Please help me with my e-ring

[CTKai]

hi everyone,

last time i was here trying to find a diamond that i want with in $6000, after searching for few month i couldn't reach that goal, now i
change the plan, and bump up the budget of the the diamond to $7500 and drop the price of the setting, cause i want to get my money worth and will upgrade the setting later. i tried to look for diamonds at WF(ACA)and BrianGavins(Signature), and they are both a lot more expensive than JamesAllen(True Hearts) and i wonder why? also wondering if anyone on PS own any JamesAllen(True Hearts)? cause they told me that all i will be getting is the GIA Cert. nothing else to prove the Hearts&Arrows, is this true?

i found two diamonds at JamesAllen they are both true heart diamonds:

http://www.jamesallen.com/?q=204065...arat-I-color-vs2-clarity-ideal-cut-sku-204065




http://www.jamesallen.com/?q=204065...rat-J-color-vvs2-clarity-ideal-cut-sku-181408



let me know what you guys think
Thank you
Kai

 

[SMC]

I think Brian Gavin and Whiteflash have more stringent H&A requirements than JA, so their diamonds command a premium. It doesn't mean that JA's H&As are bad and I doubt you'll be able to tell the difference between a JA and BGD stone (all else being equal).

If you want H&A, either of your selections are fine - I'd go with the I diamond over the J.

Hopefully someone will weigh in on what you get with an H&A purchase from JA.

 

[bunnycat]

I think Sortmon is right, WF and BGD have stricter criteria for H/A classification. But it looks like that I you have on hold is pretty nice. The IS is good and the angles look good. (I also agree go with the I over the J.)

As for H/A designation, I think it's been discussed recently and I don't know what is inscribed on the girdle of it, but you can inscribe whatever you want on a diamond girdle. I don't think any of the labs issue H/A on the reports. It's not part of a diamond grade, it's just a cool benefit of really good cutting and having all the proportions and angles and symmetry line up just right. It'snot a special cut.

If you need/want H/A but for less $$ than you'd pay at BGD or WF, you've probably got a good choice there with the JA stone.

If you want a really well cut stone, but don't care if it hits the H/A symmetry, then you might check out the BG Blue line (fluorescent stones that are well cut but don't necessarily have H/A) because it costs less than the H/A SIgnature line. Or you might look through WF inventory of their in-house Expert Selection line. I think those are their in house stones that didn't make H/A symmetry. you can save money that way to and still get a well cut, well performing stone.

here's an example in your budget:

http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/diamonds/diamond-details/1.150-i-vs2-round-diamond-ags-bl-104062571011

http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-2762642.htm

 

[JulieN]

I wouldn't want to pay for the VVS2 clarity on the J you posted. You should be able to stay under 6000 if you want a J.

http://www.jamesallen.com/#!/loose-diamonds/round-cut/1.14-carat-j-color-si1-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-205555
http://www.jamesallen.com/#!/loose-diamonds/round-cut/1.11-carat-j-color-si1-clarity-sku-204958

 

[04diamond<3]

The I VS2 looks great!!

 

[CTKai]

i found these two diamond on the BGD website one is smaller SI1 and one with strong blue fluorescence in it and they
are both more expensive than the one i found at JA, so please take a look at it and let me know where the I-VS2 diamond
i found at JA stands.
http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/d...1.150-i-vs2-round-diamond-ags-bl-104062571011
http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/d...ls/1.077-i-si1-round-diamond-ags-104064191018

thank you
Kai

 

[bunnycat]

i found these two diamond on the BGD website one is smaller SI1 and one with strong blue fluorescence in it and they
are both more expensive than the one i found at JA, so please take a look at it and let me know where the I-VS2 diamond
i found at JA stands.
http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/d...1.150-i-vs2-round-diamond-ags-bl-104062571011
http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/d...ls/1.077-i-si1-round-diamond-ags-104064191018

thank you
Kai

Either of those is going to be lovely. BG cuts really nice stones and they are pretty much the cream of the crop for performance. Every stone is cut to very tight specs as was mentioned, probably tighter than JA stones. That's just an opinion though as I've never spoken to JA about the standards to which they cut their H/A and I have talked to BG about his so perhaps I have a personal bias there.

Whether the BG will outperform the JA one I can't say. You'd probably have to get them both in and see for yourself side by side. The IS on all of them look great and so none of the are going to be duds by any means. I can only say from my own experience that the stone I had previously in my ring was an AGS000 and the one I have in there now is BG Blue and both hubby and myself consider it a better stone than the last one which was really nice and one we considered hard to beat.

 

[SMC]

i found these two diamond on the BGD website one is smaller SI1 and one with strong blue fluorescence in it and they
are both more expensive than the one i found at JA, so please take a look at it and let me know where the I-VS2 diamond
i found at JA stands.
http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/d...1.150-i-vs2-round-diamond-ags-bl-104062571011
http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/d...ls/1.077-i-si1-round-diamond-ags-104064191018

thank you
Kai

I think that you probably won't be able to tell the difference between a BGD stone and a JA True Hearts stone. One of the things you should consider is if you prefer the effect of fluorescence or not. Fluoro will make a stone appear whiter in the presence of UV light (sunlight). I would choose between the JA I stone and the BGD Blue stone. I'd probably not consider the BGD H&A stone as it is smaller and more expensive. The BGD Blue is not also sold as Hearts & Arrows. I think you have to decide if you would rather have fluoro and the BGD brand name or guaranteed Hearts & Arrows (JA).

Disregard the following if you've already found a setting locally: Another thing to consider is the setting that you are getting. Have you picked out acceptable settings from each place? It's easier to get the setting and the diamond from the same vendor so you don't have to deal with the hassles of getting insurance and/or shipping your stone from one place to another.

Finally, you can't go wrong with any of the stones you've chosen!

 

[TC1987]

I would pick the BG Blue I over the James Allen I, because of the florescence. It will whiten the apparent color. AGS grades more strictly on cut than GIA does, so that's another reason.

 

[CTKai]

I would pick the BG Blue I over the James Allen I, because of the florescence. It will whiten the apparent color. AGS grades more strictly on cut than GIA does, so that's another reason.

i don't understand this at all:

First of all, i know AGS grades more strictly on cut than GIA does, however i also know that GIA grades more
strictly on color than AGS does, so a AGS I = GIA J, so if on paper both diamond are cut equal why pick AGS I over GIA I color?

Second, i know a diamond with florescence in it will whiten the apparent color, however it holds lower market value right? so why should i pay more for less?

Third, i pick out diamonds from JamesAllen inventory base on the numbers so if all the number show on GIA paper indicates this as a great cut diamond why does it matter if AGS grades more strictly or not? i didn't just pick GIA EX or AGS Ideal

if anyone can help me out with those questions that will be great

thank you
Kai

 

[SMC]

I would pick the BG Blue I over the James Allen I, because of the florescence. It will whiten the apparent color. AGS grades more strictly on cut than GIA does, so that's another reason.

i don't understand this at all:

First of all, i know AGS grades more strictly on cut than GIA does, however i also know that GIA grades more
strictly on color than AGS does, so a AGS I = GIA J, so if on paper both diamond are cut equal why pick AGS I over GIA I color?

Second, i know a diamond with florescence in it will whiten the apparent color, however it holds lower market value right? so why should i pay more for less?

Third, i pick out diamonds from JamesAllen inventory base on the numbers so if all the number show on GIA paper indicates this as a great cut diamond why does it matter if AGS grades more strictly or not? i didn't just pick GIA EX or AGS Ideal

if anyone can help me out with those questions that will be great

thank you
Kai

I don't know if I have the answers to all your questions, but I'll try. First of all, AGS grades are all about light performance. Some people place a premium on AGS 000 stones. This premium may more than compensate the effect of AGS's slightly looser color grading. However, I think that most people view AGS and GIA as almost equivalent certs. I think AGS 000 stones seem to command a slight premium over GIA XXX stones too, so all else being equal, an AGS 000 stone should be more than a GIA XXX stone.

Secondly, fluoro does discount the stone but the discount is less as the color grades go down. In my opinion, the Brian Gavin brand name holds a value that more than offsets the fluoro discount.

I agree with you on the third question. I think that they are both great stones. From the tone of your post, I think that your preference seems to be more towards the JA stone, so you should get that one! Personally, I'd probably pick the JA stone too, but mostly because I knowing my stone has hearts and arrows, even if I can't visually tell the difference.

 

[CTKai]

I would pick the BG Blue I over the James Allen I, because of the florescence. It will whiten the apparent color. AGS grades more strictly on cut than GIA does, so that's another reason.

i don't understand this at all:

First of all, i know AGS grades more strictly on cut than GIA does, however i also know that GIA grades more
strictly on color than AGS does, so a AGS I = GIA J, so if on paper both diamond are cut equal why pick AGS I over GIA I color?

Second, i know a diamond with florescence in it will whiten the apparent color, however it holds lower market value right? so why should i pay more for less?

Third, i pick out diamonds from JamesAllen inventory base on the numbers so if all the number show on GIA paper indicates this as a great cut diamond why does it matter if AGS grades more strictly or not? i didn't just pick GIA EX or AGS Ideal

if anyone can help me out with those questions that will be great

thank you
Kai

I don't know if I have the answers to all your questions, but I'll try. First of all, AGS grades are all about light performance. Some people place a premium on AGS 000 stones. This premium may more than compensate the effect of AGS's slightly looser color grading. However, I think that most people view AGS and GIA as almost equivalent certs. I think AGS 000 stones seem to command a slight premium over GIA XXX stones too, so all else being equal, an AGS 000 stone should be more than a GIA XXX stone.

Secondly, fluoro does discount the stone but the discount is less as the color grades go down. In my opinion, the Brian Gavin brand name holds a value that more than offsets the fluoro discount.

I agree with you on the third question. I think that they are both great stones. From the tone of your post, I think that your preference seems to be more towards the JA stone, so you should get that one! Personally, I'd probably pick the JA stone too, but mostly because I knowing my stone has hearts and arrows, even if I can't visually tell the difference.

thank you so much for your quick reply and i don't prefer JA stone over the BG Blue, i just want to find out the reason behind it about how they price everything, also i think you did a great job answering my question and now i understand that florescence doesn't discount much as the color grades go down especially if it carries BG's name with it.

only part i don't get is this, if a GIA XXX stone have all the same number as the AGS 000 stone; would a AGS stone still be more expensive? and i wondering why, cause 34.9 crown angel is a number and if the number is the same what's the magic behind it to make AGS 34.9 crown angel more expensive?

thank you for reading
Kai

 

[bunnycat]

I would pick the BG Blue I over the James Allen I, because of the florescence. It will whiten the apparent color. AGS grades more strictly on cut than GIA does, so that's another reason.

i don't understand this at all:

First of all, i know AGS grades more strictly on cut than GIA does, however i also know that GIA grades more
strictly on color than AGS does, so a AGS I = GIA J, so if on paper both diamond are cut equal why pick AGS I over GIA I color?

Second, i know a diamond with florescence in it will whiten the apparent color, however it holds lower market value right? so why should i pay more for less?

Third, i pick out diamonds from JamesAllen inventory base on the numbers so if all the number show on GIA paper indicates this as a great cut diamond why does it matter if AGS grades more strictly or not? i didn't just pick GIA EX or AGS Ideal

if anyone can help me out with those questions that will be great

thank you
Kai

I don't know if I have the answers to all your questions, but I'll try. First of all, AGS grades are all about light performance. Some people place a premium on AGS 000 stones. This premium may more than compensate the effect of AGS's slightly looser color grading. However, I think that most people view AGS and GIA as almost equivalent certs. I think AGS 000 stones seem to command a slight premium over GIA XXX stones too, so all else being equal, an AGS 000 stone should be more than a GIA XXX stone.

Secondly, fluoro does discount the stone but the discount is less as the color grades go down. In my opinion, the Brian Gavin brand name holds a value that more than offsets the fluoro discount.

I agree with you on the third question. I think that they are both great stones. From the tone of your post, I think that your preference seems to be more towards the JA stone, so you should get that one! Personally, I'd probably pick the JA stone too, but mostly because I knowing my stone has hearts and arrows, even if I can't visually tell the difference.

thank you so much for your quick reply and i don't prefer JA stone over the BG Blue, i just want to find out the reason behind it about how they price everything, also i think you did a great job answering my question and now i understand that florescence doesn't discount much as the color grades go down especially if it carries BG's name with it.

only part i don't get is this, if a GIA XXX stone have all the same number as the AGS 000 stone; would a AGS stone still be more expensive? and i wondering why, cause 34.9 crown angel is a number and if the number is the same what's the magic behind it to make AGS 34.9 crown angel more expensive?

thank you for reading
Kai

I'm not exactly sure I'm understanding your question, but I'll give it a go.

A BG stone is going to command a premium because it's a branded BG stone. They are all cut to specific specs within his specific preferred tolerances. Look at any of his stones and read the angles and you will see. In other words, you probably aren't ever going to see a 35.5 crown angle or a 41.1 pavilion, like you might in a JA stone.

Also, AGS does not grade soft on color. We're not talking lumping in AGS with someone like IGI or EGL Isreal. In studies that were done between the labs I believe there was a conflict in approximately 1 out of 10 stones that were borderline cases if I remember correctly when I read it. You are not going to get something like AGS calls it an H and GIA call it a J or K. It seems like it's become an almost automatic panic for people and then it gets assumed it happens on every stone. Even GIA guidelines give a 1 grade leeway allowance. Yet in the same study, the percentage of cases where GIA and AGS tended to conflict in clarity grading in several out of 10 cases and that is always completely ignored.

AGS000 stones are in general, a smaller subset of GIA XXX and also AGS tends to be chosen by the people who make branded cuts, which are automatically going to be more expensive so there's some factors involved. I don't know JA specifics on their H/A brand. I don't know whether they get stones in and check them for H/A and then sell them as H/A if they happen to exhibit the pattern, or if they are having them cut specifically and that could account for some of the price difference so you need to compare apples to apples. Like I said, the main vendors here that sell branded H/A stones have them cut SPECIFICALLY and tend to specifically send them AGS for grading. It's not happenstance and cutting diamonds specifically for H/A and not just getting a stone in that happens to fit wastes a lot of rough. It's more expensive to produce.

Good luck on you choice! I don't think any of them are bad ones that you have narrowed down to.

 

[SMC]

I would pick the BG Blue I over the James Allen I, because of the florescence. It will whiten the apparent color. AGS grades more strictly on cut than GIA does, so that's another reason.

i don't understand this at all:

First of all, i know AGS grades more strictly on cut than GIA does, however i also know that GIA grades more
strictly on color than AGS does, so a AGS I = GIA J, so if on paper both diamond are cut equal why pick AGS I over GIA I color?

Second, i know a diamond with florescence in it will whiten the apparent color, however it holds lower market value right? so why should i pay more for less?

Third, i pick out diamonds from JamesAllen inventory base on the numbers so if all the number show on GIA paper indicates this as a great cut diamond why does it matter if AGS grades more strictly or not? i didn't just pick GIA EX or AGS Ideal

if anyone can help me out with those questions that will be great

thank you
Kai

I don't know if I have the answers to all your questions, but I'll try. First of all, AGS grades are all about light performance. Some people place a premium on AGS 000 stones. This premium may more than compensate the effect of AGS's slightly looser color grading. However, I think that most people view AGS and GIA as almost equivalent certs. I think AGS 000 stones seem to command a slight premium over GIA XXX stones too, so all else being equal, an AGS 000 stone should be more than a GIA XXX stone.

Secondly, fluoro does discount the stone but the discount is less as the color grades go down. In my opinion, the Brian Gavin brand name holds a value that more than offsets the fluoro discount.

I agree with you on the third question. I think that they are both great stones. From the tone of your post, I think that your preference seems to be more towards the JA stone, so you should get that one! Personally, I'd probably pick the JA stone too, but mostly because I knowing my stone has hearts and arrows, even if I can't visually tell the difference.

thank you so much for your quick reply and i don't prefer JA stone over the BG Blue, i just want to find out the reason behind it about how they price everything, also i think you did a great job answering my question and now i understand that florescence doesn't discount much as the color grades go down especially if it carries BG's name with it.

only part i don't get is this, if a GIA XXX stone have all the same number as the AGS 000 stone; would a AGS stone still be more expensive? and i wondering why, cause 34.9 crown angel is a number and if the number is the same what's the magic behind it to make AGS 34.9 crown angel more expensive?

thank you for reading
Kai

I think the reason an AGS stone might command a premium is just that there's a greater demand for them because they're guaranteed to perform well. It's kind of a branding thing, the same way that a Tiffany diamond will be lots more expensive than a non-Tiffany even if the stone angles are the same.

 

[TC1987]

I would pick the BG Blue I over the James Allen I, because of the florescence. It will whiten the apparent color. AGS grades more strictly on cut than GIA does, so that's another reason.

i don't understand this at all:

...

I picked the Brian Gavin I color diamond because:
I prefer a diamond with about 55%-56% table and 15% crown height. The Brian Gavin Blue I-color diamond is is more "my" type of diamond proportions. I also own a diamond that Brian Gavin recut, so I have done business with him in the past and am satisfied. I also own an I-color antique diamond that has strong blue fluorescence, and I have seen I-color diamonds that don't have any fluor, and I prefer the fluor effect. These vendors of PriceScope are not flea market sellers, and I don't expect to get the rock-bottom muleskinner's price out of them. In fact, I expect to and am quite content to pay a bit more for a diamond from a vendor who provides images, data, and services to help me make my decision, and I truly appreciate the vendors who publish all of that online, without my having to ask for it. I am less pleased with any vendor who doesn't publish all of that online, and puts a 3-diamond limit on my requests for information.

I don't believe that AGS color consistently differs one grade from GIA. A borderline case can be graded either way. Most appraisers that two graders can disagree by one grade in either clarity or color. I am nonplussed by the complaints that AGS grades softer than GIA on color. Color is important, but it can be analyzed and verified. Some of the sellers here have a colorimeter in the shop or lab (Good Old Gold does) and they can run an analysis to see if the diamond is the color that the report says, or whether it's high or low in that grade. But GIA "I" color grade is the narrowest one, so grading stones in that range of color should be pretty straightforward: Either it is an I, or it isn't.

There are fewer AGS-graded diamonds than GIA-graded diamonds. Cut is the most important thing to me. I don't mind discrete but visible inclusions. AGS gets a lot of superideal-cut diamonds sent to them. GIA gets them, too, but also gets a large quantity of other stones, too. I owned one GIA 3x and there was just something about it that I fund bland. I upgraded to a AGS-graded stone, and I love it.

If the Brian Gavin diamond doesn't meet your needs, then just buy the other one. Pricescope is a marketplace for the best-cut and best-performing diamonds. I have no affiliation with any PS vendors, other than I have bought diamonds from Good Old Gold and Brian Gavin, and I made the right choices for me. Your priorities might be different from mine.

 

[CTKai]

http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/d...nd-ags-104063255014#!prettyPhoto[gallery2]/1/

i was told to get this diamond from the Brian Gavin sales if i have the budget, what do you guys think

 

[SMC]

http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/d...nd-ags-104063255014#!prettyPhoto[gallery2]/1/

i was told to get this diamond from the Brian Gavin sales if i have the budget, what do you guys think

Two questions:
1. How much is the JA I VS2 1.16 diamond? I can't see the price since you have it on hold.
2. Where are you getting the setting from? And what setting is it?

 

[CTKai]

http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/d...nd-ags-104063255014#!prettyPhoto[gallery2]/1/

i was told to get this diamond from the Brian Gavin sales if i have the budget, what do you guys think

Two questions:
1. How much is the JA I VS2 1.16 diamond? I can't see the price since you have it on hold.
2. Where are you getting the setting from? And what setting is it?

hi Sortmon,

the JA VS2 1.16 diamond price is $7060, bank wire PS price is $6855
i will get the setting from JA if i buy it from them
http://www.jamesallen.com/#!/engage...solitaire-engagement-ring-six-prong-item-7990
i am going for this setting in 14k yellow gold because of the price

and this is the diamond Brian Gavin suggested if i have the budget
http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/d...ls/1.208-j-si1-round-diamond-ags-104063255014
it looks really nice but it's J color and after discount it will be $7264.76
then i will go with this setting http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/e...e/six-prong-solitaire-14k-yellow-gold-5351y14

like what i said in the beginning, i was going to spend more for the Tiffany setting from the vendor maybe the U-113 now i plan to go for cheaper setting and put most of the my money on diamonds, i don't know if i am doing the right thing......

after a second look by myself i think i will put this one into consideration http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/d...ls/1.060-g-si2-round-diamond-ags-104062318001
cause i don't think i want fluorescence in the diamond so BGBlue is out of the question, and i want the Hearts and Arrows let me know
what you guys think out of those three diamonds

 

[SMC]

http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/d...nd-ags-104063255014#!prettyPhoto[gallery2]/1/

i was told to get this diamond from the Brian Gavin sales if i have the budget, what do you guys think

Two questions:
1. How much is the JA I VS2 1.16 diamond? I can't see the price since you have it on hold.
2. Where are you getting the setting from? And what setting is it?

hi Sortmon,

the JA VS2 1.16 diamond price is $7060, bank wire PS price is $6855
i will get the setting from JA if i buy it from them
http://www.jamesallen.com/#!/engage...solitaire-engagement-ring-six-prong-item-7990
i am going for this setting in 14k yellow gold because of the price

and this is the diamond Brian Gavin suggested if i have the budget
http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/d...ls/1.208-j-si1-round-diamond-ags-104063255014
it looks really nice but it's J color and after discount it will be $7264.76
then i will go with this setting http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/e...e/six-prong-solitaire-14k-yellow-gold-5351y14

like what i said in the beginning, i was going to spend more for the Tiffany setting from the vendor maybe the U-113 now i plan to go for cheaper setting and put most of the my money on diamonds, i don't know if i am doing the right thing......

Tough choice! And it's yours to make. I guess, for me personally, I'd choose the JA diamond because objectively, it's a higher color, higher clarity, and it's cheaper. Both stones have hearts and arrows. The difference in diameter will be the width of a piece of paper.

Is the Brian Gavin brand name worth that much more to you? That's for you to decide.

Oh and one of your linked settings is yellow gold and one of the settings is white gold. I think either will be nice and will be fine with either stone.

 

[CTKai]

Hi Sortmon,

i just update my last post and added a link to it, you reply me before i can publish the link
and for the white gold setting that i posted they don't have it in yellow gold but they will make it for me once i order it from them
after more reading and learning from you guys, i think know what i want, so it really narrow down to 3 diamonds


$7060 before any discount, cheapest out of 3 and can have set in a budget setting for $180 but it's not AGS Cert and not BGD
http://www.jamesallen.com/?q=204065...arat-I-color-vs2-clarity-ideal-cut-sku-204065



AGS Brian Gavin Signature smallest size out of 3, don't know if it's eye clean
http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/d...ls/1.060-g-si2-round-diamond-ags-104062318001

AGS Brian Gavin Signature biggest in size but lowest in color and highest price tag
http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/d...ls/1.208-j-si1-round-diamond-ags-104063255014

please help me out guys
thank you
Kai

 

[SMC]

I've already given you my thoughts on what I would choose (the JA stone) because I think clarity, color, and price savings are more important than brand name. Hopefully others will weigh in as well but in the end, the decision is yours.