In desparate need of advice

[Clownboy]

Hello All,

I''ve been watching these forums for quite awhile and hope that I can make a good decision based on everyone''s opinions. My most important feature is the cut and the quality over the size. Could you all let me know your opinion on this ring. I truely appreciate your help.

Breakdown:

Shape & Cutting Style: Round Brilliant
Measurements: 6.20 - 6.27 x 3.89 mm
Weight: 1.00 carat
Depth: 62.4%
Table: 57%
Girdle: Thick to Very Thick, Faceted
Cutlet: Small
Polish: GOOD
Symmetry: Good
Clarity Grade: VS2
Color: E
Flourescence: Faint
Comment: Crown angles are greater than 35 degrees.

Price: $8200

Thank you in advance for all your help.

 

[aljdewey]

Hi, CB:




Picking a stone is such a personal choice, it's hard to say what's right for someone else.




At first blush, though, the stone you listed doesn't look like a winner. It has the diameter of a 90-point stone, so you're paying for a bunch of weight you can't see up top. It's likely hiding a bit of weight in the depth, but mostly in that girdle....thick to very thick isn't good.




A well-cut 1 carat stone should measure around 6.5mm.




You can improve the cut by looking for a stone with table 55/56, crown angle 34.2 to 34.8, pavilion angle 40.6 to 40.9, and at least VG/VG if not EX/EX or ID/ID. Girdle thin to med....or even slightly thick.




(The stone you posted has a steeper crown angle ...over 35 degrees...which can still be a nice stone, but it's not as optimal as the range I mentioned above.)




If you need to make tradeoffs to get a better cut and stay within your budget, I'd drop the E, VS....you could go F or G easily.




Here's a better example of a well-cut stone.....


1.013 F, VS2 for $7635


http://www.whiteflash.com/hearts_arrows/A-Cut-Above-H-A-cut-diamond-499853.htm




This stone would be an example of a MUCH better cut selection.

 

[Iceman]

You really need to see the stone.

Ive had diamonds come in here ,with the numbers were off I didnt think it would look good and they really sparkled and even had hearts and arrrows !!!!!!

There are a lot of good vendors aboard here. I would hate to put up just one , but that is a good example.

Good luck on your hunt for a diamond.

Corey

 

[Clownboy]

Thank you for the replies. I have seen this diamond and it looks really nice, but want to ensure that I am not getting a raw deal. This is due to a really good friend of mine whom has a good friend that owns several jewelery stores. The thing that makes me somewhat sketchful is that the place that I went to see the diamonds was in a Mall & I know (from people's posts) that they usually slap on a VERY high premium at those types of Jewelery stores. However, the guy was very nice and helpful and essentially took off 50% of what the same diamond would go for on the show floor. So that creates even more confusion as to whether I'm getting a good deal, or a good deal from a Mall's perspective. In reviewing the diamonds, I did notice a difference in color between E and and F (but maybe it was the cut?). The E seemed clearer and more vibrant with a light bluish hue. Do you think I could find a better deal at say, DERCO in the San Francisco Jewelery Mart?

Thanks again, I appreciate all the help.

-CB

 

[aljdewey]

----------------
On 6/14/2004 11:58:28 AM Clownboy wrote:











I have seen this diamond and it looks really nice, but want to ensure that I am not getting a raw deal.

However, the guy was very nice and helpful and essentially took off 50% of what the same diamond would go for on the show floor.

I did notice a difference in color between E and and F (but maybe it was the cut?). The E seemed clearer and more vibrant with a light bluish hue

----------------

CB.....in advance, forgive my directness.

No, you are not getting a great deal on that stone. It's really tough to help you on this because on the one hand, you're saying cut is important and this doesn't appear to be a well-cut diamond. On the other hand, you said you've seen it and it looks nice. Have you compared it nex to a well-cut stone? Perhaps your opinion of this stone would change if you did.

However, all that really matters is that it appeals to YOUR eye. If you like it, and you are comfortable with the price, then buy it.

But I cannot lie to you.......no, you aren't getting a good deal on this stone. You're paying for a 1.00 carat stone and getting a stone that looks like a .90 stone! You're sacrificing 10% of the visible weight! If cookies were $1.00 each and you paid me $10 and I only gave you 9 cookies, would you think that was a good deal? Probably not. Same thing with this stone.

Oh, and the "nice guy" who took 50% off the price.....that's because he INFLATED the price by more than 50% in the first place. Where I live, a gallon of milk currently runs about $2.89. If I were to mark the milk up to $6.00 per gallon and then "discount" it 50%, it would be $3.00.....still more than you could get it anywhere else. Here's a tip: There's NO WAY that diamond would sell for $16K to *anyone*. It's not worth $16K, and he wouldn't get it.

As per the example I gave you above, you can get an TOP-cut stone for less money than the stone you are looking for. Why would you want to spend *more* money on an inferior stone? That's like paying $15 for a hamburger when you could get a filet mignon for $12! No, it's not a good deal.

Another thing.....unless you have *superman* eyes, the difference you saw between the E and F wasn't a color difference.....the human eye cannot distinguish a difference of one color grade, especially in colorless stones. Also, a diamond looking "clearer" isn't a function of color difference....it may be a clarity difference.

CB, you really should spend some time reading the tutorials on here before making any purchase. I'm sure your "friend" means well, but this is a serious purchase. Your "friend of a friend" isn't there to look out for your best interests, and if you don't look out for them, you could make a costly mistake.

 

[Clownboy]

Thanks for your advice, aljdewey - and no worries on being so direct. I appreciate the honesty. I do have my concerns of this individual and know at the end of the day they are in business for a reason - to make $$$ (especially ones at malls). I have read the tutorials, but this store was the first place I physically looked at diamonds & obviously need to go to several other places (the ability to finance was also a better fit for me). Does anyone have an other diamonds, aside from the one mentioned above, to help me gain a better perpective on pricing?
I thank you again for your candor, aljdewey - it helped me realize that I would of settled on something that I thought had, but in reality lacked.

-CB

 

[aljdewey]

You're welcome.




A few things: With an exceptionally cut stone, you can drop a bit in color. I'd try around the G/H range. I have an H, and one of the women I work with has an F stone that isn't as well cut. Mine actually looks whiter than hers .....because the cut is superior.




Do a search on the PS front page under "search by cut quality"....there are several stones in your budget that would be excellent buys. Here's an example below:

 

[bling]

I agree with al in that you can find a much better cut stone elsewhere, especially since you are ranking cut as a top priority. the stone does seem deep and you will be paying quite alot for what you cant see. the B&M will mark it up because it says 1.0 ct..the magic number, but from the mm, it will look smaller.
you mentioned derco in sf..they do have very competitive prices for a storefront, and if you call them to make an appt, please give them some specs so that they have your stone ready to view when you go in. They do carry H&A stones..and most have an AGS cert so you can see the crown and pavillion angles. Call them, say you are looking for this ct weight, this color and clarity, and the crown and pavillion angles, and they will find something for you. if you are in the bay area, you can also go to their other store in san jose, where you will not need an appt to get in. They carry the same inventory, so there too, you can find well cut stones. their prices are also very competitive for mall stores. good luck!

 

[Clownboy]

Thank you all for you help! I just got back from the DERCO in San Jose and definitely found a better price and (I "think") quality.

The breakdown:

Shape: Round Brilliant
Measurement: 6.54 - 6.55 x 3.99 mm
Weight: 1.02
Depth: 61.0%
Table: 55%
Girdle: Thin to Medium
Cutlet: None
Polish: Excellent
Symmtery: Excellent
Clarity: VS2
Color: G
Flourescence: None

Price: $6,664

I went down a few colors, but think it is a better diamond (and a much more comfortable price). Any thoughts?

You all rock. Thank you for your guidance.

-CB

 

[aljdewey]

CB....that at least sounds a bit better. However, you only have half the information.




What you really need to get is crown/pavilion angles. The relationship of those two critical angles is very important, and they help determine the make of the stone.

 

[Clownboy]

I see what you are saying (I learn slowly...but definitely trying). The angles on the Crown is 34.5 and the Pavillion is 41.0. I am trying to decide between this one (all other info mentioned in above thread), and this one which is slighlty smaller:

Shape: Round
Measurement: 6.26-6.30 x 3.83
Weight: 0.91
Depth: 61.0%
Table: 56%
Girdle: Thin to Medium, Faceted
Cutlet: None:
Grade: VVS2
Color: F
Fluorescence: None
Crown angle: 34.9
Pavilion: 41.0
Price: $5,761
I'm thinking though that the first one I mentioned above has better light return....

 

[SFDavey]

----------------
(the ability to finance was also a better fit for me).

-CB----------------

I can tell you this very honestly and up front: Get that stone paid off BEFORE the actual marriage date and don't just carry the debt elsewhere like on credit cards or something. It's a good policy.

Good luck!

 

[bling]

Im glad you had a chance to go to derco..they have nice diamonds, if you know what you are looking for. The first (1.02)one from derco sounds really nice. The G VS2 is a sweet spot! The other one, the sligtly smaller one, is nice too, but its a tad smaller and you are paying alot for the color and clarity. unless that is something you really want, i think the G VS2 will be a much better value..more bang for ya buck! Please come back and tell us how things go!

 

[hoorray]

I agree with Bling -- I like the G/VS2 better than the F/VVS. You pay a lot for clarity and color, and these differences are in the range that you can't see. (Technically, some people see the difference between G & F, but typically only when next to each other, and even then, rarely for adjoining colors.) If you are looking to save some on price, you can stay just under the 1ctw mark (where there is a price jump) and look at G/vs2 or G SI1 stones. Do a search on the PS search engine for H&A/AGS0 stones, and you should find some great options from various online vendors.

 

[Lincoln]

Clownboy - here's a idea of what you are looking at by buying through a pricescope vendor. My diamond is a .94ct, E/SI2, 56%/61% table/depth. It cost just under $3,600. The feather you see on the corner is visible by the naked eye, if you know what you are looking for and have a couple of minutes to locate it...