Quadex Vs. Radiant Square Vs Jubilee

[manhong]

Does anyone know what is the difference between the following diamond cuts:

Quadex
Radiant Square
Jubilee

It seems that all 3 cuts are very similar. I was ring shopping at the local mall with my girlfriend a couple of weeks ago and she liked the radiant cut that was square in shape (vs the rectangular radiant cut) on the following setting: http://design.jared-diamonds.com/engagement-rings/settings-with-sidestones/ring/item_58-6141.asp . However, I know that the radiant square cut won't give off as much "bling" as any of the other cuts. I need some advice on whether or not the Quadex and Jubilee cuts are the same as a Radiant Square cut. Also, would she be able to tell the difference between a radiant square cut vs. a princess? I will probably get the setting custom made to be the same as the link above, but I worry if a Quadex, Jubilee, or Princess center stone will look as good as a Radiant Square.

 

[Rockdiamond]

HI Manhong,
Great question- and one that is a source of debate around here.
My feeling is that a truly well cut radiant will look nothing like a Quadrax or a Jubilee.
Those cuts basically take a square stone, and impose a round diamond's facet pattern on it.
This creates a totally different type of look.
The creator of the cut was Henry Grossbard- his company is still around.
He envisioned an even sparkle that does not show the type of patterning like a round. Instead there's a tremendous number of small points of light.
This creates a "bucket of crushed ice" effect.
Much like a bottomless put of sparkle.

When looking at a well cut radiant of this sort, the appearance is nothing like those of the branded stones you metnioned

 

[manhong]

Thanks Rockdiamond. What do you think about a square radiant cut versus a princess?

 

[Rockdiamond]

Two totally different stones- although ostensibly, similar.
The clipped corners of a radiant create an entirely different pattern on the top and bottom of the stone.
A case could be made that the clipped corners of a radiant are safer than the 90 degree corners of a princess....
But it really does come down to taste.
Have you seen both/either in person?

 

[StoopidMonkey]

Princess of Hearts is another brand that's comparable to the Quadex and Jubilee cuts. Any one of those would outperform a radiant cut. However, I'd also be open to square shaped August Vintage Cushion cuts. They're not necessarily "better" than square H&A stones, but the faceting is notably different and worth a look to see which you prefer better. Good Old Gold has a couple comparison videos on YouTube.

 

[marymm]

Did your GF elaborate on what she liked about the square radiant? Is it possible it wasn't just the square shape but also the specific cut - meaning she preferred the radiant's overall performance? Did she pass over the princess cuts and round brilliants in favor of the radiant? If your GF communicated that she likes the radiant cut the best, I would suggest you focus on selecting the best radiant within your budget (even if your diamond preference is something else). If it is just the square shape she likes, you do have more latitude - which perhaps makes it even harder to choose!

 

[Rockdiamond]

Princess of Hearts is another brand that's comparable to the Quadex and Jubilee cuts. Any one of those would outperform a radiant cut. However, I'd also be open to square shaped August Vintage Cushion cuts. They're not necessarily "better" than square H&A stones, but the faceting is notably different and worth a look to see which you prefer better. Good Old Gold has a couple comparison videos on YouTube.

Interesting Stoopidmonkey- I completely disagree

In terms of performance- there is no truth whatsoever to a general statement that the branded stones "outperform" a radiant.
First, we need to consider the quality of the radiant's cut- there's a range of stones called "Radiant"
If we want to throw consistency into the mix, there's a branded Radiant Cut which offers consistency in the quality of cut to rival the brands mentioned above

Then, we need to define "performance"
A patterned type of stone has a totally different look that a well cut crushed ice radiant. The branded Radiant Cut is designed to give an even, endless "Crushed Ice" appearance. In that regard, such stones will outperform the brands with the patterns
I would encourage anyone to view more than one vendor's videos- as the opinion of the person making the video affects what is shown.
The videos Stoopidmonkey refers to will not show want a well cut crushed ice radiant looks like

 

[manhong]

@marymm: My GF liked the square radiant cut over the round cut on this particular setting on her finger and didn't care about the light performance. However, she did not see how it compared to the princess cut. My plan was to go back to the jewelry store and compare a square radiant cut to a princess cut on this particular setting. If I can't tell the difference, then I might get the princess cut diamond because they are more available online and cheaper in price. She does prefer square cuts in general (except for cushion) so I'm sure that she won't care if it is a square radiant cut or a princess cut diamond.

 

[manhong]

@Rockdiamond: I have not seen the square radiant compared to a princess. I'm planning on going to a jewelry store later this week and checking it out. If I can't tell a huge difference, I will probably go with the princess.

 

[lovemybling]

Just wanted to add another opinion.

Like the other are saying, each of the stones you are mentioning are square in shape, it is the facet pattern that is different.

The Princess: Is a real square (pointy corners), I believe it has what would be called a Cheveron facet pattern. (personally this is my least favorite cut)

The radiant: Can be square or recetangular but all have cut corners (which in my opinion, is slightly safer. less likly to hit that pointy corner that a princess ha, and chip or break stone. Like others have said this stone facet pattern is more like crushed is super sparkly no real hard lines to the fascet pattern.

Square Heart & arrows, Quadex and the like: Again has cut corners but square, takes the facet pattern of a round H&A but puts in into a square stone.

So really you need to look and see which facet pattern you like then you will be able to pick the right square stone for you.

Good luck

 

[manhong]

Thanks lovemybling. I think I've got it down to either a radiant square or a princess cut. I haven't had time to go to a jewelry store so hopefully next week I will have some time to do this.

 

[Rhino]

Princess of Hearts is another brand that's comparable to the Quadex and Jubilee cuts. Any one of those would outperform a radiant cut. However, I'd also be open to square shaped August Vintage Cushion cuts. They're not necessarily "better" than square H&A stones, but the faceting is notably different and worth a look to see which you prefer better. Good Old Gold has a couple comparison videos on YouTube.

Interesting Stoopidmonkey- I completely disagree

In terms of performance- there is no truth whatsoever to a general statement that the branded stones "outperform" a radiant.
First, we need to consider the quality of the radiant's cut- there's a range of stones called "Radiant"
If we want to throw consistency into the mix, there's a branded Radiant Cut which offers consistency in the quality of cut to rival the brands mentioned above

Then, we need to define "performance"
A patterned type of stone has a totally different look that a well cut crushed ice radiant. The branded Radiant Cut is designed to give an even, endless "Crushed Ice" appearance. In that regard, such stones will outperform the brands with the patterns
I would encourage anyone to view more than one vendor's videos- as the opinion of the person making the video affects what is shown.
The videos Stoopidmonkey refers to will not show want a well cut crushed ice radiant looks like

*ahem* ... so you know for a fact that I have no videos of well cut radiants?

And in fairness there is much truth to stoopidmonkey's statement. I would dare say that *most* radiants have a very dead, watery appearance. Yes there are some great ones out there so it would be wrong to make a blanket statement but sm's statement is not off.

And regarding those rare radiants that are absolutely beautiful, to say it would "outperform" Square H&A's is equally misleading a statement Dave. To say "equally as beautiful" would really be correct and is where the individual's taste comes in to play. No?

 

[Rhino]

@Rockdiamond: I have not seen the square radiant compared to a princess. I'm planning on going to a jewelry store later this week and checking it out. If I can't tell a huge difference, I will probably go with the princess.

Good idea. In reference to princess cuts you may want to investigate the differences in appearance between princess cuts with AGS 0 light performance vs 1, 2, 3, etc. as princess cuts can vary drastically in appearance depending on their optics too. Good luck on your hunt.

Rhino

 

[Faluzure]

Thanks lovemybling. I think I've got it down to either a radiant square or a princess cut. I haven't had time to go to a jewelry store so hopefully next week I will have some time to do this.

Hey manhong, I feel your pain. I was in the same dilemma as you about a year ago when my now fiance and I went to a jewelry store to try on some rings. My fiance originally wanted a cushion, but then expressed extreme interest in a radiant featured in a video by Good Old Gold. I went through probably one of the toughest shopping tasks of my life because as others have said, radiant generally have that crushed ice appearance. The one she liked from Good Old Gold was nothing like the normal crushed ice look and therefore had me scrambling to get her a diamond like it... Which was almost near impossible. I've learned that although the name radiant implies to a cut, their appearance can vary greatly.

If you want to read my dilemma and solution, it's here: [URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/radiants-hard-to-find.140989/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/radiants-hard-to-find.140989/[/URL]

The link is a lengthy read, about 3 pages but has tons of information from fellow Pricescope users and features nearly all the radiant videos from Good Old Gold, including ones featuring mine.

In my opinion, if she likes the radiant, it's important to find out why. In my thread, it was stated that your soon-to-be-fiance will love any ring you propose to her with, but you don't want her to have some kind of opinion that she would have liked a different one. You narrowed it down to a princess and radiant shape and although the two are similar in shape, the actual cut is very different. To me, the princess Cut looks relatively dull... I did what you're doing (compared other shapes as an option to the radiant she wanted like the jubilee, a square cushion, etc,) but in the end, she still chose the radiant over the others for her own reasons.

 

[Rockdiamond]

Princess of Hearts is another brand that's comparable to the Quadex and Jubilee cuts. Any one of those would outperform a radiant cut. However, I'd also be open to square shaped August Vintage Cushion cuts. They're not necessarily "better" than square H&A stones, but the faceting is notably different and worth a look to see which you prefer better. Good Old Gold has a couple comparison videos on YouTube.

Interesting Stoopidmonkey- I completely disagree

In terms of performance- there is no truth whatsoever to a general statement that the branded stones "outperform" a radiant.
First, we need to consider the quality of the radiant's cut- there's a range of stones called "Radiant"
If we want to throw consistency into the mix, there's a branded Radiant Cut which offers consistency in the quality of cut to rival the brands mentioned above

Then, we need to define "performance"
A patterned type of stone has a totally different look that a well cut crushed ice radiant. The branded Radiant Cut is designed to give an even, endless "Crushed Ice" appearance. In that regard, such stones will outperform the brands with the patterns
I would encourage anyone to view more than one vendor's videos- as the opinion of the person making the video affects what is shown.
The videos Stoopidmonkey refers to will not show want a well cut crushed ice radiant looks like

*ahem* ... so you know for a fact that I have no videos of well cut radiants?

And in fairness there is much truth to stoopidmonkey's statement. I would dare say that *most* radiants have a very dead, watery appearance. Yes there are some great ones out there so it would be wrong to make a blanket statement but sm's statement is not off.

And regarding those rare radiants that are absolutely beautiful, to say it would "outperform" Square H&A's is equally misleading a statement Dave. To say "equally as beautiful" would really be correct and is where the individual's taste comes in to play. No?

Interesting Jon- so , if you love the way a stone looks, it's acceptable to say it "outperforms" others- but if its not your taste, then the statement is inaccurate. Maybe I'm not getting your meaning- but that's how it sounds
Personally, I don't feel the word "performance" is applicable at all when discussing diamonds- and for exactly the reason you state- taste comes into play- however sm made a definitive statement, which deserved a reply in kind so that a more balanced picture emerges.

In terms of videos- in this thread, you recently posted a link to a video called "Understanding Crushed ice" which proves clearly that you're not discussing the same type of stone I am when I use the term "crushed ice".
Did you happen to look at the video I posted in response Jon?
To save all of us the time, if you have a video of the type of stone in my video ( specifically, a stone with small virtual facets, that shows no patterning whatsoever- yet is very bright), please post it. Since the video you posted specifically mentioned crushed ice- and it was clear to me you did not understand what beautiful crushed ice is based on that that video, I naturally assumed any of your other videos would be more of the same.

Lets agree that quite a few fancy shaped diamonds are not all that well cut- and it's crucial to evaluate them one by one. Again, singling out radiant cut for a statement like "dead, watery" is simply more derogatory statements made against something you don;t like- however many others do love true crushed ice Radiant cuts.
What do you have against water Jon?
My point is, in our words we can suggest facts when they are opinions.
That's why infomercials are clearly labeled as such.
There's absolutely nothing wrong in sharing one's vision- but please, let's be crystal clear ( like the beautiful blue crystal clear waters of the Caribbean) about whether we're discussing facts, or opinions.


ETA- When I use the term "radiant cut" I'm referring the non patterned, small virual facets with limited dark areas. The "bottomless put of crushed ice" this is what the creator of the cut had in mind- as opposed to the parrterned square stones- which I agree- are very lovely.
The actual Original Radiant Cut brand is still based on this type of appearance.

 

[jstarfireb]

@marymm: My GF liked the square radiant cut over the round cut on this particular setting on her finger and didn't care about the light performance. However, she did not see how it compared to the princess cut. My plan was to go back to the jewelry store and compare a square radiant cut to a princess cut on this particular setting. If I can't tell the difference, then I might get the princess cut diamond because they are more available online and cheaper in price. She does prefer square cuts in general (except for cushion) so I'm sure that she won't care if it is a square radiant cut or a princess cut diamond.

OK, this tells me a few things...
1) She prefers the optics of smaller/multiple flashes over larger/fewer flashes.
2) She prefers a square outline over a rounded outline.

FWIW, her preferences are the same as mine on these issues. I got an AGS ideal-cut princess as I prefer the optics of a princess over those of a radiant. That is to say I like the "chevron" appearance over the "crushed ice" appearance (and yes, I agree that there is good crushed ice and bad crushed ice).

As people have mentioned, the Quadex, Jubilee, and Princess of Hearts cuts have optics similar to a H&A round, which would not be her preference. Additionally, the Jubilee has a somewhat rounded outline more like a cushion, which she also would not prefer. So a well-cut princess or radiant would be a great choice for her, but I wouldn't consider the others.

Now, in terms of performance...there are stones with good performance and stones with poor performance in every shape and cut. What Jon is saying (and I agree, for that matter) is that MOST radiants out there on the market have less than ideal performance. So do MOST princesses. However, you can find fantastic princesses and radiants...it just takes some searching. Good radiants are even harder to find than good princesses, because AGS grades princesses for cut performance, and you can just pick out an ideal cut princess...done! Radiants don't have that benefit, so you have to see them with your own eyes and preferably with an ASET if that's available.

There are a few other considerations. Radiants are known for showing more color than any other cut; this is why they're often used for fancy colored diamonds. Princesses are also known to show a bit more color than well-cut rounds, but not as much as radiants. There's also the issue of corners, which can be damage-prone. I actually love having sharp corners on my princess because there's something clean and modern about the look. I considered cut-cornered princess stones but decided the sharp corners were integral to my concept of a princess. Most people will say a cut-cornered stone is a safer choice because it's less prone to breakage.

 

[manhong]

@Faluzure: Thank you very much for your story and the link to the article. It is very very helpful to me and I feel like I'm in the same boat as you. After reading your post, I think I'm going to go with a princess after all since it's easier to find and a lot of online vendors have many very good princess cuts.

 

[manhong]

@jstarfireb: Thanks for your feedback. Assuming that money is not an issue, what is the lowest color grade that you would recommend for a princess cut and a radiant cut? I was thinking either a G or H color for both stones, but I would like to get your opinion.

 

[manhong]

@Rhino: Thank you for the info. Also, I really appreciate all of the videos that you put on vimeo and it has helped me a lot in my diamond search. I wish GOG did custom rings as I probably would have done business with GOG.

 

[Faluzure]

@Rhino: Thank you for the info. Also, I really appreciate all of the videos that you put on vimeo and it has helped me a lot in my diamond search. I wish GOG did custom rings as I probably would have done business with GOG.

Actually, just to clarify GOG does do custom rings. I'm not sure to what degree that it's done (from scratch vs modified), but in my case, I wanted a specific type of design and they worked with me to make it into a reality.

 

[Faluzure]

@Faluzure: Thank you very much for your story and the link to the article. It is very very helpful to me and I feel like I'm in the same boat as you. After reading your post, I think I'm going to go with a princess after all since it's easier to find and a lot of online vendors have many very good princess cuts.

NP. Glad to help. It's very stressful to say the least.

 

[Rhino]

@Rhino: Thank you for the info. Also, I really appreciate all of the videos that you put on vimeo and it has helped me a lot in my diamond search. I wish GOG did custom rings as I probably would have done business with GOG.

'
We do custom and have also done custom cutting as well.

 

[Faluzure]

@Rhino: Thank you for the info. Also, I really appreciate all of the videos that you put on vimeo and it has helped me a lot in my diamond search. I wish GOG did custom rings as I probably would have done business with GOG.

'
We do custom and have also done custom cutting as well.

+1 to that. Jonathan will do whatever it takes to make you happy and even bend over backwards for you. My fiance's ring is custom all the way from setting to diamond.

P.S. - Hi Jonathan. Hope all is well. Merry Christmas!

 

[rubybeth]

One advantage of a cut cornered stone like a radiant is that it won't need the square corner-protecting prongs that a princess will. I have a half carat square radiant from WhiteFlash (I VS2) and it's in the classic tiffany-style 4 prong solitaire, no additional corner protection needed. I personally love the little pinpoint flashes that I get with this stone, and would never replace it, but would love an August Vintage Cushion as an anniversary present in a few years.

As for lowest color, only you can decide how color sensitive you and your future wife are, and it's also going to depend on the size of the stone to some extent (larger stones can show more color) and the setting you choose (if you can see the stone from the side, you may see 'body color' but it could look white from the top down. My 4.75mm I-color looks very white to me, but it's pretty little compared to a 1 carat round (6.5-6.7mm).

 

[manhong]

@Rhino: I spoke with Marie via e-mail and she told me that GOG doesn't do custom designs. I sent her some pictures of a custom design and she found me a similar design, but when I asked her about custom designs, she said "We need to beef up our staff if we do the custom ring thing. Maybe someday…We will be happy to help you at another time maybe". Maybe Marie was mistaken?

 

[jstarfireb]

@jstarfireb: Thanks for your feedback. Assuming that money is not an issue, what is the lowest color grade that you would recommend for a princess cut and a radiant cut? I was thinking either a G or H color for both stones, but I would like to get your opinion.

I personally wouldn't go lower than I color for a princess, probably H for a radiant. My ideal cut princess is an I, and in general I don't see much color in it, only a little from the side view. But face-up it looks identical to my SIL's F color princess unless the lighting is very dim.

Of course, if money isn't an issue, I'd say the higher the better. If I had infinite funds, I probably would have picked up an F or G.

 

[manhong]

Thanks. That was my thought as well. I still need to go to a jewelry store to see the stones in person.

 

[Rockdiamond]

Thanks. That was my thought as well. I still need to go to a jewelry store to see the stones in person.

I agree- that's a great idea. Of course it's not going to be easy finding a store with a broad selection of well cut radiant and princess cuts.

 

[manhong]

I went to a jewelry store yesterday to look at both stones and I thought the princess cut looked slightly better than the radiant square cut in the setting. I think I will get a princess cut stone. It was difficult for me to discern the difference between both and I think she won't care either. The other thing I noticed is that I could tell the difference between a IGI rated G colored princess cut stone versus an IGI rated princess cut I colored stone. I could not discern much difference between an IGI rated G colored princess stone versus an IGI rated princess cut H colored stone, but it was slightly noticeable. However, I do know that IGI rated colored stones are no where near as strict as a GIA or AGS rated stone.

Having been to 2 B & M jewelry stores in my search, I am committed to buying the stone online. Too many pushy sales people that don't know what they are talking about. Also, the pricing is better online.