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AprilBaby

Super_Ideal_Rock
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Jul 17, 2008
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11,444
It has a large table. Have you seen it? Do you like it?
 

diamondseeker2006

Super_Ideal_Rock
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Jan 11, 2006
Messages
56,287
Large table, low crown angle, low crown. That results in a fairly flat top from a profile view. I prefer 34-35 crown angle with a 15% crown or close to that. But someone who values a little extra diameter might prefer this. I just don't personally buy any stone that doesn't have excellent for light return, fire, and scintillation, and very good is usual for spread on those.
 

act1980

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Aug 14, 2020
Messages
138
Large table, low crown angle, low crown. That results in a fairly flat top from a profile view. I prefer 34-35 crown angle with a 15% crown or close to that. But someone who values a little extra diameter might prefer this. I just don't personally buy any stone that doesn't have excellent for light return, fire, and scintillation, and very good is usual for spread on those.
Would you notice the difference between stones if they were side by side? I assumed the difference would be so slight that it would be barely noticeable?
 

diamondseeker2006

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jan 11, 2006
Messages
56,287
I think I could tell the difference in a 13% crown and 59 table over a 56 table and 15% crown side by side. But I have seen a lot of diamonds, so the average person probably wouldn't. I honestly think the video of this stone looks pretty good. It would be awesome if they could provide you with an idealscope or ASET image. That would help me know more whether I could confidently recommend it or not. Is the price good? Have you compared prices?
 

OoohShiny

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Apr 25, 2014
Messages
8,192
60/60 style = likely to be more white light return than coloured fire.

As per my comment in an earlier thread, I assume you mean HCA score, not TIC score?



Have you considered starting one thread and then using that one thread to seek opinions on all the stones you are interested in, rather than starting a new thread each time?

Having separate threads for each potential stone makes it very hard to keep track of what you have seen / like / are looking for.
 

jBright

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jun 27, 2020
Messages
85
I agree with @OoohShiny why don’t you just stick to one thread? You asked for advice and help looking for a diamond and yet stopped responding to another thread. The experts here (not me) would be able to help you more and not waste your time or theirs if everything was in one thread. So they can see all of the diamonds you’ve looked at and taken off your list for one reason or the next.

I understand you are very particular in your diamond search and RIGHTFULLY so, as this is a HUGE purchase.. but if all of your information was in one thread these lovely, well-informed PS-ers would be able to help you tons if given the right information.

I saw that you said you wanted a GIA diamond - and didn’t respond when asked if AGS is okay. My fiancé purchased a GIA diamond, because this is what I grew up with and what I was comfortable with. So I’m not knocking GIA diamonds, you just need to clearly state and respond to when asked about your preferences.

Good luck on your diamond search!
 
Last edited:

act1980

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Aug 14, 2020
Messages
138
Thanks for the replies. I understand what you’re all saying about starting one thread but I start a new thread when I find another diamond as the others that I found got sold unfortunately. ☹
 

act1980

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Aug 14, 2020
Messages
138
I agree with @OoohShiny why don’t you just stick to one thread? You asked for advice and help looking for a diamond and yet stopped responding to another thread. The experts here (not me) would be able to help you more and not waste your time or theirs if everything was in one thread. So they can see all of the diamonds you’ve looked at and taken off your list for one reason or the next.

I understand you are very particular in your diamond search and RIGHTFULLY so, as this is a HUGE purchase.. but if all of your information was in one thread these lovely, well-informed PS-ers would be able to help you tons if given the right information.

I saw in one thread you said you purchased a diamond but returned it. Why? If you give this information, PS-ers will know what you DONT want in a diamond and not even recommend something like that.

I saw that you said you wanted a GIA diamond - and didn’t respond when asked if AGS is okay. My fiancé purchased a GIA diamond, because this is what I grew up with and what I was comfortable with. So I’m not knocking GIA diamonds, you just need to clearly state and respond to when asked about your preferences.

Good luck on your diamond search!
Sorry, I just had missed that. Yes I want GIA as the company I’m buying from only stock GIA diamonds.
 

jBright

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jun 27, 2020
Messages
85
Thanks for the replies. I understand what you’re all saying about starting one thread but I start a new thread when I find another diamond as the others that I found got sold unfortunately. ☹
I understand the frustration! Maybe try going back to the thread when you asked for recommendations? And state what you want in particular, GIA XXX is a huge range. And from your post I know you’re into the details, which is not a bad thing, here in PS world it’s recommended! Lol. I’ve seen the PS community work their magic and help people find the most amazing stones - and I’m sure they can be of much help to you! Good luck again!
 

act1980

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Aug 14, 2020
Messages
138
I understand the frustration! Maybe try going back to the thread when you asked for recommendations? And state what you want in particular, GIA XXX is a huge range. And from your post I know you’re into the details, which is not a bad thing, here in PS world it’s recommended! Lol. I’ve seen the PS community work their magic and help people find the most amazing stones - and I’m sure they can be of much help to you! Good luck again!
Thank you

I haven’t returned a diamond so I think that may have been someone else. I’m still trying to find “the one” ☺
 

jBright

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jun 27, 2020
Messages
85
Thank you

I haven’t returned a diamond so I think that may have been someone else. I’m still trying to find “the one” ☺
I’m sorry! It was someone else!! Disregard that! Lol let me edit my post!!
 

diamondseeker2006

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jan 11, 2006
Messages
56,287
Let me ask you one other thing. Are you looking at D color because that is your or her preference? Are you open to E or F? Is there a list of stones you are looking at somewhere? That was three questions. lol!
 

mrs-b

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Aug 18, 2013
Messages
7,960
I think I could tell the difference in a 13% crown and 59 table over a 56 table and 15% crown side by side. But I have seen a lot of diamonds, so the average person probably wouldn't. I honestly think the video of this stone looks pretty good. It would be awesome if they could provide you with an idealscope or ASET image. That would help me know more whether I could confidently recommend it or not. Is the price good? Have you compared prices?

This - absolutely. Even not in a direct comparison. I think it would be obviously low and flat.
 

LLJsmom

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Oct 24, 2012
Messages
10,039
OK, Let's try again.

Here is your reply from the other thread:

Thank you for your reply.

I should add that I am looking for a triple ex brilliant cut stone. Minimum 2.25ct, D-G colour, VS1 or higher with no to faint flou. I'm not bothered about an upgrade policy and budget is probably $35k max.
Thank you :)

SO YOU WANT:

1. D-G
2. 2.25 carats
3. GIA ONLY, 3X
4. $35K max budget
5. VS1 minimum
6. Faint to NO fluor

Have we got it all? It sounds like you don't know if you want mostly white light return or fire. So probably best to get a nice balance.

So the stone you picked is probably going to give you a lot of white light return, and NOT much colorful fire. Are you fine with that? And YES, you will definitely be able to tell the difference between this one and one that returns more colorful flashes.Even a novice will be able to tell.

Here is an F:
GIA REPORT 1348448961

https://www.bluenile.com/diamond-details/LD13425728?refTab=DIAMONDS&track=viewDiamondDetails

Think this is decent. I would examine in person to make sure the inclusions don't bother me, but you would not see them with the naked eye.

Did you see the diamonds I linked for you in the OTHER thread? Those were Gs and would give you a nice balanced look. Or realistically are you NOT open to a G?
 

act1980

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Aug 14, 2020
Messages
138
OK, Let's try again.

Here is your reply from the other thread:

Thank you for your reply.

I should add that I am looking for a triple ex brilliant cut stone. Minimum 2.25ct, D-G colour, VS1 or higher with no to faint flou. I'm not bothered about an upgrade policy and budget is probably $35k max.
Thank you :)

SO YOU WANT:

1. D-G
2. 2.25 carats
3. GIA ONLY, 3X
4. $35K max budget
5. VS1 minimum
6. Faint to NO fluor

Have we got it all? It sounds like you don't know if you want mostly white light return or fire. So probably best to get a nice balance.

So the stone you picked is probably going to give you a lot of white light return, and NOT much colorful fire. Are you fine with that? And YES, you will definitely be able to tell the difference between this one and one that returns more colorful flashes.Even a novice will be able to tell.

Here is an F:
GIA REPORT 1348448961

https://www.bluenile.com/diamond-details/LD13425728?refTab=DIAMONDS&track=viewDiamondDetails

Think this is decent. I would examine in person to make sure the inclusions don't bother me, but you would not see them with the naked eye.

Did you see the diamonds I linked for you in the OTHER thread? Those were Gs and would give you a nice balanced look. Or realistically are you NOT open to a G?
Thanks for your reply. I’ve narrowed it down to D colour with the other specs remaining the same.
Do you know of any videos where I can compare the side by side between brilliance and fire? I need to see the comparison to know my preference but I’ve not been able to find much. I’m all very new to this as you can probably tell.

Thanks!
 

act1980

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Aug 14, 2020
Messages
138
I have to admit that I’m confused by the brilliance vs fire issue. I assumed that any diamond that scores within the TIC range in the HCA tool has an equal amount of both. Hence why you get the BIC or the FIC grade as those display more of one and less of the other.
 

LLJsmom

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Oct 24, 2012
Messages
10,039

The above is a video that explains why 3X is NOT enough.


This is a very good video that explains the difference between a GIA 3X and a super ideal.

People that do want super ideals usually end up with AGS 000 stones, at a minimum.) Since you want GIA 3X, you need to stick with stones that fall within these parameters, and your chances of getting close to a super ideal look would be better.

Depth % 60-62.3
Table % 54-58

Crown angle 34-35
Pavilion angle 40.6-40.8

These are older parameters and they are working on updating this, but this is all I have. Then plug into HCA tool.

And if it's 2.0 or less, you can consider it.
 

act1980

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Aug 14, 2020
Messages
138

The above is a video that explains why 3X is NOT enough.


This is a very good video that explains the difference between a GIA 3X and a super ideal.

People that do want super ideals usually end up with AGS 000 stones, at a minimum.) Since you want GIA 3X, you need to stick with stones that fall within these parameters, and your chances of getting close to a super ideal look would be better.

Depth % 60-62.3
Table % 54-58

Crown angle 34-35
Pavilion angle 40.6-40.8

These are older parameters and they are working on updating this, but this is all I have. Then plug into HCA tool.

And if it's 2.0 or less, you can consider it.
Very informative videos, thanks for posting!
 

act1980

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Aug 14, 2020
Messages
138

The above is a video that explains why 3X is NOT enough.


This is a very good video that explains the difference between a GIA 3X and a super ideal.

People that do want super ideals usually end up with AGS 000 stones, at a minimum.) Since you want GIA 3X, you need to stick with stones that fall within these parameters, and your chances of getting close to a super ideal look would be better.

Depth % 60-62.3
Table % 54-58

Crown angle 34-35
Pavilion angle 40.6-40.8

These are older parameters and they are working on updating this, but this is all I have. Then plug into HCA tool.

And if it's 2.0 or less, you can consider it.
This one ticks all the boxes doesn't it? Would give off more fire than brilliance? Screenshot 2020-10-25 at 09.53.25.png
 

LLJsmom

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Oct 24, 2012
Messages
10,039
This one ticks all the boxes doesn't it? Would give off more fire than brilliance? Screenshot 2020-10-25 at 09.53.25.png
I am guessing it would, based on the GIA. I am guessing this would be very pretty. However if I was buying it I would want to see it in person, or else have a 100% return policy. To me this one looks promising.
 

act1980

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Aug 14, 2020
Messages
138
I am guessing it would, based on the GIA. I am guessing this would be very pretty. However if I was buying it I would want to see it in person, or else have a 100% return policy. To me this one looks promising.
Thank you. I've found a couple of others that I think meet the right proportions but I have to say that I still don't fully understand how to make it work as I know the measurements have to complement each other to get the right "look" don't they. It's pretty overwhelming when you don't know what you're doing yet looking to spend a tonne of cash :oops2: I'll upload the other 2 I've found. Not sure about the inclusions on the D colour though
 

act1980

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Aug 14, 2020
Messages
138
I think the proportions are also good on these stones but I'm not sure of the inclusions on the D?
 

OoohShiny

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Apr 25, 2014
Messages
8,192
re: the crown/pavilion angles -

When one increases, the other should decrease.

e.g.

34 degree crown, 40.9 degree pavilion

35 degree crown, 40.6 degree pavilion


Garry H has previously mentioned that it's a -1:5 ratio - e.g: if the pavilion angle decreases by 0.2 degrees, the crown angle should increase by 1 degree.

Imagine it like two two-way mirrors hinged at the girdle - they should stay in roughly the same position relative to each other but can be moved up and down together to create a range of complementary crown and pavilion angles. (If that makes any sense??)
 

act1980

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Aug 14, 2020
Messages
138
re: the crown/pavilion angles -

When one increases, the other should decrease.

e.g.

34 degree crown, 40.9 degree pavilion

35 degree crown, 40.6 degree pavilion


Garry H has previously mentioned that it's a -1:5 ratio - e.g: if the pavilion angle decreases by 0.2 degrees, the crown angle should increase by 1 degree.

Imagine it like two two-way mirrors hinged at the girdle - they should stay in roughly the same position relative to each other but can be moved up and down together to create a range of complementary crown and pavilion angles. (If that makes any sense??)
Thanks for the info. So a 36 degree crown should be 40.3? I'm not seeing those sorts of figures on GIA's, it seems it's either 40.6, 40.8, 41 etc. They all increase in even numbers. And the crown is always a .5 minimum change
 

OoohShiny

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Apr 25, 2014
Messages
8,192
Thanks for the info. So a 36 degree crown should be 40.3? I'm not seeing those sorts of figures on GIA's, it seems it's either 40.6, 40.8, 41 etc. They all increase in even numbers. And the crown is always a .5 minimum change
Imagine it like two two-way mirrors hinged at the girdle - they should stay in roughly the same position relative to each other but can be moved up and down together to create a range of complementary crown and pavilion angles. (If that makes any sense??)
Emphasis added to key word :tongue: :D lol

Although I'm not sure how you got to 40.3 by minusing 0.2 from 40.6? :???:

I see what you did, though, given my 40.9 figure, so I understand what's happened.

I'm no expert but the 40.9 reflects perhaps the upper range for a 34 crown with an excellent score in the HCA tool??

There are a wide range of angle combinations that can be attractive - the HCA tool is a tool for sifting out options, an ASETscope image is best for identifying any potential issues in a given stone.

Garry's website will probably explain things far better than I can:
 

act1980

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Aug 14, 2020
Messages
138
Emphasis added to key word :tongue: :D lol

Although I'm not sure how you got to 40.3 by minusing 0.2 from 40.6? :???:

I see what you did, though, given my 40.9 figure, so I understand what's happened.

I'm no expert but the 40.9 reflects perhaps the upper range for a 34 crown with an excellent score in the HCA tool??

There are a wide range of angle combinations that can be attractive - the HCA tool is a tool for sifting out options, an ASETscope image is best for identifying any potential issues in a given stone.

Garry's website will probably explain things far better than I can:
I feel like the more I read the more confused I get ‍:wall:
 

OoohShiny

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Apr 25, 2014
Messages
8,192
I feel like the more I read the more confused I get ‍:wall:
It does get somewhat brain-melting to try to learn everything!

The easiest thing to do is buy one of the SuperIdeal options - Whiteflash ACA, CBI, BGD - as that removes the worry about light performance. You pay a little extra for this, of course, but it removes a level of stress.

I don't believe you could hit D VS1 2.25ct+ with a USD35k budget, though.


Perhaps these might be of interest if you want to go the SuperIdeal route::













If you want to stick with GIA XXX, this link takes you to the stones in the Search tool at the top of the forum that meet D-F, VS1+, 2.2ct+ specs for up to around USD35k budget, which also have decent HCA scores and therefore decent light return:

https://www.pricescope.com/diamonds/RR76wv

That list includes stones with Fluorescence, so you'll need to go into the Advanced Filters section to select None if you don't want it.
 
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