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Please help me find my engagement ring! Round 2-5 Carats

D

DNTA22

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jan 27, 2014
Messages
8
Hi everyone, I have read this forum for a while and we have just started looking at rings. So far we have visited Tiffanys and a few local jewelers (Chicago-area).

What we are looking for:
-2.5 to 5 carat round solitaire (I think most likely in the 3-4 carat range since I don't want it to overpower my finger...my ring size is 6.5)
-6 prong setting (because I like the rounder look and more security for the diamond)
-either a plain band, micro-pave band or with 2 tapered baguettes on the side

I have read about James Allen, Whiteflash etc., on PS as both of us are new to buying diamonds so this process has been a bit scary for us. Here are my concerns:
1) If we buy from an online retailer, how do I get my ring cleaned, checked for maintenance etc?
2) What if one of these smaller retailers or online retailers goes out of business, what happens then?
3) I have read on here that some people were able to get discounts at the bigger name jewelers such as Cartier, Harry Winston .... is paying their premium price worth it so that you always know there is a store you can go into for any issues?
4) What about Costco? I love costco's warranty but I have read on PS that if you have to resize the ring it voids the warranty and I know Costco doesn't offer the service...so who would resize my ring and maintain it?
5) What's the best way to locate someone local to independently appraise a diamond?

Sorry for all the questions, but this is a big investment and everyone here knows so much more than both of us so I really would appreciate any and all input. We are open to any and all suggestions! Thank you for your time and help!
 
What is your budget?
 
Open budget right now, but obviously would like to get the most for our money. Personally I would sacrifice a bit on color, clarity to get a larger stone. Reading PS has taught me that cut is something not to skimp on.
 
1. Any jeweler can clean your ring free of charge and they should loupe it and check it for you before they do. I get mine cleaned all the time at any jeweler I pass (except for Tiffany, etc. which will only clean their own pieces). Sizing can be done by any jeweler as well. It's not free. But you aren't talking a lot of money. You could save thousands shopping online. So that money goes toward your 80 dollar sizing free (for platinum, gold is cheaper). Same with any repair. It's just like moving. You move to a new state... where are you going to take your ring to? You just need to post for us and we can point you toward a good local jeweler (preferrably one with an in house bench) to help you.

2. I'm not sure what you are asking. Same thing as any store going under. You don't need the store for anything. Except maybe if you have an upgrade policy and want to use that. You have your ring. Why does it matter if a store goes out of business? They don't take your ring back.

3. It's a personal thing. I personally don't think it is worth it at all. Getting your jewelry taken care of is REALLY easy. If you can shop for groceries without assistance you can take care of jewelry. I personally would rather save money and get the same quality or better elsewhere. Some people have to have the brand name for whatever reason though. You have to be honest with yourself if you are one of those people or not. If you aren't, then don't waste your money. Also, there are some proprietary cuts, like the Lucida that you can only get at a certain jeweler. That' might be worth the mark up for some as well.

4. What warranty? You don't really need much of a warranty on jewelry. It's not a car. Not a lot goes wrong. As long as the piece is covered by a basic manufacturers warranty then you are fine. And I don't recommend Costco, unless you need a lifetime RETURN policy. But you can't size or alter it if you do that as you can't return it if sized.

5. You need an independent appraiser. One that is not tied to any retail establishment. Here's a list: https://www.pricescope.com/appraisers
EDITED TO FIX LINK.
 
Here is some basic knowledge to get you started. Please click on the links and read them. You are spending THOUSANDS of dollars and you need to study up a bit before you get going. :read:

The entire purpose of faceting a diamond is to reflect light.
How well or how poorly a diamond does this determines how beautiful it is.
How well a diamond performs is determined by the angles and cutting. This is why we say cut is king.
No other factor: not color, not clarity has as much of an impact on the appearance of a diamond as its cut. An ideal H will out white a poorly cut F.
You want an accurately graded stone as well. So you want to stick to AGS or GIA for labs. And GIA Ex is not enough.
So how to we ensure that we have the right angles and cutting to get the light performance we want?
https://www.pricescope.com/wiki/diamonds/diamond-cut
Well one method is to start with a GIA Ex, and then apply the HCA to it.
https://www.pricescope.com/wiki/diamonds/holloway-cut-advisor
The HCA is a rejection tool. Not a selection tool. It uses 4 data points to make a rudimentary call on how the diamond may perform.
If the diamond passes then you know that you are in the right zone in terms of angles for light performance.
Is that enough? Not really.
So what you need is a way to check actual light performance of your actual stone.
That's what an idealscope image does. https://www.pricescope.com/wiki/diamonds/firescope-idealscope
It shows you how and wear your diamond is reflecting light, how well it is going at it, and where you are losing light return. That is why you won't see us recommending Blue Nile, as they do not provide idealscope images for their diamonds. James Allen, BGD, HPD, GOG, ERD and WF do.

The Idealscope is the 'selection tool'. Not the HCA.
So yes, with a GIA stone you need the idealscope images. Or you can buy an idealscope yourself and take it in to the jeweler you are working with to check the stones yourself. Or if you have a good return policy (full refund minimum 7 days) then you can buy the idealscope, buy the stone, and do it at home.


Now if you want to skip all that... stick to AGS0 stones and then all you have to do is pick color and clarity and you know you have a great performing diamond. Because AGS has already done the checking for you. That's why they trade at a premium.


Also you do not need D IF unless there are cultural reasons for such high color and clarity. You should consider F-G VS2's as they offer the best balance of color and clarity for the conservative shopper.

And here is a thread about super-ideal cuts and what you "really" need in a diamond: [URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/likelihood-of-finding-a-signature-super-ideal-diamond.174235/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/likelihood-of-finding-a-signature-super-ideal-diamond.174235/[/URL]

:wavey:

EDITED TO FIX LINK.
 
Here are a few stones to get you started thinking about price.
http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/diamonds/diamond-details/3.087-g-vs2-round-diamond-ags-bl-104066449001 Blue
http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/diamonds/diamond-details/4.090-h-vs2-round-diamond-ags-bl-104065989001 Blue
http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/diamonds/diamond-details/4.610-g-vs1-round-diamond-ags-104063508001 Signature
http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/diamonds/diamond-details/3.077-f-vs2-round-diamond-ags-104067280002 Signature

That's if you stick to superideal and F-H and VS clarity.

So you might want to decide on your budget range. And then we can help you figure out color, clarity and other factors.
 
Another question I forgot to put in my first post.

Do you recommend buying the diamond and having it set at the same place? Is buying a loose diamond online and having it set at a store a lower cost option or is it typically the same?
 
So you might want to decide on your budget range. And then we can help you figure out color, clarity and other factors.[/quote]


I would be interested to first see what is available for less than $90,000. I am open to F-G VS2's as long as they don't look yellow.

Again, forgive me if I am wrong, but don't some jewelers offer a trade-in incentive if I want to upgrade later? Do the brand name diamonds maintain their value better?
 
It's recommended that you buy and set the stone using the same vendor, that way if anything goes wrong with the diamond during the setting, it's fully covered under their insurance policy and they'll ask you to pick another one. Simple and easy. If you buy the stone online and get a local jeweler to set it, and the jeweler damages the stone, then there's a big problem and you're at the mercy of what the jeweler wants to do. If you go through the separate vendor route it's a must to have insurance that covers the stone.

Most if not all of the vendors recommended on PS have lifetime trade in and upgrade incentives that are equal or better than retail stores. While certain brand names do hold their value better than other brand names, the quality of the diamond speaks for itself. IMO if you have a super ideal stone with the paperwork to back it up (AGS ideal cut certification, for example), it will always hold value better than a poorer quality brand name stone
 
I would be interested to first see what is available for less than $90,000. I am open to F-G VS2's as long as they don't look yellow.
Click to expand...

An H is NOT going to look "yellow" AT ALL. I would suggest going to a brick and mortar store that sells ideal cut stones (Hearts on Fire, for example. But don't buy there!) and look at stones for color preference alone. I have a D, several G's, and a J - and I love them all. The D is a cool white, the G is a neutral white, and the J is a slightly warmer toned white. But all white. And whether or not you can tell the difference when they are not next to each other is the question.

Someone here the other day used the "white paint" analogy. You can't just walk into a paint store and order "white paint". They'll laugh at you and point you to a shade selection of hundreds of colors! And chances are your eye wouldn't be able to tell the difference between 2 of them alone - not unless they are next to each other. But does that mean you "should" go for the cool-toned white if the neutral is more pleasing to your eye?

Most people can start to see color in the I-J range. I had an L for a while, and it was definitely too tinted for me. But my J is a lovely color - it faces up nice and white, just softer than my icy white more harsh looking D. I think if you stay H or above you will definitely be safe.

But as you know - do not compromise on cut quality!
 
It is important to runderstand is that color is graded FACE DOWN on a white sheet of paper. Where there is NO light return. Not face up where there is light return and refraction. You wear diamonds set. FACE UP.

Within one color grade, even the labs can't agree on the color grades of stones and something could be a "high" H or a "low" E. So... no. Not really. Within 2 color grades it is hard. Not impossible. But very hard. And it gets harder once set. If you are talking ideal rounds, or any stone with ideal light return and no sharp corners it gets harder still because the ideal light return masks body color.

Generally we say to be conservative stay above H.

This is how I think of it.

Ever gotten one of those HUGE paint fan decks? Where there are literally 100s of colors of whites? And when they are RIGHT next to each other you can TOTALLY tell that one is bluer/colder and one is a bit warmer and which one is one is TOTALLY warmer. One there's one that's slightly greener. One that's slightly pinker? But really. They are all white?

Then you pick one after agonizing over this white or that white and when it's on the walls and people are like: Oh. You painted again. And it's STILL white. Great.

And you're all... BUT it's BLUE white. Or it's a WARM white now. It used to be ____ white. It's TOTALLY different.

It's like that. You are talking about shades of white. D is colder... J is warmer. But it's all white. KL is more "candlelight" or "ivory" and you are really talking the MNO range before you start thinking... that's got yellow-- in an ideal round.

If you have an accurately graded F and an H THAT HAVE THE SAME PERFORMANCE you are going to be able to tell them apart when you compare them. But not really face up, you will have to look at the side of the stone (which is covered by a bunch of prongs) to even be able to see a slight tint. It's just like you would be able to tell if you painted your walls a slightly warmer white, but painted the crown molding a cold/straight white. But both are STILL white. But side by side you can tell the shade difference. But keep in mind you are wanting a solitaire. So you aren't going to be wearing that stone next to a D. So you are perfectly safe going to AGA and even H. G is not warm at all. H is a shade warmer... and so on. But yo

I want you notice all the qualifiers thought. I'm talking about stones with the SAME performance. An ideal H will out white an F that has compromised light performance.
 
ecf8503|1392933820|3619564 said:
I would be interested to first see what is available for less than $90,000. I am open to F-G VS2's as long as they don't look yellow.
Click to expand...

An H is NOT going to look "yellow" AT ALL. I would suggest going to a brick and mortar store that sells ideal cut stones (Hearts on Fire, for example. But don't buy there!) and look at stones for color preference alone. I have a D, several G's, and a J - and I love them all. The D is a cool white, the G is a neutral white, and the J is a slightly warmer toned white. But all white. And whether or not you can tell the difference when they are not next to each other is the question.

Someone here the other day used the "white paint" analogy. You can't just walk into a paint store and order "white paint". They'll laugh at you and point you to a shade selection of hundreds of colors! And chances are your eye wouldn't be able to tell the difference between 2 of them alone - not unless they are next to each other. But does that mean you "should" go for the cool-toned white if the neutral is more pleasing to your eye?

Most people can start to see color in the I-J range. I had an L for a while, and it was definitely too tinted for me. But my J is a lovely color - it faces up nice and white, just softer than my icy white more harsh looking D. I think if you stay H or above you will definitely be safe.

But as you know - do not compromise on cut quality!
Click to expand...

I could have just posted a "DITTO". LOL! :naughty:
 
I skimmed and may have missed this, but you have jewelry insured in case of loss or damage. After a few years, you might want your platinum polished or you might lose a little diamond in the setting, but those are low cost maintenance items that can be done by any fine jeweler. I advise people to choose a very high end jeweler for that kind of work, even if it costs a little more, because they are used to having customers that demand quality work, so it is usually the safest place to get things like that done. Buy a watch or something from the local jeweler to establish a relationship.

I wouldn't consider buying a diamond locally now that I have found vendors here. I have bought diamonds from both Good Old Gold in NY, which is a family-owned jewelry store and has been around way before diamonds were sold on the internet. I have also bought from WhiteFlash, and while they started out as a high quality internet diamond seller, they have also now opened a store in Sugarland Texas, near Houston. So I don't see either of those going anywhere! Neither has any in the 3-5 ct range in stock at the moment, but being in NY, Good Old Gold can pick up diamonds in NYC for customers all the time and will provide you with light performance information and a video comparison of stones, if you ask.
 
Under 90K.

My top picks:

http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/diamonds/diamond-details/3.087-g-vs2-round-diamond-ags-bl-104066449001 Everything in perfect balance. And medium Fluorescence to boot. And BGD Blues are pre-screened and have no negative effects. BGD has MUCH nicer in house settings that suit your requirements so that's why I am listing it first. BGD is in TX and is not going anywhere. Plus they have an awesome upgrade policy. I've bought from them many times and their pieces appraise VERY well in both setting and stone quality. http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/diamond/brian-gavins-blue-diamonds-with-fluorescence/

http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut/3.51-carat-g-color-vs2-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-280423
http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut/3.32-carat-g-color-vs2-clarity-ideal-cut-sku-269256
http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut/3.06-carat-g-color-vs2-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-228937
http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut/3.01-carat-g-color-vs1-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-25749
You would pick 3 at JA and have them do an idealscope on them for you and have the gemologist compare them for you and tell you what he sees. I don't personally love JA's settings. But they do have a few 6 prongs that might suit you. Otherwise you can just buy a setting someplace else (you would send them the diamond's lab report) and then have them send it to JA to set your diamond into it. JA's upgrade policy probably won't do you much good because I THINK you have to spend double. But they do have very good values. And they are definitely not going anywhere. JA also has a 60 day no questions asked return policy. And they pay return shipping.

UPGRADE POLICIES HERE: http://www.jamesallen.com/about-us/upgrade-policies.html
http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/home/need-help-faq/ Under Policies and special programs.

GOG and WF and HPD do not have stones H or higher in color, SI1 or better and above 2.5 carats in house.
 
Look what I found!

http://www.dimendscaasi.com/diamond/details-3.010ct-G-SI1-Preferred-Cut-Excellent Dimend Scassi is in Chicago. They have a good reputation on the boards though it is from a few years ago when they were infinity dealers, which it doesn't look like they still are. Tehy have several diamonds in your desired size range and budget LISTED but I don't know if they are in house. So... I reviewed them all and this was the only one that was in terms of dimensions, worth pursuing. SO you can call them and schedule an appointment to go see this stone.

It's a G SI1. I don't know if it is eyeclean. But you can call and ask. AND you can go down and see them and see the stone in person. And you can then SEE a G with your own eyes. And a well cut one at that!

And they have lovely settings.

http://www.dimendscaasi.com/settings/settings-platinum-Solitaire-set-rings-set-diamond-engagement-rings-juliet and they do custom work so they can make you any six prong with pave or baguettes you want.
 
Gypsy|1392934303|3619574 said:
It is important to runderstand is that color is graded FACE DOWN on a white sheet of paper. Where there is NO light return. Not face up where there is light return and refraction. You wear diamonds set. FACE UP.

Within one color grade, even the labs can't agree on the color grades of stones and something could be a "high" H or a "low" E. So... no. Not really. Within 2 color grades it is hard. Not impossible. But very hard. And it gets harder once set. If you are talking ideal rounds, or any stone with ideal light return and no sharp corners it gets harder still because the ideal light return masks body color.

Generally we say to be conservative stay above H.

This is how I think of it.

Ever gotten one of those HUGE paint fan decks? Where there are literally 100s of colors of whites? And when they are RIGHT next to each other you can TOTALLY tell that one is bluer/colder and one is a bit warmer and which one is one is TOTALLY warmer. One there's one that's slightly greener. One that's slightly pinker? But really. They are all white?

Then you pick one after agonizing over this white or that white and when it's on the walls and people are like: Oh. You painted again. And it's STILL white. Great.

And you're all... BUT it's BLUE white. Or it's a WARM white now. It used to be ____ white. It's TOTALLY different.

It's like that. You are talking about shades of white. D is colder... J is warmer. But it's all white. KL is more "candlelight" or "ivory" and you are really talking the MNO range before you start thinking... that's got yellow-- in an ideal round.

If you have an accurately graded F and an H THAT HAVE THE SAME PERFORMANCE you are going to be able to tell them apart when you compare them. But not really face up, you will have to look at the side of the stone (which is covered by a bunch of prongs) to even be able to see a slight tint. It's just like you would be able to tell if you painted your walls a slightly warmer white, but painted the crown molding a cold/straight white. But both are STILL white. But side by side you can tell the shade difference. But keep in mind you are wanting a solitaire. So you aren't going to be wearing that stone next to a D. So you are perfectly safe going to AGA and even H. G is not warm at all. H is a shade warmer... and so on. But yo

I want you notice all the qualifiers thought. I'm talking about stones with the SAME performance. An ideal H will out white an F that has compromised light performance.
Click to expand...

Gypsy, since the OP is looking at a range from 2-5 carats, and I've read that larger stones tend to show more tint than smaller stones, would they need to go slightly higher in color as the size jumps if they wanted to maintain say a "cooler" white diamond? For ex, would a 3-3.5ct G appear to be a cooler white than a 4.5-5ct G (assuming they have the same performance)? Or would the size have to be much larger to begin to show any difference?
 
diamondseeker2006|1392935190|3619597 said:
I skimmed and may have missed this, but you have jewelry insured in case of loss or damage. After a few years, you might want your platinum polished or you might lose a little diamond in the setting, but those are low cost maintenance items that can be done by any fine jeweler. I advise people to choose a very high end jeweler for that kind of work, even if it costs a little more, because they are used to having customers that demand quality work, so it is usually the safest place to get things like that done. Buy a watch or something from the local jeweler to establish a relationship.

I wouldn't consider buying a diamond locally now that I have found vendors here. I have bought diamonds from both Good Old Gold in NY, which is a family-owned jewelry store and has been around way before diamonds were sold on the internet. I have also bought from WhiteFlash, and while they started out as a high quality internet diamond seller, they have also now opened a store in Sugarland Texas, near Houston. So I don't see either of those going anywhere! Neither has any in the 3-5 ct range in stock at the moment, but being in NY, Good Old Gold can pick up diamonds in NYC for customers all the time and will provide you with light performance information and a video comparison of stones, if you ask.
Click to expand...

This was one of the reasons I leaned towards GOG for my first foray into the world of internet diamond shopping!
 
No. You're fine with G color at any size in an ideal round. You are talking a LOT of light return and miniscule tint. It's not going to look more tinted. G is VERY VERY VERY white. She doesn't need to go up in color.

One of my friends had a 3.5 carat H ideal and even high end jewelers thought the thing was an E or F routinely (she replaced it with a 4+ cushion a while back).[URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/kristydarlings-3-stone-by-leon-mege.44363/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/kristydarlings-3-stone-by-leon-mege.44363/[/URL] Here it is. The thing was HUGE and WHITE. Trust me. I drooled over that thing A LOT and with a loupe and a bunch of picky pricescopers around.

Remember diamonds REFLECT so the colors you see are from the walls, upholstery, clothing.

You put my F into a Nordstrom Cafe with their ick beige walls and it looks like it should be a K. It's just reflecting what it sees.
 
ecf8503|1392933820|3619564 said:
I would be interested to first see what is available for less than $90,000. I am open to F-G VS2's as long as they don't look yellow.
Click to expand...

An H is NOT going to look "yellow" AT ALL. I would suggest going to a brick and mortar store that sells ideal cut stones (Hearts on Fire, for example. But don't buy there!) and look at stones for color preference alone. I have a D, several G's, and a J - and I love them all. The D is a cool white, the G is a neutral white, and the J is a slightly warmer toned white. But all white. And whether or not you can tell the difference when they are not next to each other is the question.

Someone here the other day used the "white paint" analogy. You can't just walk into a paint store and order "white paint". They'll laugh at you and point you to a shade selection of hundreds of colors! And chances are your eye wouldn't be able to tell the difference between 2 of them alone - not unless they are next to each other. But does that mean you "should" go for the cool-toned white if the neutral is more pleasing to your eye?

Most people can start to see color in the I-J range. I had an L for a while, and it was definitely too tinted for me. But my J is a lovely color - it faces up nice and white, just softer than my icy white more harsh looking D. I think if you stay H or above you will definitely be safe.

But as you know - do not compromise on cut quality!
Click to expand...

This is a great idea, because we all tend to see things a little differently at times (ie, what I might think is a "neutral" white paint color, you might see as "cool" white). It's especially helpful if you're thinking of going w/ a setting w/ sidestones, depending on the design.
 
Thanks Gypsy, got it!!

I realized after reading this (along w/ ecf"s post) that I've rarely gotten to compare any ideal stones that are face up and IN SETTINGS!!! The only ideal stones I have are my melee and only one of my friends has an ideal center stone, but it's an E so yeah, it's blazing white for sure LOL :)) .

My jeweler has spent a lot of time w/ me comparing stones face-down on white paper, and well ... you know how that can go. The stones have always been loose, and even when you try to "set" them into a semi-mount, they're tilting, etc so I've never spent a lot of time trying to nail those comparisons down.

Well, now I've got an idea for my next field trip to my local jeweler's, yeah!!! :appl:

p.s., No more hijacking on my part, I promise. Sorry OP!!
 
DNTA22|1392927888|3619490 said:
Hi everyone, I have read this forum for a while and we have just started looking at rings. So far we have visited Tiffanys and a few local jewelers (Chicago-area).

What we are looking for:
-2.5 to 5 carat round solitaire (I think most likely in the 3-4 carat range since I don't want it to overpower my finger...my ring size is 6.5)
-6 prong setting (because I like the rounder look and more security for the diamond)
-either a plain band, micro-pave band or with 2 tapered baguettes on the side

I have read about James Allen, Whiteflash etc., on PS as both of us are new to buying diamonds so this process has been a bit scary for us. Here are my concerns:
1) If we buy from an online retailer, how do I get my ring cleaned, checked for maintenance etc?
2) What if one of these smaller retailers or online retailers goes out of business, what happens then?
3) I have read on here that some people were able to get discounts at the bigger name jewelers such as Cartier, Harry Winston .... is paying their premium price worth it so that you always know there is a store you can go into for any issues?
4) What about Costco? I love costco's warranty but I have read on PS that if you have to resize the ring it voids the warranty and I know Costco doesn't offer the service...so who would resize my ring and maintain it?
5) What's the best way to locate someone local to independently appraise a diamond?

Sorry for all the questions, but this is a big investment and everyone here knows so much more than both of us so I really would appreciate any and all input. We are open to any and all suggestions! Thank you for your time and help!
Click to expand...


Most have been answered already but as a 27 year diamond ering wearer lol
1. I have an ultrasonic cleaner, a toothbrush and dishwashing detergent. done. maintenance, I drop in local jeweler once a year and have the prongs checked. that's it.
2. Once you purchase a ring, a watch et al you will never get what you paid for however that being said most on line vendors have a trade up policy. We got our ering from a family jeweler yeah he's still there but we moved an hour away an It really never came up that I needed his services again witth regard to our ering.
3. Balogne on the discounts you will do much better with the quality online retailers and guidance from PS members.
4. Costco RUN Away ,,,,,only second to Jared or Kay jewelers lol
5. There is a list on the banner here at PS that guide you to an appraiser in your area. However that being said if you buy a GIA or AGS certified stone it will be helpful when the completed ring is appraised as the appraisal is for replacement value you will have the stats of the stone on ther certificate and the bill of sale from whom ever puts the ring together so you already have an idea of what it is worth
 
Gypsy|1392928726|3619499 said:
Here is some basic knowledge to get you started. Please click on the links and read them. You are spending THOUSANDS of dollars and you need to study up a bit before you get going. :read:

The entire purpose of faceting a diamond is to reflect light.
How well or how poorly a diamond does this determines how beautiful it is.
How well a diamond performs is determined by the angles and cutting. This is why we say cut is king.
No other factor: not color, not clarity has as much of an impact on the appearance of a diamond as its cut. An ideal H will out white a poorly cut F.
You want an accurately graded stone as well. So you want to stick to AGS or GIA for labs. And GIA Ex is not enough.
So how to we ensure that we have the right angles and cutting to get the light performance we want?
https://www.pricescope.com/wiki/diamonds/diamond-cut
Well one method is to start with a GIA Ex, and then apply the HCA to it.
https://www.pricescope.com/wiki/diamonds/holloway-cut-advisor
The HCA is a rejection tool. Not a selection tool. It uses 4 data points to make a rudimentary call on how the diamond may perform.
If the diamond passes then you know that you are in the right zone in terms of angles for light performance.
Is that enough? Not really.
So what you need is a way to check actual light performance of your actual stone.
That's what an idealscope image does. https://www.pricescope.com/wiki/diamonds/firescope-idealscope
It shows you how and wear your diamond is reflecting light, how well it is going at it, and where you are losing light return. That is why you won't see us recommending Blue Nile, as they do not provide idealscope images for their diamonds. James Allen, BGD, HPD, GOG, ERD and WF do.

The Idealscope is the 'selection tool'. Not the HCA.
So yes, with a GIA stone you need the idealscope images. Or you can buy an idealscope yourself and take it in to the jeweler you are working with to check the stones yourself. Or if you have a good return policy (full refund minimum 7 days) then you can buy the idealscope, buy the stone, and do it at home.


Now if you want to skip all that... stick to AGS0 stones and then all you have to do is pick color and clarity and you know you have a great performing diamond. Because AGS has already done the checking for you. That's why they trade at a premium.


Also you do not need D IF unless there are cultural reasons for such high color and clarity. You should consider F-G VS2's as they offer the best balance of color and clarity for the conservative shopper.

And here is a thread about super-ideal cuts and what you "really" need in a diamond: [URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/likelihood-of-finding-a-signature-super-ideal-diamond.174235/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/likelihood-of-finding-a-signature-super-ideal-diamond.174235/[/URL]

:wavey:

EDITED TO FIX LINK.
Click to expand...
Gypsey you should start a thread just with what you wrote so helpful for newbies et al...... :appl:
 
DNTA22|1392929706|3619510 said:
So you might want to decide on your budget range. And then we can help you figure out color, clarity and other factors.
Click to expand...


I would be interested to first see what is available for less than $90,000. I am open to F-G VS2's as long as they don't look yellow.

Again, forgive me if I am wrong, but don't some jewelers offer a trade-in incentive if I want to upgrade later? Do the brand name diamonds maintain their value better?[/quote]


Yes and No....Yes jewelers offer trade in and No brand names don't necesssaarily maintain their value and you are paying for their name. Tiffany has its own grading service
 
Hi everyone, thank you all so so much for all the advice!!

We are currently in Miami, so out of curiosity we visited a few jewelers here. I look at the AGS website, and they have a list of jewelers that carry AGS diamonds so we visited Kirk Jewelers in Miami. They are family owned and they had a few nice stones, but nothing spectacular. We also ended up looking at diamonds at Neiman Marcus...I didn't even know they sell them, does anyone have any opinion on Neiman Marcus diamonds? I will have to read the forum to find out more.

Lastly, we visited a diamond wholesaler here in Miami. Vivid Diamonds, located in the DuPont Building. They had many stones and cut their own diamonds, so we will likely go back there to look at more stones later this week.

I will post the specifics on 2 diamonds we were shown that they had in their office today. Thank you again for all your help!
 
The 2 we were shown today were:

2.17 F color, SI2, GIA cert = $22,750

3.27 K color, SI1, GIA cert = $28,000


They will be getting more stones in later this week, in the 3-5 carat range so we will likely go back again. Any opinions on these prices? Has anyone used the Rapaport price charts? That's how it appeared they were determining the prices they quoted us.
 
Pricing varies A LOT by cut quality. Get the certificate numbers of the stones you are looking at, then we can give you a better idea.
 
Gypsy|1393373376|3622995 said:
Pricing varies A LOT by cut quality. Get the certificate numbers of the stones you are looking at, then we can give you a better idea.
Click to expand...


Thank you Gypsy, you are so helpful! Do you mean the GIA certificate numbers? Is asking for the certificate number a normal/typical question to ask (i don't want to offend anyone)?
 
DNTA22|1393373571|3623000 said:
Gypsy|1393373376|3622995 said:
Pricing varies A LOT by cut quality. Get the certificate numbers of the stones you are looking at, then we can give you a better idea.
Click to expand...


Thank you Gypsy, you are so helpful! Do you mean the GIA certificate numbers? Is asking for the certificate number a normal/typical question to ask (i don't want to offend anyone)?
Click to expand...


A) yes, that's what I mean.
B)yes it is normal for an informed shopper.
C) you are spending THOUSANDS of dollars. Offending anyone by asking for more information should not even be on your radar. This isn't a beauty pageant, it's a high dollar business transaction.
 
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