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ctnsf2000

Rough_Rock
Joined
May 3, 2007
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Hello,

I am shopping for a diamond and wanted to know if I am being over charged for this diamond since it is shy of 2.00 carat and demanding a close to 2 carat price. If it is over-priced, what should I pay for this stone.

GIA
1.96
F
VVS1
Excellent Cut
Excellent Symmetry
Excellent Polish
Diameter is about 7.** X 7.99 I forgot...
None Flour
Heart and Arrow

Out the door price is 37,100 tax included.

Thanks for all your help.
 
I don''t think you are being "overcharged" based on those specs alone, but...

1) without more information, it is hard to say if that stone will be a really good performer, despite the "Excellent" cut grade
2) your clarity is overkill-- by dropping down into VS you would lose nothing visible yet could save money or buy a bigger stone.
 
Jeff,

1) What other specs will deteremine if the diamond is a good performer?

2) A friend told me that I should pay for but be in the 2.0 carat category because of the way the rapaport prices are structured. Do you agree?
 
Date: 5/3/2007 1:12:26 PM
Author: ctnsf2000
Jeff,


1) What other specs will deteremine if the diamond is a good performer?


2) A friend told me that I should pay for but be in the 2.0 carat category because of the way the rapaport prices are structured. Do you agree?
Click to expand...

1) experts here like the numbers of the certification (depth/table/crown angle/pavillion angle) [as well as pictures, especially IdealScope pictures, if possible]

2) I think I have heard here that diamonds just shy of the "magic numbers" carry a little bit of a premium, which brings their price closer to the magic number. So it would not be surprising to me if your 1.96 costs similar to a 2ct.
 
Hi ct,

Here''s the closest one I could find to compare. It is just over the 2 ct. mark, which would make it a bit more, but 1 color lower, so take say, 1000-1500 off for that.

I''d say they''re asking a bit too much. Not to mention, the clarity is overkill.
2.gif


http://www.jamesallen.com/diamond.asp?cid=53&item=861179
 
Is there any particular reason you want VVS? Personally, I think this is overkill. You easily go down to VS or SI1 and still find an eye-clean stone.
 
Hi Ellen,

Yes, I know VVS stones are overkill but I like things that are rare and don''t mind paying a higher price for it. I just want to make sure that I am not over paying on the particular stone that''s all.

Looks as though the vendor is asking too much.
 
Do you have the "numbers" for this diamond? Crown, Pavilion, table, depth ???
I''d say if the numbers are good and this is indeed a well cut diamond, somewhere around 30-32K will be about what a diamond with thos especs goes for . . . so 34K seems slightly more but still semi-reasonable???
 
Date: 5/3/2007 2:00:29 PM
Author: ctnsf2000
Hi Ellen,

Yes, I know VVS stones are overkill but I like things that are rare and don''t mind paying a higher price for it. I just want to make sure that I am not over paying on the particular stone that''s all.

Looks as though the vendor is asking too much.
Click to expand...
That''s fine then, some people want that in a stone. We all just pointed it out, as some don''t know better.
2.gif


When you say "vendor", I''m not sure if you mean online, or a jeweler. You will pay more from a private jeweler, usually. But that''s still too much if so.
 
I don''t have the numbers but will try to get them today.

Are the prices you quoted tax included?
 
Date: 5/3/2007 2:33:55 PM
Author: ctnsf2000
Ellen,

I just find this one which is closer to the jewelry I am shopping for.

http://www.jamesallen.com/diamond.asp?cid=53&item=1055656


The G stone you found had negligible flour. Could that have been why the price is slightly lower?
Click to expand...
Hmm. I can''t believe I missed that. (although I am multi tasking lol).

I''m surprised it''s going up that much for 1 color and to hit the magic number. I wonder if it''s more the bigger you get? Because in smaller stones I have not seen this big of a jump...

No, the negligable flo wouldn''t lower the price.
 
Date: 5/3/2007 2:43:01 PM
Author: Ellen

Date: 5/3/2007 2:33:55 PM
Author: ctnsf2000
Ellen,

I just find this one which is closer to the jewelry I am shopping for.

http://www.jamesallen.com/diamond.asp?cid=53&item=1055656


The G stone you found had negligible flour. Could that have been why the price is slightly lower?
Click to expand...
Hmm. I can''t believe I missed that. (although I am multi tasking lol).

I''m surprised it''s going up that much for 1 color and to hit the magic number. I wonder if it''s more the bigger you get? Because in smaller stones I have not seen this big of a jump...

No, the negligable flo wouldn''t lower the price.
Click to expand...
So given the James Allen price, is the 1.96 still reasonable? Or still out of line?
 
Date: 5/3/2007 2:50:57 PM
Author: ctnsf2000

So given the James Allen price, is the 1.96 still reasonable? Or still out of line?
Click to expand...
Apparently it may not be so bad. Maybe someone else will chime in?

Pyramid, I''m leaving and don''t have time to look this over thoroughly, but at a glance, I''m not seeing a 9000.00 jump. I''ll look again when I have time.
 
I still say if the cut is top notch, which you can have a better idea with those numbers I think 34K is not a bad price for F VVS1 in that size, atleast given what is available right now . . .
 
Well.... interesting.

I would advise you to seek professional help with your purchase. You''re talking about having piece of mind for a $ 34,000.00 purchase.

Accurate value conclusions made without seeing the purchase stone, and the stones the values are being compared to in a "select" market area ( internet pricing of sellers) to me is rather "risky".

While most of the consumer people propose comparisons, are well intentioned, a lot of their opinions are based on assumptions. Making assumptions of comparison equalness of the comparables, may or may not be accurate or factual.

Find a qualified gemolgist / appraiser - see if your seller will send the stone to them ( hopefully one that is local to you (see resources/appraisers to search for one) which will provide you with advanced analysis based on the equipment he has, and where a broader marketplace for getting comparables is used rather than a limited one.

If this were an "inexpensive" priced stone, certainly you need to weight whether the cost of an independent expert it called for, but for that level of purchase, especially when you have close to "carat weight pricing considerations" it will probably be the prudent thing to do.

Rockdoc
 
Date: 5/3/2007 3:24:19 PM
Author: hikerchick
I still say if the cut is top notch, which you can have a better idea with those numbers I think 34K is not a bad price for F VVS1 in that size, atleast given what is available right now . . .
Click to expand...
So 37K is too high then?
 
I notice on the 2.02 carat GIA report at James Allen it says 'Clarity: VVS1, Potential'. So that means the diamond could potentially be repolished/recut to make the FL or IF grade - the feather is on the very edge, maybe that would affect the price upwards.
 
Date: 5/3/2007 3:37:26 PM
Author: Pyramid


I notice on the 2.02 carat GIA report at James Allen it says ''Clarity: VVS1, Potential''. So that means the diamond could potentially be repolished/recut to make the FL or IF grade - the feather is on the very edge, maybe that would affect the price upwards.
Click to expand...

So if a diamond like that is recut, wouldn''t it lose carat weight which would then reduce price? - Just curious.
 
You'd need an expert to look at it about recutting and weight loss. Generally, recuts don't cost that much in weight.
 
Date: 5/3/2007 3:34:31 PM
Author: ctnsf2000
Date: 5/3/2007 3:24:19 PM

Author: hikerchick

I still say if the cut is top notch, which you can have a better idea with those numbers I think 34K is not a bad price for F VVS1 in that size, atleast given what is available right now . . .
Click to expand...
So 37K is too high then?
Click to expand...

Ooohhh . . . I misread your original post and thought that 34K was the price . . . 37K, well that is a harder decision. There isn''t much for comparison online but that may not matter if what RockDoc says is true and price comparisons for ideally cut diamonds in similar range is not an acceptable way to determine cost ranges? In that case, none of us can really help you or anyone else . . . I will let one of the other experts chime in here. However, I do think spending a little money to have it appraised might be worth it, however, I wouldn''t spend the appraisal money until I had the numbers and maybe even an IS image in front of me to determine if having it appraised is even worthwhile. Just my humble non-expert opinion.
 
Date: 5/3/2007 3:34:31 PM
Author: ctnsf2000
Date: 5/3/2007 3:24:19 PM

Author: hikerchick

I still say if the cut is top notch, which you can have a better idea with those numbers I think 34K is not a bad price for F VVS1 in that size, atleast given what is available right now . . .
Click to expand...
So 37K is too high then?
Click to expand...

I think $37k is a little too high, even for a well-cut stone.

HOWEVER, the MUCH more important issue is whether the stone you are considering is well cut. If not, than $37k is definitely too much to pay for it. if the stone is not well cut, EVERYONE here would tell you $37k is WAY too much to spend.
 
Date: 5/3/2007 5:40:06 PM
Author: boston_jeff

Date: 5/3/2007 3:34:31 PM
Author: ctnsf2000

Date: 5/3/2007 3:24:19 PM

Author: hikerchick

I still say if the cut is top notch, which you can have a better idea with those numbers I think 34K is not a bad price for F VVS1 in that size, atleast given what is available right now . . .
Click to expand...
So 37K is too high then?
Click to expand...

I think $37k is a little too high, even for a well-cut stone.

HOWEVER, the MUCH more important issue is whether the stone you are considering is well cut. If not, than $37k is definitely too much to pay for it. if the stone is not well cut, EVERYONE here would tell you $37k is WAY too much to spend.
Click to expand...

Noted with thanks!

So is the diamond bleow a better deal?

http://www.jamesallen.com/diamond.asp?cid=53&item=1055656
 
depends on the specs of the 1.96...

depth/table/crown angle/pavillion angle?
 
Date: 5/3/2007 1:05:19 PM
Author: boston_jeff
I don''t think you are being ''overcharged'' based on those specs alone, but...

1) without more information, it is hard to say if that stone will be a really good performer, despite the ''Excellent'' cut grade
2) your clarity is overkill-- by dropping down into VS you would lose nothing visible yet could save money or buy a bigger stone.
Click to expand...

Jeff,

Just because the cut grade is "Excellent" doesn''t mean it is an ideal cut diamond? Could you help clarify?

So a cut grade "Very Good" could be a better performer?

Thanks!
 
At the extremes of the Excellent cut grade, there are proportions that would not perform as well as proportions near the VG/EX border.

I feel like D/E VVS2/VS1 is a better balance than F VVS1.
 
Date: 5/3/2007 6:18:36 PM
Author: ctnsf2000


Jeff,


Just because the cut grade is 'Excellent' doesn't mean it is an ideal cut diamond? Could you help clarify?


So a cut grade 'Very Good' could be a better performer?


Thanks!
Click to expand...

Again, because I'm not an expert, I can't tell you the specifics, but it has been stated many times that a GIA cut grade of Excellent does not guarantee that the stone will be a great performer... because of its tolerances it will allow stones without optimal angles to be Excellent... I am sure someone else can explain it more fully.
 
Date: 5/3/2007 12:38:41 PM
Author:ctnsf2000
I am shopping for a diamond and wanted to know if I am being over charged for this diamond since it is shy of 2.00 carat and demanding a close to 2 carat price.
Click to expand...
You hit the nail on the head - under 2 carats at a 2 carat price. It would be a much better "value" (if you can call it that) to get something just over 2 carats at a similar price per carat. p.s. I agree with Julie, I''d rather have 2 carats and D-E VVS2-VS1 at about the same price.
 
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