Newbie questions: B&M vs Online pricing, Diamond value, custom settings and Appraisals

[oshelef]

This is my first post, although I have done a lot of reading, research, etc...

So I have a couple questions:

1) How much more than online stores should one expect to pay from a B&M store than online? I was in a good local store and saw a diamond that I liked (actually saw several that I liked, but narrowed it down). Now the price he quoted me seems to be about 15-20% higher than I can get a similar(at least based on the basic specifications) online. I assume there is some negotiating room in his quote, but should I expect him to match online pricing or expect his minimum to be higher than online?

2)I see lots of discussion of very technical measurements, but is there a good way to get a ball park price for a diamond without having all those details? I.e. Since I don''t measure all the angles when I''m looking at a diamond in a store, how can I tell if the price is reasonable? (The one I ended up liking was .73ct ideal cut, RB, F, VS1. and I was quoted $3,500)

3) Custom rings...another reason I liked this jeweler is i liked his collection of custom rings...but I see little information to compare what it should cost to make a custom ring. Is there any good guide? I was quoted in the range of $1600-1800 for platinum for something similar to several I saw, of course, depending on what happens that could change. If I do decide to get a different diamond, should I expect to pay more for the setting/mounting?
Several times it was suggested that I sit down with his designer. Should I expect to pay for this?

4) appraisals..If I end up purchasing both setting and diamond from this jeweler, should i get an appraisal before it is set (with a follow-up once set) or just when its finished? I assume that the diamond would be returnable if I''m not satisfied with it (or after appraisal) but that the setting would not be. (And there would be some cost to setting a different diamond)

5) appraisal recommendations. I''m in the SF Bay Area, and there was only one appraiser listed in the resources here anywhere near me. (i.e. less than 100 miles away) Any recommendations for one in the area? Or, alternatively, are there any recommendations for one(s) I can deal with well via Fedex?

There are several questions in there, and I appreciate your help in advance.

 

[strmrdr]

1> they might or might not be able to come close to the price but being local and the time they spend with you is worth something so spending a little more can be the right thing to do.

2> You can use the pricescope search engine to get rough numbers based on basic specs.

3> The price seems to be the going rate which seems outragous to me.
Some places will charge more for the setting if they dont provide the diamond and some wont set them at all.

4> When its finished should be ok as long as you see the diamond first and stay with a gia or ags cert and there isnt anything that might be questionable about the diamond like a v-thin girdle.

5> There are several appraisers who post here that do good work and would be willing to recieve a ring by fed-ex and appraise it.
Someone local that you could sit in with on the appraisal session would be better of course. Someone may know of other independant appraisers in your area also.

 

[aljdewey]

1) How much more than online stores should one expect to pay from a B&M store than online? I was in a good local store and saw a diamond that I liked (actually saw several that I liked, but narrowed it down). Now the price he quoted me seems to be about 15-20% higher than I can get a similar(at least based on the basic specifications) online. I assume there is some negotiating room in his quote, but should I expect him to match online pricing or expect his minimum to be higher than online?

How much more? There is no "rule-of-thumb" percentage. Keep in mind that you are getting amenities and services that you don't get with online vendors (chance to view the stone in person locally, a storefront to walk into, a local place to get your diamond checked, etc.) Those extras have to be factored into the equation too, so I don't think it's realistic to expect a price match. If it were me, I'd ask him to split the difference......I'd say offer a price that you feel is fair to the vendor and to you, and see what he says.

2)I see lots of discussion of very technical measurements, but is there a good way to get a ball park price for a diamond without having all those details? I.e. Since I don't measure all the angles when I'm looking at a diamond in a store, how can I tell if the price is reasonable? (The one I ended up liking was .73ct ideal cut, RB, F, VS1. and I was quoted $3,500)

In my personal opinion, no, there is no way to get a "good ballpark" price for a diamond without knowing the make......and the make information is revealed in the details--the measurements. If you go to Kay's right now, you can get a "1 carat certified round (d/e/f color) for $4499. A provable (measured) well-cut 1 ct. D, VS2 stone from a PS vendor is listed right now for $8986. That's a 4.5K swing.....double the price! That's a pretty wide "ballpark" to me! Why would one diamond be nearly double the other? Because of its make....the difference is in the details. I believe you can't get a reasonable idea on "ballpark" until you can define what "comparable" diamonds are, and that means knowing the make....the measurements.

3) Custom rings...another reason I liked this jeweler is i liked his collection of custom rings...but I see little information to compare what it should cost to make a custom ring. Is there any good guide? I was quoted in the range of $1600-1800 for platinum for something similar to several I saw, of course, depending on what happens that could change. If I do decide to get a different diamond, should I expect to pay more for the setting/mounting?
Several times it was suggested that I sit down with his designer. Should I expect to pay for this?

Is there any good guide? Well, it depends on a bunch of variables. Are there sidestones? Is the 1600-1800 just for the platinum without sides? How intricate is the design? How skilled is the craftsman? There are designers here who charge about that price for a platinum piece (not including sides, I think). They are correct that you need to nail down details with a designer to arrive at a firm price, but I think the haste to have you sit with a designer is also partly to make you more committed to the sale. Because a designer's time is valuable, I personally wouldn't choose to sit with a designer until I picked a stone and had a rough idea of what I wanted to see in a setting.

4) appraisals..If I end up purchasing both setting and diamond from this jeweler, should i get an appraisal before it is set (with a follow-up once set) or just when its finished? I assume that the diamond would be returnable if I'm not satisfied with it (or after appraisal) but that the setting would not be. (And there would be some cost to setting a different diamond)

It's really a matter of personal preference, but if this is an engagement ring purchase, it's likely the most significant diamond purchase you'll ever make. For me, that warrants sending the stone to an independent appraiser while it's loose. Trust, but verify.

Also, it lets you confirm that the stone isn't damaged prior to setting....a little protection in case something happens.

Please, PLEASE don't assume anything about returnability.....get it in writing! Not all vendors allow you to "return" a diamond, and some will only allow exchange, not refund. If you return a stone because you decide you want a better make, you may end up paying closer to the high-end anyway, and you have less negotiating power on the final price because you've already tied up money into the purchase that you can't get back. This has happened to a few folks here.

I bought from a vendor (one of the vendors here at PS) that allowed a 10-day inspection period and full refund (no strings attached) if I wasn't completely happy. Also, you may not be able to return the stone once it's been set.....so find out. Lastly, if you set it into a custom setting and change your mind about the setting, the setting will likely not be refundable or even exchangeable.

5) appraisal recommendations. I'm in the SF Bay Area, and there was only one appraiser listed in the resources here anywhere near me. (i.e. less than 100 miles away) Any recommendations for one in the area? Or, alternatively, are there any recommendations for one(s) I can deal with well via Fedex?

Can't help you with a local appraiser....I know that some of the Bay Area folks have used Nancy Stacy. I chose to use an appraiser in Florida even though I was in Massachusetts, and I found him to be exceptional. I'd highly recommend either Rich Sherwood in FL or Dave Atlas in PA if you can't find someone to your liking locally.

Good luck in your search.....let us know if we can help!