How to judge cut on websites

[eddie269]

Hey guys, new to the forum and needed some help. I have been using bluenile.com and their website it so easy to use. However, many other websites seem to leave out CUT as a search options and they will also use words like "premium". Now I want an ideal/excellent cut (basically highest grade as I will not compromise here). Any reasoning on why they leave out CUT in the search options?

Also, any suggestions?

Bugdet $8k-$9k

1.5c - above
Ideal/excellent cut
F-H
SI1-VS2

GIA preferred


Lastly, how do I sort out the other misc specs such a polish, symmetry, depth, etc?

I just want something eye clean, yet absolute brilliance under a light.

i.e. something like this looks perfect to me but maybe I'm missing something. The price is way cheaper than something similar on bluenile.com bye almost $1000. Kind of skeptical.

link

Thanks in advance.

 

[vadar]

it''s a tedious process on sites that don''t have a copy of the cert, or don''t list the crown/pavilion angles. You need this info to plug into the HCA, which will tell you if it''s a candidate for the "ideal" range, DON''T go by the sites, they list everything under the sun as ideal cut.

This site has a ton of info in the knowledge section, use it and ask around here as well, there are some really knowledgable posters who will help you. I''m just a noob who just went through the buying process, but I''ll try and help you out as well. Personally, I requested a ton of certs for "ideal" diamonds before I found a winner, most sites will send them to you. good luck.

 

[Regular Guy]

Vadar''s been there, but don''t overlook the easy ways.

See below my signature.

This one found on the big db here. You''d have to give up your GIA preference, which would be to your benefit. The hit is taken for finish, where it matters the least.

Also, there''s a couple at GOG to attend to...a bit smaller than you''re seeking, including this one.

Regards,

 

[oldmancoyote]

Date: 1/8/2009 3:07:06 PM
Author:eddie269
Hey guys, new to the forum and needed some help. I have been using bluenile.com and their website it so easy to use. However, many other websites seem to leave out CUT as a search options and they will also use words like ''premium''. Now I want an ideal/excellent cut (basically highest grade as I will not compromise here). Any reasoning on why they leave out CUT in the search options?

Because cut grading is a) controversial b) indipendent labs only grade rounds and princess cuts, so evaluation on other cuts is even more subjective/biased c) it''s far from widespread anyway

Also, any suggestions?

My suggestion is to shortcircuit the process by focusing on the dealer. Choose a dealer that you can trust, and work with them. The amount you save going to a "no frills" site like BN is trivial compared to the value of having an expert adviser to guide you through a selection. That''s assuming you could save any money at all... (see your example below).

Bugdet $8k-$9k

1.5c - above
Ideal/excellent cut
F-H
SI1-VS2

Sounds a bit ambitious for rounds - probably at the lower end of the range (H/SI1) and more like 1.25-1.30 if you want no compromise on cut

GIA preferred

Consider AGSL too!!!

Lastly, how do I sort out the other misc specs such a polish, symmetry, depth, etc?

Depth is part of proportions/cut, so it goes with the rest... Polish and simmetry - personal preference is "good and above is fine". Some people insist on excellent/ideal here too; personally, since you can''t really see it with the naked eye, it feels a bit overkill (like clarity above VS).

I just want something eye clean, yet absolute brilliance under a light.

You are picking the

i.e. something like this looks perfect to me but maybe I''m missing something. The price is way cheaper than something similar on bluenile.com bye almost $1000. Kind of skeptical.

Why? BN does not necessarily have the lowest prices, plus with the fact that they don''t hold inventory they are more exposed to the vagaries of manufacturers; perhaps ERD bought this stone years ago. In addition, bear in mind that not all SI1 are equal; perhaps this one has a more visible inclusion.

ERD however will look at the diamond for you and tell you what it''s like, BN won''t (back to my point about choosing the dealer). If you like this, ask Mark to get you specs and photos.

link

Thanks in advance.

 

[Rockdiamond]

Actually, Blue Nile has some of the lowest prices listed for some stones- that does not address the fact you need to buy blind if you shop there...
But I''d say that the 1.51G/SI1 for $8194 linked to is an error.
If it is available, it''s an amazing deal, unless there''s something really wrong with it in terms of imperfection.
The price is simply too low.

AS has been mentioned here- many of the sites which list cut grades are simply abusing the term.

In my opinion, the only valid way to advertise a "cut grade" is either the one on a newer than 2006 GIA round diamond- the top cut grade is "Excellent", or an AGSL report- which would use the term "Ideal"

 

[eddie269]

I had a feeling that price was too good to be true. My original budget was to keep it under $10,000 and I found a few at BN with my specs for around $9-9.5k price range. I think I''m going to contact some dealers.

 

[Rockdiamond]

Another thing we''ve found happening on Blue Nile is that sometimes an old listing ( with an old price) is somehow left in the db. So you''ll find a huge variation on two stones that are ostensibly identical

 

[about2begin]

Search Ideal cut on BN, then look at the cert and pop the angles into the HCA, bro.

 

[oldmancoyote]

Date: 1/8/2009 5:01:25 PM
Author: eddie269
I had a feeling that price was too good to be true. My original budget was to keep it under $10,000 and I found a few at BN with my specs for around $9-9.5k price range. I think I''m going to contact some dealers.

For the cost of a call to an 800 number... call them as well and ask!

 

[stone-cold11]

It has strong blue fluor and just a VG in polish which will account for some of the lower price.

 

[eddie269]

Date: 1/8/2009 5:12:19 PM
Author: about2begin
Search Ideal cut on BN, then look at the cert and pop the angles into the HCA, bro.

And by plugging the angles into the HCA grading, it will tell me all I need to know about the cut and how well it sparkles? I used this method and 3 out of the 4 stones that were "ideal" were just "good." One stone however had the "Excellent" grading. Perhaps that''s the one worth checking out seriously?

 

[Lorelei]

Date: 1/11/2009 4:44:28 AM
Author: eddie269

Date: 1/8/2009 5:12:19 PM
Author: about2begin
Search Ideal cut on BN, then look at the cert and pop the angles into the HCA, bro.

And by plugging the angles into the HCA grading, it will tell me all I need to know about the cut and how well it sparkles? I used this method and 3 out of the 4 stones that were 'ideal' were just 'good.' One stone however had the 'Excellent' grading. Perhaps that's the one worth checking out seriously?

The aim of the HCA is to score 2 or below in most cases, then such diamonds are then deemed worthy of further evaluation which is usually done with Idealscope images etc - however BN don't provide them. The HCA is used for elimination, not selection and as it can't physically see the diamond, is not capable of telling you everything you need to know about the cut. This page goes into further detail.

http://diamonds.pricescope.com/ideal.asp

So really the info you can get from BN is limited, all you can go by are the proportions and use of the HCA to help you, however they do have a good return policy.

 

[CharmyPoo]

I agree that Blue Nile has one of the easiest search engines to use. I also really like the Adiamor and James Allen search engines. I usually use these sites to find the stones and then contact my vendor of choice to look at the stones. It is too bad that some of the popular online vendors haven't invested in improving their websites. In my opinion, this is one of their biggest selling tools (other than customer service and reputation).

My 2 cents but I am sure the experts will chime in and correct as approriate:

1) Vendor rates cuts based on their specifications. Their specifications may not always be considered the best so you can't really go by them.

2) Just because GIA rates the diamond with triple EX doesn't mean it is the best cut diamond. The range for GIA EX is broad. As you have been told, plug the numbers into HCA with a score of less than 2 being desireable. If I understand correctly, it takes the intersection between GIA EX and AGS0.

3) You will find the same diamonds on many of the websites. You will know which vendor has the best price by comparing the same diamond on various sites. I have been focusing on Cushions - I have found ERD to have some of the best prices. I don't know if this applies to RB. I found the same diamond on Adiamor and Abazias for several hundred more - http://www.adiamor.com/D-8013605.htm or http://www.abazias.com/database/NewDiamondInfo.asp?stock=54132355&src=builder.

4) You will have to use http://www.gia.edu/reportcheck/ to get the certs for the search engines that don't have them. For example, here are the full specs on the diamond you linked above - http://www.gia.edu/reportcheck/index.cfm?fuseaction=home.showReportVerification&reportno=1109169985&weight=1.51.

 

[eddie269]

Date: 1/11/2009 7:20:01 AM
Author: CharmyPoo

My 2 cents but I am sure the experts will chime in and correct as approriate:

3) You will find the same diamonds on many of the websites. You will know which vendor has the best price by comparing the same diamond on various sites. I have been focusing on Cushions - I have found ERD to have some of the best prices. I don''t know if this applies to RB. I found the same diamond on Adiamor and Abazias for several hundred more - http://www.adiamor.com/D-8013605.htm or http://www.abazias.com/database/NewDiamondInfo.asp?stock=54132355&src=builder.


4) You will have to use http://www.gia.edu/reportcheck/ to get the certs for the search engines that don''t have them. For example, here are the full specs on the diamond you linked above - http://www.gia.edu/reportcheck/index.cfm?fuseaction=home.showReportVerification&reportno=1109169985&weight=1.51.

You just found me an option. That''s awesome. The diamond HCA score was a 1.8. Hopefully it satisfies my definition of eye clean. Sent an email to Abazias as that was the cheapest price offered.

Thanks for the info guys. Keep them coming.

 

[WinkHPD]

Date: 1/8/2009 3:07:06 PM
Author:eddie269
Hey guys, new to the forum and needed some help. I have been using bluenile.com and their website it so easy to use. However, many other websites seem to leave out CUT as a search options and they will also use words like ''premium''. Now I want an ideal/excellent cut (basically highest grade as I will not compromise here). Any reasoning on why they leave out CUT in the search options?

Sure, if they wanted you to have it they would provide it.

Actually that is my snotty side replying.

Here is a more thoughtful answer.

It is an absolute Pain-in-the-Rear to enter all that stuff into the site, and that is perhaps also an answer, especially for those who are just posting other people''s lists.

The reality is that many uninformed buyers make their choice from those lists, and $5 less is the winning bid. Those who take the time to get informed are rarely happy when they ask for the information and discover that the lists don''t have many stones cut the way they are wanting to have them cut and eventually end up buying from those who do provide the information, who do so because:

1. They know it is important.

2. They sell stones that are properly cut, thus they are not only happy to do the extra work, they are happy to be selling to those who know enough to care.

Just my opinion of course, you will find most of the Pricescope vendors providing you with this information.

Wink

 

[CharmyPoo]

Date: 1/11/2009 4:16:32 PM
Author: eddie269


You just found me an option. That's awesome. The diamond HCA score was a 1.8. Hopefully it satisfies my definition of eye clean. Sent an email to Abazias as that was the cheapest price offered.

Thanks for the info guys. Keep them coming.

The cheapest option for that diamond is actually ERD. I didn't add the link because this is the same diamond you found and linked to in your first post. It's only $8194 - they might offer a cash or bank wire discount too. Plus, ERD offers free FED EX shipping which can save you another $100.

http://www.engagementringsdirect.com/loose_detail.php/session/85f2a011f8c4e5881b5131211b0277fb/id/18044037/sz/150/premium/premium