you will get with colored diamonds. Okay? They are different beasts than white diamonds. Color first.

You need to learn to use your eyes. Numbers on a lab report tell you nothing about fancies or colored diamonds, let alone fancy cut and fancy colored diamonds.


As for sites that say 'ideal' or whatever for cut on cushions: the large majority of that is meaningless vendor BS. GIA does not grade cushions for cut. Only AGS does, and only for a VERY select number of branded stones. Ignore them. They will only confuse you. Only BN's Signature line (even though it is not an AGS 0 line, and is technically an excellent cut), GOG's AVC line, and Canera's Cushions, and BGD's Hearts and Arrows cushions, and Briella cushions are "ideal" cushions. Pretty much nothing else is.

You have to buy WHITE cushions by faceting and light performance.

But you are looking for a COLORED cushion. And what matters there is FIRST color, then cut/performance. And colored diamonds are not cut for ideal light performance. They are cut for color. With colored diamonds what you want to avoid is dark, lifeless spots of light loss and also avoiding windows. If you LOOK and STUDY the diamonds I posted for you, you should be able to see what I mean.

OKay?
 
Brilliant! By George I think I've got it! Lol, I hope I haven't exasperated you, but I've learned a great deal just for your responses tonight. Can't thank you enough. All the best, you're an :angel:
 
No problem. Here to help. :wavey: :wavey:
 
Hi Elizabeth,
Congratulations on your impending purchase.
Personally, I do not believe that you can ascertain important light performance information from the photographs on most of the vendors websites.
In terms of "windows" you will need to see the stone in motion to be able to see any window. Every diamond will show a window as you tilt it, the question is of degree.

In terms of trapezoidal side stones – it really needs to be done physically. There's no workable formula. Many times stones will surprise me when I put them next to each other. That is to say sometimes I thought they would look great together and they don't, and sometimes I did not think they would look good together but put them together and… Bang - amazing combination.
Hope this helps and best of luck in your search.
 
Hi David,

Thanks for joining the conversation and sharing your expertise. Although exciting it's a difficult task shopping for something as complex and expensive as diamonds online. Some websites have those helpful videos with the stones spinning around, but so many don't. For the complete novice that leaves info and pictures. Gypsy's advice helped me see something I didn't see before. I took the photos of the six diamonds she referenced and placed them side by side. Wow! It was SO easy then to see what she was talking about. But you are of course correct. I won't be able to see or see through the windows of a stone until I see its dance/performance. :D
Happily most vendors offer to share their expertise and help filter out the definitely nots. I'll be taking advantage of all the help they want to give.

Onward!
 
You're welcome Elizabeth, my pleasure!
Excellent that you are looking at pictures and noticing differences. Given that you are purchasing on the Internet that is going to be an important element in the recipe of buying successfully.
One thing to keep in mind about pictures is that they are static. They are showing you the diamond as it looks in that lighting environment, at that very instant. One thing that I have noticed about fancy colored diamonds is that they tend to change color based on the lighting environment as well as the colors around them.
Part of this has to do with the way they are cut – fancy colored diamonds gather light from all over- even the bottom of the Diamond may find light and use it well.

If you're speaking with someone in possession of the diamond they can look at it and give you their impressions. Multiple photos in different lighting environments would also be good.
But another fact of life is that Fancy Colored stones can change appearances after they are set. This is common. Sometimes for the better, sometimes… not
 
I agree that if you choose a faint yellow, you should think about side stones in the D/E/F color range to maximize the color in the center stone. As you can see from this thread, some prefer faint yellow colors, while others prefer more intense color. For me, faint yellows just don't offer enough bang for my buck and they come off looking like what I would consider a stone of lesser quality. Obviously, color preference is a personal preference, so I wish you the best of luck in finding a yellow that's just right for you =)
 
Thanks David. I did read that setting the yellow stone in a yellow-gold setting helps intensify the color.

I'll keep your advice in mind as I shop. :D
 
I just saw a three-stone ring with the center stone an M color. It helped me see what you are saying momhappy. I definietly want more color than that.

Thanks :D
 
I have a 3-stone ring (medium yellow center stone with two, near colorless trillion side stones). The basket for the yellow center stone is 18K yellow gold and the rest of the setting is white gold. The yellow gold blends really well with the center stone and adds warmth.
 
Your ring sounds gorgeous momhappy. Is there any way you could post a picture here?
 
Gypsy|1412308244|3761076 said:
I would advise you to post on the Colored stones board.

It is important to remember is that color is graded FACE DOWN. Where there is NO light return. Not face up where there is light return and refraction. You wear diamonds set. FACE UP.
Click to expand...

Diamonds on the D-Z scale are graded face down, fancy colored diamonds below Y-Z are graded face up for color.
 
I do agree that seeing stones in motion is VERY important. If you can work with a vendor that can make nice videos for you, that would be ideal. If not... then there are other work arounds.
 
MelisendeDiamonds|1412393592|3761810 said:
Gypsy|1412308244|3761076 said:
I would advise you to post on the Colored stones board.

It is important to remember is that color is graded FACE DOWN. Where there is NO light return. Not face up where there is light return and refraction. You wear diamonds set. FACE UP.
Click to expand...

Diamonds on the D-Z scale are graded face down, fancy colored diamonds below Y-Z are graded face up for color.
Click to expand...

I did post that the information you quote is for white diamonds only. Not colored diamonds.

But I didn't know that Y-Z are graded face up. What about fancy colors? I assume those are as well.
 
Gypsy, may I ask you, well please excuse me but I have been sitting here trying to envision pee yellow. I hope I do not enjoy wearing pee yellow and I am almost afraid to ask.:))) I would rather not go into detail I think about which may qualify.

I really enjoyed reading your tutorial though. I agree with everyone here that especially with FCDs they should be seen in motion, it is extremely hard to photograph them right. It is also hard to tell with some of these online photos posted whether they have better color and cut IRL or are the way they look on the photos,honestly even some of these better ones suffer and hopefully it is only the pix.
 
So I looked and couldn't find a radioactive pee (which is what I call the color) diamond. Occasionally they come up and I find them very off putting.

Yellow diamonds are so hard to shop for because the shades and the modifiers really make a difference.
This for me is the perfect vivid "saffron" yellow. It's got a tiny bit of orange (to me) in it. I love this shade:
http://www.leibish.com/yellow-diamond/070ct-fancy-vivid-yellow-cushion-vs1-93944-16340

They refer to it as Zimmi color, after the mines Sierra Leone.

This one is also Vivid yellow, but it lacks that 'saffron" yellow (hinting toward orange) color. So while it is lovely (truly), I just don't find it as amazing as the 70 pointer above. http://www.leibish.com/yellow-diamond/180ct-fancy-vivid-yellow-cushion-vs2-53876-12379
 
Oh, it would have been lovely to see the pee yellow. Ok, so when you say radioactive then I can envision it more but it makes me think of the angry/loud yellow color of treated yellows, so not sure if this was what you meant.

I think that people have strong preferences when it comes to what shade of yellow they prefer and it can be a difficult color to wear because of skin tones, I think this is why people often prefer the lighter, cooler, lemony yellows.

Yes the warm orange-yellows I absolutely love but I also love the cooler shades leaning towards green and being less saturated. I think the latter works better with many skin tones and wardrobes, including perhaps my own. It is not so important when we are talking about rings but definitely more so when it comes to other types of jewelry.

Thanks for the entertaining comparison.:)))
 
Oh, it would have been lovely to see the pee yellow. Ok, so when you say radioactive then I can envision it more but it makes me think of the angry/loud yellow color of treated yellows, so not sure if this was what you meant.

I think that people have strong preferences when it comes to what shade of yellow they prefer and it can be a difficult color to wear because of skin tones, I think this is why people often prefer the lighter, cooler, lemony yellows.

Yes the warm orange-yellows I absolutely love but I also love the cooler shades leaning towards green and being less saturated. I think the latter works better with many skin tones and wardrobes, including perhaps my own. It is not so important when we are talking about rings but definitely more so when it comes to other types of jewelry.

Thanks for the entertaining comparison.:)))
 
^The treated yellows definitely have a different intensity (and not in a good way IMO). I don't care for the colors of treated stones (especially blues and yellows). As far as untreated yellows, yes, everyone has their preferences. I prefer bright, sunny yellows - I'm not a huge fan of orangey-yellows and/or yellows with a greenish tint.
 
I hear you momhappy, no, the treated ones do not have attractive color, it is a very strange, very fake looking, loud color in most cases.

Unfortunately for my wallet, I love all yellows but perhaps my most favorite ones are the pretty pure yellows which match almost everything and are very happy stones but cooler, greenish yellows really appeal to me as well and orangey ones are really summery happy. Love their nuances for sure.
 
momhappy|1412606172|3762910 said:
^The treated yellows definitely have a different intensity (and not in a good way IMO). I don't care for the colors of treated stones (especially blues and yellows). As far as untreated yellows, yes, everyone has their preferences. I prefer bright, sunny yellows - I'm not a huge fan of orangey-yellows and/or yellows with a greenish tint.
Click to expand...

We hear this from a lot of people.
Although a Vivid Yellow is the "king" of Yellow Diamonds, a lot of people like lighter shades.
There's quite a difference from an M color- which might be closer to the scatological term Gypsy used ( which really depends on how much water one drinks) to a U-V color, for example.
So you're by no means alone Momhappy
 
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