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PRICE INCREASES ... AGAIN?

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moremoremore

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Mar 15, 2004
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6,825
OK- am I crazy...or have prices gone up AGAIN this week...maybe it's b/c price links are being updated...but it just seems that every time I look at a stone, it's gone up by several hundred dollars? It's really starting to tick me off. I guess you just have to pick a stone and move fast on it? This is so frustrating. Has this always been the case...or are the constant price increases a new trend?

**** TO MAKE IT CLEAR- I AM NOT COMPLAINING ABOUT A VENDOR RAISING PRICES AFTER THE MANU DOES SO. MY PROBLEM IS THAT THE MANUFACTURERS SEEM TO KEEP RAISING THEM....FREQUENTY!!!
 
Hi MMM,

Prices have been creeping up in many categories.

For instance: last Friday prices 2.00-2.99 pear shape list had increases from D/IF thru K/SI-3.

Bigger goods are tighter, its not just talk.
 
I'm so glad someone started this thread. I was thinking the same thing. It definitely seems to me that I can no longer get the basic same stone I purchased almost 15 months ago for the same price.
 
You wrote the following:

"For instance: last Friday prices 2.00-2.99 pear shape list had increases from D/IF thru K/SI-3."


Where are the price increases usually posted? Do consumers have access to these postings?

Thanks.
 
Headlight- I'm talkin even more often than that!!!
sad.gif

I look at whiteflash's site b /c they seem to update...pricescope links are old man...I can and have tracked major increases. every week.

Well, this past week, mid week, I wanted to call in a stone...we got sarin... This morning it was 700 more. I'm pissed. I don't really want it for the current price. How can I feel like I'm getting a good deal now from the manufacturer? (this has nothing to do with the vendor, b/c their prices are based on the manu prices)How is it that in a span of two weeks I can't afford a 2 carat F vs2? I could two weeks ago but now can't?

A stone I actually purchased two weeks ago and returned is also now several hundred dollars more. It's insane. If I can't close the deal SOON, it's not gonna happen b/c I can't afford the initial stone specs I wanted. It's crazy. (I also doubt that vendors who have outdated links honor the prices they posted.)


But seriously...how is it that a manufacturer increases prices by 700 in one week? That to me is a total bull sh*t. I just feel like we are gettin hosed by the manufacturers.
 
MMM,

I have to agree with you. I have been in the market for a larger radiant (based on immediate shrinkage!!
Up_to_something.gif
since I just got my new one last December). I was informed that the increase was around 25%. If it is even more, I will hold out for a lab grown, I can assure you of that. I feel that the prices are over inflated by whoever (DeBeers
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) is holding onto rough etc. There is only so much these mines can expect people to pay before the whole market hits rock bottom (no pun intended!
naughty.gif
)!

My beautiful radiant (the slightly shrunken one) will do just fine until either pigs fly or the market comes to reasonable pricing! I will not be price gouged!!
angryfire.gif
 
I wonder how long til lab growns are available. I'd go for that. I am at a point where I'm sick of it all and there aren't really any amazing stones that I see out there...so I'll need to be taking a break for diamonds and maybe revisit after Christmas. I have two candidates.. but I really am settling...which sux. If they don't work out. That's it. I also asked Jon to maybe ask the manu about a break on the price...b/c any increase would have been very recently I think....I guess the lesson is that you need to act quickly and not drag your feet...
 
I just wanted to add that I can understand increases...but every few weeks? I just don't understand how it works I guess...if I'm looking at a stone that a manu owns...how does the price go up? Didn't they acquire it at a certain price which doesn't change?
 
You better find and buy one soon.
 
LOL...I'm workin on it. I sent Jon an SOS. I have narrowed it to two. One doesn't look GREAT...the other is a lower color but higher clarity (G vs1)...at least we know it's eye clean...right EP? lol
 
Keep looking until you find the one that speaks to you. You'll know when you find it.
 
I can't afford to keep looking....by monday, prices could go up again...
naughty.gif
 
Maybe one will speak to you on Monday. LOL.
 
ep6585, I have to tell you this (and by the way, no offense), but everytime I read your messages...it's like your dog is speaking. His picture looks like he is just a "plain spoken" tell it like it is dog. He is so precious...I just love it when I see your messages!
 
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On 8/7/2004 8:49:27 PM moremoremore wrote:

I just wanted to add that I can understand increases...but every few weeks? I just don't understand how it works I guess...if I'm looking at a stone that a manu owns...how does the price go up? Didn't they acquire it at a certain price which doesn't change? ----------------
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more,
let me take a shot at this- look at it from the vendor's point of view. if the vendor had a stone and he was asking $10,000 for it two weeks ago, ..even though they could make money today by selling the same stone for 10K, now to replace that stone today, it might cost them $10,500. so they have no choice but to raise the prices. example would be if the spot price of gold was $390 per oz.last week, and today the spot price is $400 per oz. a commodity dealer's can't sell one ounce of gold based on $390 spot price,because it cost them more to replace that one oz. of gold, seems like every vendor is raising the price on their stones- especially 2+ ct and up.
 


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On 8/7/2004 7:52:21 PM moremoremore wrote:




How is it that in a span of two weeks I can't afford a 2 carat F vs2? I could two weeks ago but now can't?

But seriously...how is it that a manufacturer increases prices by 700 in one week? That to me is a total bull sh*t. I just feel like we are gettin hosed by the manufacturers.
----------------
Click to expand...

It's a fairly new concept.......called "supply and demand".

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(Kidding)



It's the same reason that I could have afforded a given house two years ago, but now I cannot. The market price of a thing is how much someone is willing to pay for it. As availability becomes scarce, bidding (or what people are willing to pay for it) becomes intense, driving up the price. If people are willing today to pay $700 more for something than they were two weeks ago, then that's what the market will bear.



Honestly, this shouldn't be a surprise to the most occasional of readers on PS. The vendors on here have been chattering about the scarcity of large, decent rough for MONTHS now and warning prices would be affected.



Sooooooooooo glad we bought at the end of last year!
 
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On 8/7/2004 8:46:19 PM moremoremore wrote:

I have two candidates.. but I really am settling...which sux. If they don't work out. That's it. I also asked Jon to maybe ask the manu about a break on the price...b/c any increase would have been very recently I think....I guess the lesson is that you need to act quickly and not drag your feet...----------------
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Two things.

1. Never settle, life is too short.

2. Prices are moving and have been for some time now, and they are moving quickly. At a full retail margin, we can afford to absorb some of the change, but at internet margins, if our cost goes up $200 your cost goes up $200. Recently, as stated, the prices are going up a LOT more than $200 and it will only accelerate between now and Christmas. There have been many posts advising of current and coming price increases, and there will be more.

I have heard many times that it is not fair to raise prices on goods I already own just because prices went up, but how many of you will sell your home for the same price you bought it for, just because it isn't fair to raise prices? If I own a stone that cost me 10k and now it costs 11k I can hardly sell it for less than the 11k that I would spend to replace it, and at internet margins that is just what I would be doing if I did not raise the price. If you find a stone that you want and then return it, don't be surprised that when you decide you want it to find the price having moved.

Within the trade some vendors have even tried to raise prices on stones already out on memo. Not something I would ever do, but I have heard some horror stories. If you want a stone, move on it or be prepared to pay a higher price. Still, do not be preasured into buying a stone you do not want.

Our cutters and site holders are being squeezed by DeBeers who wants to trim many of us from the business so that they can return to the days of fewer vendors and higher margins. Do not think that the pricing will be advantageous to you as consumers if this happens.

Wow, who is this masked man? Wink on cough syrup, it's not a pretty sight...

Wink
 
And not too surprising, as I read further every one of my comments looks copied from respondants who read this earlier than I...

Sigh.

Wink
 
I think I can understand both sides here.

Yes, it is tough for the consumer to swallow a price increase on something that is already in stock. We say to ourselves...now they are just making that much more on the diamond. This concept of replacement of the stone. I sort of see it, but then the next stone can yield the same profit can't it, at the new pricing?

I think to see the other side of the coin here, though, lets think of it this way. Let's say your looking at a 1ct. G VS1 diamond. It is listed at $7,000 (not sure if that is realistic...just bear with me here). Of course, the retailer has a certain markup in the stone, say $1,000 (again maybe not realistic...but bear with me). So essential your paying the retailer's cost for getting the diamond $6,000 + $1,000 in markup. Now tomorrow rolls around and you want the stone. You hear the price of G VS1 diamonds has DROPPED $700. Are you willing to pay $7,000 for that diamond yet...because the retailer has the stone in stock and that is what he paid for it. MOST LIKELY NO! You want the diamond for $6,300 all together, leaving your friend like Wink in trouble paying the bills for the month.

That is my attempt on business for this evening. I hope my thinking is not off base here.

I am a consumer sticking up for our good friends in the business here. And by the way, I am currently looking at diamonds for purchase, so it may effect me too...although I may be prompted to act quick :-)
 
BTW...does anyone know where the prices are being raised at. Across the board, or just in the higher carat areas?
 
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On 8/8/2004 12:20:32 AM wonka27 wrote:

You want the diamond for $6,300 all together, leaving your friend like Wink in trouble paying the bills for the month.----------------
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Wah, that is just what happened to your good old buddy Wink. He replaced a bunch of diamonds at the beginning of 1980 when prices were at an all time high. Within three months I was selling them at a fraction of what I had paid for them, that REALLY hurt. In February 1980 a one carat D-Flawless went between dealers at the Diamond dealer's club for $65,000 per carat. Same stone six months later was going for about $9k wholesale. Ten years earlier the same stone would have sold retail for about 4k retail. If I had held on to the stones I bought in Jan, Feb of 1980, I still could not get for them now what I paid for them then.

Wink
 
This thread is so depressing. I feel like I am doing a disservice to the vendor(s) who spends time working with me and then I leave them high and dry when I don’t move on a purchase…and apparently it’s hurting my pocketbook, too, the longer I linger and await the perfect stone to appear. I can’t help but feel sorry for the business people who have invested their time only to reap no sale. My emotions are symptomatic of the Stockholm syndrome!
15.gif
 
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On 8/8/2004 12:20:32 AM wonka27 wrote:

I think I can understand both sides here.

Yes, it is tough for the consumer to swallow a price increase on something that is already in stock. We say to ourselves...now they are just making that much more on the diamond. This concept of replacement of the stone. I sort of see it, but then the next stone can yield the same profit can't it, at the new pricing?

I think to see the other side of the coin here, though, lets think of it this way. Let's say your looking at a 1ct. G VS1 diamond. It is listed at $7,000 (not sure if that is realistic...just bear with me here). Of course, the retailer has a certain markup in the stone, say $1,000 (again maybe not realistic...but bear with me). So essential your paying the retailer's cost for getting the diamond $6,000 + $1,000 in markup. Now tomorrow rolls around and you want the stone. You hear the price of G VS1 diamonds has DROPPED $700. Are you willing to pay $7,000 for that diamond yet...because the retailer has the stone in stock and that is what he paid for it. MOST LIKELY NO! You want the diamond for $6,300 all together, leaving your friend like Wink in trouble paying the bills for the month.

That is my attempt on business for this evening. I hope my thinking is not off base here.

I am a consumer sticking up for our good friends in the business here. And by the way, I am currently looking at diamonds for purchase, so it may effect me too...although I may be prompted to act quick :-)----------------
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wonka,
yes, if i was a dealer i would sell you the stone for $6300 as long as i can replace the stone for less than $6300.
 
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On 8/8/2004 12:32:24 AM Wink wrote:

----------------
On 8/8/2004 12:20:32 AM wonka27 wrote:

You want the diamond for $6,300 all together, leaving your friend like Wink in trouble paying the bills for the month.----------------
Click to expand...
Wah, that is just what happened to your good old buddy Wink. He replaced a bunch of diamonds at the beginning of 1980 when prices were at an all time high. Within three months I was selling them at a fraction of what I had paid for them, that REALLY hurt. In February 1980 a one carat D-Flawless went between dealers at the Diamond dealer's club for $65,000 per carat. Same stone six months later was going for about $9k wholesale. Ten years earlier the same stone would have sold retail for about 4k retail. If I had held on to the stones I bought in Jan, Feb of 1980, I still could not get for them now what I paid for them then.

Wink
----------------
Click to expand...

wink,
that is exactly what happened to the rare coin market, except it happened in the spring of 1992. a coin that traded at $50,000 when the market was at its high, a year later the same coin can be bought for $20,000 and nobody want it. all i could do was sell those coins for a loss...but try to replace it at a cheaper price. i guess the same goes for the diamond market.
 
Yes, and if we diamond dealers think we have it tough, you coin dealers seem to have invented working for nothing. You did not seem to have to change your margins much to work on the internet, you were already there for many years...

Wink
 
Well if it gets to the point that pleasure vs cost gets unfavorable just dont buy.
No one actualy needs a diamond.


Any dealer that raises the price of an instock diamond over a two week period that im looking at will either sell it to me at the original price or get told to stick it where the sun dont shine.
Thats my bootom line.
On called in stones they dont have controll of the price so I would be nicer about it but would still likely tell em no thanks.
Thats my bottom line too.

I dont play that game replacement cost has nothing to do with profit margins its what was paid for the diamond.
 
supply and demand has little if anything to do with it.
Its market manipulation pure and simple.

Using the same rationalization of higher replacement costs why not just charge more because the price might go up in the next year.
Hey it works for the gas companies.
Woops I forgot no one needs a diamond and with gas were pretty much stuck…..
 


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On 8/8/2004 7:57:28 AM strmrdr wrote:





I dont play that game replacement cost has nothing to do with profit margins its what was paid for the diamond.


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Really? That's the only criteria for profit margin, huh? What was paid for the diamond vs. what it sold for?



I wonder, then, where the jeweler is supposed to recoup the cost of the shoppers who don't end up buying? Where do they recoup the cost of labor in taking pictures of diamonds, sending idealscopes, etc, shipping the diamond, etc.........exactly where do they recoup those costs? Hmmm.....what about phone lines, webservers, storefront overhead (if they have one)........I guess the jewelers are just supposed to foot all of those expenses out of pocket, huh?



I'm sorry, but as Wink pointed out, if your house value goes up 10K in the next three months, I sincerely doubt you would sell at that time (3 months later) for the pre-increase price to someone who looks at it today but doesn't make an offer until 3 months from now because he wasn't sure about it.



If *I* was the jeweler, my feeling would be "sorry, but I don't play THAT game. If you wanted the price it was two weeks ago, you could have bought at that price then. Any smart consumer knows that the costs of goods could go up or down at any given moment, and they should be astute enough to take that into consideration in their buying process. If you choose not to buy from me at the current price, that's fine also.....someone else will."





 
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On 8/8/2004 8:01:36 AM strmrdr wrote:

supply and demand has little if anything to do with it.
Its market manipulation pure and simple.

----------------
Click to expand...


It is the market manipulation that frosts me. I feel very bad for the honest jewelers just trying to make a sale. The ones manipulating the market will likely put the whole industry in jeopardy since there is only so much increase the market will bear on a diamond.
 
oh boy here we go again....

AL,
The cost of all the things mentioned was in the original price.
The cost of the diamond and enough profit to cover the stuff you mentioned was in the original asking price.
Any aditional is just greed.

Now about the house, good luck selling a house that was listed at 100k then ask 110k two weeks later to a person that wanted it at 100k its not likely to happen most people would righfully tell you to stick it.
 
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