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Hydrothermal Sapphire Vendors

Rococo

Rough_Rock
Joined
Aug 12, 2020
Messages
10
I read that these would be the most natural looking and better quality.
Please recommend some. I checked on Stag and Finch website but they only have one colour.
I'd like to see more choices. :???:Thanks.
 

Rococo

Rough_Rock
Joined
Aug 12, 2020
Messages
10
Precision Gem sells lovely lab stones, and hydrothermal sapphires are amongst those.
Precision Gem doesn't deliver to the UK (where I live). Also, they have nice stones, but only blue sapphire (in 3 shades) is hydrothermal. I am looking for hydrothermal fancy coloured sapphires, but thanks for the suggestion. :))
 

Niffler75

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Jan 3, 2020
Messages
1,112
@Rococo I am in the UK too. @paragon1234 recently had some stones cut by PrecisionCutGems on Etsy who is also UK based and had a very good experience. I am sure he has lab sapphires listed. :mrgreen2:
 

dk168

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jul 7, 2013
Messages
6,569
Try reaching out to Jeff White at https://www.whitesgems.com/ or Gary Braun at https://www.finewatergems.com/ to see if they have any suitable materials.

Gary very recently posted 3 lab Sapphires, however, the listings did not mention how the materials were created.

They are based in US, however, they have no issue with shipping to UK (where I too am based) for certain - the introduction of GDPR did not appear to affect them at all!

Both are very helpful and easy to communicate.

DK :))
 
Last edited:

Rococo

Rough_Rock
Joined
Aug 12, 2020
Messages
10
Try reaching out to Jeff White at https://www.whitesgems.com/ or Gary Braun at https://www.finewatergems.com/ to see if they have any suitable materials.

Gary very recently posted 3 lab Sapphires, however, the listings did not mention how the materials were created.

They are based in US, however, they have no issue with shipping to UK (where I too am based) for certain - the introduction of GDPR did not appear to affect them at all!

Both are very helpful and easy to communicate.

DK :))
I had seen them before, but I thought they only sold natural sapphire. Will have to check again. Thank you~ :))
 

dk168

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jul 7, 2013
Messages
6,569
I had seen them before, but I thought they only sold natural sapphire. Will have to check again. Thank you~ :))
Gary posted to say due to Covid-19, he has not been able to travel to source natural CS roughs. Hence he decided to cut some lab materials instead until the conditions for travelling abroad are more favourable. He will be cutting a Paraiba YAG for me soon.

Jeff cuts lab materials from time to time - I got a lab EC Emerald from him a couple of years ago.

DK :))
 

dk168

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jul 7, 2013
Messages
6,569

Rococo

Rough_Rock
Joined
Aug 12, 2020
Messages
10
Gary posted to say due to Covid-19, he has not been able to travel to source natural CS roughs. Hence he decided to cut some lab materials instead until the conditions for travelling abroad are more favourable. He will be cutting a Paraiba YAG for me soon.

Jeff cuts lab materials from time to time - I got a lab EC Emerald from him a couple of years ago.

DK :))
Thanks for pointing that out. I'll keep it in mind. =)2
 

Niffler75

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Jan 3, 2020
Messages
1,112
@Rococo Just bear in mind if ordering from the US you will be subject to customs charges and VAT and it can bump the price up a fair bit! :shock:
 

Niffler75

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Jan 3, 2020
Messages
1,112
@Rococo Take a look at the gov.uk and Royal Mail website. You do get hit for charges if the item comes in over £135 on items outside the EU. Then Royal Mail charge another £8 to handle clearing from customs too. It can mount up on higher value items. :x2
 

Rococo

Rough_Rock
Joined
Aug 12, 2020
Messages
10
@Rococo Take a look at the gov.uk and Royal Mail website. You do get hit for charges if the item comes in over £135 on items outside the EU. Then Royal Mail charge another £8 to handle clearing from customs too. It can mount up on higher value items. :x2
I'll take that into consideration. Hopefully I'll find something I like here in the UK. :))
 

PrecisionGem

Brilliant_Rock
Trade
Joined
Jul 27, 2004
Messages
1,726
They are based in US, however, they have no issue with shipping to UK (where I too am based) for certain - the introduction of GDPR did not appear to affect them at all!

DK :))
The reason they don't have issues with GDPR is because they didn't fully read or understand the requirements. The company I worked for spent quite a bit on lawyer's and IT to get fully compliant, and it took them months to get fully aligned.. The threats of not fully compliant greatly offset the lost sales for me.
 

PrecisionGem

Brilliant_Rock
Trade
Joined
Jul 27, 2004
Messages
1,726
Love the colors but it looks like they are all boules of flame fusion synthetic, not hydro.
These are all flame fusion.

Nothing wrong with flame fusion. For almost all colors other than blue, you can not tell the difference once cut. The reason people buy blue hydrothermal is the flame fusion blue only has the color near the outside of the boule. This makes it difficult to cut larger stones, and trickier to really cut any stone. The finished stones if you view them from the side will show the color pocket. Some cutters will try to place the color in the culet, but this is really not the best way to cut these. The stones are much better if you place the color in the crown,

Other colors of flame fusion this either doesn't exist or is much less pronounced. There are also a lot more colors produced by flame fusion than by hydrothermal. The other consideration is the cost. The cost of the rough is many many many times more for hydrothermal to produce. So to cut that material, you either take a much smaller profit margin on the finished stone, or sell the cut stones for a lot more.
 

Grymera

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Nov 26, 2017
Messages
140
Love the colors but it looks like they are all boules of flame fusion synthetic, not hydro.
Oh that's possible, I guess a message to Phil would clear it up and he could clarify/offer hydro colors. I just have that photo saved and was itching to share!
 

Grymera

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Nov 26, 2017
Messages
140
Here is a photo a flame fusion blue sapphire, and a hydrothermal. Notice how the blue color is concentrated on outer curved edge.

The hydrothermal piece has consistent color throughout.
Thanks Gene! Very educational!
 

PrecisionGem

Brilliant_Rock
Trade
Joined
Jul 27, 2004
Messages
1,726
Its pretty easy to tell flame fusion material from hydrothermal in the rough. This photo shows two flame fusion sapphires on the left, and hydrothermal blue sapphire slab and emerald hydrothermal slab.

The difference in price is dramatic. The two flame fusion boules were less than $25, both hydrothermal pieces were over $1000.

IMG_1361.jpeg
 

Tartansparkles

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Feb 23, 2017
Messages
301
Its pretty easy to tell flame fusion material from hydrothermal in the rough. This photo shows two flame fusion sapphires on the left, and hydrothermal blue sapphire slab and emerald hydrothermal slab.

The difference in price is dramatic. The two flame fusion boules were less than $25, both hydrothermal pieces were over $1000.

IMG_1361.jpeg
Does the flame fusion material always come as a boule and the hydrothermal always as a slab? And if flame fusion comes as boule and as the picture above highlights, the concentration of colour is around the curved outer edge, are there cuts that can take advantage of the colour concentration? (I was specifically wondering about the opposed bar cut).
 

oodlesofpoodles

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Dec 29, 2017
Messages
215
I have nothing to add except to say this is awesome and I love this website and group. This is super interesting and I'm so happy to learn new things about jewels and gems.
 

PrecisionGem

Brilliant_Rock
Trade
Joined
Jul 27, 2004
Messages
1,726
Does the flame fusion material always come as a boule and the hydrothermal always as a slab? And if flame fusion comes as boule and as the picture above highlights, the concentration of colour is around the curved outer edge, are there cuts that can take advantage of the colour concentration? (I was specifically wondering about the opposed bar cut).
From what I have seen yes, the flame fusion is boules, and Hydrothermal as slabs. Sometimes you see broken pieces of hydrothermal, and many people don't want to spend the money to buy a whole slab. The blue sapphire slab was actually $1800.

I supposed you could do creative things with the color pocket on the flame fusion. It is mostly found on the blue colors, and a very small amount on some other colors. Ruby is always consistent color throughout the piece.

I wouldn't think of an opposed bar cut for it. I like the opposed bar cuts mainly in tourmaline that has closed or very dark C axis. An open bright colored stone doesn't really lend it's self well to opposed bar cuts, you need the contrast of a darker stone.
 

Rococo

Rough_Rock
Joined
Aug 12, 2020
Messages
10
Its pretty easy to tell flame fusion material from hydrothermal in the rough. This photo shows two flame fusion sapphires on the left, and hydrothermal blue sapphire slab and emerald hydrothermal slab.

The difference in price is dramatic. The two flame fusion boules were less than $25, both hydrothermal pieces were over $1000.

IMG_1361.jpeg
Thanks for clarifying that. Looks like I'll have to have blue or go with flame fusion. :o
 
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