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Ouros has a rose cut - anyone seen it in real life?

monipod

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Jun 25, 2019
Messages
813
I have been waiting for something like this for a long time and am wondering if anyone has seen one in real life.

Do you mean a rose cut in general, or Ouros' rose cut diamond in particular? I've only seen smaller stones. I love them. Not sure if they are the best sparklers but so pretty...
 

YadaYadaYada

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Feb 2, 2016
Messages
8,169
I haven’t seen any of his stones in real life but I did correspond with him about a stone in his shop. I found him to be very pushy and he said he could hold the stone with a deposit. When I asked him if the deposit was refundable (pending review of an outdoor video) he said it was not. I didn’t proceed once finding that out. Just FYI, I know folks have bought from him and been happy but that experience put me right off.
 

monipod

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Jun 25, 2019
Messages
813
I haven’t seen any of his stones in real life but I did correspond with him about a stone in his shop. I found him to be very pushy and he said he could hold the stone with a deposit. When I asked him if the deposit was refundable (pending review of an outdoor video) he said it was not. I didn’t proceed once finding that out. Just FYI, I know folks have bought from him and been happy but that experience put me right off.

Oh that's a shame. I do have a problem with the need for a non-refundable deposit just to check out the video! I had a positive experience with Vijay and found him perhaps more tenacious than pushy in that he'll follow up on enquiries quite enthusiastically, but I never felt the pressure to proceed.

However...

My issue is that I'm not sure how his stones perform, and not enough people have bought his larger stones for me to pull the trigger on a bigger purchase. I'm more inclined to go with Rhino for a lab OEC than Ouros until I can see what the latter produces. So far I am not seeing what I want to see from his OECs. The rose cut is lovely though but I'm not sure what cut/angle numbers one should want from a rose cut, and indeed what performance is expected from them.
 

shellyisa

Rough_Rock
Joined
Mar 30, 2021
Messages
9
Oh that's a shame. I do have a problem with the need for a non-refundable deposit just to check out the video! I had a positive experience with Vijay and found him perhaps more tenacious than pushy in that he'll follow up on enquiries quite enthusiastically, but I never felt the pressure to proceed.

However...

My issue is that I'm not sure how his stones perform, and not enough people have bought his larger stones for me to pull the trigger on a bigger purchase. I'm more inclined to go with Rhino for a lab OEC than Ouros until I can see what the latter produces. So far I am not seeing what I want to see from his OECs. The rose cut is lovely though but I'm not sure what cut/angle numbers one should want from a rose cut, and indeed what performance is expected from them.

Hi! I’m curious what you’re looking for in the lab OECs from Ouros that you aren’t seeing from him but you are Rhino? I’ve compared pricing and Ouros is about 1/3 of the price of Rhino (I’m looking at a large stone, almost 4 carats). Rhino’s price for a lab stone was actually more (double) than I paid for my antique earth mined OEC that is 3.5 carats. (he is amazing to work with though!!!)

Vijay just cut a moissanite OEC for me (I purchased and it’s shipping tomorrow) so I can check the exact cut in person before proceeding with the large lab stone - but from the videos thus far (a few screen shots attached) and the cut looks very similar to Rhino’s and other lab and mined OECs I’ve seen over the years.

Also, he sent me videos without any need for a deposit on in stock items he had. Multiple pics & CACC35D2-8A9F-4C4E-903B-787E3E1C836D.png videos for me to compare to find the exact cut I want. He does follow up persistently, BUT I am also in sales so it didn’t bother me :)
 

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monipod

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Jun 25, 2019
Messages
813
Hi! I’m curious what you’re looking for in the lab OECs from Ouros that you aren’t seeing from him but you are Rhino? I’ve compared pricing and Ouros is about 1/3 of the price of Rhino (I’m looking at a large stone, almost 4 carats). Rhino’s price for a lab stone was actually more (double) than I paid for my antique earth mined OEC that is 3.5 carats. (he is amazing to work with though!!!)

I can only go by the one or two OEC's that Vijay has on Etsy (so admittedly not a big enough a pool to judge from), but of the one he has currently on Etsy (https://www.etsy.com/au/listing/937...earch_query=oec&ref=shop_items_search_3&frs=1), his OEC does not have a tall crown at all at 13.5% In fact, it seems almost too shallow. It's also got a pretty big table for an OEC at 62.5% If you compare that to Rhino's OECs (this one for example for size to size comparison - https://www.distinctivegem.com/coll...uropean-cut-private-reserve-lab-grown-diamond), he's truer to the antique cut numbers with a tiny 46% table and 22.5% crown. This gives the classic flowery appearance that just isn't present for me in the Ouros stone. I also love how the culet reflects in Rhino's OECs (can't remember the technical name for this) but it adds to that overall look I like in antique stones.

Of course a taller crown is going to mean a less wide stone (Ouros' 1.5ct stone is wider), so Vijay may be more mindful of retaining weight in the diameter and not overall height. Still, it's not a classic OEC for me.

Having said that, I'd love to see your Moissy and if Vijay is able to cut a more classic OEC, I wouldn't rule him out. I am just not seeing anything remotely like Rhino's which I lurve.
 

oncrutchesrightnow

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Apr 17, 2006
Messages
297
Thanks for all the replies. Very educational to help discern quality in lab grown antique cut reproductions.

@monipod the cool thing about rose cuts is that they are supposed to look like delicate bubbles as opposed to peak performing light-reflectors. So there’s no need to be technically perfect — there just has to be large flat clear facets of carbon to throw off some rainbows on occasion. They don’t even need high color because the surrounding setting/skin color will show through the stone and even colorless rose cuts look warm.

Just typing out loud at this point...

So a lab grown version would not need much technical skill compared to the hyper-awesome light returning cuts or the fancy facet pattern antique cuts. A lab grown rose cut would look great at low color and just needs minimum clarity to avoid dark inclusions in the center of the stone.

I don’t know Rhino that well but get the impression he enjoys the challenge of designing and having cut a diamond with excellent light return, so maybe rose cuts don’t interest him? They’d sell like hot cakes though. Rose cut sapphires and moissonites don’t have the same tell-tale fire.

Seems like the price of earth mined rose cut diamonds and related jewelry has inflated mighty quickly of late. And the average potential rose cut customer probably never planned on spending $15k on a super ideal ACA hearts and arrows true hearts signature ideal 1.012576 ct XXX000 diamond with ten certificates and no fluorescence in the first place. That customer just wants mostly clear and softly colored. Seven hundred bucks for a one-carat rose cut that does not need to perform yet has the high color and clarity that customers are told they should want but that doesn’t exist often in the rose cut world is a fantastic deal psychologically. I really want to see one.

Maybe I’ll give up going through the Starbucks drive thru for ten weeks and use the savings to buy a stone... :lol:
 

monipod

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Jun 25, 2019
Messages
813
So a lab grown version would not need much technical skill compared to the hyper-awesome light returning cuts or the fancy facet pattern antique cuts. A lab grown rose cut would look great at low color and just needs minimum clarity to avoid dark inclusions in the center of the stone.

Yes! I totally get you. It's much the same as old mine cuts - chunky facets to catch some light. I therefore agree that you probably can't go wrong with a rose cut from Ouros. I think they do great stones, and sorry to have digressed from your original topic with talk of OECs. That's another kettle of fish!

I was about to say that @MMtwo got a lovely rose cut and I'm glad she posted here. Exactly as she said, it's a like a lovely droplet of water. I'm not sure how best to show them off? Pendant? Earring? I figure they're best with light coming in from both sides equally?
 

shellyisa

Rough_Rock
Joined
Mar 30, 2021
Messages
9
I can only go by the one or two OEC's that Vijay has on Etsy (so admittedly not a big enough a pool to judge from), but of the one he has currently on Etsy (https://www.etsy.com/au/listing/937...earch_query=oec&ref=shop_items_search_3&frs=1), his OEC does not have a tall crown at all at 13.5% In fact, it seems almost too shallow. It's also got a pretty big table for an OEC at 62.5% If you compare that to Rhino's OECs (this one for example for size to size comparison - https://www.distinctivegem.com/coll...uropean-cut-private-reserve-lab-grown-diamond), he's truer to the antique cut numbers with a tiny 46% table and 22.5% crown. This gives the classic flowery appearance that just isn't present for me in the Ouros stone. I also love how the culet reflects in Rhino's OECs (can't remember the technical name for this) but it adds to that overall look I like in antique stones.

Of course a taller crown is going to mean a less wide stone (Ouros' 1.5ct stone is wider), so Vijay may be more mindful of retaining weight in the diameter and not overall height. Still, it's not a classic OEC for me.

Having said that, I'd love to see your Moissy and if Vijay is able to cut a more classic OEC, I wouldn't rule him out. I am just not seeing anything remotely like Rhino's which I lurve.

Thank you! I love learning about these different cuts. I def understand what you’re meaning about the shallower cut vs one with a taller crown. I believe as long as you stay above 60% depth it should still look pretty good - but if I’m being honest with myself, I think I tend to lean towards a transitional cut being more of my aesthetic which could be my I don’t mind the Ouros cut. I should receive it in about a week and will let you know what I think once I receive it in person :)

Also, I got into a “too shallow” situation with my mined diamond...it’s right at 50% and has a bit of a fish eye effect :( So I’m def keeping an eye out with the ones I’m checking out now.
 

oncrutchesrightnow

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Apr 17, 2006
Messages
297
Yes! I totally get you. It's much the same as old mine cuts - chunky facets to catch some light. I therefore agree that you probably can't go wrong with a rose cut from Ouros. I think they do great stones, and sorry to have digressed from your original topic with talk of OECs. That's another kettle of fish!

I was about to say that @MMtwo got a lovely rose cut and I'm glad she posted here. Exactly as she said, it's a like a lovely droplet of water. I'm not sure how best to show them off? Pendant? Earring? I figure they're best with light coming in from both sides equally?

No worries, it was good to hear your thoughts on lab oecs. I hope to get one in the future and it’s hard to find earth mined oecs in high color. IMHO the best setting for a rose cut is a ring so you can see it. But I say the same thing for every stone. Seriously though, a rose cut is going to show whatever is on the other side of it, so a pendant or studs might not be as nice as dangling earrings.

I have an oval, a square, and a round that doesn’t have a pavilion ( so like a portrait cut). I’m getting a round dome soon and then I’m done for a while. But if some inexpensive lab grown rose cuts appear on the market I will have to try one.

C93597C2-452C-4F6F-9C0D-37CD63398DD2.jpeg 549DAB89-7D5F-40A3-8193-407843118D4E.jpeg 193CF71C-F7E7-4E5D-BAA4-2DEF8A3426CB.jpeg
 

foxinsox

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jul 18, 2015
Messages
3,529
So a lab grown version would not need much technical skill compared to the hyper-awesome light returning cuts or the fancy facet pattern antique cuts. A lab grown rose cut would look great at low color and just needs minimum clarity to avoid dark inclusions in the center of the stone.

I don’t know Rhino that well but get the impression he enjoys the challenge of designing and having cut a diamond with excellent light return, so maybe rose cuts don’t interest him? They’d sell like hot cakes though. Rose cut sapphires and moissonites don’t have the same tell-tale fire.
I’m not sure that’s quite right. Moissanite is doubly refractive compared to diamond so has more fire for the equivalent cut. You’re also looking at a cut that performs quite differently when you have a high dome rose cut vs a shallow rose cut.
 

elizat

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Mar 23, 2013
Messages
2,871
That still picture of the rose cut honestly looks terrible from Ouros.

If they are not well cut they just look like flat lifeless stones. I think you would be much better off buying something that has a wonderful cut, especially with the rose cut.
 

oncrutchesrightnow

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Apr 17, 2006
Messages
297
I’m not sure that’s quite right. Moissanite is doubly refractive compared to diamond so has more fire for the equivalent cut. You’re also looking at a cut that performs quite differently when you have a high dome rose cut vs a shallow rose cut.

Totally get what you’re saying — I meant sapphire/topaz/quartz etc. have little if any fire and moissanite has double refraction, so all in all the clear gemstones don’t quite reproduce the fire of a diamond exactly.

I like moissanite’ s double refraction in photos but don’t have much experience with them in real life. I have never considered one in a common diamond cut because I thought it would be too bling for me personally. But maybe given how few facets rosecuts have moissanite might be worth trying in a rose cut. I do have a doubly refractive sphene and that thing is awesome. :cool2: :cool2::cool2:
 

foxinsox

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jul 18, 2015
Messages
3,529
Totally get what you’re saying — I meant sapphire/topaz/quartz etc. have little if any fire and moissanite has double refraction, so all in all the clear gemstones don’t quite reproduce the fire of a diamond exactly.

I like moissanite’ s double refraction in photos but don’t have much experience with them in real life. I have never considered one in a common diamond cut because I thought it would be too bling for me personally. But maybe given how few facets rosecuts have moissanite might be worth trying in a rose cut. I do have a doubly refractive sphene and that thing is awesome. :cool2: :cool2::cool2:

I've got 2 smallish high-dome rosecuts in moissy and they're great! In the future, I'd like to get a bigger oval moissy rosecut and replicate this as I think it would be the right material for it 641953
 
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