Is this a fair price?

[captainmcgee]

Hi All,

So still on the hunt for a stone and have found one that seems to be great but wondering whether we are getting a good price.

It is a 4.17 Triple Ex E colour SI2- it is completely eye-clean so gorgeous couldn't believe it was SI2. It is about roughly $73,000.

It looks amazing and it fits all our criteria but wondering on the price, it seems fine to me but I am worried it's too expensive for what it is or is it too cheap and am I silly and it's not that great a stone if its that price?

Hope there is enough information to give a rough idea of the pricing guide.

Thanks!

 

[slg47]

I would definitely check it out in different lighting to make sure it is eye-clean to your specifications. A search on PS for 4 carat E SI2 gives prices as around $64000 for GIA but there are no Ex Ex Ex stones on the search. (see search function under resources)

 

[captainmcgee]

Would Ex/Ex/Ex affect the price by $10,000?

Yes, I did a search also and noticed that but thought it was due to the fact that there were no Ex/Ex/Ex stones listed that there was nothing in a similar price range.

Thanks!

 

[slg47]

there are also factors such as cut quality, fluorescence, the fact that your stone is at a B&M store and these are online that could affect the pricing. the search is the only information I have though...hopefully it was somewhat helpful.

 

[antelope1]

A 4ct eye-clean SI2??

Do you have an inclusion plot? Is the a nebula, a white feather, or what? I'm trying to think of ways an SI2s could be eye-clean at that size.

Also, have you checked it out in different lighting -- window light, incandescent, sodium lights, etc? B&M stores always spend a ton of money to get the absolute best lighting -- a diamond will never look as good as it does in the store IMO for that reason!

 

[captainmcgee]

I am getting this stone through a merchant who is a friend of the family and thought that might be the reason for the pricing as others I have seen on the PS search that were similar seemed to be at the $118k mark. It has no fluro and is triple ex as I am super particular on the cut first and foremost.

I can't see the inclusions face up could it be that they are only visable from the side? Would this be possible or SI2's never eyeclean in the 4ct range?

What would you suggest to do when I go and see it again? I have walked around with it in the office to see it under different lighting and there is an exchange period, so I am not sure they would be trying to sell me a dud, plus they are friends of the family. Maybe I am too naive?

 

[whatmeworry]

I am getting this stone through a merchant who is a friend of the family and thought that might be the reason for the pricing as others I have seen on the PS search that were similar seemed to be at the $118k mark. It has no fluro and is triple ex as I am super particular on the cut first and foremost.

I can't see the inclusions face up could it be that they are only visable from the side? Would this be possible or SI2's never eyeclean in the 4ct range?

What would you suggest to do when I go and see it again? I have walked around with it in the office to see it under different lighting and there is an exchange period, so I am not sure they would be trying to sell me a dud, plus they are friends of the family. Maybe I am too naive?

The only thing that's raising alarms is "exchange" period. Usually that means you can exchange the diamond for another diamond. I would much rather have a "return" period, where if for whatever reason you just don't want it you can return it for your money back.

 

[slg47]

can you take it to an independent appraiser and get it checked out? for such a large purchase I think this is wise

 

[yssie]

BIG ditto to getting it appraised (by a qualified *independent* appraiser). Unfortunately deals with family friends do go sour, and it's even worse when they do since you usually can't just say goodbye and move on.


An eyeclean 4ct SI2... well, statistically unlikely using any normal definition of eyeclean, but statistic mean little on an individual level.


Do you have photos of the stone? Not all GIA Exs are created equal. If polish for example is vg it's not a dealbreaker - you won't see the difference IRL.

 

[antelope1]

Perhaps you could ask the family friend for a copy of the cert?

I don't think it's impossible for a 4ct SI2 to be eye-clean, but I'm just curious as to how it could be eye clean. It could be a really big cloud in the table with a feather in the perimeter, maybe? If that were the inclusion plot, I would buy both the clarity grade and the eye clean rating. Maybe it has a black inclusion somewhere?

If you go back and look at it again, ask to look at the inclusions under a loupe (or preferably a 70x microscope). Locate them, and make sure that they match the inclusions on the plot on the cert. (An independent appraiser would do the same.)

 

[yssie]

at the risk of redundancy, ditto antelope.


I'm honestly more worried that the stone *is* eyeclean. This means the inclusion isn't openly visible, and clouds/wisps can be insiduous in large quantities/thickly concentrated - and yet can still be worthy of an "SI2" grade through the loupe, and difficult to see without a loupe w/ the naked eye...an ugly black crystal near the girdle would make a fantastic inclusion, as you could just prong the bogey and know it's interfering very little with light return.

I finally found the thread I was looking for - this stone from this thread in CS really illustrates the importance of location of an artifact in a gemstone. The example stone is a pink tourmaline with a blue culet and surrounding area... now imagine that the stone is a diamond, with a dense cloud at/near the culet. Eyeclean, maybe, but...

GIA does not consider the effects of inclusions on cut grade - cut is strictly proportions based.

 

[captainmcgee]

I am getting this stone through a merchant who is a friend of the family and thought that might be the reason for the pricing as others I have seen on the PS search that were similar seemed to be at the $118k mark. It has no fluro and is triple ex as I am super particular on the cut first and foremost.

I can't see the inclusions face up could it be that they are only visable from the side? Would this be possible or SI2's never eyeclean in the 4ct range?

What would you suggest to do when I go and see it again? I have walked around with it in the office to see it under different lighting and there is an exchange period, so I am not sure they would be trying to sell me a dud, plus they are friends of the family. Maybe I am too naive?

The only thing that's raising alarms is "exchange" period. Usually that means you can exchange the diamond for another diamond. I would much rather have a "return" period, where if for whatever reason you just don't want it you can return it for your money back.

Sorry should have clarified they have a full return and money back period not exchange.
Yes shall we going to very closely scrutinise before next week so will update more.

 

[slg47]

OK I am glad they have a full return period. I would get it checked out with an appraiser but I hope you love it and it is what you have been looking for!

 

[Rockdiamond]

Hi all,
Guys, to understand clarity grading means considering all the possibilities.
If the SI2 imperfection is a single black spot, which is located directly over a large facet, sure, you might be able to see it.
But if we divide that same black spot into 5 pieces and locate them all over small virtual facet areas, then it's totally possible that the smaller spots are completely impossible to see with the naked eyes.
Or, as Yssie suggests what if that same single SI2 sized booger is located where it can't be seen from the top of the stone- or even from the side- only from behind.
What if it's a cloud that is nearly impossible to see?
All of these possibilities exist
So, there's no need to be incredulous that a 4ct Si2 can be eye clean- many are.
Many aren't as well- yet that's no reason to discourage folks from trying to find the eye clean ones.
They're out there.
I'd never suggest using a 70x microscope to look at a stone either.
Matching plot and diamond is best accomplished with a normal 10 power loupe.

 

[captainmcgee]

Thanks so much rockdiamond, I really appreciate it.

I'd like to think I can trust them and also that my judgement is correct. I don't have mind-clean issue so am hoping this SI2 is it.

I will report back once I've seen it again this week.

 

[antelope1]

I'd never suggest using a 70x microscope to look at a stone either.
Matching plot and diamond is best accomplished with a normal 10 power loupe.

Aw, I just like microscopes is all.

 

[Rockdiamond]

Aw- you scientific types- where would we be without you!!

You're welcome Mif!!!

 

[captainmcgee]

I really hope this is the one so will have to be very picky. The cut & colour and exactly what I was after and only want eye-clean so lets just all hope this is the one- fingers crossed.

Does this price sound fair though- around $73,000?