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My stone's cut is Fair, not Ideal- opinions please

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Kathryn007

Rough_Rock
Joined
Dec 17, 2010
Messages
20
I finally got a peak at my engagement ring center stone's GIA report and I was really disappointed at what I saw. My husband told me the stone was 2.05 carats, E color, VS2 clarity, Ideal cut BUT the report says it's a FAIR cut. I just can't believe my husband compromised on the cut and not on say, the color, and I am extremely irritated.

Is it fair (no pun intended) to say that we could probably find a 2 carat, F Color, VS2 clarity, ideal cut for a similar price as the current 2.05, E, VS2, fair? Would I notice a big difference?
 
Did you think it was a beautiful stone or did you already notice lack of sparkle before seeing the GIA report?
Can you post pictures of you ring and the GIA certificate?
Sorry to ask you, but what about your budget?
 
I think it's a beautiful stone but I had a bad feeling about the jeweler. Just didn't trust him for some reason (gut feeling) and my husband clearly didn't educate himself well enough before making a purchase. I don't have the GIA report on me now but I can post that and a pic of the ring later. Budget is $30,000. Thanks for all input!
 
Kathryn007|1292601747|2799531 said:
I finally got a peak at my engagement ring center stone's GIA report and I was really disappointed at what I saw. My husband told me the stone was 2.05 carats, E color, VS2 clarity, Ideal cut BUT the report says it's a FAIR cut. I just can't believe my husband compromised on the cut and not on say, the color, and I am extremely irritated.

Is it fair (no pun intended) to say that we could probably find a 2 carat, F Color, VS2 clarity, ideal cut for a similar price as the current 2.05, E, VS2, fair? Would I notice a big difference?
Click to expand...

I would suspect you're going to have a difficulty finding something for the same price when looking to increase the cut quality by 3-4 levels and only lower color by 1 level.

This really depends on what the original stone was purchased for. But, you will notice a big difference between a fair and ideal cut diamond. IMO.
 
Kathryn007|1292602740|2799543 said:
I think it's a beautiful stone but I had a bad feeling about the jeweler. Just didn't trust him for some reason (gut feeling) and my husband clearly didn't educate himself well enough before making a purchase. I don't have the GIA report on me now but I can post that and a pic of the ring later. Budget is $30,000. Thanks for all input!
Click to expand...

With that kind of a budget, you might be able to find something:

http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/F-VS2-Ideal-Cut-Round-Diamond-1279568.asp?b=16&a=12&c=77&cid=131

http://www.bluenile.com/round-diamond-2-carat-ideal-cut-f-color-vs2-clarity_LD01651876
 
I would say that men are clueless about diamonds...don't be angry with your husband: he surely did his best (he went to a "reputable" jeweler and gave him a lot of money for a small useless carbon stone...isn't it love?).

I guess you can have a bunch of options within your budget...but can you have the money back?
 
so are you planning on trading it in, or buying a new stone and keeping it?

also have you considered a recut? not all stones are candidates and you would lose some carat weight but it might be worth checking out, depending on the cut of your stone you may not lose that much diameter.
 
The plan would be to trade it in...I believe he paid $25,000 for the current stone which seems like a lot for a fair cut stone even considering the other c's. I do like being at the 2 carat mark though. I'm just really disappointed about the cut and wondering if I would notice a huge difference in the sparkle factor if we went with an ideal.
 
does your vendor have a good trade-in policy?

I obviously don't know anything about the specific dimensions of your diamond but here are some videos showing the difference cut quality makes

http://vimeo.com/2225754
http://vimeo.com/1097057
http://vimeo.com/2556364

Brian Gavin does diamond recuts but I cannot link to their blog page per PS rules. I'm sure you could find it if you go to their website, briangavindiamonds.com
 
Just keep in mind that the highest cut grade given by GIA is excellent. If you want an ideal, you will need to get an AGS 0 graded stone. This might sound like a "picky" point, but it is important to understand the differences so you know what you are getting. If your jeweler tells you that a GIA stone has been graded with an ideal cut, he is not being accurate. That being said, I would not be happy with a fair cut, either. You will have to make some compromises to get the best cut diamond, however. Since you don't trust this jeweler, why not return the stone and start over with someone else.
 
noted on the excellent vs ideal. thanks.
 
One of the weakness of the GIA grading scale is that it's fundamentally comparing stones to some mathematical models that they have determined to be popular. That is to say, in a Pepsi challenge type test, people generally prefer some stones over others and the most popular among stones are called 'excellent' while the least popular are called 'poor'. That's useful enough information, especially for dealers who are trying to sell things, but it's important to remember that 'popular' is not a synonym for 'better' or 'more beautiful'. That's a considerably more difficult question and GIA wisely ducks it. GIA gave it a 'fair' grade for a specific reason and this may or may not be a problem for you. If you've seen it and you love it, I point out that a fair cut grade tends to drive the price down. That's a feature, not a problem. If you've seen it and you don't love it, that's a problem no matter what GIA thinks.

If you can post a scan of the cert or a link to the online lookup, we may be able to tell you WHY they gave it the grade they did but whether or not this is a big deal depends on you.
 
Yes and those stones that are "most popular" and graded "excellent" are popular for good reason!! I'll upload the cert when I can get my hands on it later. Your input is very much appreciated.

I just can't understand why my husband, with that kind of a budget, would compromise so much on cut. It really blows my mind. Especially because he absolutely demands quality in all other types of products, from watches to cars to apparel to furniture! I guess I'm disappointed b/c it seems like such a careless decision on his part. I do feel like such a brat but I would much rather compromise on color or even carat size and I think most of you would agree? Now that I know, I just can't stop thinking about it.
 
it is possible he wanted to get over 2 carats and he thought higher color/clarity was more important? also maybe the sales person 'helped' him pick it?
 
most likely-- but it doesn't take much to do a little research on the four c's, especially when you're spending a big chunk of change. and isn't it pretty much universally accepted that cut is the most important? and then you prioritize from there?
 
no, I don't think it is accepted at ALL that cut is the most important, just on PS ;) I think a lot of vendors push color and clarity
 
Really? I'm surprised to hear that. Most literature I've read on the subject tends to focus on cut as the most important.
 
I would agree that literature would support that, but I think a lot of times vendors push higher color and clarity as being more valuable and desirable (also they are more expensive).
 
Most people seem to put size and price at the head of their list when evaluating diamonds. Not that it matters what most people want, which was my point above. Any chance your jeweler will allow a tradein for something that more suits your tastes? Many if not most are prepared to do something on new purchases to make the client happy. I do understand your position. I'm very much a cut snob and I rather like the GIA cut grading scale, but the issue at hand is your taste, not mine and not GIA's. Depending on the jeweler, this might be an easy deal and it might be a huge pain. Have you asked?
 
it's too bad my husband didn't know better. oh well, i suppose it is just a little piece of carbon after all...
 
denver- my husband is not happy about it but he's looking into it. thanks.
 
Just take it back and compare to some GIA excellent cut with similar proportions. if you want to upgrade at that point then do so. If not, thank your hubby for dropping $25K on ya :)
 
seems like a big piece of carbon to me :-P what is your trade in policy?
 
Kathryn007|1292610384|2799655 said:
denver- my husband is not happy about it but he's looking into it. thanks.
Click to expand...
did you show your husband the videos?
 
I know, I know, I'm being a brat!

Not sure of the specifics on the trade in policy but I know we have options.
 
I sent him the videos but I think I've bruised his ego a little bit. Not sure if he's watched them yet.
 
Kathryn007:

My husband too purchased a fair cut diamond for me. It was a princess cut diamond and the "X" was so far off center, the culet was obviously tilted to one side. Like your hubby, mine was counseled by the jeweler that this stone was worth his hard earned money and that I would love it. Since he/I didn't become diamond educated for many years after the purchase, we could not take it back.

I lived with it because there was really no recourse, it was 13 years later that we had it recut by Brian Gavin and now we have a gorgeous cut diamond and gave up very little surface area.

So what and I taking so long to say here? If I knew then, what I know now, what fair cut really means, I would have most certainly changed it for another stone with a better cut. I regret that it was years afterwards before we realized how important cut is. If you have the option to return it and/or exchange it, I would definitely do that.

I would try to get your money back and take your business elsewhere. I would never trust a jeweler who sold a fair cut without explaining what that really means to the appearance of the stone and making sure that is a compromise you are willing to make with full disclosure of the facts.

I would imagine that it is possible to find a fair cut diamond that is as beautiful as a better cut one, and if that is the case with your diamond than you should count yourself as very fortunate. Will it bother you just knowing that your diamond is a fair cut even if in appearance it is beautiful? Only you know the answer to that.

Good luck!
 
Kathryn007|1292601747|2799531 said:
Is it fair (no pun intended) to say that we could probably find a 2 carat, F Color, VS2 clarity, ideal cut for a similar price as the current 2.05, E, VS2, fair? Would I notice a big difference?
Click to expand...
Ideal or excellent cut stones do not cost the same as otherwise similar fair cut ones. In most cases the premium is considerable. It's certain that you are going to have to compromise on something in this deale either in terms of weight, clarity, color or price (or perhaps a combination of these things). The jeweler should be fully prepared to discuss these issues with you. If not, there are plenty of jewelers out there who ARE.
 
Neil's given excellent advice- I would not beat up hubby too much- the cut grade is not all that noticeable on the GIA unless one is looking for it. Plus, it looks to me as if he did not overpay.
An EX cut grade wold have been a LOT more.
Furthermore, if you love the diamond, it might not be necessary to return it.
That said- if you do want to, did hubby get a money back guarantee?
 
slg47|1292609800|2799646 said:
I would agree that literature would support that, but I think a lot of times vendors push higher color and clarity as being more valuable and desirable (also they are more expensive).
Click to expand...
+1 MM....

If it weren't for PS, and some research, I would have done the EXACT same thing.. And I also do research on just about any purchase I make over a few $100.

Just ask my wife the research I did when I bought my $4000 bicycle :lol:

I also say the best you can do right now, is go and compare your fair cut to a few excellent cuts and make your decision from there.
 
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