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Looking to buy a Pear shaped diamond...PLEASE HELP :(

crocop

Rough_Rock
Joined
Oct 30, 2016
Messages
35
Hey,

Just joined this community from a friends suggestion. My SO really wants a pear shaped diamond, and from everything I've read online, and on this forum, the numbers and/or specs do not make as much sense as round diamonds.

Can someone point me in the right direction? In terms of the "specs", what is a red flag I need to watch out for?

This is sort of what I am looking for.

1.2-1.3 carat
Budget: Approx $6500-$7500 Canadian

How do these 2 look?

http://www.bluenile.com/ca/diamond-details/LD07661098

http://www.bluenile.com/ca/diamond-details/LD07319909

I am also open to other suggestions from blue nile and/or James Allen

Thanks in advance.
 

Gypsy

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Aug 8, 2005
Messages
40,198
There are no specs for pears. You have to buy from pictures and ASET images. I'll see if I can find something good for you.
 

Gypsy

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Aug 8, 2005
Messages
40,198
This is a lovely pear, but above budget. http://www.jewelsbygrace.com/loose-diamonds/1-ct-to-2-00/1-31ct-antique-pear-shape-diamond-gia-g-si1#.WBaXniRn3IU


Your size range is too limiting and honestly, meaningless, so I am going to throw that out. With pears one 1 carat pear can face up larger than a 1.3 carat pear.

Good pears are few and far between and you want the largest selection pool, which is at the 1 carat mark. Limiting yourself to a 10 point carat range is just bad.


This is the only stone I found that was worth your time:
https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/pear-shaped/1.00-carat-g-color-vvs1-clarity-sku-1833533
 

crocop

Rough_Rock
Joined
Oct 30, 2016
Messages
35
Gypsy|1477875922|4092138 said:
This is a lovely pear, but above budget. http://www.jewelsbygrace.com/loose-diamonds/1-ct-to-2-00/1-31ct-antique-pear-shape-diamond-gia-g-si1#.WBaXniRn3IU


Your size range is too limiting and honestly, meaningless, so I am going to throw that out. With pears one 1 carat pear can face up larger than a 1.3 carat pear.

Good pears are few and far between and you want the largest selection pool, which is at the 1 carat mark. Limiting yourself to a 10 point carat range is just bad.


This is the only stone I found that was worth your time:
https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/pear-shaped/1.00-carat-g-color-vvs1-clarity-sku-1833533
Thanks Gypsy.

I am open to looking at 1 carat, was not aware that there would be better selection there. I do like the one you posted from JA.

Anything specific I should be looking at with pears?

I am hoping to buy within a few weeks.

Are the ones I posted from BN above any good? Spec wise..I know it helps to see it? any other suggestions from JA? I spoke to a few reps there, and it seems they just throw out random stuff at me.

Thank you in advance.
 

tyty333

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Dec 17, 2008
Messages
21,685
crocop|1477862589|4092090 said:
Hey,

Just joined this community from a friends suggestion. My SO really wants a pear shaped diamond, and from everything I've read online, and on this forum, the numbers and/or specs do not make as much sense as round diamonds.

Can someone point me in the right direction? In terms of the "specs", what is a red flag I need to watch out for?

This is sort of what I am looking for.

1.2-1.3 carat
Budget: Approx $6500-$7500 Canadian

How do these 2 look?

http://www.bluenile.com/ca/diamond-details/LD07661098

http://www.bluenile.com/ca/diamond-details/LD07319909

I am also open to other suggestions from blue nile and/or James Allen

Thanks in advance.
Without an ASET image or a rotating video we cant tell anything about the light return of these stones. You should be looking for
- nice faceting pattern (that reaches down towards the point and up towards the rounded end)
- crisp, nicely outline facets (see above)
- facets that flash on/off as stone rotates (hall of mirrors effect )
- no dark bow-tie
- nice pear shape (no shoulders)
- nice length to width ratio (that one above is too long in my opinion)

It just helps to look at LOTS of pears on James Allen.

I did see a decent "I" colored pear but that is a little lower in color than I like to go unless you are putting it in a yellow or rose
gold setting. The stone that Gypsy posted is nice.
Here is the "I" just FYI...I prefer the G though
https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/pear-shaped/1.20-carat-i-color-if-clarity-sku-2074914

Enchanted Diamonds has quite a few around the 1 carat mark...
https://enchanteddiamonds.com/diamonds/search?carat_max=1.43&carat_min=0.99&clarity=VS1,VS2,SI1&color=H,G,F,E,D&heirloom=true&shape=Pear&wire_price_max=5860
 

crocop

Rough_Rock
Joined
Oct 30, 2016
Messages
35
tyty333|1477923621|4092277 said:
crocop|1477862589|4092090 said:
Hey,

Just joined this community from a friends suggestion. My SO really wants a pear shaped diamond, and from everything I've read online, and on this forum, the numbers and/or specs do not make as much sense as round diamonds.

Can someone point me in the right direction? In terms of the "specs", what is a red flag I need to watch out for?

This is sort of what I am looking for.

1.2-1.3 carat
Budget: Approx $6500-$7500 Canadian

How do these 2 look?

http://www.bluenile.com/ca/diamond-details/LD07661098

http://www.bluenile.com/ca/diamond-details/LD07319909

I am also open to other suggestions from blue nile and/or James Allen

Thanks in advance.
Without an ASET image or a rotating video we cant tell anything about the light return of these stones. You should be looking for
- nice faceting pattern (that reaches down towards the point and up towards the rounded end)
- crisp, nicely outline facets (see above)
- facets that flash on/off as stone rotates (hall of mirrors effect )
- no dark bow-tie
- nice pear shape (no shoulders)
- nice length to width ratio (that one above is too long in my opinion)

It just helps to look at LOTS of pears on James Allen.

I did see a decent "I" colored pear but that is a little lower in color than I like to go unless you are putting it in a yellow or rose
gold setting. The stone that Gypsy posted is nice.
Here is the "I" just FYI...I prefer the G though
https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/pear-shaped/1.20-carat-i-color-if-clarity-sku-2074914

Enchanted Diamonds has quite a few around the 1 carat mark...
https://enchanteddiamonds.com/diamonds/search?carat_max=1.43&carat_min=0.99&clarity=VS1,VS2,SI1&color=H,G,F,E,D&heirloom=true&shape=Pear&wire_price_max=5860
Thanks for this info. I will request come ASET's. How long do they usually take to get?

Which specific ones from enchanted diamonds do you recommend?

Thank you
 

tyty333

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Dec 17, 2008
Messages
21,685
crocop|1477923713|4092279 said:
how does this one look?

http://www.bluenile.com/ca/diamond-search?stockno=LD07718299

I used the ideal "specs" on this site under the knowledge tab to find the one that clicks all the boxes.

Should I request an ASET?
I've read online, and on this forum, the numbers and/or specs do not make as much sense as round diamonds.

Per Gypsy
There are no specs for pears. You have to buy from pictures and ASET images.

You said it yourself yet you try to go find a stone by the specs? It does not work. You can ask for an ASET on that stone but I'm
pretty sure it will not look good.

Look at the faceting pattern on the ones we have posted and try to find ones that look like those (or better would be great). The
rounded ends of nicer stones will tend to have faceting patterns like round brilliants.

This is the pear that Gypsy posted. The green area is the nice faceting pattern that is returning good light. The better the stone
the bigger this area will be (you want it to go as far south to the pointed end and as far up north as possible towards the rounded
end). This stone has a pretty big area of good light return and looks to be a nice pear. Look for pears like this. Most pears will
have significantly reduced light return towards the pointed end and will have a somewhat triangle shaped area at the rounded end
of reduced light return.

nice_pear.png
 

crocop

Rough_Rock
Joined
Oct 30, 2016
Messages
35
tyty333|1477924848|4092287 said:
crocop|1477923713|4092279 said:
how does this one look?

http://www.bluenile.com/ca/diamond-search?stockno=LD07718299

I used the ideal "specs" on this site under the knowledge tab to find the one that clicks all the boxes.

Should I request an ASET?
I've read online, and on this forum, the numbers and/or specs do not make as much sense as round diamonds.

Per Gypsy
There are no specs for pears. You have to buy from pictures and ASET images.

You said it yourself yet you try to go find a stone by the specs? It does not work. You can ask for an ASET on that stone but I'm
pretty sure it will not look good.

Look at the faceting pattern on the ones we have posted and try to find ones that look like those (or better would be great). The
rounded ends of nicer stones will tend to have faceting patterns like round brilliants.

This is the pear that Gypsy posted. The green area is the nice faceting pattern that is returning good light. The better the stone
the bigger this area will be (you want it to go as far south to the pointed end and as far up north as possible towards the rounded
end). This stone has a pretty big area of good light return and looks to be a nice pear. Look for pears like this. Most pears will
have significantly reduced light return towards the pointed end and will have a somewhat triangle shaped area at the rounded end
of reduced light return.
Ok thanks for this, really appreciate it.

finding this is going to be harder than I thought :(
 

SpencerDane

Rough_Rock
Joined
Oct 18, 2016
Messages
33
I am not usually a big fan of pear shaped diamonds. Therefore, I really do not know what to look for to guarantee you are getting one that is worth your time and money. However, in looking at the first two you posted and the second one gypsy posted, I have to vote for the one tha gypsy found for you. One thing I do think about a pear diamond is the stones that those that are around 1ct tend to show much better in light and have the most beautiful sparkle when compared to stones that are only slightly larger.
 

crocop

Rough_Rock
Joined
Oct 30, 2016
Messages
35
guys...any other suggestions for a 1-1.2 carat pear shaped?

I am really struggling...the customer service at JA has not been the best either...every time they just send me random diamonds and say that they love them.

any good pears out there?
 

tyty333

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Dec 17, 2008
Messages
21,685
crocop|1478280071|4093704 said:
I would say that the 1.13 is not that great. The 1.07 is ok.

I actually like this one a little better than the 1.07. Try to get an aset because it is on the shallow side but I still think it looks better
than the 1.07.
https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/pear-shaped/1.02-carat-h-color-vs2-clarity-sku-2121114

This one is not as big (8.85mm) but could be nice...

https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/pear-shaped/1.01-carat-h-color-vvs2-clarity-sku-1976860
 

oldminer

Ideal_Rock
Trade
Joined
Sep 3, 2000
Messages
6,378
You can do two things to screen out pear shapes for being potentially well cut.

Take a look at the AGA Shape selector under "Tools" at the top of Pricescope pages. Try to find one which does not seem to have more or less than -10% to +10% bulge in either its shoulders or pointed end. Also, slide the upper purple color slider within the range given on the chart supplied for length to width ratio so you have some idea of the best shaping. It remains subjective but can be useful to understand what cutters and dealers look for. You can alternatively fill in the length and width above the slider and the stone outline will adjust itself to the proper ratio.

Use the AGA Cut Class Grader Tool, also located at the top of Pricescope pages under "Tools" to screen out less well cut pears and other curved sided fancy shapes. Refer to the chart in the photo to understand where borderline parameters lie, but not to grade diamonds one parameter at a time. Use the automated grader as suggested.

chrtpear-heart-oval-marq.jpg
 

Gypsy

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Aug 8, 2005
Messages
40,198
I disagree with David Atlas.
 

oldminer

Ideal_Rock
Trade
Joined
Sep 3, 2000
Messages
6,378
Gypsy;
It would be good to understand and to explain why you "disagree". It is simple enough to buy into the concept that the longer the facts are delayed or concealed, the more people will buy a diamond that is not well cut. We have been promoting the best cut philosophy here for a long time and the shaping that goes into fancy cuts such as H&A Cushions and AGS000 Princess cuts has become an accepted and valid addition to what many of us suggest as the best cut for light return.

The long standing parameters on the round and princess cut charts and grading I promoted over time happen to mesh very well in the overall with GIA and AGS cut grading. I was long ahead of their efforts and far less able to be scientific, but as many diamond dealers will tell you, the eyes are an important tool for experts which we can't just lend to consumers. We needed and found systems which helped consumers to be more expert without years of painful learning.

Your disagreement without a reasonable explanation is a seemingly indifferent response. What is your disagreement based upon? The round cut stones that grade very well in the AGA cut class system are very commonly the top grades of GIA. The same applies to round and princess with AGS grading. That is the purpose of a screening tool. It eliminates some that could not possibly be fine and gives high grades to many that would be among the very best. What approach have you offered? What educational tool do you freely share to create a better ability for consumers to make a smart purchase instead of a costly mistake? Or, have I somehow insulted you in a past thread and you don't want me to contribute? Sorry if I have stepped on your toes by accident, if I did.
 

tyty333

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Dec 17, 2008
Messages
21,685
Hi Oldminer,
While I cant speak for Gypsy, I have an issue with using this method (going by numbers) because we have had several posters
find stones "by-the-numbers" and they do not result in decent stones (nice faceting, minimal bow-tie and nice light return).
I assume there are just to many variables in a pear cut for the number of specs (depth, table, crown and girdle) to really
address the problem. I really wish I Knew all the specs (and had them) that would result in a nice pear...it sure would make things
easier. So far, for me, the best thing that works are videos, images and to a small degree aset. I used to think that the aset was
the end all for pears but honestly it is only one view of the pear. The best thing for me is videos where you can see how the
facets flash as the stone moves.

We know that specs pretty much work for rounds because there are a limited number of variables and rounds are symmetrical while
pears are not.

I may need to do some more research whether pear specs help to knock out more bad pears (while keeping good pears) but its
clearly been demonstrated to me that using the specs alone does not usually result in a "decent" pear.

So how do I try to help posters looking for pears?
- posting pictures like the one above with the lines drawn on it to show what to look for (scroll up some to see pic)
- posting links to "nice" pears so they can see what to look for as well as posting links to not-so-nice pears so they know what to
stay away from
- provide opinions on pears that they have posted...I need to get better at telling them why I dont think a pear will perform.

If you do have pointers that you know work in selecting nice pears, please share. Always willing to learn new things.

Best,
tyty
 

oldminer

Ideal_Rock
Trade
Joined
Sep 3, 2000
Messages
6,378
Like I said, I use my eyes and not much in the way of any tools to select what looks the best. There are important factors to getting "beauty" that tools don't work well on, but trained eyes work very well with. It is extremely difficult for consumers to rely on their eyes, and they want to do rough screening with some kind of tool if it is possible. To that end I support ASET and I-S tools along with many other forms of verification and screening processes. The best tools seem to be the greatly enlarged, high resolution videos which vendors now widely produce. It is a wonderful scenario of being able to actually see diamonds on line which was never envisioned back when guys like me who looked at numbers were trying to do something meaningful and useful.

However, if the industry is going to promote fine cutting the GIA and others will come out with numerical specifications that derive from those diamonds which a broad sample of unbiased observers tells them "looks best". Like in the rounds and princess cuts, I believe those stones will be in or very near the already established numbers developed by me and others who have used our own powers of observation over an extended period of time. Please look at curved sided fancy cuts that you feel are very well cut with no needless extra depth, no needless very thick girdles, no lumpy shoulders, or needle-like thinness and see if the best performers don't tend to be in the range of the numbers on the chart provided. I believe you will find the majority will be in the higher predicted range and that only occasionally will an unusual circumstance lead to an unexpected inclusion or rejection where some element of weaker than "best" cutting is present.

Diamond being a pure element is highly consistent in its optics. Diamond is totally dependable in how it refracts and reflects light. Because of that, the current cut grading of rounds and princess cuts is rather accurate and repeatable. What would make anyone suspect that the exact same family of characteristics in curved sided fancy shapes would not be solved in a similar way in order to judge cut quality and light return properties which equate in some valid way with our consensus of what is "beauty"? Yes, I'll agree the matter has additional factors and that it is therefore a more complex calculation, but I can't agree, short of seeing evidence that is factual, that these numbers mislead anyone. Hundreds or maybe thousands of folks have succeeded getting a diamond they loved with these factors and those top cut stones have nothing problematic to experts in any of their shape or cut parameters.

Look at a sample of diamonds you have found that you consider to be among your best examples of the pear shape. Look at table %, depth %, girdle thickness, length to width ratio, polish & symmetry, bulge or lack of roundness in shoulders and pointed ends. I believe most of your best stones will easily fit into the best grades so long as you honestly look at what is off, such as too much or too little depth, too thin or too thick a girdle, too small or too large a table, asymmetry, improper bulge..... Dealers don't like to uncover the weaknesses in their supposed "best" diamonds, but my job is to look for weaknesses and strengths and report overall conclusions. Lots of dealers don't like it that way, but the public loves to know how to choose wisely. They need some tools and assistance to do the job right. Their own eyes are not always sufficiently trained to use only their eyes to decide.
 

crocop

Rough_Rock
Joined
Oct 30, 2016
Messages
35
tyty333|1478287526|4093769 said:
crocop|1478280071|4093704 said:
I would say that the 1.13 is not that great. The 1.07 is ok.

I actually like this one a little better than the 1.07. Try to get an aset because it is on the shallow side but I still think it looks better
than the 1.07.
https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/pear-shaped/1.02-carat-h-color-vs2-clarity-sku-2121114

This one is not as big (8.85mm) but could be nice...

https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/pear-shaped/1.01-carat-h-color-vvs2-clarity-sku-1976860
Hi tyty,

Thanks for these links. I have contacted JA and I will get getting an ASET for the 2nd one (1976860), but for the first one you recommended, they said the diamond is overseas and they cannot get an ASET. anything else I should look out for or ask for?

I am thinking about pulling the trigger on a diamond this week, so hopefully you can give you analysis when I get the ASET.

Do you still think the first one you posted is better? I find the bow tie effect on it is much stronger than the 2nd one, but i am no expert (in fact, I am REALLY new to this).

Thanks,
 

Blingalingaling

Brilliant_Rock
Premium
Joined
Dec 26, 2014
Messages
521
Hi! I'd like to open up a discussion regarding the differences between an "8-main" pavilion plot versus a "5-main" pavilion plot in a pear shaped diamond. Is one plot indicative of more or less light return or a more pleasing face-up facet pattern? I noticed on GIA Certs that they are both called "Pear Brilliant" in the shape category, but there are several cut patterns for pear cuts so I'm curious to know how the cut of the pavilion affects the diamond.

I tried searching PS for the answer to this question, but there doesn't seem to be anything related to cut patterns for pear shapes...unless I'm looking in the wrong places. Can someone enlighten me? Thanks! :confused:
 
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