Is Mondera an A Cut Above Dealer?

[Superidealist]

Carefully compare the arrows images on this Mondera page with the arrows image on this Whiteflash page. It helps if you magnify the Mondera image. Particularly note the lighter "pie slice" at the three o''clock position in the diamond''s eye.

Look closely at the Mondera hearts and they will look familiar, too.

 

[Mara]

Don''t know about the images but Mondera''s H&A stones have GIA certificates...while all ACA branded stones will only come with an AGS cert.

Secondly, I looked at a few of the Mondera diamonds in a search and they list their cuts as ''Very Good (H&A)'' and have girdles that are ''Medium-Thick''.

The cert thing debunks the myth for me, but I also have a feeling that WF would take exception to their ACA brand being called ''Very Good'' cut rather than exceptional nor do I recall any ACA stones having a Thick portion of the girdle. In fact most of them err more on the thin side.

I''m sure WF will chime in, but I bet Mondera is selling a loosely interpreted non-branded H&A stone rather than an actual branded stone.

 

[JohnQuixote]

Mara - You are correct. They have lifted our imagery.
DR has been kind enough to bring this up before.

Of course, as with others, Mondera is not an ACA dealer.

If you cruise and click enough, you'll see our H&A imagery has been lifted in many places.

It's flattering that they use our patterning as the standard, but we cannot endorse such use, since the stones they are selling are not ACA. In some cases sites have removed the images when asked, in others they have not. Our legal department is handling it.

You will notice recent imagery for consumers has an ACA copyright stamped on it.

Thanks again for bringing it up, DR.

 

[JohnQuixote]

Recent ACA image with copyright stamp.

 

[RockDoc]

Hey John....

Clever to have your copyright marking on the photo, but as you know it can be cropped out.

WIsh I could make a useful suggestion for you....


Regards and wishes for a good holiday...

Rockdoc

 

[denverappraiser]

John,

Unfortunately, this is a problem you can expect to deal with for a long time. It goes along with doing excellent work. The bright side is that it puts you in the position of being the one to copy. By stealing your work, they are defining quality to mean "Almost as good as ACA."

This happens with jewelry designers constantly. I can''t tell you how many times I''ve seen my designs cloned into mass distribution.

By the way, just what are you on vaction FROM, if it isn''t us? Turn off the damn computer and go sip some eggnog.

Neil Beaty
Independent Appraisals in Denver

 

[JohnQuixote]

Date: 12/28/2004 10

3:31 AM
Author: denverappraiser
John,

Unfortunately, this is a problem you can expect to deal with for a long time. It goes along with doing excellent work. The bright side is that it puts you in the position of being the one to copy. By stealing your work, they are defining quality to mean ''Almost as good as ACA.''

This happens with jewelry designers constantly. I can''t tell you how many times I''ve seen my designs cloned into mass distribution.

By the way, just what are you on vaction FROM, if it isn''t us? Turn off the damn computer and go sip some eggnog.

Neil Beaty

Independent Appraisals in Denver

Neil - LOL. Well, I have have high-speed internet at the Marriott and a twisted desire to visit you fine folk between festive diversions.

Sincere thanks for the cheerful outlook. As much as we can consider it a compliment, I know you will appreciate that our foremost concern is for the buyers. No matter how much we appreciate the nod to our quality, a company using those images when not selling the product is being untruthful.

Rockdoc - Thank you, and of course, you''re right. We are working on it with our legal eagles.

 

[danielksc]

Hi

I am new to this forum. I have recently bought a H&A diamond from Mondera. Is there any cause for concern? Are you trying to to say that there''s something wrong with Mondera''s H&A diamonds?

BTW, do you know how I can get insurance to ship my diamond from Singapore to New York?

Please advise.


Thank you.
Dan

 

[JohnQuixote]

Date: 1/8/2005 10:35:10 PM
Author: danielksc
Hi

I am new to this forum. I have recently bought a H&A diamond from Mondera. Is there any cause for concern? Are you trying to to say that there's something wrong with Mondera's H&A diamonds?

BTW, do you know how I can get insurance to ship my diamond from Singapore to New York?

Please advise.

Thank you.

Dan

Dan - If the stone looks beautiful to you, then no worries.

The simple focus of this thread is the fact that Mondera has lifted our imagery to represent their H&A diamonds. The photograph used to advertise their H&A stones is of a Whiteflash "A Cut Above" diamond we had cut to specific proportions - a stone which Mondrea never owned or sold. We feel this is deceptive to their clienetele. We have initiated communication with Mondera but have not received satisfaction or acknowledgement of this issue as of today (1/9/05).

Mondera is a dealer who has satisfied many customers. There is nothing "wrong," except for the fact that they are coining the work and standards of others and calling it their own.

As far as insurance goes, I suggest contacting David Stone with Chubb:

David Stone
The Plastridge Agency of Boca Raton
Toll Free :  800-473-6603
In the Boca Raton area :  561-395-1435
email: [email protected]

 

[JohnQuixote]

Update...Mondera has now greyed-out the images (see via D Riley's link above). However, to the best of my knowledge those are still WF images. We are still awaiting a response frrom Mondera.

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

http://www.mondera.com/learn/hearts_diamonds.asp?mscssid=3VWMBLW2X9D48GK8U4EV3ND10H1HBRWD

http://www.whiteflash.com/diamond-education/visible_perfection.aspx

too busy to write

 

[valeria101]

Date: 1/9/2005 2:35:39 AM
Author: Garry H (Cut Nut)
...too busy to write

Do you think Mondera customers even bother hold this seller to their aparently rarefied standards ???

WF gets that treatment .. at least here, that is.

 

[Superidealist]

To clarify, Ana's first image is from Whiteflash (Garry's second link) and her second image is from Mondera (Garry's first link).

Both, however, are predated by the image shown below from Gamzu's website. If you're going to copy, at least get it right... extensive white are???

 

[Superidealist]

JohnQuixote said in private communication:

I wanted to contact you here first to let you know that Brian had a mutual business relationship with Gamzu when our graphics were developed years ago. Gamzu is aware of our interpretation of the images, and it has been acknowledged publicly.
.
.
.
Brian is on an airplane right now, but I will try to find where the prior acknowledgement of Gamzu was.

So, to clarify, Whiteflash used the text and graphics with permission.

 

[Superidealist]

Date: 1/9/2005
Author: JohnQuixote
Update...Mondera has now greyed-out the images (see via D Riley's link above). However, to the best of my knowledge those are still WF images.

I don't believe these come from Whiteflash. Compare The new Mondera image with one taken from Diamond Source of Virginia and another from Wink's FreeCZ website.

Mondera

Diamond Source of Virginia

FreeCZ


However, here, here, and here are a few other pages with uncredited Whiteflash images.

 

[JohnQuixote]

DR – Appreciate your reply and the clarification.

The page is years-old and predates my involvement with WF. Frankly, for educational purposes I prefer these illustrations Brian developed for the PS tutorial, which are more recent. We're in the process of creating a page with actual photos that should be more progressive – but that's not the point of this thread.

To elaborate on the point: The page we developed while doing business with Gamzu was a progression. Pertinent content and descriptors remained, but the graphics were evolved and the format and titles changed. Mondera, on the other hand, lifted our evolved graphics, removed the color, outlined the stones and left it as-is...Even the font sizes (and the typo) are intact. Unlike our situation with Gamzu those years ago, Mondera does not have a working relationship with us.

 

[JohnQuixote]

Date: 1/9/2005 8:54

2 PM
Author: Superidealist

I don't believe these come from Whiteflash. Compare The new Mondera image with one taken from Diamond Source of Virginia and another from Wink's FreeCZ website.

However, here, here, and here are a few other pages with uncredited Whiteflash images.

You have an uncanny knack for this. Good calls on those now-shifting Mondera images.

Thank you for linking the other incidents of imagery “nickery.” I was not aware.

 

[Lord Summerisle]

About the only thing I could suggest to help combat the lifting of images, is to put a very feint copyright text through the middle of the images, in a very light grey.

See moonmaiden]for example the main problem I see is that since the image is highly symetrical it might be necessary to put the copyright text accross the centre of the image. Altho i think the image style is such that it would be on the eaiser side of difficult to edit the image back to that without the copyrighting, with it being simple colours, and the symmetry... inherant problems really

 

[Superidealist]

John, did Brian find the announcement acknowledging his business relationship with Gamzu? I''d be interested in reading it since I had speculated privately (on the Diamonds After Dark forum) a couple of years ago on a connection between Gamzu''s Supereightcut diamonds and A Cut Above diamonds. I''d like to see how right or wrong I was.

 

[JohnQuixote]

Brian told me it was on a B2B site associated with the Mouawads, but the name escapes him. He told me Rockdoc may have been a moderator. I've written to Bill to see if he remembers. It predates my involvement, but perhaps you know of this forum (?)

Brian returns today. Once he's back in the saddle I'll see if he can provide particulars.

 

[Superidealist]

If it was a business to business board it may have been restricted to members of the trade.

 

[Superidealist]

Here are a few more you can go after.