looking for yellow sapphire for engagement ring, please help

[fmartin5]

hello everyone!! let me start by saying this website is awesome! so, i want to go the unconventional route of getting a yellow sapphire as the center stone for my engagement ring. a friend of a friend is a jeweler and doesnt seem very open to the idea. she keeps pushing me to get a yellow diamond. I dont think she has access to a wide selection of stones except for diamonds. if she does get some i may be paying top dollar which i dont want to do. i need some help!!!! any tips on how i should proceed? my budget is 8-10k for the stone. i live in las vegas am willing to drive within reason. please help!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Niel]

Re: looking for yellow sapphire for engagement ring, please

This
[URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/sapphires-from-africagems-marc-sarosi.197884/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/sapphires-from-africagems-marc-sarosi.197884/[/URL]

http://m.africagems.com/square-yellow-sapphire-g2k-5247.html

 

[marymm]

Re: looking for yellow sapphire for engagement ring, please

OP - I suggest you read this sticky thread - https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/new-to-coloured-gemstone-buying-read-this-first.174284/

And if you'd like yellow sapphire suggestions, it would be helpful if you would post some photos of sapphires that have the yellow you prefer, and the shape(s) and size(s) you are considering. Please also advise as the level of treatment you find acceptable (untreated/unheated, heat-only, etc.)

GemFix and Peter Torraca also have a nice selection of yellow sapphires - http://www.gemfix.com/sapphire_yellow_orange.html - http://www.spectralgems.net/sapphire/

Your budget is quite healthy and I think you will easily find a yellow sapphire that works for you (unless your requirements are particularly narrow).

eta: here's Pala Gems' link to yellow sapphires - http://www.palagems.com/php/db_sear...es=&inventory_number=&submit=Find+All+Matches

If you are up for a drive, Pala Gems is in Pala, Californa, and GemFix is in San Diego... you could set up appts with both ahead of time and have them pull yellow sapphires that meet your criteria.

 

[swissmiss]

Re: looking for yellow sapphire for engagement ring, please

I second the asscher cut sapphire (having seen it in real life). It's a STUNNING stone, which unfortunately did not look fabulous with my skin tone. AfricaGems usually has some sort of promotion going (e.g., 15% coupon) if the price is giving you palpitations.

 

[corundum_conundrum]

Re: looking for yellow sapphire for engagement ring, please

you have the budget for a lighter yellow diamond. Try this site:

http://www.leibish.com/yellow-diamond/101ct-fancy-light-yellow-radiant-vvs2-59922-13027

 

[chrono]

Re: looking for yellow sapphire for engagement ring, please

You have the budget for a yellow sapphire and yellow diamond which is a bonus.
1. Have you seen both gem types to see the difference and to decide which look you prefer?
2. Are you open to buying online? Some online stores have an actual Brick & Mortar presence you can visit but could be many states away) or must you be able to step into the store yourself? For online shopping, we would only recommend vendors that have a 100% refund with no questions asked and a generous review/return period so you are only out the shipping cost.
3. If you are considering a yellow sapphire, have you given thought as to what level of treatment is acceptable to you?

 

[pregcurious]

Re: looking for yellow sapphire for engagement ring, please

+1

Sapphire and diamonds are completely different look. I hope you have the opportunity to see them in person.

 

[LoversKites]

Re: looking for yellow sapphire for engagement ring, please

Embarrassingly perhaps, I have never seen a yellow sapphire in person so I can't list the differences but I was surprised at the level of intensity of saturation in fancy and fancy light yellow diamonds - I thought they would be lighter and less appealing.

 

[chrono]

Re: looking for yellow sapphire for engagement ring, please

LK,
Diamonds, even when coloured, have a very appealing dispersive quality which sapphires can never come close to displaying.

 

[endless_summer]

Re: looking for yellow sapphire for engagement ring, please

+1 on checking out the yellow stone Swissmiss pulled from Marc Sarosi - it is gorgeous!

And, you do have a healthy budget for the stone alone, which should give you the choice between a yellow sapphire and a yellow diamond, so if you have the opportunity - definitely see some examples of both in person. At a minimum, it would allow you to know what you are choosing between. Good luck!

 

[mcmsinger]

Re: looking for yellow sapphire for engagement ring, please

I would rather go for a Yellow Sapphire in my personal preference too, OP.

More bang for the buck in terms of clarity, color, cut and carats.

With a yellow diamond you will probably get less clarity, less color quality, cut maybe better or same or lower depending and the carat weight will defiantly be much much less.

 

[fmartin5]

Re: looking for yellow sapphire for engagement ring, please

wow! i am overwhelmed by all the helpful comments. i thought it was gonna take weeks to get a helpful response. Niel, that is a wonderful stone but I'm hesitant of an online transaction. Marymm, gemfix and pala gems are definitely within driving distance. They'll be receiving a call from me soon. Corundum, I'm leaning heavily against a diamond for many reasons. I kinda feel society uses the size of the diamond as a measure of the guys commitment, love, worth, and overall status. Very few people know about sapphires (including myself!!) to make an educated guess as to the worth of the ring. Chrono, diamonds are very pretty and i did have the chance of comparing them next to sapphires but they are not for me. A high quality yellow sapphire is much more unique and rare than a diamond, or so it seems.
This exciting search has lead me to learn a lot about sapphires. It reminds me a little of visiting a doctor or a dentist. You can read all day and night about the subject but at the end of the day, its difficult to educate yourself enough to tip the balance of knowledge in your favor. As i go through this forum i find people defining the purpose of the purchase, ex: e-ring vs investment. A common response to people who are looking for e-rings is "ultimately you have to be happy with it". In a sense that is very true but i struggle with that statement since I do not have the expertise to know what will make me "happy". in my case, I'd be happy if the stone is valued reasonably close to the purchase price. in other words, i dont want to buy a stone for $10k that made me "happy" and later find out its really only worth $4k. Any tips on not overpaying? also, what type of markup is expected from a jeweler? they have to make a living too but at what point is it excessive. should I pretend its an "investment" stone? maybe ill get a better deal since no emotions are involved. does anyone share my view?

 

[fmartin5]

Re: looking for yellow sapphire for engagement ring, please

I would rather go for a Yellow Sapphire in my personal preference too, OP.

More bang for the buck in terms of clarity, color, cut and carats.

With a yellow diamond you will probably get less clarity, less color quality, cut maybe better or same or lower depending and the carat weight will defiantly be much much less.

I wish the jeweler i was working with shared your sentiment!! Its refreshing to hear that, thanks

 

[fmartin5]

Re: looking for yellow sapphire for engagement ring, please

You have the budget for a yellow sapphire and yellow diamond which is a bonus.
1. Have you seen both gem types to see the difference and to decide which look you prefer?
2. Are you open to buying online? Some online stores have an actual Brick & Mortar presence you can visit but could be many states away) or must you be able to step into the store yourself? For online shopping, we would only recommend vendors that have a 100% refund with no questions asked and a generous review/return period so you are only out the shipping cost.
3. If you are considering a yellow sapphire, have you given thought as to what level of treatment is acceptable to you?

1. I did have a chance to compare them side by side and diamonds do sparkle!! but not for me.
2. id feel more comfortable if i bought it from a a jeweler with a brick and mortar presence. It's my first large purchase since graduating college (2 months ago). I don't want to screw it up
3. I would ideally like the stone to be completely untreated. any other qualities that you would suggest i look for?

 

[slksapphire]

Re: looking for yellow sapphire for engagement ring, please

my understanding is that pala is not a retailer but a true wholesaler to the trade only. i'm not sure you can even make an appointment to go view stones (or maybe you can but they will not tell you prices). pls call and let us know what their policies are.

 

[MollyMalone]

Re: looking for yellow sapphire for engagement ring, please

I don't believe Pala International entertains visits from retail customers. From their FAQ page: Trade versus retail:
If you are not a member of the trade, you can still view our goods online, but you will not see prices. To personally examine goods or learn prices, you can work through your local jeweler.
http://www.palagems.com/questions_trade.htm

Do let us know, however, if you gain entrée!

 

[mcmsinger]

Re: looking for yellow sapphire for engagement ring, please

I would rather go for a Yellow Sapphire in my personal preference too, OP.

More bang for the buck in terms of clarity, color, cut and carats.

With a yellow diamond you will probably get less clarity, less color quality, cut maybe better or same or lower depending and the carat weight will defiantly be much much less.

I wish the jeweler i was working with shared your sentiment!! Its refreshing to hear that, thanks

You welcome.

If you go to a jeweler your chances of paying a price very close to a price you would get if you sold the piece of jewelry would be next to impossible unless you were related and they wanted to do you a favor which is not very probably at all.

Moreover jewelers are often very ignorant on some treatments ESPECIALLY sapphires. They often don't even know if the stones they have are heated or what for that matter. And they may even tell you it's not treated because that's what you want to hear.

Your honest best bet is to buy a stone wholesale from a legit reliable reputable dealer. Compare all your options from all the reputable dealers and make a informed decision according to your budget, needs and exactly which dealer is giving you the best deal for your money.

For treatments disclosure insist upon some independent reputable lab report like GIA, AGL, AGT or even SGL. Something at least.

Never ever buy any stone (not just sapphires) with laser-drilling A.K.A diffusion or fracture-filling.

And then once you buy the yellow sapphire: Have it set by a VERY trustworthy jeweler...

I don't want to spread paranoia but due to common problems with this and considering you seem a bit new to the jewelry world I don't want you to get taken advantage of... Research a trustworthy jeweler who will allow you to watch them set your stone and keep your eyes on them at all times.

Here is some information on what to look out for when setting a stone by jewelry and how to prevent your stone being switched...

I've heard many horror stories of customers leaving their diamond or gemstones to the jeweler either for polishing, cleaning, setting or for some repair...

Only to get back a lower quality stones that looks very close to the higher quality stone which the dishonest Jeweler pockets quietly.

I've even heard multiple accounts from many experiences that a dishonest Jeweler with a lot of practice is capable of switching out a stone in even less than a minute.

This has happened to many people in stores like Zales, Blue Nile, Kay Jewelers, Mall Jewelers and I've even heard of this happening to someone who went to a local jeweler that was considered reputable and everyone in the community even said that they could be trusted only to betray that trust by switching stones.

Many accounts are based on solid evidence and facts from independent appraisals and GIA certifications.

Although I will say that they are cases of a Jeweler being falsely accused due to...

1) Either a spouse getting a CZ but telling them it's a diamond or other valuable gemstone. This happened in one very publicized case in the Newspapers and the Jeweler had their reputation unfairly tarnished over it.

2) Druggie son, daughter or relative switching the stone. (One lady broke down crying because she suspected it was her druggie daughter.)

3) False inaccurate over-graded appraisal. Especially if the appraisal is not independent and made by someone not well-qualified to give an assessment. (One Appraiser was falsely accused of switching a diamond because the previous appraiser over-graded the stone. He lost $15,000 dollars in defense costs and for 1 year his reputation in the community was done the drain until he finally cleared his name of the misunderstanding.)

4) Sold a fake or misrepresented stone from the get-go. (This is also a very common scam.)

5) A dishonest "customer" (more like criminal) themselves making the switch. (This has happened as well sadly.)

20/20 ABC News back in the day did a experiment by hiring a gemologist. They brought 6 high-quality diamonds to 6 different jewelers for setting.

All 5 of 6 jewelers switched the stones according to a qualified independent gemologist. That's a pretty scary result to think about.

One professional reputable jeweler once told my friend to never never EVER leave your jewelry to a jeweler. Always kept it well within your site. She said stone switching is very common and freely admitted to what goes on behind back doors.

If you must leave a stone or have them take it out of sight, I've heard from many honest jewelers that you should have it appraised independently beforehand and know yourself stone very well by looking at it with a good high-powered loupe before giving it along with having a picture taken of it in magnification with the receipt describing it accurate to the T.

And than once you receive it, you should look at the stone again under a loupe before leaving the shop.

This protects both the jeweler and the customer.

It's best to watch them set the stone though and if the jeweler refuses... Run (do not walk) from the shop.

Considering shops from many big name jewelers and even so-called "reputable local jewelers" many years in business doing this with FULL DOCUMENTED evidence and proof that would hold up very well in a court of law.

It is very uncomfortable and you pretty much can't trust anybody in this business it seems.

One jeweler commented that a young lady was reluctant to give her diamond for cleaning it where should couldn't watch the jeweler. Her mother told her it's okay. She gave the diamond. The jeweler while in the back with the diamond with a co-worker looked at the diamond under a loupe and said "Jeez, I don't what she was worried about, the stone is a flawed piece of ****."

And this jeweler accidently said this within ear shot as the lady was behind them watching unknown to them and heard every word... She yelled back "Just give me my stone!"... And rightfully so I'll say!

I think this incident also highlights how the majority of jewelers have a complete utter disregard for customers' property. So the stone is not as expensive or top-quality in general for a pretentious snob. But so what? What if that stone is the most expensive gem in their life for that individual in particular?

Many wealthy clients still wear the same cheap diamond for their wedding that they could afford at the time even though they could upgrade no problem but they don't because sentimental value is not replaceable.

A job of a jeweler is not to find a stone unattainable to a customer due to unaffordability according to their wallet. That doesn't do the customer any good and it sure as hell doesn't do the jeweler any good since they will not make a sale. (You can't get blood from a stone. Pun intended.)

I found it shameless and classless that a jeweler would freely tell that incident about themselves and have no apology for it at least if they wanted to relate it.

The jeweler also by his statement implied that if it was not a "piece of ****" she had something to worry about.

Such attitude of this jeweler raises quite an eyebrow at the industry as a whole with the majority of bad apples ruining it for the few good apples.

I know they are very honest people in every field and very dishonest people in every people.

But such horror stories honestly puts me very off and makes me very weary.

I suspect the majority of jewelers switch stones worth switching and get away with it because most people are very misinformed with diamonds, gemstones and jewelry. They can easily be fooled by a lower-quality stones swapped in and even by CZ's sadly.

Worse is this scam: The Jeweler sells a completely real diamond or other gemstones... But when they customer comes back for cleaning, polishing, repair or re-sizing... The cleverly and disgustingly with no shame for ethics swap the stone. No class or dignity with how low they will stoop.

But I know in this world of dishonesty and greed... They are still a few honest people out there because there is a demand for it in business and there always will be. But dishonestly and greed has no demand and never has ever had any demand. Demand is the very foundation of a business.

The dishonest employees at the Jeweler is also a factor. Some shops are very reputable and the owner would never even think to swap a stone but that doesn't mean their employees wouldn't hold the same standard.

They other risk factor is the shop you go to. I've heard an account that they high-end premium stores for example Tiffanys (They are more high-end shops) would never ever swap a stone in most likelihood.

But the mall jewelers, chain retailers and other shady establishments would not hesitate to swap a stone. It's in fact a industry practice. Illegal and criminal but highly profitable and low risk considering most customers are not gemologists or savvy in diamonds or whatever other gemstones.

One account I heard related that if the jeweler is honest and has nothing to hide... They will not mind at all if you request for the stone to be in your view at all times. If they huff and puff, that is a huge red flag and you should run out of the shop not walk out.

It also depends on how stupid you seem to a dishonest jeweler. If you seem uninformed and like a potential sucker, they will not hesitate to pull a fast one on you. But if they see you know your stuff, they will think twice and not do it. So some jewelers are basically half honest and half dishonest if you want to call it that. Also depending on the value of the stone or jewelry. If it is very expensive and rare of a diamond, they will help themselves. If it's just mid-level and below they won't bother.

Stone swapping isn't they only problem. Internet buying is too.

Clever dealers put out the charade that they offer wholesale prices when in actuality they aren't for the quality of the stone.

Simple specifications don't always give the full story sadly. It sounds illogical but it isn't.

Buying wholesale you CAN get much cheaper prices but you need to be a expert, well-informed and really know what you are doing.

30 minutes of google education will not cut it.

They are actually gimmick wholesalers out there and even the legit wholesalers can give you a bad deal if you don't know your stuff.

Wholesale buying should only be reserved for people who really understand diamonds or other stones they are interested in, are experienced in the jewelry business, gemologists, educated appraisers or well-informed investors who know and understand the entire business along with diamonds and gems.

The pictures are usually very deceptive even among the best of wholesale dealers online.

Basically, not for the faint of heart.

I believe retail is best for most people due to these reasons but even retail has a big caveat according to everything I see...

The majority of retailers are also to put it bluntly a bunch of scumbags, criminals and crooks.

But if you find 1 out of 1,000 thousand jewelers who is honest (Yes, I believe the situation of dishonesty is that bad.) they can help you buy a stone of good quality without dangerous inclusions comprising durability or other major defects in grading making it ideal....

There will be a mark-up though even if you haggle the price. But the peace of mind is worth it.

Wholesalers can sell you a stone with improper grading or not accurate in appraisal. You need to be well-educated to avoid this type of disaster and it can take even a whole decade to be well-informed on what to look for.

I feel the wholesale market place is rigged against you without a serious amount of gemstone IQ and even luck because I am noticing that as internet buying gets more popular the so-called wholesale price of today was yesterdays retail price with the stone not ideal in the 4Cs and not even set in jewelry. In these cases, you should have gone retail to begin with.

But there's a problem in the retail place too...

I feel the retail place is filled with sharks, crooks, criminals, shady individuals and disgusting dishonestly with such devious lows that even Hitler himself would shake his head at.

Some of the ways they try to scam you stone switching is so pathetic and shameless.

What makes it worse is when fraudulent "consumers" also attempt to pull a fast one. That just makes an already bad situation worse in the end.

I do not trust Kay Jewelers, Zales, Blue Nile or other mall outlets nor many other jewelers either. An old lady had once caught a small jeweler shop at the mall switch her stone by looking under the loupe. The priceless look of all the employees showed them to be shocked. They did of course say it was accidental to save face. They thought they were clever and the old lady would have been none the wiser.

Tiffanys seems very trustworthy but I believe they have too much a markup. Like excessive just because of the brand. The positive is that if you buy a 10-carat diamond and take it in for servicing... It is very unlikely they will switch it because they are almost a bit of an authority in providing retail service for the most rarest of diamonds and stones worth millions. Their reputation and endless client list from J.P. Morgan to the Top A-List Celebrities makes it not worth their time or inclination to do such a low-class unprofessional practice of stone switching.

But again the mark-up is too high. Great jewelry at Tiffanys and you can be assured they will not switch your stones like street criminals.

The jeweler industry really needs to be regulated by law more to address these concerns and prevent consumers from being taken advantage of.

It's like stone switching has become a very profitable low-risk way of money-changing.

But even in the high-end market one Jeweler was caught stone switching for very wealthy clients and even the famous golfers Jack Nicklaus and Greg Norman were sold worthless jewelry.

Jack Hasson is the name of the jeweler guilty of this.

You can google "jeweler switch diamond"

Try it.

Google will assist in it search and give other similar suggestions on searching. That means it's a common search inquiry and therefore a common concern of customers in the back of their minds.

Many cases have shown the jeweler to copy your serial number and laser it to the substitute.

Therefore an independent appraisal is your best defense before and after along with knowing your stone very well in inclusions along with getting a print out of it. That is very tough to counterfeit.

In fact, I'm wrong... You can't counterfeit that since every stone has it's own unique fingerprint and you can't manufacture inclusions to match it with current technology.

Serial numbers are easily counterfeited.

Insurance is also your friend. Please, Martin... Get Insurance! Make sure you have an independent appraisal for insurance purposes. Watch the appraisers to at all times and do not ever let your stone out of sight.

 

[mcmsinger]

Re: looking for yellow sapphire for engagement ring, please

If working with a Jeweler is a must than go to a really good honest and trustworthy jeweler with many years in the business.

Often times the best jewelers are those who are in decades in the business.

Research jewelers specializing in sapphires.

Do not rush. Educate yourself on sapphires particularly yellow sapphire. Know how to determine their value. Research first. Don't be quick to take out your wallet. There is no rush or urgency.

Clarity is very very important and highly valued in yellow sapphires. No less than VVS1 clarity for a top quality one. Try to shoot ideally for Internally Flawless if you can.

A lemon yellow color is what you should look for. Avoid brownish hues. Light yellow sapphire are less valuable. Look for a very well-saturated color and a lemon yellow color.

Cut is important too in a yellow sapphire but not as much as in a diamond for example.

Than carat size. If you want to hold your price or at least have it appreciate the most. Experience and history has shown that gemstones 2 carats and up have the highest appreciation in value. (Of course clarity, color, cut and treatments are taken into account too but I'm assuming those are all equal.)

 

[mcmsinger]

Re: looking for yellow sapphire for engagement ring, please

Also untreated stones have shown many times statistically to hold their value better compared to treated stones. (assuming of course equal 4C's such as color, clarity, cut and carats.)

 

[MollyMalone]

Re: looking for yellow sapphire for engagement ring, please

I'll simply comment on a couple of things mcmsinger has said that I find most disconcerting:

Your honest best bet is to buy a stone wholesale from a legit reliable reputable dealer. Compare all your options from all the reputable dealers and make a informed decision according to your budget, needs and exactly which dealer is giving you the best deal for your money.
By the very definition, wholesalers sell only to "the trade"; not to consumers/retail customers. Yes, there are some who sell to both markets, but the trade price is, in my experience (my father-in-law was in the trade) always lower than the price quoted to a consumer.

Never ever buy any stone (not just sapphires) with laser-drilling A.K.A diffusion or fracture-filling.
Laser drilling is not the same thing as either fracture-filling or diffusion. (According to GIA, diamonds are the only stones subject to being laser-drilled, primarily because they are the only gems that can withstand the heat of the laser bore.)

Research a trustworthy jeweler who will allow you to watch them set your stone and keep your eyes on them at all times.* * * They will not mind at all if you request for the stone to be in your view at all times. If they huff and puff, that is a huge red flag and you should run out of the shop not walk out.
If one is having a ring custom-crafted -- as is often the case with many colored gem stones since they often are not cut to fit stock settings-- do you really believe it's realistic to think that you can park yourself bench-side while the ring is being crafted?
.
Clarity is very very important and highly valued in yellow sapphires. No less than VVS1 clarity for a top quality one. Try to shoot ideally for Internally Flawless if you can.
GIA's clarity grading is more "forgiving" when it comes to colored gems than is the case with diamonds, and GIA does not assign Internally Flawless (or VVS1 for that matter) to any colored gem, regardless of whether it's a Type I, II (how sapphires are classified), or III. See, e.g.,
http://www.gemfix.com/GIA_clarity_system.html

Moreover, AGL -- which most of us would use for colored gemstones rather than GIA -- does not employ GIA's VVS, VS, etc. terminology. AGL has its own proprietary system of grading color and clarity in gemstones; their clarity scale ranges from FI1 - E13. Bottom line: you do our OP a disservice by exhorting him to insist on at least VVS1 in sapphires; there is no such thing.

fmartin5, note that although GemFix uses the GIA nomenclature (e.g., VVS or VS) in their listings, a AGL report is included with virtually all of their yellow sapphires:
http://www.gemfix.com/sapphire_yellow_orange.html
And here's an article from Pala Gems' web site re appraisals & insurance; it dates back to 1999, but the advice remains solid imo:
http://www.palagems.com/choosing_an_appraiser.htm
(I'm not certain what mcmsinger means when he refers to a gem's "fingerprint", but GemPrint's registry is for diamonds only.)

 

[mcmsinger]

Re: looking for yellow sapphire for engagement ring, please

Molly,

I know laser-drilling is different than fracture filling.

Laser-drilling = drilling small holes and filling them with acid to erase flaws.

Fracture-filling = inserting lead-glass material into the stone.

I'm not here for your condescension or snobbery. I mentioned both and you assumed I thought it was the same thing like a know-it-all fault finder full of yourself.

 

[mcmsinger]

Re: looking for yellow sapphire for engagement ring, please

Yes, there are some who sell to both markets, but the trade price is, in my experience (my father-in-law was in the trade) always lower than the price quoted to a consumer.

do you really believe it's realistic to think that you can park yourself bench-side while the ring is being crafted?
.
GIA's clarity grading is more "forgiving" when it comes to colored gems than is the case with diamonds, and GIA does not assign Internally Flawless (or VVS1 for that matter) to any colored gem, regardless of whether it's a Type I, II (how sapphires are classified), or III.

Moreover, AGL -- which most of us would use for colored gemstones rather than GIA -- does not employ GIA's VVS, VS, etc. terminology. AGL has its own proprietary system of grading color and clarity in gemstones; their clarity scale ranges from FI1 - E13. Bottom line: you do our OP a disservice by exhorting him to insist on at least VVS1 in sapphires; there is no such thing.


(I'm not certain what mcmsinger means when he refers to a gem's "fingerprint", but GemPrint's registry is for diamonds only.)

1. It beats retail prices any day of the week.

2. Yes. Many jewelers are starting to offer that option. Do your research. Some jewelers even insist. And I never said that's they only option. I gave examples of what you can do to protect yourself. (Loupe chart, appraisals and insurance.)

3. GIA is not the consumer. The fact is that Yellow Sapphire than any other sapphire are set to a higher standard in clarity expectations than all other sapphires. (Ruby, Blue Sapphire, White Sapphire and Pink Sapphire.) I never ever said anything general about colored stones having high clarity standards than any other stone. I meant specifically yellow sapphires and only yellow sapphires especially compared to other species of Sapphires. The OP didn't ask for diamonds either. So no need to mention them where they are not relevant. Stick to the topic. Otherwise go discuss Diamonds' superiority elsewhere.

4. The metric is merely different used by them. There is such a thing if you know how to convert the metric. You later prove me right by your own statement at the end of your post mentioning GemFix using that metric.

5. You do the OP disservice by hijacking the thread with fault-finding condescension to make yourself feel superior. No need to address yourself with "our". You don't own this forum or website. Speak for yourself like I do.

6. Every gemstone out there has it's own different unique inclusions which you can identify under a loupe. That's what I mean by "fingerprint". You thought I meant a GemPrint registry service because you assume and imply I'm an idiot. And than mention it's for diamonds only. Take your attitude, condescension, arrogance, snobbery, fault-finding eagerness and irrelevant admirations of diamonds against other gems elsewhere. This is a Yellow Sapphire thread and also not a knowledge/fault-finding competition.

 

[chrono]

Re: looking for yellow sapphire for engagement ring, please

When it comes to coloured gemstones, colour is what sets the price. However, colour preference is also very personal; some like the pop of colour to be intense whilst someone else might prefer a more subdued colour. Some want only a pure yellow whilst others don't mind a green modifier. Find out what you like/dislike and go from there. In short, a pure yellow with intense saturation will be the most expensive and a muted yellow with x modifier will be the least expensive.

Untreated yellow sapphires are very difficult to find, especially if you are looking for a strongly saturated pure yellow. If you accept "simple" heat only, your options open up greatly. Not impossible but it will take more time to find a pretty looking untreated yellow sapphire.

The clarity standard for yellow sapphires is to only be eye clean. There is no point in paying more for an internally flawless stone and adding to the difficulty of the search unless it happens to be that clean as well. Again, colour should always come first for most people.

Cutting is a difficult topic to discuss but a good cut can make a gem highly attractive (beautiful and very lively flash). Potential cut issues include windowing (not to be confused with a tilt window), extinction, off-symmetry and more.

 

[MollyMalone]

Re: looking for yellow sapphire for engagement ring, please

Actually, mcm, I don't carry a torch for diamonds (much to my late father-in-law's confounded dismay, I turned aside all the diamond-only engagement rings he pressed upon me & opted for an estate jeweler's much less expensive, antique emerald ring with mine-cut , accent diamonds -- the horror! ). My concern was that your holding forth included some statements that were misleading/confusing to a newbie, such as"'laser-drilling A.K.A diffusion or fracture-filling."

I know that you purchased a sapphire from Astrological Gems that they described as VVS1, but had you submitted the stone to GIA or AGL, their lab report would not come back with such a designation. And so I wanted to explain why that's the case lest fmartin5 feel "ripped off" upon receiving a GIA or AGL report that did not parrot a vendor's Internally Flawless or VVS1 grading. (Similarly, neither GIA nor AGL grades yellow sapphires on "a higher standard in clarity expectations than all other sapphires.")

It's certainly true that there are jewelers who will set a stone in the customer's presence, but I've not heard of any goldsmith or platinum artisan who would offer a client the opportunity to hover over them while they fashion a ring "from scratch". If you know of such, please share.

 

[pregcurious]

Re: looking for yellow sapphire for engagement ring, please

fmartin, do you have access to stores within driving distance of you where you can see yellow diamonds and sapphires? If you email us your general geographical area (e.g. Boston), we may be able to suggest some places as it can be difficult to find a store that has colored stones.

 

[fmartin5]

Re: looking for yellow sapphire for engagement ring, please

Believe it or not i learned a ton from the exchange between both of you, mcmsinger and mollymalone. It seemed to me that it was all a big misunderstanding. Im sure both of you would get along just fine in a different setting but this is the nature of the internet. both of you seem very knowledgeable and i trully do appreciate your help.

 

[fmartin5]

Re: looking for yellow sapphire for engagement ring, please

fmartin, do you have access to stores within driving distance of you where you can see yellow diamonds and sapphires? If you email us your general geographical area (e.g. Boston), we may be able to suggest some places as it can be difficult to find a store that has colored stones.

Im in las vegas, nv. I have not found a jeweler that specializes in gems here in las vegas. I hear jck convention is in las vegas in may but can only be attended by those in the industry. Do you know if there are any side events held for the public? .

 

[mcmsinger]

Re: looking for yellow sapphire for engagement ring, please

Unheated yellow sapphires with good 4Cs are hard to find because they are rare. And because rare, they are hard to find.

Therefore the price goes up, the demand goes and you are more likely to retain your value in the stone. You have more collector money chasing fewer stones as well.

Yellow sapphires are found with a higher rate of very good clarity compared to other sapphires. Therefore there is a higher expectation of clarity and clarity standards is less forgiving.

If you want unheated yellow sapphire, look for strong color saturation. Do not buy a light color unheated yellow sapphire because they can fade due to excessive sunlight or heat.

Go for a medium canary color with slight hints of brownish and orange hues or a lemon yellow color. Avoid excessive brownish color and overly dark stones.

Cutting IS important but more forgivable on yellow sapphire than say a diamond. But also keep in mind not to compromise too much on the cutting.

 

[mcmsinger]

Re: looking for yellow sapphire for engagement ring, please

Not impossible but it will take more time to find a pretty looking untreated yellow sapphire.

Stones with particular criteria that are hard to find, take time and effort to get a fair price are usually worth having. Stones which are extremely easy to find, take no time and no effort to get a fair price are usually disposable.

Note: Not always the case but many times it is. White sapphires used to be very inexpensive, easy to find and took no effort to get a good price. White Sapphire now are quite expensive. Not anywhere near diamonds but they have really shot up in price.

 

[mcmsinger]

Re: looking for yellow sapphire for engagement ring, please

Actually, mcm, I don't carry a torch for diamonds (much to my late father-in-law's confounded dismay, I turned aside all the diamond-only engagement rings he pressed upon me & opted for an estate jeweler's much less expensive, antique emerald ring with mine-cut , accent diamonds -- the horror! ). My concern was that your holding forth included some statements that were misleading/confusing to a newbie, such as"'laser-drilling A.K.A diffusion or fracture-filling."

I know that you purchased a sapphire from Astrological Gems that they described as VVS1, but had you submitted the stone to GIA or AGL, their lab report would not come back with such a designation. And so I wanted to explain why that's the case lest fmartin5 feel "ripped off" upon receiving a GIA or AGL report that did not parrot a vendor's Internally Flawless or VVS1 grading. (Similarly, neither GIA nor AGL grades yellow sapphires on "a higher standard in clarity expectations than all other sapphires.")

It's certainly true that there are jewelers who will set a stone in the customer's presence, but I've not heard of any goldsmith or platinum artisan who would offer a client the opportunity to hover over them while they fashion a ring "from scratch". If you know of such, please share.

Alright. Just a misunderstanding.

All forgiven.